Pro Touring Charger 68/69

[Birkholm]

hey..

where can I find Chargers with special colour and wheels ?

I don't know what to call it, pro touring or costum


thanks Christian // Denmark
http://www.bilgalleri.dk/uploads_xl_wm/1359070.jpg?

[Bill Howell]

You mean like this?
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,60029.0.html
that is my 72, done in a protouring style. Factory color, but certainly bigger wheels, brakes, etc.

[Birkholm]

I mean normal pictures taken with camera ..

[Hemidog]

I mean normal pictures taken with camera ..

Look at the whole thread!

Also, check these:
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,19141.0.html
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,48500.0.html

Lots of others, do a search.

[G-man]

Just get yourself a serious badass 15" looking wheel for your MUSCLE car and leave those "pro touring" (Half rice half muscle) cars alone. 

[69bronzeT5]

Just get yourself a serious badass 15" looking wheel for your MUSCLE car and leave those "pro touring" (Half rice half muscle) cars alone. 

Not all pro-touring cars are half rice. I have a feeling you don't like pro-tourers but you don't have to ruin it for the rest of us. SOME people do cross the line into ricer with their cars sometimes but other people make them look just right....for example, I don't see anything rice about these "pro-tourers"....

[bigred68]

Just get yourself a serious badass 15" looking wheel for your MUSCLE car and leave those "pro touring" (Half rice half muscle) cars alone. 

Not all pro-touring cars are half rice. I have a feeling you don't like pro-tourers but you don't have to ruin it for the rest of us. SOME people do cross the line into ricer with their cars sometimes but other people make them look just right....for example, I don't see anything rice about these "pro-tourers"....

Yup! Cody you beat me to it! AND... Pete's Charger(Autodynamics) and Norway Chargers Beast, There's a bunch of them, all awsome!!
BTW, did you notice the fabrication going on with the tail section of the last Charger? Cody, do you have anymore pics of that last car? I've already got a complete library of the incredible "Angry" cars! 

[elacruze]

Just get yourself a serious badass 15" looking wheel for your MUSCLE car and leave those "pro touring" (Half rice half muscle) cars alone.  

I'm going with wide 15" Cop rims and dog dishes; I still consider mine to be 'Pro Touring'. Electronic Fuel Injection, dual plane manifold. Heavy flywheel, Gear Vendors Overdrive, ARB air locked 8-3/4 at 3.55:1. Frame connectors. Firm Feel cop box, torsion bars, F&R sway bars, upper control arms, reinforced LCA's and Konis; 11-3/4 front disc brakes. Modern air conditioning components. Entirely targeted towards a 20,000 mile summer next year.

Am I missing something?

[Back N Black]

So, what makes a car or "charger" pro touring. Is it the rims, racing seats,reverse lights modded into the bumper?   

[bigred68]

So, what makes a car or "charger" pro touring. Is it the rims, racing seats,reverse lights modded into the bumper?   

Jeez, I'm not sure if there is a proper definition. I Think? Its a car set up to run with the best of the best? A car that can handle like its on rails, brake on a dime, yet has the creature comforts of air conditioning, descent ride quality, etc. A car that can run triple digits across the nation all day long in triple digit temperatures while keeping its occupants cool and comfortable. Then, when it gets to Laguna Seca, it can run laps with the Ferrari's and BMW's.
elacruze's car Qualifies in my book!!
Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[HPP]

Well, initially there were G machines. The whole idea behind that concept was a car that could produce 1 g of accelleration in accelleration, braking, and cornering. Since the means to do that produces some pretty heavy weight machinery that isn't always the most pleasent to ride in for any lenght of time, it kind of morphed into pro-touring which took the G machine concept and backed off the performance a little bit while adding to the comfort of a late model list of options like air, cruise, seating, stereo, etc.  Kind of like pro-street was based on the pro-stock look but was a more streetable approach.

Much like pro-street became a charicature of itself with fat tires and no peformance in the 1980s, so too has pro-touring become a phrase to call out the big wheel, thin sidewall bolt on crowd that doesn't ride an better, nor perform any better than the 60s era cars they are based on.  Fortunatly, there are still some cars out there that can combine excellent performance characteristics with comfort.

[NYCMille]

I'm going with wide 15" Cop rims and dog dishes; I still consider mine to be 'Pro Touring'. Electronic Fuel Injection, dual plane manifold. Heavy flywheel, Gear Vendors Overdrive, ARB air locked 8-3/4 at 3.55:1. Frame connectors. Firm Feel cop box, torsion bars, F&R sway bars, upper control arms, reinforced LCA's and Konis; 11-3/4 front disc brakes. Modern air conditioning components. Entirely targeted towards a 20,000 mile summer next year.

