Daytona/500 rear window-Vega hatch or 'glass

[richRTSE]

I'm in the slow (well, very slow) process of building my clone. I have all the parts to build a 500, so I'll probably go that route for right now. But eventually I'd like to make it a Daytona, or maybe build both. Right now I have a fiberglas plug and lexan window from Janak. I just found a Vega hatch here locally that I'm thinking of getting, and just wondering which would be the better way to go. The hatch is complete with glass and trim (what's a good price?), but still waiting on pictures. I've read just about all the posts on here about the Vega conversions, and now I'm having second thoughts about using the fiberglass piece. Just looking for your opinions.

Thanks, Rich

[hotrod98]

There are a couple of problems with using the Janak stuff. One is that it's difficult to keep the filler from cracking where you've joined the fiberglass part to the steel body. They tend to expand and contract at two different rates. Another problem is the lexan isn't as durable as the original glass. Another is you don't have stainless moldings so it doesn't look correct even with a correct appearing plug.
The downside of the vega plug is that is does look slightly different than the correct plug.
Remember, you still have to fabricate the headliner retainers (teeth) to go along the top and sides of the back window. I attached the side retainers to the Charger inner sail panels, but I attached the upper to the vega plug itself.
Looks like you already have the deck lid altered so if you go the vega plug route, use the Janak plug as a reference for altering the lower edge of the vega plug. With the vega plug you will have to find a 3rd gen Dutchman panel to alter for the front drip trough or manufacture one from scratch. The plug will need to follow the contour of the front edge of your deck lid to look right.
Basically, the Janak plug will be the easier of the two options and I've had guys tell me that they've figured out a way to keep the filler from cracking. You have to decide which way is better for you. Personally, I wanted real glass and real stainless moldings so I was willing to go to the extra work in using the vega plug.
As for what the vega hatchback is worth, that depends on how nice it is. If it were a rust free piece with perfect glass and moldings, I wouldn't hesitate to spend up to $200 for it. I've bought them for much less but they're getting harder to find.

[RTDaddy]

I used the Janak plug, and have a Vega plug "just in case."  I got the Vega stuff for $50 of of one heading to the crusher inthe boneyard, (it was, literally, setting beside the crusher).  There is an outfit that was making the Daytona rear glass reproduction, (DPG I think, if you really need it, I'll find my notes), I found a pair of 500 rear windows.  I have heard about he cracking with the 'glass plug.  I "got lucky," the rear window frame (roof) had rusted, so when I repaired it, I just made the roof about 1/8" low, and with the grooves along the sides of Janak's plug, I was able to span the joint with matt, then glass it in.  As far as outside rear window trim, I got luck and had it.  BUT, the corner radii are the same as the 68/9/70 trim, just the straight pieces are a little longer.  If you get two sets of trim, you should be able to sqauueze the straigts down enough to telescope into each other and get by.  I also used Janak's a post covers, went to a local sigh/lettering store, adn bought a piece of "chrome" vinyl lettering material.  It works pretty well.  If you car to look, go to the www.wwnboa.org (Winged Warriors) website, scroll down to Barry and Rita's 69 Daytona clone, and there are some shots.  Hope this helps.

"IF YOU'RE UNDER CONTROL, YOU AIN'T GOING FAST ENOUGH."

[Daytona R/T SE]

Here's what I did on my clone:


http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,10669.0.html


http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,21596.0.html

[richRTSE]

Thanks for the replies.
One of the major things I'm worried about is cracking, especially with the crazy weather here in Ohio. It doesn't really bother me that the Vega hatch is not a perfect match.

Larry, thanks for the tips. Do you have any picts of how you did the headliner retainers? I swear I've seen them on here once, but I never saved them.

RTDaddy,  how long ago did you do your 'glass plug? No problems with cracking? The factory window fits okay in the Janak plug? All I have right now is the lexan piece, and a couple sets of regular trim.

Daytona R/T SE, I wish I was as talented as you. That plug looks great. I like the way you did the window trim, and I'm planning on doing the same thing. Thanks.

Does anyone know if the 71-74 Plymouth Dutchman panel would work? It does have a slight contour already, and you can get new ones from AMD for about $200. Just not sure if its wide enough, as the ends turn in.

So far here is what I have: '70 Charger 500 body, 440/Hemi 4-speed/4.10 Dana, the Janak plug/window, the decklid and hinges from Mike at Dayclona, A-pillar trim from Erik Nelson, C500 grille and headlight bezels, grille brackets and fillers from Dayclona, '69 and '70 fenders, '70 hood, Larry's wing and nose brackets, and Dane will be shipping my wing by the end of the week. I don't know when I'll be able to afford the nose, front valence, headlight buckets, etc, so more than likely I'll put the car together as a 500, and continue buying parts for the Daytona as I can.

[moparstuart]

Thanks for the replies.
One of the major things I'm worried about is cracking, especially with the crazy weather here in Ohio. It doesn't really bother me that the Vega hatch is not a perfect match.

Larry, thanks for the tips. Do you have any picts of how you did the headliner retainers? I swear I've seen them on here once, but I never saved them.

RTDaddy,  how long ago did you do your 'glass plug? No problems with cracking? The factory window fits okay in the Janak plug? All I have right now is the lexan piece, and a couple sets of regular trim.

Daytona R/T SE, I wish I was as talented as you. That plug looks great. I like the way you did the window trim, and I'm planning on doing the same thing. Thanks.

Does anyone know if the 71-74 Plymouth Dutchman panel would work? It does have a slight contour already, and you can get new ones from AMD for about $200. Just not sure if its wide enough, as the ends turn in.

