Help building a garage/selecting a contractor

[AKcharger]

Good day guys

I've really got the bug to build my garage but need some help. My plan was to send out "requests for proposal" to  some contractors around town and select the best offer. My question is do I tell them GENERALLY what I want as a finished product or do I buy the garage plans I want and tell them EXACTLY what I want? Any other tips in selecting a builder?

Thanks!

[rav440]

buy the garage plans or have them drawn to you specs and needs . then the builder can give you a price on the garage . youll be more protected that way . plus youll most likely have to have a set of drawing to submit to the township for a building permit .

[hemigeno]

The more explicit the instructions you give to the bidding contractors, the more likely it is that you'll have comparable proposals.

Even if the GC's are well-intentioned, it is hard for two or more people to understand exactly what you want and craft a proposal without a well-defined scope of work.  Effort put in on the front end of a project always makes the construction phase go much smoother.  It can eliminate a TON of arguments on down the road too.

[Dodge Don]

The more explicit the instructions you give to the bidding contractors, the more likely it is that you'll have comparable proposals.

Even if the GC's are well-intentioned, it is hard for two or more people to understand exactly what you want and craft a proposal without a well-defined scope of work.  Effort put in on the front end of a project always makes the construction phase go much smoother.  It can eliminate a TON of arguments on down the road too.

Completely agree 100%. Any successful project is 70% planning 30% execution. You'll only have one crack at it, take the time to think through everything you want. Use the help here as well, there are probably a ton of "if I had only thought of...." scenarios.

[RECHRGD]

The more explicit the instructions you give to the bidding contractors, the more likely it is that you'll have comparable proposals.

Even if the GC's are well-intentioned, it is hard for two or more people to understand exactly what you want and craft a proposal without a well-defined scope of work.  Effort put in on the front end of a project always makes the construction phase go much smoother.  It can eliminate a TON of arguments on down the road too.

Completely agree 100%. Any successful project is 70% planning 30% execution. You'll only have one crack at it, take the time to think through everything you want. Use the help here as well, there are probably a ton of "if I had only thought of...." scenarios.

Absolutely right!!  Also, be careful of contractors asking for money up front.  You don't want your money to be used to pay for their last project.  Some of the smaller contractors may need a certain percentage of a down payment to get some materials coming and that's OK.  You just don't want someone that's operating on a shoestring budget.  They may not complete the job and leave you hanging.  Most states have web sites that you can check on their licenses and see if they have a record of complaints against them.  Bob

[AKcharger]

Copy all guys...makes perfect sense.

Next: Those who have already built a garage, what are the lessons learned or "I wish I would have..." Don as you said you only have one shot at this. My intent is a simple 16x26 2 car garage to store both cars or work/restore one. Only cosmic things I'm planning to add is 220 for a large compressor and to support a welder and I want to wall off the back end to make a seperate "parts room"

suggestions?

[General_01]

#1) Build a deeper garage. I am assuming you are going to wall off the last 4 ft. This leaves you with a 22' stall. Not much room for a workbench and tool storage plus room to walk around the car. I would go 32' minumum. I have a 24' garage with a work bench and tools in the front. I kick myself everyday I didn't scrap up the money to go deeper. And this was after we added 4' to the plans. The original plans were for a 20' garage. I would have moved by now if I would have left it at 20'. I can barely park my truck in there now.

#2) Build wider. 16' is going to be really small if you put two vehicles in at once. Go 22' if possible. Gives you room between the vehicles and between the vehicles and the walls. You can get in and out of your cars much easier, instead of Dukes style.

#3) If you are thinking of insulating it, do it when it is built, before you load the garage up with everything. I want to do it, but after 15 years here it is going to be alot of fun emptying the garage to insulate and sheetrock.

[Cuda Hunter]

I live in Colorado.  It gets very cold here.  After I built my garage, I built one for a customer who wanted in floor heating.  The tubing for the heating was installed inside the concrete.  This made his garage very nice in the winter.   It works on a recirculating system so it is pretty cheap to operate.  The majority of the price for this falls in the installation process.  Well worth it.  Will do to my next garage. 
  I fully agree with making the garage bigger.  16 foot is pretty small. 

[Blown70]

I have to agree there by the time you try to stuff one car in there to work on you will have NO room for anything else but a yogo for a second car in there.

28 or 32 feet deep and I would go 18 to 20 minimum wide. 

Tom

Copy all guys...makes perfect sense.

Next: Those who have already built a garage, what are the lessons learned or "I wish I would have..." Don as you said you only have one shot at this. My intent is a simple 16x26 2 car garage to store both cars or work/restore one. Only cosmic things I'm planning to add is 220 for a large compressor and to support a welder and I want to wall off the back end to make a seperate "parts room"

suggestions?

[NHCharger]

I have built a ton of garages over the last 24 years. Since your garage is not that large i don't think it would be necessary to spend money on an extravagant set of plans. You could get a generic set of plans cheap and then generate your own spec sheet that lists out everything you want/need. When I was building spec houses I had a spec sheet that listed out every detail, from footing size to type of finish paint, it was 5 to 6 pages long. Depending on where you build there is going to be a building code that any builder has to follow.

