ELECTRICAL DASH PROBLEMS

[Nassau1969]

Ok Hello everyone. Hope someone can help. IM NOT NEW TO MOPARS so its hard to ask for assistance. My history, I still have a 1969 R/T Charger with 57,000 original miles I bought in HS in 1983 and bought a 1970 R/T 4 years ago and have had a few other Chargers in-between. Ok the problem I think (Wiring or a Ground somewhere). My car was totally resorted 1 1/2 years ago 100% rotisserie on the 1970 R/T Charger 4spd. Everything new I mean everything new or NOS. All new wiring harnesses (Painless) head light motor wiper motor you name it - it was done. Dash restored & gauges restored by Auto instruments steering wheel and column restored with everything new steering box restored everything. Ok the problem. Just recently the car was giving me a hard time with starting, I would turn the key sometimes nothing sometimes it would start. I would have to start it off the relay every so often under the hood with a screw driver then it went to starting it off the relay all the time. I Changed the relay with a auto trany one and that seemed to solve that problem, at the same time before I changed the relay if the car was idling and I turned on the head lights the engine would shut down if I was giving it a little throttle it would not stall out. Ok now that has all stopped with the relay changed. This has been happeneing since I recieved the car back I put the high beams on all the headlights shut off and I hear a clicking in the head light relay switch and the emergency red dash brake light dims to almost out. I changed the floor high beam switch and its still the same problem.  Ok now after changing the starter relay getting it to start nicely again headlights go on engine stays running, now  I have no dash lights after the relay was changed. Map light still works. I'm starting to get really pissed off.  I think its a ground problem somewhere. Also I have been looking everywhere for a manual starter relay switch anyone no where to get one, everyone I see outhere is for auto trany car. I must say I had my gauges done by auto instruments I'm some what not to pleased with them. The temp gauge is way off and the alt gauge and Tach are not working as well as they should, the alt gauge the needle fell off the other day. The tach is at zero when its idling Any suggestions / advice.

[nascarxx29]

Check on the other related wiring posts .You will find similar wiring experiences .And how to diagnose and fix.

[nascarxx29]

You got a aftermarket painless wiring so original diagram colors do not not apply . But still same principals.Your starter relay in most case the automatic type one with extra terminal either went to the clutch pedal safety switch. And clutch had to be pushed down in order to start.Or that extra terminal got soldered back to the case by the factory to make it a 4 speed type relay .Or you can make up a short jumper wire and ground it.Is your electrical 70 type in the column ignition switch ever been replaced and check its connection to harness .Being as your staring off the relay.The other electrical issues  clicking headlights relay dimming emergency brake light warning light.Maybe be a intermitant +power connection or_ ground connection .Making them might work at times or flicker on or off causing things to glow and click.The dash lights are fused by a 3 amp.And the roll switch control adjusts dimming.And get its power from the headlight swich .But if there a dash cluster ground issue they will not work or flicker on and off

[Nassau1969]

Thanks nascarxx29,
I had a old auto relay lying around from my 69 and put it in. I do not need to have the clutch pushed down to start it. The entire steering column was restored and the ignition switch replaced. Also electronic ignition was added to this car. Now the jumper wire to ground the relay, which terminal should I do it from ? all connectors on the really are being used. The dash lights are not flickering there just out now as of 2 days ago. The dimmer switch on the dash is a brand new NOS one and was working 4 days ago. I have only put 1800 mile on the car since resto. When I hit the high beam switch to get the brights working and the emergence brake light dims and flickers I hit the floor switch right back I don't want to fry and wires. What wiring harness is out there that will match original colors.

[nascarxx29]

You have this type of starter relay.The terminal that slants is the ignition contact from key switch.The other terminal besides that one is not angled .Thats the one you want to put a terminal connector and wire and back to ground.To make it start by the key switch by
bypassing the neutral safety or clutch switch function

[Nassau1969]

Ok this is what I have there is a green wire already there. Not sure if that's a ground. I'll trace it and I'll add another one if its not. The green wire also looks as if its the only one that was not replaced.

