No 2010 Camaro???

[BLUE68RT4ME]

Has anyone had time to read the article in Car and Driver about Chevy's concerns about releasing the new Camaro?  I have not but my friend was texting me saying that he read it and it appears Chevy's concerned with releasing a muscle car with the loan money that the government gave them.  What on Earth would they do?     There's no way to justify the loss of NOT selling them, right?  If they didn't I'd go knocking on their door demanding my tax money back because they're just throwing it away!   

A side note, I don't like the looks as much as the Challenger and the Mustang.  The grill has a resemblence to the smile a stoner gets after taking a hit, but that's just my opinion and yes... my imagination can get away from me at times.   

[Troy]

Yet another reason why it's bad to have government too involved in business. Businesses typically understand customers where the government couldn't run a lemonade stand.

I believe they've already got a lot of inventory so I can't imagine them sitting on the cars. The whole idea of recovery depends on selling products.

Troy

[Ghoste]

And at the same time I can understand GM's fears.  I'm sure there are still some in their structure that recall the fear they once held about anti-trust suits.  You combine that with the ever tightening EPA regulations and the current wave of greeniness that is sweeping the nation with the government intervention and it makes a good case for a nice all purpose "people's kar".

[BLUE68RT4ME]

Yet another reason why it's bad to have government too involved in business. Businesses typically understand customers where the government couldn't run a lemonade stand.

I believe they've already got a lot of inventory so I can't imagine them sitting on the cars. The whole idea of recovery depends on selling products.

Troy

My thoughts too.  Sounded to me as though it's more of a PR ploy, seeking pity so the press doesn't hammer them for making muscle cars on tax money.  This whole situation is upsetting.  I honestly don't want any of the Big 3 to go down, but there has to be better solutions than this.  That said, I don't want to take this any further politically.   

Has anyone read the article?

[dodgecharger-fan]

All of the auto mags that have test driven these cars better hide them and stop answering the phone. 

[Rolling_Thunder]

ive already seen one out on the open road...     

[mauve66]

update - with the new cafe requirements Obama signed last week all future cars will come with only 4 cyl motors by 2011 and all will be full hybrids by 2016, including trucks, no way around CAFE requirements, a V8 will never make it

[BLUE68RT4ME]

(Insert explitive here)!!!     I'm sure that won't cause any problems for farmers, ranchers, loggers, carpenters, etc!     Someone try telling me again how cool the Corvair was... I need a good laugh right now!   

[Mike DC]

Yet another reason why it's bad to have government too involved in business. Businesses typically understand customers where the government couldn't run a lemonade stand.

I believe they've already got a lot of inventory so I can't imagine them sitting on the cars. The whole idea of recovery depends on selling products.

Troy

update - with the new cafe requirements Obama signed last week all future cars will come with only 4 cyl motors by 2011 and all will be full hybrids by 2016, including trucks, no way around CAFE requirements, a V8 will never make it

My thoughts too.  Sounded to me as though it's more of a PR ploy, seeking pity so the press doesn't hammer them for making muscle cars on tax money.  This whole situation is upsetting.  I honestly don't want any of the Big 3 to go down, but there has to be better solutions than this.  That said, I don't want to take this any further politically.   RantExplode

Has anyone read the article?

Chevy's concerned with releasing a muscle car with the loan money that the government gave them.  What on Earth would they do?   ahum  There's no way to justify the loss of NOT selling them, right?  If they didn't I'd go knocking on their door demanding my tax money back because they're just throwing it away!   spank

Insert explitive here)!!!   RantExplode  I'm sure that won't cause any problems for farmers, ranchers, loggers, carpenters, etc!   sarcasm alert  Someone try telling me again how cool the Corvair was... I need a good laugh right now!   brickwall

If we didn't want the govt messing with our cars, then all we had to do was be in favor of allowing the price of gasoline rise instead.  It would have happened perfectly naturally through the demands of the free market as worldwide oil demand grows.

So, how many of you guys were in favor of letting gas prices rise?   




We did this CAFE problem to ourselves.

[Ghoste]

I think the government of the day would have been looking for a way to interfere with the evil car companies no matter what.  The bailout money gave them leverage far more than the price of gas. 

[69CoronetRT]

I think the government of the day would have been looking for a way to interfere with the evil car companies no matter what.  The bailout money gave them leverage far more than the price of gas. 

Ghoste,

very insightful, as usual.

[Mike DC]

I think the government of the day would have been looking for a way to interfere with the evil car companies no matter what.  The bailout money gave them leverage far more than the price of gas.

Yes, I agree.  

But people complain about the govt doing this stuff to the cars as if they had a big choice in the matter.  If the govt just stepped back & did nothing, then regular supply & demand would eventually crash the domestic economy with high gas prices (just because of sheer market forces).  


Nobody seems to look at it from the point of view that these increased CAFE rules will artificially CHEAPEN our gas.  The American public has CHOSEN this.  We have collectively spoken loud & clear that we will take any amount of CAFE regs as long as gasoline stays cheaper than bottled water.

 

[BLUE68RT4ME]

Hey Mike, I don't want to sound like I'm just complaining to complain.  Sorry if I did.  I understand that something had to be done and I haven't thought of anything better.  But, now that the money has been handed out, I can see many ways it will impact us.  I don't think this country will ever be the same again, in many respects.

As for the cheapening of gas, it will only cheapen it if the oil companies don't cut back production.  Once they calculate the future demand they'll calculate where they'll be most profitable in regards to production volume.  That may mean turning down production and charging more per gallon.    