I have to agree with everyone else, bigger is better (at least on garages). My garage/shop is 30'x88', 50' is heated shop, 38' is garage. I wish I had gone 34' deep. Remember, 16x24 is the outside measurement, if your using 2x6 construction your already down to 15x23 on inside dimensions.

Go with a 12/12 pitched roof and use attic trusses that are rated for storage, use a set of pull down stairs so you don't waste any space with stairs. Have a door or pair of doors on the exterior so you can haul the bigger stuff up that way. Use an out swing entry door. Build a small room behind the garage for the compressor, or put it up in the attic if possible.

The radiant floor heat is nice but the last time i priced it out you still needed a hot water heater or boiler with a circulator pump. Your already cramped for room and this is just more equipment taking up space. I'd go with a modine heater you can hang from the ceiling.

As mentioned above a parts room will make the garage to small. One wall of shelving 2' deep is your best bet.

Check out www.garagejournal.com. Lots of good ideas over there.

[General_01]

Thanks for the link NH. Some neat ideas there.

AK, here is a link to a thread there. Somebody built a 20x22 garage. You can get a real good visual of how small it is.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25571

[Dodge Don]

Make sure it is tall enough for a lift in case you ever go that route. Or have an I-beam with a pully/chain lift. Obviously bigger is always better. Is this garage for Alaska or lower 48?

[BigBlackDodge]

Also keep in mind any property setbacks you may have and that your garage will fit within them.


BBD

[AKcharger]

Wow Good info guys!

As far as going big I'm with you guys, however in addition to budget I have lot size to keep in mind also. Big black is right,I need a 10 foot easement on each side of the building so I only have about 25x50 feet to work with in total

- NH didn't think about "outside" measurement, good point in addition to an outside door to store stuff up in the rafters...hoods really don't fit trough those little pull down steps do they  

- General copy on insulating, if plan goes well gargage will be up by end of summer and i can do inside work next winter

- Cuda...I'd LOVE radent floor heating, just a quesion of cost. Garage will be dead storage till next rebuld which I'm estimating will be 2012 so just a cost consideration...oh I want to do the floors too, since the conreate is new I figure I'll have a better chance o success with adheasion.

- Don, this is for up here in Alaska, I'd really like a lift but again cost. I'm lil' over a year out from retirement and want it ready when I bring the '70 up.

[moparguy01]

you will want to go deeper. You will notice 4 extra feet longer more than you will notice 4 feet wider. Honestly, go as big as both your budget and the area your building will allow you to go. Also, if your planning on storing things in your garage, you might want to look into a room-in-attic gable style truss to maximize your storage space. Also you need to think about how you want the front door or doors arranged, as well as figure out what type of insulation you want to put into your bid request. They will need to know whether you want 2x4 or 2x6 construction, even though 2x6 is more common now days, some builders will do 2x4 for garages which would limit you to a r15 insulation, where as a 2x6 would allow you up to r21 before causing you any issues. I would recommend the latter of the two. Also being in your location up in alaska i beleive, you will want to figure the attic insulation as well, whether you want to go with a fiberglass blow in style or bats, this could determine your spacing. Another thing to think about is what style of heating your going to use, if you know your going to run a natural gas style heater which requires a vent through the roof while it is being built is the time to install it, or else it becomes a major pain in the butt.

Also remember for a garage, windows to me aren't the best thing. I'd rather spend more on lights than windows for 2 reasons, the first is nobody can see in to case your stuff, and the second is that windows are always going to be a cold spot.

If you have any questions about anything I posted feel free to pm me and we can chat about it.

[SFRT]

pick out the biggest compressor you think you want and then get the next size up. put it outside on an isolated cement pad with a metal cage around it.

[dodgecharger-fan]

You may want to consider putting the tubing in for the radiant floor heating - even if you're not ready to go that route yet. With the systems they have now, that's the cheaper part of things. They usually just tie wrap it on top of the rebar.

Leave the tubing "roughed in" where the boiler can go in the future - or just to a manifold that you can plumb to wherever the boiler ends up..

That will also give you all the time you want to shop around for a boiler..... and maybe, if the technology advances enough, a wall-hung unit isn't out of the question at some point in time. That'd save you some floor space.

[lisiecki1]

as a former framing contractor I can tell you that you'll have a much better experience if you can show your GC exactly what you want....

also, I'd add a minimum of 10% to all the quotes you get, just to be safe.....there are a lot of "overages" when building from scratch....and material prices fluctuate constantly, so if you get quote "a" this month and don't start building until 3 months from now odds are your prices are going to increase....however in that situation most contractors would want to re-quote you.....

[PocketThunder]

Wow Good info guys!

