Fender tag and truemusclecars

[rooroo]

Two questions for everyone:
1. I'm looking to buy a 69 charger. Should I be overly concerned whether a car has it's fender tag or not? Assuming rest of car is solid does it have a big impact on the value? 2. Anyone know the type of quality american classic muscle cars (truemusclecars.com) puts into their restorations? I won't even look their way if their rep is bad. Thanks.

[68X426]

With all the cons out there, having no tag leaves you vulnerable to every alleged Hemi, Dana, A12, numbers matching, etc. scam going. The tag can be faked but at least the buyer stands a chance of minimizing the risk. Example: see the thread about the General Lee currently going. I bet the seller is saying its a Hemi or 440. The tag helps lower risk. 

[Dans 68]

Having a tag only tells you "how" the car came from the factory. As mentioned above there are a fair number of upper end cars that have faked tags. A true muscle car could be a 318 car upgraded to what you want. Unless you want to show the car, or it is just important to have that pedigree, it isn't needed to be a muscle car. 

Dan

[BigBlockSam]

 

[68X426]

rooroo: I should add to what Dan said. If it's a driver or racer then the tag doesn't matter. Muscle is muscle. If you choose to show it/brag on it then the pedigree and history means everything IMHO and you want the real tag.

Of my 4 Mopars, if three didn't have tags, absolutely no one would care. They are fun, they drive and race, but the tag is no big deal.

My Road Runner's tag is everything, it is its heritage and I wouldn't have bought the Runner without the tag. Or, equally, without the receipts, clean title, and lots of info on the builders too. So I guess that means the tag is worth 10k or 20k of the total value. (Which is now well north of 50k but then again it's not for sale).

So you got choices based on your personal priorities about what you expect from the Charger.

Sorry don't know anything about truemusclecars.com. 

[472 R/T SE]

truemusclecars.com is HLPAG's new name.

Different name, same junk.  Do a search on HLPAG.  Run & run fast!!!

[A383Wing]

Run & run fast!!!

RUN FORREST, RUN! 

[drifter69]

You need to ask yourself what it is that you want and start there.

[1969chargerrtse]

Well here's my thought as my tag is missing.  By matching my trunk lip number and radiator number I know my car is a real R/T by the XS29 vin. By pulling the sail panel headliner piece I know it's a true SE car as there are just 2 holes for the SE emblem. It's a true A/C car as the firewall has the Fan popping out of it. It's a true PW car as it obvious by holes,wires, old plastic covering over the opening etc. All the other options like PS, PB etc don't change the value to much. So I paid out my butt for it. The fender tag would be great to have but the facts of what I just mentioned matter most. Some day someone will beg me to sell them the car and they probably won't know or care what a fender tag is. Until then I am the proud owner of a real R/T SE and it's not for sale. I was one if those guys that wanted everything numbers match, today most people are just grateful to be a Charger owner of any matter or condition. Fender tags are fantastic to have but ownership beats everything no matter the shape or tag.  

[rooroo]

My only reason for asking the question is whether the tag significantly decreases the value. I know the car is not an SE or R/T already. I am comfortable with the condition and restoration of the car but don't want to purchase it and then have a chorus of people telling me I paid too much simply because it lacked a fender tag. I look at the car a both a passion and investment. I would have no intention of selling it BUT I also don't want something that is worth significantly less than what I paid for it.

[Tilar]

2. Anyone know the type of quality american classic muscle cars (truemusclecars.com) puts into their restorations? I won't even look their way if their rep is bad. Thanks.

Just the fact that they use gmail.com for emails when they own their own domain should be enough to raise suspicion. Just like was mentioned above, do a search on HLPAG since that is who they really are and then be glad that you asked about them BEFORE you buy.

[carolina charger]

Once you get the tiltle and registration in your name, you can buy a fender tag. If its a car you are interested in I wouldn't let a missing tag  bother me.

[1969chargerrtse]

My only reason for asking the question is whether the tag significantly decreases the value. I know the car is not an SE or R/T already. I am comfortable with the condition and restoration of the car but don't want to purchase it and then have a chorus of people telling me I paid too much simply because it lacked a fender tag. I look at the car a both a passion and investment. I would have no intention of selling it BUT I also don't want something that is worth significantly less than what I paid for it.

To answer your question on a non R/T or SE car. No. The value won't be hurt much as it's still a 69 Charger.  As suggested find out what is original options and have a tag made. Remember though, good mature people in the hobby won't even mention the lack of it to you, and who cares what Joe public without a Charger thinks?  An other idea is to just tell anyone that ask that it's at home for security reasons. That's what I've done several times. They are held in by nothing more than 2 screws. Missing the tag won't hurt the value.

[Mike DC]

    

Let's say you have 3 matching identical R/Ts in front of you:  


--  One is an original R/T, with its original tags & drivetrain.  It's worth $40k.  $25k for the physical car and $15k for the tags.  

--  The second car has same R/T mechanical parts on it as the first one now, but it has its original factory 318 tags.  The owner freely admits that he took a factory 318 car and cloned an R/T out of it.  This car is worth $25k, all of that value for the car's physical condition right now.  

