I don't get it!

[66hemi]

Ok, I just replaced the disk brakes. Fired it up the 440 rt and it sounds like it is missing. I rebuilt the carb (holly 4150) and put new plugs in. Tried it again same thing. I ordered new plug wires and cap
and it is now worse. I checked the timing it is 10 DTC for my mods I have ( 6 pack rods, 30 over 509 lift cam, torker 2 manifold, stock exhaust manifolds) I looked at the firing order it is correct. Only difference I can see is the distributor cap cap has a little cap next to the coil wire. I don't know what that is. It is a mopar cap from summit. Any help would be great.

[Ghoste]

The little cap on the cap is just a vent so no worries there.  It got worse with new plug wires?  Are they the same brand and size that were on there before?  They are all on tight?  Electronic ignition?  ECU grounded?  Is it a consistent misfire?  One cylinder or many, which one(s)?  Coil good, no cracks?

[66hemi]

It is electronic ignition. The wires are flame thrower 7mm for the stock look. All are tight on the cap and plugs. It was sitting for a few months while I was doing the brakes. But not long. it was at slow speed that it was missing. It didn't seem to be a constant miss before. When I hit it it would take off but now it is back fireing.

[RCKSTR]

Are you sure of the firing order? 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2 and they turn counter clockwise.

[1969chargerrtse]

Missing on idle?  You rebuilt the carb.  I would look at the carb, they are not easy to rebuild correct.  I know of rebuilding places that closed because they got so many rebuilt returns it wasn't worth it. Get ready for this thread to be "moved " soon.

[66hemi]

I basicaly just replaced gaskets and the float seats on the carb. Is the hemi different as far as the distributor? On that car the number one plug wire goes to the post next to the vaccumme on the cap. different from my 440 that is almost opposite.

[BrianShaughnessy]

10 degrees initial isn't much if it's a 108 509 cam - try 16 or even 18.    Not sure what to say if it's the 114 version.
What power valve did you take out and what's in there now?    

[R2]

Did you pull the distributor out when you were working on the car ?,,,you did mention you changed the cap.....
Sounds like a timing issue
Wondering if you should check and see if #1 on the cap is facing the rotor on the compression stroke for number one cylinder,,,and make the sure the distributor is in the right spot,,,,and that the wires are on the correct tower on the cap,,you may have the wires in the wrong spot on the cap,based on where the rotor is facing.,,,,if this is incorrect,,,this may be the problem.....
I agree with Brian,,,10* isnt much,,,,might want to change that after find out the problem,,,i re-curved mine and put 30* initial,,and 36-38* total.....

[66hemi]

I didn't change the power valv. I left what was in there. I did drop the jets to 72 and 82 from 73 and 83 though. The cam is a direct connection purple shaft 509. That's all I know about the cam. I can try mt elderbrock car and see if that makes a difference?

[66hemi]

I didn't pull the distributor out. I just changed the cap.

[R2]

I would still check it by turning the motor over by hand,,,,getting number one on the compression stroke ( pull the plug,,,and feel for air coming out ).
THEN,,,,,pull the cap off,,,see where the rotor is facing,,,,in relation to number one on the cap,,,,,it should be facing it directly,,,if not,,,,,you have to move the wires ON the cap.....

[Cooter]

Check those brand new plugs as well...I've seen brand new Champion's come out the box with hair-line cracks in them causing all kinda hell...

[66hemi]

Ok, checked the new plugs (black already) too rich or due to running like crap, wires are where they are supposed to be and rotor points to #1 on compression the rest are to firing order. could it be the coil or the orange electronic box? I am stumped now.

[Cooter]

If it were mine, I'd dump that Chrysler stock Electronic ignition and go with a proven combo Like MSD...But, that's just me, as I've had Nothing But PROBLEMS out of the stock chrysler stuff....Backfiring and Blowing mufflers off, Shutting off in the road, wait ten minutes, starts up, drive 4 miles, shuts off again, Won't start at all, missing when it does fire up, etc...


You really don't know at this point whether it's NOT firing or carb problems causing your black plugs...What heat range are they? Stock heat range?

What brand wires did you get? The first thing to determine which cylinder is missing would be to pull off one plug wire at a time while running, but BE CAREFUL!! Don't wanna get the hell knocked out of you by electric shock..

[66hemi]

That's funny I have been knocked on my butt from messing with the wires. I thought I would take my timing light and put it on all the plug wires. They all had power going thru them. I think it is a carb issue at this point. There seems to be other issues like the vacuum too. I messed with it a bunch today. Holley said the power valve is too big for the vac I have. That's why it is running rich. The adjustment screws do nothing until they are turned in all the way. Then it doesn't even idle rough. Summit said the carb might be too big too. It should be 600 to 750. Even if it isn't running great I still love my 69 RT. Its the most fun to drive too.

[R2]

- How much timing do you have,,,,,both at initial and total ?

-Power valve has nothing to do with idle....unless it's blown

Can you describe what the car is doing,,,,,is it just idle issues,,,,is it off idle issues as you rev it,,,,or wide open throttle....

I would think you would want more initial timing

If it bogs when you nail it,,,maybe the squirters are an issue.

need more info.......

[b5blue]

My 509 was always lumpy and low vacuum at idle but crappy fuel is what came to mind as brakes have nothing to do with motor. 

[66hemi]

I know the brake job had nothing to with the car running like crap. The issue is it doesn't run bad at idle. just a little rough from the cam.

Here are the symtoms again.

1 will not go back to idle after a rev right away.
2 running very rough (missing) at around 1400 to 2100 rpms. especially when cold
3 when I nail it it does go but sometimes backfires out the exhaust.
4 hesitation on a rev
5 plugs are black
6 mixture screws when turned all the way in, even out the idle
7 smoke out the back at idle (running very rich)

I have in the car:

440ci. 30 over
direct connection purple shaft 509 lift cam
sixpack rods
edelbrock torker 2
holley 4150 800cfm double pumper
stock ex. manifolds,
electronic (orange box) ignition
stock coil
7 mm flame thrower plug wires (new)
autolight plugs (new)
mopar cap/rotor (new),
timing set at 10 before tdc
carter electric fuel pump
4:10 Dana, 4spd.
hays 40lb flywheel
ram powergrip clutch.

[Cooter]

Swap out the carb for another one and see how it does with freash plugs. Sounds like a carb problem to me as the backfire is unburned fuel and the smoke as well...

[R2]

If it was me,,,,,,,i would fix the distributor FIRST before you start tearing into the carb.

10* is NOT enough timing,,, ,,,you also dont mention what the total timing is....

I would try and put 18-25* of INITIAL timing in it,,,,and about 35-37* total,,,all in by 2200-2600rpm,,you WILL notice a big difference in idle,,,vacuum,,,etc

You will have to "curve" your distributor to do this,,,,very easy to do.....

AFTER you get the distributor set up correctly,,,,,,you can fine tune the carb,,,,,

If you were near by,,,,we could swap in my distributor,,,and see what you think,,,,, good luck 

[SeattleCharger]

carb being so big definately is not helping,  heard people say after they downsize an 800 to a 650-700 problems gone, don't know if other problems are there, but surprised that thing even launched off the line without a bog down.   if you have it all dialed in, I would expect it would bog out when you punch it from idle