As far as going big I'm with you guys, however in addition to budget I have lot size to keep in mind also. Big black is right,I need a 10 foot easement on each side of the building so I only have about 25x50 feet to work with in total

Is your spouse going to be happy with the whole backyard turning into one big garage?  If yes then i would build a 4 car tandem at 25x40 = 1,000 sf.  Not too big to heat but just enough space to have two stalls for parking and two stalls for working.

Then you have an additional 10 of space on the back to add on to later in life once (when) you run of space in the garage.   

What is your towns website?  I can search thru there to find the height limit for garages, unless you know that already.

Paul

[hemi68charger]

NOt sure if anyone's mentioned it, but potential attic space. Make sure you're joists are wide enough to bare the load you may give it.. Always over-engineer in my book... I have 2x12's.. I have more than enough strength to handle most things I wish to put up there.. Make the pitch of the roof such, if you can, it's comfortable being up there standing... Your pull-down attic access ladder, make sure it's in the right position considering where the two cars will be... I would, if you can, extend the garage further back for any future work bench construction.. Work bench's rock in a garage............

Troy

[Mike DC]

I think storage (and workspace/countertop) is the most underestimated issue with old car projects. 

When you see a typical overstuffed garage, it's usually not that it's "overstuffed" with too many cars for the structure.  What rendered it unusable is that every horizontal surface in the place (including the floor) is covered with piles of stuff.  Tools, car parts, raw materials of things, etc. 



I think you should decide whether this garage is going to be the primary storage place as well as just the shop.  Depending on your situation it may make more sense to do something else for storage. 

For example, a storage building (or even just a dedicated storage area of this garage) doesn't need the great heating, insulated walls, lighting, electrical outlet access . . .  all that great stuff that you'd want in the shop itself. 

 

[AKcharger]

Keep it up guys more great info!

- 01, I never knew the size of the frame (2x4 or 2x6) made a difference with insulation? who knew!
- Charger-fan I think I may take your advice since for the first few years it's just going to be a parking spot
- Troy, copy on the attic, I don't plan on putting too much stuff up there, a hood and fenders perhaps
- Pocket, She'll tolerate a reasonable size garage...but with a 10 foot easement I can't go that big. Here's the city web site for my neighborhood: http://neighborhood.muni.org/details.aspx
- DC This will be a bit diffrent than most garage projects in that I already have a reasonable garage with work bench and storage (see photo below) Problem comes when I bring my '70 up here and I'll both cars in the garage. I really, really, really, like getting in a warm car and not scraping ice in the winter...so does the MRS. So my intent is to have room to park/store the cars for most of the year so we can park our regular cars in the house garage. Chargers get driven on Fridays to work and on weekends in summer to shows...otherwise they just sit.

Both cars are "done"  but I do plan on tearing the '70 apart in a few years as I cut some corners during the 2003 resoration and want to fix it right. During that time I plan to move the '72 out and have the entire 2 spots to work on the car so I have plenty of room to media blast, weld, sand, ect. An other area I'm unusual (due in large part to moving a lot) is I have a very small cache of spare parts, I'm just not a pack rat...if I need something I'll go buy it so storage is really secondary, So here's the time line
- 2009-2011 Parking spot only with limited storage of minor parts
- 2011-2013 Garage will become prime workshop for the '70 re-restoration (estimate 18 month project time)
- 2013-2014 Still prime workshop as '72 gets full re-restoration (estimate 10 month project time)
- 2014-        Parking spot only with limited storage of minor parts

Attached is my childish drawing of what I envision for the garage interior open bay with both cars (yes those colored squares are supposed to be cars) with a walled off back room for parts storage shelvesfor use during the rebuilds. Idea is a "clean" place to park the cars and all the "stuff" will be neatly stored in the back room, that's what I did last time and it worked great, no lost or damaged parts

[PocketThunder]

Well if you already have the tuck under garage for your daily drivers, then we just need a width of the detached "Charger Den" to start with and go from there.  I'd suggest at least 22' wide.  Then you can at least put one car on skates and move it to the side so you can work on the other one with the doors open.  What width are you thinking about at this point?

Paul

[Old Moparz]

Seems like a lot of good ideas listed here.   

Something I didn't see though, if you need to bring your utilities underground to the garage, make provisions to have additional conduit in place before the floor is poured. When I built my garage I dug trenches to it, one for the electric, one for water, & one for sewer. I don't have water & sewer yet, but the sewer pipe is stubbed up through the concrete floor, capped & connected to my septic tank since the tank was adjacent to the garage. For the water, I installed a larger diameter conduit with a curved "sweep" that's capped at both ends so I can later push a flexible copper feed through.

The electric trench got 2 conduits, one for high voltage, which was the main, & one for low voltage, which was telephone & cable TV wire. This is where I wish I had installed a few more conduits in case I added things, which I did. One conduit is the main feed to a sub panel & stands alone. The other I put wires in for future use, but ended up pulling them back out to add more that I didn't anticipate. It was a real pain to get them all back through, but still easier than digging another trench. If I had put 3 or 4 conduits in the ground, the whole thing would have been simpler. Conduit is cheap, so put extras in at the beginning.