Denver legalizes marijuana possession...........>>>>

[Charger_Fan]

And as regards the gateway drug thing, I guess in certain circumstances it's plausible - when you're high you're more likely to have impaired judgment and think that it's "okay" to try the other drugs.

[snip]

  But look at it this way, if the only place you can get marijuana is from a drug dealer who is pushing harder substances, then the temptation to "upgrade" your drugs is always there. 

This is pretty much what I've personally witnessed with a few separate individuals. I think the overall attraction to play with stronger drugs lies within the individual. If the individual is easily steered by peer pressure, or is dissatisfied with their life currently, it's much easier to cave in & try other means.

It's my opinion that a more intellectual person with a stronger self worth will not be as likely to go the direction of stronger, more lethal drugs.


Regarding the question of whether pot is a gateway drug, I strongly believe it is...but only to certain type of individual.

[Johnny SixPack]

But isn't this America?

Shouldn't it be my decision, RD?

If I know the consequences, and I am an adult of legal age, smoking the reefer in the confines of my home, what business is it of the federal/state/local government?

I don't think that they (Denver and other cities that will follow suit) mean for people to start puffin' sweets, or taking bong hits at stop lights, or anything of that nature.

There most certainly will be legal constraints upon the use of it when/if it is legallized.

Kids/teens would still be bared from it, so that would not be an issue (as if that stops them now, even with it being illegal).

IMO marijuana should be treated in the same fashion as cigarettes and alcohol.

A known vice with potentially life threatening side effects, but legal if used within the confines of the law.

[RD]

formula,
   You are right, this is America.  And if it is legalized, then all that want to smoke it should go ahead.  I will not stop you from doing it.  But the first time someone hurts one of my family members (albeit from smoking pot, any other drug, alcohol, what have you), you better hope you die before I get to you.

[CFMopar]

Damn you guys.I wasted to much time reading all your post and it cut into my masterbation time.... 


On this topic.
I really hope they just either make it legal across the board or make it illegal. I've done it twice and it did nothing for me. Felt no high no munchies no nothing.


Nothing is worse than when they decriminalize possession but then cops get shot during a raid on a grow op. Which happened in Canada where 3 RCMP officers were killed.

Either its legal or its not. Don't send mix messages.

[Vainglory, Esq.]

Seeing as I have a good reason to keep this particular debate civil, let's just agree to disagree.   

But I do have one more thing - you know how you said it kills brain cells?   http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn8155

I know of more than one stoner who was mighty pleased to read that article...

[Johnny SixPack]

formula,
    You are right, this is America.   And if it is legalized, then all that want to smoke it should go ahead.   I will not stop you from doing it.   But the first time someone hurts one of my family members (albeit from smoking pot, any other drug, alcohol, what have you), you better hope you die before I get to you.

I hear you, man.

I've lost friends to drinking and driving and know that the effects of one incapacitated driver can ruin multiple lives and families.

But honestly, the people that will put others in that position are not going to be stopped by a law.

[Old Moparz]

Prohibition didn't work very well, might as well legalize & tax it. Then again, new money in the cookie jar would just be raided anyway.

[RD]

Seeing as I have a good reason to keep this particular debate civil, let's just agree to disagree.   

But I do have one more thing - you know how you said it kills brain cells?   http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn8155

I know of more than one stoner who was mighty pleased to read that article...

that was an interesting article.   I think it focuses on what the researchers needed (i.e. a tad biased) due to the fact that it does not address all the other harmful substances within ganja, but interesting nonetheless.

You type in marijuana on a google search and you find millions of sites "pro" and "con".   I typed "marijuana gateway" and got 1,200,000 sites alone   

oh well, i will just let this dead dog lie also, though it was enlightening.

[Charger_Fan]

Damn you guys.I wasted to much time reading all your post and it cut into my masterbation time.... 

I noticed that you logged off fairly fast, though.

Then again, new money in the cookie jar would just be raided anyway.

That's for sure!

[bull]

We should legalize everything and then the crime rate will just disappear.

[Big Lebowski]

Geez, i guess i picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue. Put the Big Lebowski back in the DVD player.

