Originality question

[Troy]

A while back I picked up a 70 Challenger. Originally a 340 (A66), console auto in sublime with a black interior, black bumblebee stripe, and A/C. It is missing the drive train but the rest is there and it's pretty solid. I did a bit of research to see how rare the car is and didn't get any definitive answers. I had initially written off putting a 340 in the car because they tend to be tough to find and expensive. Plus, I have a lot of stuff left over from my Barracuda - including a 5.9 Magnum and 5.7 Hemi (both with low miles). I figured a modern engine with good brakes and suspension would be just as much fun as a stock restoration.

Well, here's my dilemma: I found a complete 340 that's within about a month prior to my car's build date. While it will never be "numbers matching" and it's not quite "date correct" it is the right year with all the original parts on it. This makes the cost much more acceptable (although I'd still have to track down all the other correct engine compartment items to match). The engine just needs freshened up but I could upgrade the internals while I have it apart so that it looks stock but has a bit more punch to it.

I am a fan of stock/restored cars as well as modern technology so I'm not particular about which way I go with this car. If the car has some sort of historical significance I'd like to make it as original as possible but, if not, then I will modify things a bit. The cost for the 340 is on par with the 5.9 - although the 5.9 will have more power just because of the heads and intake. The Hemi is the most expensive and difficult route but probably the most streetable when finished. I do drive my cars a LOT. I think I'll be happy no matter which direction I choose but what would you guys do in a similar situation?

Troy

[PocketThunder]

I'd go 5.7 and drive it alot as you say.  The 340 is not original so its just another block.   

[SFRT]

5.7 make it great to drive!

I dont see the point in crazy restos that cant be driven for fear of getting a smudge on the paper tag attached to the cigarrette lighter school of thought. these cars should be driven! often!

[Dans 68]

Wow. I'd probably flip a coin... No, what I would do is to restore it to as close as original. There is history there, and a less powerful (but correct) 340 would make the car more "authentic", and more satisfying to drive. I hope you understand what I'm saying. You can always install other engines, but 340's will not always be available, and clearly not date correct (no matter it is not numbers matching). Add modern upgrades here and there, but the heart of the car is the engine. Keep it old school.

Dan

[moparstuart]

 I agree go with the 5.7 and drive the hell out of it !    but if the 340 is cheap enought pick it up also and keep it . Thats alway a good selling point down the road if you decide to move it.

[41husk]

I put a 70 model year 340 in my Challenger and really wish I had gone with the new 5.7 hemi,  Mine was originaly a 6 cylinder.  It would have been much cheeper to through in a 360, but if you already have the 5.7 I think I would go that direction.  Then again if I had another 70 Challenger, I would probably take my extra 340 get a 6pk set up and do a TA clone

[1969chargerrtse]

Once again I'm the odd man out.  I'd put the 340 in it and like my charger be proud to say it's " date code correct "  340's are an awesome engine anyway.  Put a classic motor in your classic.  If it's not going to look mostly original, then drop anything you wish in there.   

I'd like to share my 340 story If I can.   I had a 73 340 Challenger.  I was coming home from the night shift on the highway, and had my head just leaning on the door glass as I zoomed home.  I loved the rumble of the 340 and took a peak at the tach.  it said 5,000 RPM.  5,000 RPM!! I thought?  It glanced at the speedo to find out I was going over 100MPH!!  Yep, great engine.

[Neal_J]

I'd go with the 340, regardless of the non-matching numbers.  The modern stuff in an old chassis just doesn't do it for me.  The 340 is a great motor and your ride will be considered stock by 90% of the world.   Chick will dig you, guys will want to be like you.  World peace may also ensue.   But no pressure though, Professor...

Neal

[Old Moparz]

One 1970 Challenger With a 5.7 Hemi Coming Right Up!

[Joshua]

Even though I'm not a big fan of "restored" cars....I'd put the 340 back in if I had one at my disposal. 340's are a screamin' little engine.
Would one of the newer engines have fuel injection, O2 sensors, cam position sensors, fuel pump in tank, etc? I hate all that CRAP.....but that's just me, I LIKE old technology......

[tan top]

it would be  tough discision for me      would be good to have a modern HEMI bolted in ...    but i think looking stock is the way to go ,  if you challenger was mine Troy , but i think i would be real real tempted with the hemi ,  may be like what has been mentioned  .still buy the 340 & keep in in the garage ..  drop the hemi in it ... & 

[41husk]

I'd go with the 340, regardless of the non-matching numbers.  The modern stuff in an old chassis just doesn't do it for me.  The 340 is a great motor and your ride will be considered stock by 90% of the world.   Chick will dig you, guys will want to be like you.  World peace may also ensue.   But no pressure though, Professor...

Neal

Chicks will dig You?  looks like I will be keeping my 340

[moparstuart]

  here is a 6.1 in a cuda !!   If you read about the 5.7 's alot of guys are getting great performance if you put the 6.1 heads and intake on the 5.7 .  The heads are pretty cheap ( compared to aluminum heads for our old cars) from chrysler also !