Hell yea this combo qualifies. Larger wheels are definitely a "look" but more to the point they are generally there to accommodate larger brakes. This is not to say you can't get a car to stop with 11.75" rotors and standard calipers, it may just not be as good as some of the bigger systems. If you are going to do the FirmFeel stage III box make sure you also get the fast ratio pitman arm, it makes a WORLD of different, just make sure it'll clear you headers. Otherwise it sounds like you're right on track to building one bad ass street machine.

Just get yourself a serious badass 15" looking wheel for your MUSCLE car and leave those "pro touring" (Half rice half muscle) cars alone

- I'd love to know where the rice on my cars is located, LOL!

[Mike DC]

Much like pro-street became a charicature of itself with fat tires and no peformance in the 1980s, so too has pro-touring become a phrase to call out the big wheel, thin sidewall bolt on crowd that doesn't ride an better, nor perform any better than the 60s era cars they are based on.  Fortunatly, there are still some cars out there that can combine excellent performance characteristics with comfort.

And in my opinion those huge wheels don't even perform better.  They're too easy to damage on the street, and they're heavy enough to offset the slight contact patch gain over 15-17" wheels.  These huge 19" wheels are pure bling IMHO. 

[NYCMille]

Keep in mind that with these bigger wheels comes a much greater selection of performance tires and a greater clearance for larger brakes. Look at any performance car built today, nothing has under an 18" wheel... there IS a reason for this.

[Troy]

Yep, brakes. I had many conversations with Andy at AR Engineering and he said even the 13" Viper discs he sell will fade after a few laps on the track on a big heavy car like a Charger. Of course, if you aren't making regular stops from a high speed you're fine. The bigger wheels are heavier but the sidewalls are stiffer too. You can't avoid them if you want decent brakes though.

Oh, and I hate it when I see a car with HUGE wheels and tiny drum brakes inside (usually painted a bright color to be noticeable right away).

To the original question... different paint and wheels aren't really even custom - just modified. There are lot of pictures here on the site of cars in non-stock colors with after market wheels.

Troy

[Blown70]

Much depends on the brakes you run, as stated above,  I have driven cars with larger sidewall and with smaller sidewall, dont know becasue I did not have a way to measure G-force or lateral acceration, but I can tell you I much perfered the skinner sidewall, with the way the suspension was set on that car..... the wide sidewalll did not give much for road feel and seemed to float more than I liked upon cornering..... On the straight  not much difference at all.

I am not a fan of the 20" plus wheels on a charger...... but there are some reasons to run a 17" or 18" wheel.  last set up for brakes I looked at from Wilwood required a 17" min, wheel.....

Tom

[69bronzeT5]

So, what makes a car or "charger" pro touring. Is it the rims, racing seats,reverse lights modded into the bumper?   

It's all about the handling and braking. A quote I've heard before is "a pro-touring muscle car is like a new performance car wrapped in a classic muscle body."

[elacruze]

...If you are going to do the FirmFeel stage III box make sure you also get the fast ratio pitman arm, it makes a WORLD of different, just make sure it'll clear you headers. Otherwise it sounds like you're right on track to building one bad ass street machine.

They don't fit. 

Somewhere down the line I'd like to build a set of Burns Tri-Y headers-then I'd be sure to build in clearance.
Now I just need a TIG welder and a month of practice...

[Rolling_Thunder]

I'm planning on 18x8 and 18x9.5 wheels on my Charger...     but then again i'll be running 14" rotors and 6 piston calipers...     aint no way those will fit under 15's     

[Bill Howell]

I have been active at pro-touring.com for a long time now. the consensus there is protouring is defined as a musclecar with improvements that make it run(drivetrain), steer(suspension) and stop (BRAKES) better than stock. There are certainly different degrees of this genre, but to me, brakes are high on the list of necessities. We all know how inferior the original brakes where on these cars, especially those with drum brakes and/or non power brakes. You can upgrade the engine and suspension all you like, but if you can not stop it, you will soon be rebuilding it. You simply can not put big brakes on anything and keep the 14 or 15 inch rims. Even corvette 13 inch rotors require 17". As heavy as our cars are, it just makes sense to put 14" rotors if you are serious about running your car and stopping without fad. The following picture of my car will show that 18 is the minimum I can run and clear the brakes.

