Mufflerchoise

[c00nhunterjoe]

i completly agree. it is your car and it should sound the way you want. i'm not arhuing that everyone should run flowmaster's and i am not saying that they are the best. all i am trying to say is that i dont feel they deserve the title of "restrictive pos" that they are being labled on here as "flowbastards". 
           i also dont feel that every car with flow's sounds liek a mustang. i can tell when a 5.0 with 40 series is coming down the road and i can tell when a big block mopar with 40 series is coming down the road. to me they sound totaly different. 
         i also agree that the 40 series flowmasters are loud and obnoxious both inside and out of the car. i would know, they are on my car. they are great mufflers if that is what you want. everyone knows you are coming and everyone knows when you are leaving. and when you stand on it everyone jumps up to see who it is.  like you said, its all in what you are looking for.
       i really feel that comparing ultraflow's to flowmaster 40's and other chambered mufflers is liek comparing apples to oranges. both are fruit both are totaly different. the ultraflow isnt a chambered muffler while a flowmaster is. either way all the dyno sheets i have been able to read and tech articles show virtually the same numbers between the 2 mufflers. that said it comes down to the sound for me and that is what its all about- the most hp and tq with a sound YOU love. the muffler from flowmaster to compare to an ultraflow is the 10 series or outlaw line from flowmaster.
    for me personally i dont liek the delta flow flowmasters, not the same tone as the origonal flowmasters. my personal favorite is the flowmaster 30 series. unfortuantly is was discontinued 7 years ago. it was built as the top ten shootout muffler. the flow rates were incredible but it met the class's low db rating. it rocked that class. unfortunatly it didnt do well with the street crowd as it is not a super loud muffler. my cousin has them on his chevelle and it sounds incredible. the best way to describe it is the origonal 40 series (not the delta flow 40 series) but much much much quieter and absolutly 0 interior drone. idle is nice and quiet, purrs liek a kitten but when you stand on it they come alive and roar. its like someone hits a the header cut out switch. cruising is great, just enough noise to know there is something coming but not enough to give you a headache. they are very unique in their sound and performance but as i said they were discontinued.  if you search flowmasters site the do have a 30 series on the market but it is NOT anytihng liek the old series. i spent alot of time on the phone with flowmaster and i got put in touch with a  guy named gary silva. everyone else had no idea what i was asking for with the old school 30's. he was very anxious to find out my interests in this muffler as he was a big fan of it as well and was upset when flowmaster decided to can it. we talked for a good 45 minutes about my car and what i was looking for in a muffler. he told me that i would most likely like the 50 series suv. the case size is identical to the old 30 series and the internal design is the same with the exception of one additional baffle near the exit. these are the mufflers that i will be trying out soon and i hope to get the same sound and performance that i long for.

[firefighter3931]

will outperform straight pipe.  The Aero Chamber performs better, sounds better, and will stand out from the crowd. 

  The exhaust set-up I finally settled on was from Dynomax, that is all I will say...Everyone should go thru the ropes and find what they really like, just as I did.  Did I blow money in my quest for the perfect muffler?  Yes.  Do I have fresh muffs sitting on the shelf in my shop?  Yes.  Do I have improved performance and what to me qualifies as a BA sound...You better believe it! 

I can't tell you how good it feels to get the "sound" down and know that you are on par to keep times low when you head to the track.

It's not surprising to hear that you settled on a set of dynomax mufflers. 

That was a good post you put up....lots of valid points and observations. 

For me, the tin can sounds and resonance of the Flowbastards is horrible but the inferior performance as compared to a tru straight-thru muffler (Ultraflow/Magnaflow) is the deal breaker. I've seen too many street/strip rides improve significantly at the track to ignore the reality. 


Ron

[firefighter3931]

everyone knows you are coming and everyone knows when you are leaving. and when you stand on it everyone jumps up to see who it is.  like you said, its all in what you are looking for.