So far here is what I have: '70 Charger 500 body, 440/Hemi 4-speed/4.10 Dana, the Janak plug/window, the decklid and hinges from Mike at Dayclona, A-pillar trim from Erik Nelson, C500 grille and headlight bezels, grille brackets and fillers from Dayclona, '69 and '70 fenders, '70 hood, Larry's wing and nose brackets, and Dane will be shipping my wing by the end of the week. I don't know when I'll be able to afford the nose, front valence, headlight buckets, etc, so more than likely I'll put the car together as a 500, and continue buying parts for the Daytona as I can.

your plan sound good , I 'm in about the exactly same stage and plan as you are on my dayclona.   

[hotrod98]

I wanted to save my original retainers in case I ever put the car back to stock so I didn't want to alter them. Besides, they weren't going to be long enough anyway.
I took lengths of 18 ga steel and simply punched holes along the edge using my pneumatic hole punch. I then used my angle grinder and sharpened the area between the holes. I measured the distance from the edge of the plug opening to the inside edge of the sail panel and bent the strips so that the teeth edge of the piece followed the window opening. The top pieces are slightly radius-ed and have to be cut first before punching and grinding them. Then the pieces at the top are stepped slightly and then plug welded to the inside of the vega plug. I had to fab up the lower ends of the side strips to give me a place to screw in the interior moldings as well. I'm using the stock daytona interior trim, but I'm having to heat up the corner pieces and change the radius slightly. It has been like one big jigsaw puzzle, only you have to fabricate the pieces yourself and then try to make them fit together. 

Do you plan to go ahead and install the wing along with the 500 front end? Driving our Road Runner with the Superbird wing installed has been a lot of fun. We just couldn't wait until we finished one of the clones to drive some kind of a wing car.

[richRTSE]

Thanks for the info Larry.
Actually I think I'm gonna wait to put the wing on. I'm not sure it would look good with the 500 stripe. I'm still holding out hope that I may be able to pick up a 3rd Charger to make the Daytona. Then I'd have all 3 Charger body styles: my '69 R/T SE, a 500, and a Daytona. 

Rich

[moparstuart]

Thanks for the info Larry.
Actually I think I'm gonna wait to put the wing on. I'm not sure it would look good with the 500 stripe. I'm still holding out hope that I may be able to pick up a 3rd Charger to make the Daytona. Then I'd have all 3 Charger body styles: my '69 R/T SE, a 500, and a Daytona. 

Rich

wow that would be a very nice set     

[BigBlockSam]

here's a pic of my vega plug when it was roughed in . i would go with a metal plug . i would hate to see the car all painted and then the bodywork start to crack . Rene

[hotrod98]

Can you imagine going out and seeing a long hairline crack in the paint, knowing just how much work that was going to be to correct it?  It's definitely something to think about.
Of course, the very best option is to buy a correct repro steel plug, the correct repro glass and then make a set of stainless moldings using original Charger moldings. You're looking at around $3500 plus shipping, etc. going that route. If I were building just one clone and planned to drive just that one car forever, you can bet that I would have gone that route. I would have used the very best stuff for the nose as well. That's the problem when you own numerous cars and don't want to get rid of any of them. You have to spread the dollars around a little. 

[RTDaddy]

Rich,
Plug in since 2001, no cracks.  Window fit was good.  Good luck,

"IF YOU'RE UNDER CONTROL, YOU AIN'T GOING FAST ENOUGH."

[richRTSE]

Well I was able to pick up a hatch today (sorry the picture is a little grainy). Overall, in pretty good shape. And the best part was I was able to drive and pick it up, as it was only 40 miles from home.   And the seller seemed happy with my offer of $100.


Now as soon as my basement is finished, I can get started on the car...

[hotrod98]

Congrats. That looks like a nice one. 

[BigBlockSam]

that's a nice one  look at that for $100 you got the plug , window and trim . nice score 

[hotrod98]

Too bad you're so far away. I can show you some tricks on installing that plug. I'm getting it down to a science now.
It's a lot easier since I bought an english wheel. I can radius the lower area to lay in a lot nicer now.

[moparstuart]

Too bad you're so far away. I can show you some tricks on installing that plug. I'm getting it down to a science now.
It's a lot easier since I bought an english wheel. I can radius the lower area to lay in a lot nicer now.

great by the time you do mine you will have it down 

[hotrod98]

They get easier and better every time I do one.       Price is the same though...

[BigBlockSam]

Price is the same though... coolgleamA

add a little extra on Stuart's bill  for me  and by yourself something pretty . like a new challenger. 

[hotrod98]

Thanks Rene...you know...you're so good to me.

[moparstuart]

Price is the same though... coolgleamA

add a little extra on Stuart's bill  for me  and by yourself something pretty . like a new challenger. 

    you know I 'm coming to see you   
  If I had the money he would have already been done with the car

[hotrod98]

I just sold my 70 Camaro, so I have one empty spot in the bodyshop now.
If I sell a couple of the Trans Ams, I'll have enough room to start tearing the 70 Satellite down. I have 6,000 sf and it's still not enough space. The plan is to sell more cars, not build more buildings.

[WingCharger]

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[hotrod98]

What is the plan for the '70 Satellite?

Actually, the plan keeps changing. We thought that we had made a deal on a nice 70 Sublime Road Runner to use for the Superbird clone, but that deal fell through a couple of weeks ago. Now our only option is to use this Satellite for the clone. I don't plan to actually complete the car at this time, but may go ahead and tear it down to decide what all needs to be done to the car.

Too bad there isn't an in-expensive, easy way to convert the back glasses on a Superbird. I have the Cuda back window section that I may use. I keep going back and forth on that idea. The cuda back glass is about two full inches shorter in height than the Superbird back glass. If it's place just right, it doesn't look too bad. If I use it I'll probably center it up. I'm short (5'9") anyway so seeing out the back glass if it's only an inch lower shouldn't be a problem.

[WingCharger]

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