Road racers agree that 17 is the optimum size for their cars, but I choose the larger rotors. You don't have to put rubberband tires on your car, there are more options coming every year. I hate to look at ebay and see all the "protouring cars" that are really nothing but a set of Torque Thrust IIs on a stock suspension and brakes. Sure, there are a group of guys that spend the money for the bolton parts and never drive their cars, but that will always be, some people never learned that trailers are for boats. I am 51 and have always had hotrods and musclecars. I for one am a poster child for driving your protouring car. I can tell you, after 12000 miles on my last car, and still drive it regularly, that there is a huge difference in the way it drove originally and now. My Charger will ride on 19s and 20s when traveling, but don't mistake that as being a poser. The 18s and toyo 888s will make it a huge threat at the autocross and roadrace events. It will represent MOPARS at the Optima Challenge in Nov, the day after SEMA.  I have driven it  pretty hard the last several days and it does need some fine tuning, but I can tell you this, I can put it into a offramp hard enough right now that the outside rear wheel comes off the ground. Yes, needs heavier springs up front, but they are coming but the frontend is on rails and that is a good thing. Hit the brakes and it is refreshing to know it will stop.

[G-man]

I guess the rice to me is the big diameter wheels that belong on Supras/skylines etc not muscle cars which are meant to look beefy, fat tyres, big profiles, tough looking bodies...

I dont consider fuel injection/custom seats etc rice though I dont want any of that either.

it looks fine on both the blue 69 Charger recently done and angry charger as the rest of the cars set up to suit it but I guess it just isnt the way I would go due to reasons above (traditional muscle cars = big profile tyres not big wheels)

No offense intended to anyone 

[Bill Howell]

I guess the rice to me is the big diameter wheels that belong on Supras/skylines etc not muscle cars which are meant to look beefy, fat tyres, big profiles, tough looking bodies...

I dont consider fuel injection/custom seats etc rice though I dont want any of that either.

it looks fine on both the blue 69 Charger recently done and angry charger as the rest of the cars set up to suit it but I guess it just isnt the way I would go due to reasons above (traditional muscle cars = big profile tyres not big wheels)

No offense intended to anyone 

Certainly non taken here.
It is just to have the whole package, brakes in particular, the bigger wheels are a necessary evil. Some have even attempted to hide them buy powder coating the wheels black and pinstriping a red ring around the outer edge to make the wheel appear part of the tire.  I too like bigger sidewalls when drag racing, but will say that since I started autocrossing, I 1) understand the need for shorter sidewalls, and 2) find straight lining bores me quickly anymore.

[Mike DC]

                

I understand the reasonings for the G-machine type wheel & tire combos.  



However I think there's a huge practicality difference between 17" rims and 45-series tires, as opposed to 20" rims and 25-series tires.  

And I see a lot of 19-20" rims containing rotors that would be easily swallowed by 17" rims.  

     

[69bronzeT5]

I guess the rice to me is the big diameter wheels that belong on Supras/skylines etc not muscle cars which are meant to look beefy, fat tyres, big profiles, tough looking bodies...

No offense intended to anyone 

None taken....I do agree...the biggest I'd go on any car I'll ever own is 18". Anything over that is just gay

[elacruze]

I spent a lot of time wringing my hands over what brakes to have. First, I don't like big rims on Chargers. They're OK on E-bodies, and some A-bodies and even Roadrunners-but not gen 2-3 Chargers. Personal preference. Second, I have no intention of 'crossing or roadracing this thing; it will stay right close to the speed limits 99% of the time, and when it's faster I don't plan on stopping hard twice. I expect the 11.75" will do fine for my intended usage. Thirdly, I really wanted other-than-stock calipers, but utility won the day-if anything goes wrong on the trip(s) I can replace any of the parts at any local parts store nationwide. Oh yeah, I forgot to mention Cruise Control.

Think 10% Pro and 90% Touring. If we can schedule it all in, we're doing Power Tour, Rte 66 from Chicago to San Diego, whatever big Mopar meets fit in, and maybe up the coast of CA and over the top through Yellowstone and Mount Rushmore. Home again from Michigan to Florida on old Dixie Highway.

I'll be keeping a close eye on larger rims, in case I see something I like. After the summer tours, she'll get a 500" secret squirrel motor and more brakes, if I can find rims I can live with. Anybody make 18" steel rims for dog dishes?