[golden73]

Q: Can a person become addicted to marijuana?
A: Yes. While not everyone who uses marijuana becomes addicted, when a user begins to seek out and take the drug compulsively, that person is said to be dependent on the drug or addicted to it. In 2002, over 280,000 people entering drug treatment programs reported marijuana as their primary drug of abuse, showing they needed help to stop using (12).

A lot of people will get addicted to drugs, its not necessarily the drug itself that is so mind controlling. Its the weak minded person who can't control it. So why should everyone not be allowed to use it, if only a handful get "addicted"

There are data showing that marijuana can play a role in crashes. Studies show that approximately 6-11 percent of fatal accident victims tested positive for THC. In many of these cases, alcohol was detected as well. When users combine marijuana with alcohol, as they often do, the hazards of driving can be more severe that with either drug alone. In a study conducted by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, a moderate dose of marijuana alone was shown to impair driving performance; however, the effects of even a low dose of marijuana combined with alcohol were markedly greater than for either drug alone.

In one study conducted in Memphis, TN, researchers found that, of 150 reckless drivers who were tested for drugs at the arrest scene, 33 percent tested positive for marijuana, and 12 percent tested positive for both marijuana and cocaine (2). Data also show that while smoking marijuana, people show the same lack of coordination on standard "drunk driver" tests as do people who have had too much to drink (11).

I hate when people say that. It doesn't prove ANYTHING except, that a lot of people smoke. THC stays in your system for 30 days... So if you get in a car accident and you hadn't smoked in 29 days, are you saying you were under the effects of marijuana? I don't think so...

[bull]

There seems to be a lot of potheads on this board. That explains some things.

[Orange_Crush]

There are data showing that marijuana can play a role in crashes. Studies show that approximately 6-11 percent of fatal accident victims tested positive for THC. In many of these cases, alcohol was detected as well. When users combine marijuana with alcohol, as they often do, the hazards of driving can be more severe that with either drug alone. In a study conducted by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, a moderate dose of marijuana alone was shown to impair driving performance; however, the effects of even a low dose of marijuana combined with alcohol were markedly greater than for either drug alone.

In one study conducted in Memphis, TN, researchers found that, of 150 reckless drivers who were tested for drugs at the arrest scene, 33 percent tested positive for marijuana, and 12 percent tested positive for both marijuana and cocaine (2). Data also show that while smoking marijuana, people show the same lack of coordination on standard "drunk driver" tests as do people who have had too much to drink (11).

I love this type of statistic because its so open-ended that it is absolutely meaningless but can be used to prove anything.

Just a question...

How many of those drivers tested positive for "cell phone," "Big mac," "tired," or "fucking around with the CD player?"

You could also say that, of those 150 drivers, 80% of them had used a cell phone in the past hour so cell phone use is a contributing factor in 80% of automobile accidents.  That is patently ridiculous.

In addition, you can prove nothing by typing something into a search engine.  I know for a fact that if you type "failure" and do an "I feel lucky" search on google, you'll get G.W. Bush's website.  What does that prove?

[RD]

There seems to be a lot of potheads on this board. That explains some things.

[Old Moparz]

There seems to be a lot of potheads on this board. That explains some things.

Got any statistics to back that up? How about a graph or a pie chart? 

[Orange_Crush]

There seems to be a lot of potheads on this board. That explains some things.

I love the "pothead" moniker. 

I occasionally smoke weed.  I enjoy it and don't really care if I get caught because...other than paying a fine, what the hell's gonna happen to me.  I own my business so I won't get fired, My wife knows so she won't leave me, and many of my friends smoke weed as well, so I won't be an outcast.

Am I a pothead?  Well, if smoking pot is the only criterion for being one then, I guess I am.

But here's the funny thing.

I have smoked with more than a few cops, a well known financial analyst, the president of a college, a youth minister at a Presbyterian church, more bank VPs than you can shake a stick at, and a couple of neighbors in my upper-middle class neighborhood.

Its all around you folks.  If every pot smoker in the country was arrested, well, you'd see waaaay fewer people on the streets.

Want to keep it illegal?  No skin of my nose.  It hasn't stopped me or anyone I know from smoking. 