[nascarxx29]

That green wire originally should have went to the firewall and into clutch pedal start switch.If you dont use that switch .That wire coming off relay should be grounded .Or the only way you cant start up .Is by underhood crossing the relay

[Nassau1969]

Little lost now, should I leave it the way it is or set it up to the clutch pedal start switch, and then ground the relay.
Danny

[nascarxx29]

Try a temporary bypass by grounding the green wire and see if you start by the key again.Then go back to how it was hooked up and see if it starts by the key.You can do either clutch pushed pedal in to start to ground relay termninal .Or ground terminal out with the wire going to it.You cant do both

[Nassau1969]

Hello XX29, did the bypass surgery and it went well.  I grounded it from the relay and it started up with the green wire off. I left it unplugged altogether got nothing, so that's a good sign. Now the clutch pedal start switch that should be by the pedal correct just like the brake switch. This is my first 4 sped car so bare with me. So now I have to get that wire to the clutch pedal correct. And that should be one problem solved. Then I'll start on the dash lights.

[Nassau1969]

d

[nascarxx29]

Its optional if you hook up the clutch pedal saftey switch.You can unhook the green wire.Make a wire and terminal .From where the green wire connection was on relay back to a ground.And not need the clutch safety switch.Thats if you can locate a new or used one

[nascarxx29]

With the relays you have available they work for automatic and 4 speed.The 4 speed wire up usually has it going to the clutch pedal inside the car on the pedal with a green wire back to relay.Or you can ground it and eliminate the need to push in clutch over and over again and start the car in any gear which you have to be carefull .The automatic has a wire going to neutral safety switch.To only start in Neutral or Park.If you bypass it then you can start car in every gear range aswell.

[Nassau1969]

Thanks for your help, do you know if those wires can be purchased separately or just buy the connectors and make my own. Maybe if you have time think about this one >>>> I checked the fuse box all fuses are good, I check all with a meter, the instrument fuse is hot on the bottom but not at the top of the fuse box ?
Danny

[nascarxx29]

You have to make up your own wire for the relay,As for the dashlights.Theres a orange wire that feeds the pin on the circuit board where that flat pin connector pushes on cluster That lights all the dashlights.And be sure your twist in bulb sockets lock in on both sides and bulbs and circuit board are good.And the circuit board where the bulb sockets twist in .Is clean copper.The other wire should be tan that goes to roll switch and should be hot when headlight switch is activated to provide power for dash lights from the tan wire your not getting power from.If you jump power into the orange wire bypassing the roll switch you should get lights.The top of the fuse is either tan or orange.And bottom of fuse is either tan or orange.And what I do is take power from near by hot fuse with a 12 volt testlight showing power with a jumper wire.And touch dash light fuse where its mounted  at top or bottom of fuse and see what happens.If orange wire lights them .Then you not getting power to roll switch from headlight switch

[Nassau1969]

Well I hope its the same color codes as the old harness, I put all new harnesses in when the car was done. Thanks again for all your help.
Danny

[nascarxx29]

Anytime you need help just ask .Good luck with dashlights

[hemi68charger]

Is the dash frame grounding properly to the chassis of the car? What I mean is with a total resto. there are areas that get painted better than the factory ever intended it to. So maybe the dash frame itself isn't grounding. I know it's a long-shot. Also, may dang sure your bulkhead connection is properly connected. I would hate to think your harnesses were made inferior......

Troy

[nascarxx29]

Along with dash frame being checked for ground .Be sure they used the right small headed phillips attaching the cluster.If you got a 12 volt testlight attached to + source and touch dash cluster or its mounting frame .The light should light.Alot of mopar issues are grounds and loose connections

[Nassau1969]

OK I want to thank you all who help assist me, I hope I can return the favor one day. When I figure out t he high beam problem I'll post it. Now I have a Grille issue. Some parts I can see getting lost in resto Process. I'll try here before I go to the another column. What does the bracket look like that holds the corner of the 70 Charger grille up in place look like.

[nascarxx29]

The headlight harness should ground somewhere rad support etc.That may be your headlight cut out and clicking

[Nassau1969]

I will check that next, I will let you no over the weekend if I solve the problem thanks.

[nascarxx29]

Sounds good