318 engine build

[paulgrr63]

Yet another 318 thread 

I have a bone stock 1973 318. 8 1/4" rear with 2.71 gears. I'm looking for a little more power (aren't we all) Also changing the gears.
Here is what I have so far:

Carb: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=HLY-0-80570

Intake: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=DCC-4876335

Cam: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=CCA-CL20-222-3

Heads(302 casting but are off Ebay.....good choice?): http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CHRYSLER-5-2L-318-ci-85-91-Cylinder-Head-REMANUFACTURED_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1171Q7c66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem22fe5f8856QQitemZ150296561750QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

Valve covers: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=DCC-5007611
Air cleaner: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=DCC-5249807
I'm going to paint the engine orange while its out. Not too fond of the baby blue color.

Rear end parts:
Ring and pinion: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=RMG-CR825355

Sure grip: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=DCC-4529273

Ignition: Got nothing........need help with a good setup


PLEASE......feel free to criticize this build. I want to do it right the first time around


PS: Thanks for the help on my other threads

[firefighter3931]

That's a good looking combination of parts....well done ! 

The only thing i might change is the carb....holley makes a 570cfm avenger which would be better suited to this build, inmo.

I would also recommend a new double roller timing chain and possibly a set of headers and 2.25in dual exhaust.

Youn might also be looking at a set of valvesprings....depends whether ot not the springs on those 302's are compatible with your xe cam. 


Ron

[paulgrr63]

That's a good looking combination of parts....well done ! 

The only thing i might change is the carb....holley makes a 570cfm avenger which would be better suited to this build, inmo.

I would also recommend a new double roller timing chain and possibly a set of headers and 2.25in dual exhaust.

Youn might also be looking at a set of valvesprings....depends whether ot not the springs on those 302's are compatible with your xe cam. 


Ron

Sounds good. I'll add this carb to the list http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=HLY-0-80570&N=700+4294925239+400178+4294919007+4294891681+4294902726+1051506941+115&autoview=sku

Is this a good double roller? http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=DCC-5249131&autoview=sku

I already have 3" dual exhaust TTI headers are definitely on my shopping list
Also, do you think I'll be ok with buying the heads off of ebay? That price is unbeatable.

I've done a ton of reading on here and the ignition seems to be something that must be changed. Do you have any suggestions?

[flyinlow]

Assuming you have the stock electronic ignition and the distributor is healty, all you need is an advance curve spring set .  I put a MSD ignition box on my 73 while I still had the 318 in it . Worked well and has a revlimiter.

If your going to that much work on the rear axle you might want to consider finding a 8 3/4 axle.

[paulgrr63]

Assuming you have the stock electronic ignition and the distributor is healty, all you need is an advance curve spring set .  I put a MSD ignition box on my 73 while I still had the 318 in it . Worked well and has a revlimiter.

If your going to that much work on the rear axle you might want to consider finding a 8 3/4 axle.

That crossed my mind several times. There are plenty of 8 3/4 axles out there for little $$. If I get a 8 3/4 is it plug and play or do I have to do any major changes?

It has the stock ignition and a new distributor.

[mikepmcs]

I already have 3" dual exhaust

WWRWD.  Ron, isn't this too much exhaust for this application?  Won't this rob the low end pull? Paul's wanting to beef it up but might not realize the gains given the size of the exhaust??   

[Foreman72]

the stock ignition is pretty hardy...by that i mean this kit...

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=DCC-3690426&N=700+4294925143+4294908110+4294908099+4294840085+4294925079+115&autoview=sku

which is based off of stock...you said you already had a new dist so you can just purchase the ECU (orange box to be specific) and run with that...but if your looking for big time ignition hop up then MSD is great, Mallory has a great kit too...but check out these articles, they should provide you with some solid info in regards to your 318...which i also have...

so  to not scrapping 318s for BBs...good man

http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tech/0810phr_chrysler_318_engine/index.html

(this is what i'm doing to mine)

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/mopp_0409_318_engine_build/index.html

good luck! looking forward to seeing the progress since i'll be hopefully tearing mine apart soon...

btw...great looking engine...

[flyinlow]

On 73-74's they mounted the leaf springs in a rubber  isolator, tring to turn the Charger into a personal luxury car. The perches on the axle are different.

A 73-74 Charger,RR  axle with 11 inch brakes would be the ideal choice.

The 8 3/4 I put in mine came out of  a 71 RR.  It works if you use the shock plates from the older year. I got the plates at Mancini racing. Try to get the one you need with the rear a.xle. The older ones have no rubber isolators. They work fine.

. The driveshaft will work if the the 8 3/4 has 7260 (small ujoint) companion flange. If not you can put a conversion ujoint in the rear ujoint.

[paulgrr63]

the stock ignition is pretty hardy...by that i mean this kit...