This is the typical mindset of those who prefer a tinny chambered muffler sound....performance is a secondary issue. Reminds me of the Harley guys with unbaffled pipes. 

Ultraflows are pretty damn impressive when you mat the pedal....make no mistake. They are just mellower at idle (think deep musclecar sound) without the drone at cruise. Best of all worlds. 

Joe, next time you're at the track crawl under some cars and see how many are running Flowmaster....i'm talking the serious guys, not the ham and eggers.  Anybody who's on top of their game will have some kind of straight thru muffler on their car.

I'm glad that you like your Flowmasters and have no problem with that...really. I just don't want other folks reading this thread to think that they are a performance muffler....because they are not. Well maybe if you're replacing a factory can they would be considered an "upgrade".... but against the "better" stuff out there they leave a lot to be desired.


Ron

[b5blue]

Wow mufflercity here! So what or how bad is stock hemi/440 muffs and or resonators? I really wanted to make my 440 sound "factory" and being a daily driver db level low. I like "hearing" everything going on with my car (and the radio too) the gurgle of a pair of resonators is kinda what I mean...anybody?

[mikesbbody]

If you look at what was posted earlier..

Sound Off in Quietest to Loudest (Decibels):
1.Borla XS, 80db at idle, 90db at 2,000 rpm, 110db at WOT.
2.Hooker Maxflow, 80db at idle, 90db at 2,000 rpm, 120db at WOT.
3.Magnaflow, 82db at idle, 91 at 2,000 rpm, 114db at WOT.
4.Flowmaster, 82db at idle, 93 at 2,000 rpm, 115db at WOT.
5.Flowtech Warlock, 83db at idle, 92 at 2,000 rpm, 112db at WOT.
6.Dynomax UltraFlo, 83db at idle, 94 at 2,000 rpm, 113db at WOT.
7.Borla XR1, 83db at idle, 96db at 2,000 rpm, 118db at WOT.
8.Bassani Street, 83db at idle, 96db at 2,000 rpm, 120db at WOT.
9.Edelbrock RPM, 84db at idle, 93db at 2,000 rpm, 118db at WOT.
10.Bassani Real Street, 84db at idle, 96db at 2,000 rpm, MAX. (120+db).
11.Flowtech Afterburner, 86db at idle, 94db at 2,000 rpm, 115db at WOT.
12.Flowtech Terminator, 86db at idle, 94db at 2,000 rpm, 119db at WOT.
13.Hooker Aerochamber, 87db at idle, 94db at 2,000 rpm, 114db at WOT.
14.SpinTech, 87db at idle, 97db at 2,000 rpm, 116db at WOT.
15.MAC, 87db at idle, 98db at 2,000 rpm, 119db at WOT.
16.No Muffler, 91db at idle, 103db at 2,000 rpm, MAX. (120+db).

What I would like to know is what the other louder muffler's sound like? not much has been said about them more so the sound, and tinny-droning noise of FM's

"As for the performance, it is flow based.  To be honest, my muffs of choice seem to be down just a tad in the seat-meter region right off idle, but that worry went away when I got south of town and stood on it.  I always wanted to conduct a Mopar muffler shootout...Record power #s on a mule engine, record dbs, flow #s out the muff, and of course sound clips.  I kind of lack the facilities, equipment, and cash to make that happen.
This, I have always wanted to make a comprehensive Mopar Exhaust Database"

I agree! I'd love to see this have as many set ups as possible on the same car decibles, flow, H.P etc with and without Tailpipes it would be great! but as mentioned time and cash make it out of the question for us but a Magazine could do it no problem.