[TeeWJay426]

An original sublime 340 car? That's not exactly a combination that would be considered plentiful by any stretch of the imagination..... I'd grab the 340 and do it as close to original as possible, if it were me. If it was a plain jane 318 car, I'd probably go in a different (5.7L) direction.... but hey, it's your car, not mine, just chiming in with my 

[Troy]

Well, to clarify...

the 340 (if that's route I take) will look stock. No after market heads, aluminum radiators, chrome accessories, and whatnot. If I wanted to "build up" the 340 I'd go with the 5.9 Magnum any way since it has more cubes and the stock heads are better. The 5.9 is nice because it's still a small block, it drops right in, produces a LOT of power, has a roller cam, and most people (even some Mopar fans) wouldn't notice the Magnum heads on there any way if I made the rest look stock. Plus, I already own it so no more money out of pocket. The Hemi will take a lot more money and effort to get working since I'll need to get the wiring, ignition, and fuel sorted out. It isn't exactly a simple install and the additional items I need to purchase will cost more than the 340 AND the rebuild on it. I certainly won't be able to fool anyone about what is in there either. The nice part about the newer engines is the ability to keep the EFI which is fascinating to me. Fuel injection and a modern overdrive trans would certainly make the car more appealing on road trips (I live 45 minutes from everything).

In order of cost/complexity, the 5.9 would be the best choice with the 340 next and the Hemi last. I have to purchase the 340 before I can build it. I can sell the Hemi and 5.9 to offset the cost of the 340 OR keep the Hemi for one of my Chargers. By the same token, I could sell the Hemi and build a kick-butt 5.9 while clearing some space out of the garage. If I want the best "bang-for-the-buck", the 5.9 wins again. With the availability of cheap stroker kits and excellent aluminum Magnum heads it can be built much stronger than the 340 (even built up) for about the same cost as just getting the stock Hemi installed (and at that point it's well beyond the Hemi performance as well). The Hemi really becomes a novelty item - an expensive one. I'm sure that with more research and careful buying decisions I could get the Hemi going for a somewhat reasonable amount. It's the best performance choice if I don't modify anything internally and has the most potential if I ever want to "upgrade". The initial buy-in is the problem.

Troy

[Old Moparz]

I posted the 5.7 since you already have it in stock & could avoid spending money on an engine again. Not sure how much the 340 would set you back, but do you know for certain it's in good condition & that it has no damage? 

I think sometimes when you have less choices, things are a lot easier to decide. 

[Troy]

I agree go with the 5.7 and drive the hell out of it !    but if the 340 is cheap enought pick it up also and keep it . Thats alway a good selling point down the road if you decide to move it.

Not cheap enough to stash in my garage for later. Plus, I have a bad habit of collecting stuff that I never sell.

Even though I'm not a big fan of "restored" cars....I'd put the 340 back in if I had one at my disposal. 340's are a screamin' little engine.
Would one of the newer engines have fuel injection, O2 sensors, cam position sensors, fuel pump in tank, etc? I hate all that CRAP.....but that's just me, I LIKE old technology......

Yes, the 340 is a powerhouse and that's originally why I wanted one. All my other cars have big blocks but I think of E-bodies as Trans Am car and should be driven on curvy roads with a high winding small block. The 5.9 will likely be switched to a carb initially so I won't be dealing with the sensors and such (although if I keep the serpentine setup I'll need a fuel pump). The Hemi I'm not sure about. It depends on the computer I end up going with but the electronics are part of the allure of that particular engine.

  here is a 6.1 in a cuda !!   If you read about the 5.7 's alot of guys are getting great performance if you put the 6.1 heads and intake on the 5.7 .  The heads are pretty cheap ( compared to aluminum heads for our old cars) from chrysler also !

Define "cheap". I can add heads, cam, valve springs, intake, carb, and headers to the 5.9 and still have less than $4,000 in it or I can skip the heads and cam and have it running in the car for a bit more than the purchase price of the 340. The electronics, motor mounts and headers for the 5.7 will cost around $2,000 without even opening up the engine. There isn't much point in switching to the 6.1 heads without also adding a cam.

An original sublime 340 car? That's not exactly a combination that would be considered plentiful by any stretch of the imagination..... I'd grab the 340 and do it as close to original as possible, if it were me. If it was a plain jane 318 car, I'd probably go in a different (5.7L) direction.... but hey, it's your car, not mine, just chiming in with my 

Exactly. My inquiries earlier showed about 7,500 total A66 Challengers in 1970. Depending on the color break downs there probably wasn't more than about 200-300 ever made. Plus, mine has A/C. If it were a 318 car there wouldn't be any discussion. After all, the 5.9 and later the 5.7 were slated for my 318 Barracuda.

I posted the 5.7 since you already have it in stock & could avoid spending money on an engine again. Not sure how much the 340 would set you back, but do you know for certain it's in good condition & that it has no damage? 