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=DCC-3690426&N=700+4294925143+4294908110+4294908099+4294840085+4294925079+115&autoview=sku

which is based off of stock...you said you already had a new dist so you can just purchase the ECU (orange box to be specific) and run with that...but if your looking for big time ignition hop up then MSD is great, Mallory has a great kit too...but check out these articles, they should provide you with some solid info in regards to your 318...which i also have...

so  to not scrapping 318s for BBs...good man

http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tech/0810phr_chrysler_318_engine/index.html

(this is what i'm doing to mine)

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/mopp_0409_318_engine_build/index.html

good luck! looking forward to seeing the progress since i'll be hopefully tearing mine apart soon...

btw...great looking engine...

Thanks for the info

[paulgrr63]

On 73-74's they mounted the leaf springs in a rubber  isolator, tring to turn the Charger into a personal luxury car. The perches on the axle are different.

A 73-74 Charger,RR  axle with 11 inch brakes would be the ideal choice.

The 8 3/4 I put in mine came out of  a 71 RR.  It works if you use the shock plates from the older year. I got the plates at Mancini racing. Try to get the one you need with the rear a.xle. The older ones have no rubber isolators. They work fine.

. The driveshaft will work if the the 8 3/4 has 7260 (small ujoint) companion flange. If not you can put a conversion ujoint in the rear ujoint.

I'll be lookin out for rear with 11" brakes

[firefighter3931]

That's a good looking combination of parts....well done ! 

The only thing i might change is the carb....holley makes a 570cfm avenger which would be better suited to this build, inmo.

I would also recommend a new double roller timing chain and possibly a set of headers and 2.25in dual exhaust.

Youn might also be looking at a set of valvesprings....depends whether ot not the springs on those 302's are compatible with your xe cam. 


Ron

Sounds good. I'll add this carb to the list http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=HLY-0-80570&N=700+4294925239+400178+4294919007+4294891681+4294902726+1051506941+115&autoview=sku

Is this a good double roller? http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=DCC-5249131&autoview=sku

I already have 3" dual exhaust TTI headers are definitely on my shopping list
Also, do you think I'll be ok with buying the heads off of ebay? That price is unbeatable.

I've done a ton of reading on here and the ignition seems to be something that must be changed. Do you have any suggestions?

The carb is fine. I like the Comp Cams Magnum double roller chain sets....better quality than the MP stuff and usually less $$ as well. 

The stock distributor is fine....as mentioned above they are easy enough to recurve with a spring kit. The MSD box is a great addition if funds permit. The heads are a great deal....jump on them. 

The 3in exhaust is overkill but as long as your headers are sized properly it will work fine....just be noisier than a smaller exhaust system.


Ron

[firefighter3931]

WWRWD.  Ron, isn't this too much exhaust for this application?  Won't this rob the low end pull? Paul's wanting to beef it up but might not realize the gains given the size of the exhaust??   

Mike, the more critical dimension is the header primary tube diameter....exhaust pipe diameter has some bearing on performance but in this case as long as the headers are sized properly it will be OK. Big tube headers are the real torque killer. When the headers are too big the scavenging effect is lost and intake reversion occurs....diluting the incoming intake charge and robbing torque. 

That being said....a 1 5/8 primary tube header is the right choice for this build. 



Ron

[paulgrr63]

That's a good looking combination of parts....well done ! 

The only thing i might change is the carb....holley makes a 570cfm avenger which would be better suited to this build, inmo.

I would also recommend a new double roller timing chain and possibly a set of headers and 2.25in dual exhaust.

Youn might also be looking at a set of valvesprings....depends whether ot not the springs on those 302's are compatible with your xe cam. 


Ron

Sounds good. I'll add this carb to the list http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=HLY-0-80570&N=700+4294925239+400178+4294919007+4294891681+4294902726+1051506941+115&autoview=sku

Is this a good double roller? http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=DCC-5249131&autoview=sku

I already have 3" dual exhaust TTI headers are definitely on my shopping list
Also, do you think I'll be ok with buying the heads off of ebay? That price is unbeatable.

I've done a ton of reading on here and the ignition seems to be something that must be changed. Do you have any suggestions?

The carb is fine. I like the Comp Cams Magnum double roller chain sets....better quality than the MP stuff and usually less $$ as well. 

The stock distributor is fine....as mentioned above they are easy enough to recurve with a spring kit. The MSD box is a great addition if funds permit. The heads are a great deal....jump on them. 

The 3in exhaust is overkill but as long as your headers are sized properly it will work fine....just be noisier than a smaller exhaust system.


Ron

Added this to my cart: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=CCA-2103&autoview=sku

Ron, everyone, thanks for the help

[firefighter3931]

I'd say you're all set.  Just have the valvesprings checked out to make sure they're compatible with your cam and start building. 


Ron

[paulgrr63]

I'd say you're all set.  Just have the valvesprings checked out to make sure they're compatible with your cam and start building. 


Ron

Will do. I will update this thread(with pics) as soon as the build gets going

[paulgrr63]

I'd say you're all set.  Just have the valvesprings checked out to make sure they're compatible with your cam and start building. 