--  The third one appears to be the same thing as the first one, but there is some question about the tags.




Now, the 3rd one is worth $40k if the R/T tags are legit, just like the first one.  If the tags are phony, then it's worth $25k.  

But no amount of phony tags and number deceptions on this third car could ever make it worth less than $25k.  Because that's the least value that any possible original identity could make it worth.  (Well, unless it turns out to be full-blown stolen property or it has a lien on it or something.)

 

[1969chargerrtse]

   

Let's say you have 3 matching identical R/Ts in front of you:  


--  One is an original R/T, with its original tags & drivetrain.  It's worth $40k.  $25k for the physical car and $15k for the tags.  

--  The second car has same R/T mechanical parts on it as the first one now, but it has its original factory 318 tags.  The owner freely admits that he took a factory 318 car and cloned an R/T out of it.  This car is worth $25k, all of that value for the car's physical condition right now.  

--  The third one appears to be the same thing as the first one, but there is some question about the tags.




Now, the 3rd one is worth $40k if the R/T tags are legit, just like the first one.  If the tags are phony, then it's worth $25k.  

But no amount of phony tags and number deceptions on this third car could ever make it worth less than $25k.  Because that's the least value that any possible original identity could make it worth.  (Well, unless it turns out to be full-blown stolen property or it has a lien on it or something.)

 

I disagree that the thrid one is worth about 25k compared to the exact 40k car. I would think the car would be more closer to 30 to 35 if just missing the tag but numbers match with correct R/T Vin?

[Mike DC]

No, I was meaning the third car has a VIN that is also suspect. 

[1969chargerrtse]

No, I was meaning the third car has a VIN that is also suspect. 

O 

[BROCK]

It's all about resale value & as stated bragging rights.  If you want a car to build your way, then
such things like fendertags & buildsheets won't matter.  If you're looking for a car that is a survivor,
or restorable to factory stock, then even if it is a 318 or 6 cylinder the fendertag & buildsheet do
matter.

For your benefit:  Don't buy a car that needs a fendertag etc to be stock - if that is the direction
you choose.  It will be the biggest of all money pits.

For the cars' benefit:  Don't buy a car that has all the factory stuff - only to hotrod it.

[69 OUR/TEA]

In 2002 I bought an EV2  matching numbers 70 AAR (project) without fender tags from Florida from a very reputable member over on moparts.He knew the car and orig owner for a long time,and bought it to flip.I was the first one to contact him,after numerous phone conversations,decided to buy it.He had other locals that were coming in person with cash,assuring him I was a serious buyer,and even being very far away,he did a gentlemens hand shake over the phone.That monday I mailed the $$$$$,that tues he overnighted me the orig florida title,thurs a truck was picking it up for me.
The reason for not having tags was another party was trying to buy the car and when the owner told them it was pretty much already spoken for,they took the tags off,stole!!!!!The buyer,guy I bought from,gets car and sees tags not there anymore,asks what happened to orig owner,he says the other people looked at it and must have taken.Party I got car from knows the others,being into mopars knew who they were.Contacts them and says I bought the car,give up the tags.Nope,you took the car from under me,never will you get them.
   Great!!!!Not the end of the world,AG backeast lives near me,I'll get the car verified and get new tags made,which I did.Kept in touch to see if they can ever get the orig tags,never happened.
   Six years go by,low and behold,on Ebay,a fender tag for an EV2 AAR in florida,excatly where my car is from,surfaces.WITH THE VIN NUMBERS CUT OFF!!!!Not rocket science,Iknew 100 % it would be my tag.I kept it cool,won it for a mere $53.00.Got the tag and when you flip it over,they missed about a 1/16" of the top of the numbers and you can clearly see my cars numbers.
  It was like a needle in a hay stack,never thought I would ever have the original.Once I had the tag,I then sent a message to the seller asking how'd you get that?As I have the car.Bails by saying he bought a parts car and it was on it! Does'nt matter now,gratefull to have the cars orig tag.Now,if I land the orig BS(found the wrong one in my car)that would be really great!!!!
  Having the fender tag is definitely a plus,but what are you going to do if its not there?If you 100% know the car is real and really want it and you're fine with it,buy it,if not and you are uncertain ,pass and wait for another one.

[69bronzeT5]

Contacts them and says I bought the car,give up the tags.Nope,you took the car from under me,never will you get them.
   Six years go by,low and behold,on Ebay,a fender tag for an EV2 AAR in florida,excatly where my car is from,surfaces.WITH THE VIN NUMBERS CUT OFF!!!!Not rocket science,Iknew 100 % it would be my tag.I kept it cool,won it for a mere $53.00.Got the tag and when you flip it over,they missed about a 1/16" of the top of the numbers and you can clearly see my cars numbers.
  It was like a needle in a hay stack,never thought I would ever have the original.Once I had the tag,I then sent a message to the seller asking how'd you get that?As I have the car.Bails by saying he bought a parts car and it was on it!

What a bunch of dicks I hate people like that. 

[Brock Lee]

I did a car show once where someone picked at and bent my fender tag. Ever since then I have remove it and leave it with the broadcast sheet in that cars documents folder.