As I said...marijuana enforecement is throwing good money after bad.

[RD]

There seems to be a lot of potheads on this board. That explains some things.

I have smoked with more than a few cops, a well known financial analyst, the president of a college, a youth minister at a Presbyterian church, more bank VPs than you can shake a stick at, and a couple of neighbors in my upper-middle class neighborhood.

that is not surprising, I guess it makes it okay then huh?  "Hey, we affluent individuals break the law and we do not commit violent crimes, snort coke, or smoke marijuana while driving, so it is perfectly fine!"  Hmmmm.... interesting way of substantiating your wrongness.

You do what you want to do, but until marijuana is legal, you are a criminal, and so are the others that you do that with.  I am not judging you, not my job, just stating a fact.  I break laws too!  I go 60 in a 55mph zone, I may turn right without signalling first, and I do "Cali" stops, but that is the extent of it.  I consider them harmless, but I guess breaking a law is breaking a law.

I just have one question for you, how often do you smoke marijuana a week, and how many joints do you smoke in one setting?

[Orange_Crush]

There seems to be a lot of potheads on this board. That explains some things.

I have smoked with more than a few cops, a well known financial analyst, the president of a college, a youth minister at a Presbyterian church, more bank VPs than you can shake a stick at, and a couple of neighbors in my upper-middle class neighborhood.

that is not surprising, I guess it makes it okay then huh?   "Hey, we affluent individuals break the law and we do not commit violent crimes, snort coke, or smoke marijuana while driving, so it is perfectly fine!"   Hmmmm.... interesting way of substantiating your wrongness.

You do what you want to do, but until marijuana is legal, you are a criminal, and so are the others that you do that with.   I am not judging you, not my job, just stating a fact.   I break laws too!   I go 60 in a 55mph zone, I may turn right without signalling first, and I do "Cali" stops, but that is the extent of it.   I consider them harmless, but I guess breaking a law is breaking a law.

I just have one question for you, how often do you smoke marijuana a week, and how many joints do you smoke in one setting?

You do what you do and I'll do what I do.  Its a choice I make.  I'm aware of the consequences (the REAL consequences...not the ones you read in the government propaganda) .  Am I supporting terrorism?  Nope..the stuff I smoke is grown right here in the good ol' U.S. of A....if anything, I'm contributing to our economy   Am I supporting crime?  Nope...the violent criminals are more intersted in selling the expensive stuff...not much money to be made in home-grown weed.  Are we getting baked and driving?  I'm not...I can't speak for anyone else.  About the only thing I'm doing is spending too much money on pretzels and corn chips.

How much do I smoke?

Welp...Last year I took a big long hit off a sweet waterpipe once and I smoked a couple of joints with my two neighbors.  This year, I have smoked a grand total of....zero.

My heaviest year, I got baked every weekend.  Never had the urge to try anything stronger and I NEVER actually went out of my way to get stoned.  Never had any type of "dependence" or even what one would call a "jones."


I will make one suggestion to you just for an FYI...

Go to an N.A. meeting sometime and ask people around there what their "gateway drug" was.  The answers will surprise you.  I performed that little experiment for some research I was doing on this exact subject for a paper in college.

Many of the people there hardly ever smoked pot and most didn't like it.  Most would say that there was NO gateway.  They went for Crack, Meth, Coke, or worse right off the bat.  The ones who told me there WAS, in fact, gateway told me their gateway was (get this) ALCOHOL.  Only one person actually told me his gateway was weed.

[Johnny SixPack]

I break laws too!   I go 60 in a 55mph zone, I may turn right without signalling first, and I do "Cali" stops, but that is the extent of it.   I consider them harmless, but I guess breaking a law is breaking a law.

I just have one question for you, how often do you smoke marijuana a week, and how many joints do you smoke in one setting?

RD, that sums up the feelings of many people who commit unlawful acts.

All of which could potentially be as dangerous as driving under the influence.

Or worse if you were doing all of them while stoned/drunk/sleepy/applying your makeup/eating an Egg McMuffin/getting-giving a hummer.

And I think only old hippies smoke J's anymore.