[oldschool]

i like my horsepower to do the talking,not the mufflers   imo, i like it as quiet as possible.i dont need a loud muffler to make my ride SOUND like it has power.like ron said,they are not harleys that make all that noise,just to have only 60-80 hp.now this is just my opinion. not trying to

[b5blue]

I call them "big noise for little boys bikes"  just as bad a subwoofer buzz bombs

[c00nhunterjoe]

i still say they are not as bad as you make them out to be. dyno sheets dont lie, i have seen plenty of cars that run great with them and i have a tenative track day planned for my car this coming wedsday evening. so we will see if my car gets faster with the flowmaster's removed. my plan is 3 passes with mufflers on and 3 passes with mufflers off.  if i can get someone with a good camcorder to come i will have video of it all.

[TexasStroker]

If everyone is cool with me archiving the links I'll use them as a basis for the database.

This will be very time consuming and I have a few projects to get done first, but this is something that I've wanted to do for 10 years now.

If anyone wants to contribute get a vid, give the adequate info, and if possible provide dyno #s, ETs, and weather conditions.  If I do this I want it to be the be-all and end-all exhaust database.

It is unrealistic for me to expect dyno #s, flow #s, and DB levels from everyone, and for some the weather conditions will be a stretch, but by all means if you've got them post them.

Also "adequate info" refers to more than just "2.5" Cherry Bombs.  I am a stickler for details.  I want to know compression, cam, heads, headers, CID, pipe size and material, straight, x or, h, tail pipe or no tail pipe, turn down, side exit, etc...EVERYTHING!  If you know it, post it!

I've got to finish the car, make a few vids of some events held here, and a few other things, but I will slowly get back on this.  I had started it late last winter, but put it on the backburner.  I take my time, but anything I do I will do to the best of my ability.  It won't be in a month, it may not be this year, but rest assured at some point I will make it happen for the Mopar community.

You can post here, e-mail me, PM me, whatever...I will give credit to each user that helps compile the sound clips etc.  Again, don't expect to see it any time soon, but I think it is worth waiting for 

[Foreman72]

If everyone is cool with me archiving the links I'll use them as a basis for the database.

This will be very time consuming and I have a few projects to get done first, but this is something that I've wanted to do for 10 years now.

If anyone wants to contribute get a vid, give the adequate info, and if possible provide dyno #s, ETs, and weather conditions.  If I do this I want it to be the be-all and end-all exhaust database.

It is unrealistic for me to expect dyno #s, flow #s, and DB levels from everyone, and for some the weather conditions will be a stretch, but by all means if you've got them post them.

Also "adequate info" refers to more than just "2.5" Cherry Bombs.  I am a stickler for details.  I want to know compression, cam, heads, headers, CID, pipe size and material, straight, x or, h, tail pipe or no tail pipe, turn down, side exit, etc...EVERYTHING!  If you know it, post it!

I've got to finish the car, make a few vids of some events held here, and a few other things, but I will slowly get back on this.  I had started it late last winter, but put it on the backburner.  I take my time, but anything I do I will do to the best of my ability.  It won't be in a month, it may not be this year, but rest assured at some point I will make it happen for the Mopar community.

You can post here, e-mail me, PM me, whatever...I will give credit to each user that helps compile the sound clips etc.  Again, don't expect to see it any time soon, but I think it is worth waiting for 

i'm looking forward to reading this...

[firefighter3931]

If everyone is cool with me archiving the links I'll use them as a basis for the database.

This will be very time consuming and I have a few projects to get done first, but this is something that I've wanted to do for 10 years now.

If anyone wants to contribute get a vid, give the adequate info, and if possible provide dyno #s, ETs, and weather conditions.  If I do this I want it to be the be-all and end-all exhaust database.

It is unrealistic for me to expect dyno #s, flow #s, and DB levels from everyone, and for some the weather conditions will be a stretch, but by all means if you've got them post them.

Also "adequate info" refers to more than just "2.5" Cherry Bombs.  I am a stickler for details.  I want to know compression, cam, heads, headers, CID, pipe size and material, straight, x or, h, tail pipe or no tail pipe, turn down, side exit, etc...EVERYTHING!  If you know it, post it!