[Mike DC]

 
Hey, it's cool.  Sorry if you took my post personally, I didn't mean it that way.  This issue has just become a total soapbox thing for me. 


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I don't see any way for worldwide oil production to actually be reduced any time soon.  It's only a question of trying to maintain current levels and increase where possible.  We're getting a huge percentage of our existing production from aging fields with outputs that are falling by the year. 

It's true that some wells may be stopped, but that often has a lot to do with "resting" the field.  (Over-pump a field and you will reduce its eventual total output in the future.)  That, and trying to build up some semblance of excess reserves for stabilization purposes.  The worldwide excess capacity (to turn on temporarily and offset short-term problems) is way too small anymore.  It was a lot bigger in the 1970s and we still had huge problems. 

[BLUE68RT4ME]

No problems Mike, I just didn't want give the impression of being a cronic complainer!  This post teeters on a fine line concerning politics and it wasn't my intent to push that side of it.  If people don't know where you're coming from things can get misunderstood and quickly heated.  I simply was inquiring about the article.  Anyway, it would be foolish to let a conversation about a Chevy come between Mopar guys!   Hope all is well! 

[69CoronetRT]

I think the government of the day would have been looking for a way to interfere with the evil car companies no matter what.  The bailout money gave them leverage far more than the price of gas.

If the govt just stepped back & did nothing, then regular supply & demand would eventually crash the domestic economy with high gas prices (just because of sheer market forces).   

Mike,

I'm sorry that makes no sense and goes against the laws of supply and demand. If the price of a commodity exceeds demand, the price goes down to meet demand. If supply can't keep up with demand, the price goes up. Oil/gas will only go as high as the demand allows it to. If demand goes down, the price goes down. Commodities will seek a balance unless artificial forces come into play.

I know we're not supposed to discuss politics on this board so how about we bring the topic back on track?
Will GM release the Camaro?

[Brock Samson]

 it's a done deal, i guess you didn't notice... 

[moparjohn]

I can't imagine driving a 1/2 engine car!  I have always had a V8 RWD car/truck. WHY WHY WHY is the only thing I like in cars sooooooooooo bad? (no answers please, I know why.)  

[dodgecharger-fan]

If they don't sell 'em, what are they going to do with all of these:

http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i249/lumpy92/Camaro/

You're friend is yanking your chain, I think.
For what it's worth, I couldn't find any articles on the car and driver web site like he described.

[keepat]

One of the black Camaros is mine! 
Pat

[Brock Samson]

 Remember we got the same kinda' thread about two weeks before the '09 Chally was released, some guy came on here talking about he heard that because of the high gas prices they decided not to release it...
A couple moments of simple google reasearch would lay these rumors to rest, just like a couple words in the search box will reveal a treasure trove of past threads about pretty much anything charger related,..   
I think folks especially new members just want to start a thread or discussion..    or stir the pot..   
I guess it's pretty much human nature. 

[JT01]

I have always loved camaros and I own a 71 SS but I think thease new ones are ugly. This is what they should of built                                                                                                                                                      

[Brock Samson]

   So here's the thread i was remembering which didn't turn out to be true...
Topic: Cerebrus Strangles 2008 Challenger:
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,33430.0.html
as regards which Camaro they should have built, they know the '69 is the most popular so they went that way..
the last Issue of Collector Automobile has an extensive article on their design rational. A great Magazine worth every penny CA is...

   and another topic about how the greenies are gonna kill the Chally..

Greens hate new Challenger (hard to imagine)
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,29806.0.html

[BLUE68RT4ME]

A couple moments of simple google reasearch would lay these rumors to rest, just like a couple words in the search box will reveal a treasure trove of past threads about pretty much anything charger related,..   
I think folks especially new members just want to start a thread or discussion..    or stir the pot..   
I guess it's pretty much human nature. 

Wow Brock, you sure assume a lot.  I asked if anyone's read the article because I hadn't.  My friend that DID read the article summarized it as I mentioned, but I asked for feedback from ANYONE ELSE who read the article.  He said the article is on page 13 of the April addition of Car and Driver.  And for your information I did read other threads but none of them mentioned their concerns about bringing the car to market.

I guess because I'm a new member I'm just not as worthy of speaking as you and I see that when you do you have to make sure everyone knows it.  Sorry to have caused you so much trouble.   If I were you I'd just ignore any other threads that us new-bies start because they will probably just waste your time.  

[Mike DC]

I'm sorry that makes no sense and goes against the laws of supply and demand. If the price of a commodity exceeds demand, the price goes down to meet demand. If supply can't keep up with demand, the price goes up. Oil/gas will only go as high as the demand allows it to. If demand goes down, the price goes down. Commodities will seek a balance unless artificial forces come into play.

You said "oil & gas will only go up as high as the demand allows it to." 

And I agree.  But the rules of the free market are exactly the problem now. 

Our own US population is growing.  China/ India/Russia/Middle east all add up to demanding just as much oil as we do already, and their demand will be absolutely EXPLODING in the coming decades.   

More people competing for the same supply of oil + worldwide daily oil supply is struggling to remain flat, let alone increase any more = prices can still rise even when people all use less individually. 


In the long run it's either higher CAFE standards or higher pump prices for the domestic US population.  We'll be very lucky if it's not both.


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I know we're not supposed to discuss politics on this board so how about we bring the topic back on track?
Will GM release the Camaro?

Yeah, they will most assuredly release it.  It'll just be quickly squeezed down in size & power in the coming years like everything else.  It looks like the 1970-74 Challenger experience all over again.