The kids are smoking sweets these days.

Destroys the taste, but if it's bad to begin with, I guess it helps mask the flavor.

Kind of like mixing Coke/Pepsi/Sprite/7Up with 'well' achohol so it's not so wretched.

Damn potheads anyhow!



Oh yeah, pretty impressive that we've managed to disagree without this going the MoParts way.

[RD]

There seems to be a lot of potheads on this board. That explains some things.

I have smoked with more than a few cops, a well known financial analyst, the president of a college, a youth minister at a Presbyterian church, more bank VPs than you can shake a stick at, and a couple of neighbors in my upper-middle class neighborhood.

that is not surprising, I guess it makes it okay then huh?   "Hey, we affluent individuals break the law and we do not commit violent crimes, snort coke, or smoke marijuana while driving, so it is perfectly fine!"   Hmmmm.... interesting way of substantiating your wrongness.

You do what you want to do, but until marijuana is legal, you are a criminal, and so are the others that you do that with.   I am not judging you, not my job, just stating a fact.   I break laws too!   I go 60 in a 55mph zone, I may turn right without signalling first, and I do "Cali" stops, but that is the extent of it.   I consider them harmless, but I guess breaking a law is breaking a law.

I just have one question for you, how often do you smoke marijuana a week, and how many joints do you smoke in one setting?

You do what you do and I'll do what I do.   Its a choice I make.   I'm aware of the consequences (the REAL consequences...not the ones you read in the government propaganda) .   Am I supporting terrorism?   Nope..the stuff I smoke is grown right here in the good ol' U.S. of A....if anything, I'm contributing to our economy   Am I supporting crime?   Nope...the violent criminals are more intersted in selling the expensive stuff...not much money to be made in home-grown weed.   Are we getting baked and driving?   I'm not...I can't speak for anyone else.   About the only thing I'm doing is spending too much money on pretzels and corn chips.

How much do I smoke?

Welp...Last year I took a big long hit off a sweet waterpipe once and I smoked a couple of joints with my two neighbors.   This year, I have smoked a grand total of....zero.

My heaviest year, I got baked every weekend.   Never had the urge to try anything stronger and I NEVER actually went out of my way to get stoned.   Never had any type of "dependence" or even what one would call a "jones."


I will make one suggestion to you just for an FYI...

Go to an N.A. meeting sometime and ask people around there what their "gateway drug" was.   The answers will surprise you.   I performed that little experiment for some research I was doing on this exact subject for a paper in college.

Many of the people there hardly ever smoked pot and most didn't like it.   Most would say that there was NO gateway.   They went for Crack, Meth, Coke, or worse right off the bat.   The ones who told me there WAS, in fact, gateway told me their gateway was (get this) ALCOHOL.   Only one person actually told me his gateway was weed.

I will take you up on that due to the fact that I have to attend two NA meetings and a recovery road meeting as well as AA meetings and I will report the results here, as well as my Professor's opinion.  Maybe we can get some good information flowing here.  (none of what I said was sarcastic, strictly informational).

[472 R/T SE]

There seems to be a lot of potheads on this board. That explains some things.

Can't prove it.   

[bull]

There seems to be a lot of potheads on this board. That explains some things.

Can't prove it.     

That's true, but you gotta wonder about the Chiefs fans. Speaking of which, were you serious about laying down some cash money on that game? You know I have Sundays off now.

[John_Kunkel]

Alchohol is addictive, kills brain cells, leads to violent behavior and is LEGAL.

Mary-jew-ahna kills brain cells, has never been proven to be addictive, does not lead to violent behavior (just the opposite) and is ILLEGAL.

Even a person with a 2-digit IQ can see there's something wrong there.

[Old Moparz]

Alchohol is addictive, kills brain cells, leads to violent behavior and is LEGAL.

Mary-jew-ahna kills brain cells, has never been proven to be addictive, does not lead to violent behavior (just the opposite) and is ILLEGAL.

Even a person with a 2-digit IQ can see there's something wrong there.

Now, pot smokers may not be easily found or proven, but I know there's definitely 2 digit IQ people on this site, & you don't need statistics, graphs or pie charts to prove it either.