I've got to finish the car, make a few vids of some events held here, and a few other things, but I will slowly get back on this.  I had started it late last winter, but put it on the backburner.  I take my time, but anything I do I will do to the best of my ability.  It won't be in a month, it may not be this year, but rest assured at some point I will make it happen for the Mopar community.

You can post here, e-mail me, PM me, whatever...I will give credit to each user that helps compile the sound clips etc.  Again, don't expect to see it any time soon, but I think it is worth waiting for 

i'm looking forward to reading this...

Me too ! Sounds like an excellent project 

TS, we have an archive section called the proven engine builds....once you begin the thread & data compilation I'll move it over there for permenant archive. I should have some data/track times on mine, very soon. 



Ron

[TexasStroker]

Glad I'm not the only one who likes the idea...I need to find my files where I last stopped working.

Hopefully I can get started on it within a few weeks...and finished as soon as possible, even if it takes awhile...My free time is basically weekends and after 10 PM, lol.

[Belgium R/T -68]

I definetly learned a lot again by what I thought was a simple question, turning out to be a whole sience.

Per

[Purple440]

I definetly learned a lot again by what I thought was a simple question, turning out to be a whole sience.

Per

Good questions can usually do this. 

[Foreman72]

I definetly learned a lot again by what I thought was a simple question, turning out to be a whole sience.

Per

i was waiting for something like that

[1970440RT]

I will also add that my 6 year old 50 series Flowmasters rotted from the inside out. 

The passenger side blew out the bottom at the track last year ( pretty embarassing )and the drivers side gave up the ghost last month on the highway.  Way too much backpressure to do something like that.  I welded plates on the bottom as temporary fixes but I will not be buying Flowmasters again. 

They were aluminized not stainless but still should be in one piece on a car that I drive 5 to 6 thousand miles a year.  

[c00nhunterjoe]

my aluminized 40 series have been on my car for 8 or 9 years now and i got them used from my cousin who ran them for about 6 years and he got them from a car show used......... sounds liek you got a bad batch or something. rotted from the inside out sounds liek you had water laying in them?

[mikesbbody]

I found this maybe you guy's might be interested   http://racetruck.tripod.com/muffler.html
It was from a F..d magazine 

[1970440RT]

I don't think I had water in them as they were brand new when installed.  The rest of the exhaust is aluminized and no problems.

I called the mfr. as I was p.o.'d and of course, 3 year warranty on aluminized.

Replacements will probably be Dynomax.  Ron hasn't steered me wrong yet, I'll go with what he recommends.

[Road Dog]

Run Flowmasters on the Dodge. Put them on 20 years and 200,000 miles ago. They are in great shape. Had a fella in a new mustang tell me he wishes his car sounded that good.

[firefighter3931]

Here's a good read on Ultraflows with actual track results....open headers vs full exhaust.   

http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=5411262&an=0&page=0&gonew=1#UNREAD



Ron

[b5blue]

So at the bottom of the page it's pointed out "the X pipe builds torque", do you agree Ron? I've read X pipes are quieter also? Just thinking X or H pipe is a variable for testing. 

[firefighter3931]

So at the bottom of the page it's pointed out "the X pipe builds torque", do you agree Ron? I've read X pipes are quieter also? Just thinking X or H pipe is a variable for testing. 

Neal, i've seen plenty of Chassis Dyno data that supports the X-pipe arguement....increased RWL horsepower & Torque. 

I have one on my car....it sounds slightly different than the typical H-pipe...quieter for sure. Of course that's a relative term....how quiet can it be with 3in exhaust and straight-thru mufflers. 


Ron

[b5blue]

Thanks Ron I was toying with the idea of running an x pipe and resonators, no mufflers. I ran a Z/28 "back in the day" with a cheater pipe in place of the cat. converter and just resonators (kinda made a X, maybe more like 2 Y's) the car ran great and sounded really cool. (?)

[c00nhunterjoe]

x-pipe flows better then the h, obviously, and they equalize the exhaust flow from both banks very well. helps out a great deal. a worth while investment