Ron

One more question.....looked on ebay again and found these heads http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/88-91-Chrysler-318-Cast-302-Cylinder-Head-Pair_W0QQitemZ270346550239QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item3ef1e8fbdf&_trksid=p4506.m20.l1116   $340 with shipping.

The other heads would be $400.

Should I go with the cheaper set? I don't see a difference.

[devilgear]

I have question for you...I am just curious..You have a great car by the way, I have a 73 as well...You are doing alot of work with the stock 318, and unless you are just trying to keep evrything stock for the most part....Why not build a 440 or something with more power to begin with? Seems like it would be money better spent to start with a motor that you may keep in there as opposed to one you may throw alot of money at and not be as happy with...Just asking is all....Either way you have a great ride...

[firefighter3931]

I'd say you're all set.  Just have the valvesprings checked out to make sure they're compatible with your cam and start building. 


Ron

One more question.....looked on ebay again and found these heads http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/88-91-Chrysler-318-Cast-302-Cylinder-Head-Pair_W0QQitemZ270346550239QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item3ef1e8fbdf&_trksid=p4506.m20.l1116   $340 with shipping.

The other heads would be $400.

Should I go with the cheaper set? I don't see a difference.

Paul,

If you read the descriptions on both e-bay auctions you will notice the difference. The first listing show's heads with new valves while the second listing has reground valves. The idea of brand new valves is more appealing to me....but that's your call. 



Ron

[paulgrr63]

I have question for you...I am just curious..You have a great car by the way, I have a 73 as well...You are doing alot of work with the stock 318, and unless you are just trying to keep evrything stock for the most part....Why not build a 440 or something with more power to begin with? Seems like it would be money better spent to start with a motor that you may keep in there as opposed to one you may throw alot of money at and not be as happy with...Just asking is all....Either way you have a great ride...

I thought about that but I just want a mostly stock car with a decent motor. I'm not looking for a huge gas guzzler powerhouse. I am about to sell my boat(not the green one in my sig) and I'm going to use some of the money for the car.  Around 3k on the engine and the rest will be used for the rust it has and some paint touch ups

[paulgrr63]

I'd say you're all set.  Just have the valvesprings checked out to make sure they're compatible with your cam and start building. 


Ron

One more question.....looked on ebay again and found these heads http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/88-91-Chrysler-318-Cast-302-Cylinder-Head-Pair_W0QQitemZ270346550239QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item3ef1e8fbdf&_trksid=p4506.m20.l1116   $340 with shipping.

The other heads would be $400.

Should I go with the cheaper set? I don't see a difference.

Paul,

If you read the descriptions on both e-bay auctions you will notice the difference. The first listing show's heads with new valves while the second listing has reground valves. The idea of brand new valves is more appealing to me....but that's your call. 



Ron

New sounds better

How much HP do you think this combo will put out?

[devilgear]

Hey man that is cool...I just ask cause most of us are power whores...hahaha

[paulgrr63]

Hey man that is cool...I just ask cause most of us are power whores...hahaha

I'm gonna get a BB for sure......its just gonna have a car with it. I plan on getting a 71 or 72 Charger soon.

[flyinlow]

 

Make your car safe to drive, then put a cool sounding exhuast on it ,fix the body and have fun driving it. Work on the 318 as you have time.

I put a 446 in my Charger and thought I owned the road . Then I pulled up to a traffic light and a guy had a 446 in a Dart . Then the guy in the Dart pulled up to a traffic light next to a guy with a Hemi stroker in a go cart. Then the guy with the go cart pulled up to a traffic light next to a guy on a skateboard with a sidewinder missle straped to his back.............. Unless your last name is Force, there is always someone else thats faster.

[paulgrr63]

Make your car safe to drive, then put a cool sounding exhuast on it ,fix the body and have fun driving it. Work on the 318 as you have time.

I put a 446 in my Charger and thought I owned the road . Then I pulled up to a traffic light and a guy had a 446 in a Dart . Then the guy in the Dart pulled up to a traffic light next to a guy with a Hemi stroker in a go cart. Then the guy with the go cart pulled up to a traffic light next to a guy on a skateboard with a sidewinder missle straped to his back.............. Unless your last name is Force, there is always someone else thats faster.

My car is safe, sounds awesome, and %100 drivable. I'm just looking for a little more power

[firefighter3931]

How much HP do you think this combo will put out?

With the headers, increased compression/better heads, 4bbl and the XE cam it should be in the 300hp range, inmo. You will notice a significant difference over the current configuration. 

[paulgrr63]

How much HP do you think this combo will put out?

With the headers, increased compression/better heads, 4bbl and the XE cam it should be in the 300hp range, inmo. You will notice a significant difference over the current configuration. 

Thats what I was hoping to hear

[LeadfootBob]

I'd say forced induction... The payoff for building a small block just feels dumb when you can slap a centrifugal supercharger on the stock longblock and pull more horsepower without sacrificing a shred of driveability. Blowing up a stock 318 and finding a new one is easy, rebuilding a prepped engine is not. The only headache is the fuel delivery, force-fed carbs are a science and EFI might get pricey... just another factor to think about.