I think sometimes when you have less choices, things are a lot easier to decide. 

Yep, but the purchase price is just one small part of getting that thing installed. As stated above, if the car were a base model there wouldn't be a decision. I'm reasonably certain that this particular 340 is in very good condition. For the price, it's worth it since I mostly find bare blocks that need all the other pieces ($$$) to complete. Fewer choices are definitely better. Anyone who knows me knows I put myself in the position to have lots of choices.

Troy

[moparstuart]

 I was quotes 350 each on 6.1  heads , that seemed cheap enought , you might wanna try to find a used intake the factory one is 600.00 and i think thats bare ? 

[Troy]

One 1970 Challenger With a 5.7 Hemi Coming Right Up!

By the way, that's a 392 - way out of my budget (list price of ~$19,000).... but pretty cool. I didn't realize they were that light though.

Troy

[CB]

sorry to hijack this threat but I wonder how much a 340 engine is worth. I do have the original 340 out of my (ex)cuda sitting at a friends shop somewhere in LA. It needs a complete rebuild though.
I don't need/want it.
I'd stay with a 340 in the chally, if possible. 
CB

[moparstuart]

One 1970 Challenger With a 5.7 Hemi Coming Right Up!

By the way, that's a 392 - way out of my budget (list price of ~$19,000).... but pretty cool. I didn't realize they were that light though.

Troy

sorry if i had 19k to spend on a motor it would be a real hemi 426 based 

[tan top]

One 1970 Challenger With a 5.7 Hemi Coming Right Up!

By the way, that's a 392 - way out of my budget (list price of ~$19,000).... but pretty cool. I didn't realize they were that light though.

Troy

  sorry if i had 19k to spend on a motor it would be a real hemi 426 based 

     

[69*F5*SE]

I'm a 340 fan so I guess I'd go that route if it were me, but that's me.   

[Old Moparz]

By the way, that's a 392 - way out of my budget (list price of ~$19,000).... but pretty cool. I didn't realize they were that light though.

Troy

Stop nitpickin'   


BTW, if you go the way of the 340 & want to get rid of the 5.7......I bet it would fit nicely in a Charger ragtop   

[Rolling_Thunder]

Troy -  Don't you already have a couple nicely restored Mopars ?  Make a nice driver...     drop in the 5.7 with an auto OD and just enjoy it...     I'm dropping the 6.1 in my Charger to have a nice driver...       AC, Cruise, power brakes, comfy seats, good handeling...      what's to debate man ?       

[BrianShaughnessy]

Sounds like you got your mind mostly made up anyway.   But I got  here anyway.  Do the EFI 5.9.  Screw the temporary carb conversion... do it once.

Rick's Savoy runs freakin great with the EFI 5.9 magnum crate and it turns decent times with 2.94 gears.

Most of it's based on factory parts.  It looks fairly stock except for a few extra gizmo's here and there and he's got a unsilenced air cleaner on top.    I'm sure a '70ish air cleaner would cover up most of the injector stuff even better.

It starts right up, idles great, dam good mileage.   Sounds killer with the 3" TTI system. 

I'm just not convinced that a non RT 340 car is THAT historically signifigant to go all original.   Your opinion may differ.

[firefighter3931]

Here's my 

E-bay the 5.7....it's not a real  hemi anyway.  

Spruce up the low milage 5.9 Magnum (awesome little engine with excellent cylinder heads  ) with a 4bbl and a nice mild performance cam, headers/dual exhaust and call it good. A proper  rebuild of any engine (insert 340 here) will cost 3k if not more.

And most importantly, finish of that E-headed 440 that i sent you parts for !   



Ron

[1969chargerrtse]

One 1970 Challenger With a 5.7 Hemi Coming Right Up!

By the way, that's a 392 - way out of my budget (list price of ~$19,000).... but pretty cool. I didn't realize they were that light though.

Troy

  sorry if i had 19k to spend on a motor it would be a real hemi 426 based 

Friggin A!!

[Troy]

Just a little background on the 340 cars in 1970:

They weren't badged as an R/T although the A66 "Challenger 340 Performance Package" included R/T bits such as the performance hood, HD brakes, HD suspension, bumble bee stripe, and Scat Pack (Bee) decal on quarter window. The wheel lip moldings were deleted as well. Road tests and personal accounts show that the 340 would generally beat a 383 in the 1/4 and the lighter weight (mine says just over 3200 lbs on the sticker) improved the road handling over the big blocks. I found another source stating 6,933 340 4bbl Challengers were made and I know about 1,800 were 4-speed cars leaving about 5,100 automatics. Dodge made 70,000 Challengers so this is a relatively small number (7%). I can't find a break down of colors (or even a good "guess") but all of the high impact colors are rarer than standard colors.

By the way, that's a 392 - way out of my budget (list price of ~$19,000).... but pretty cool. I didn't realize they were that light though.

Troy

Stop nitpickin'   


BTW, if you go the way of the 340 & want to get rid of the 5.7......I bet it would fit nicely in a Charger ragtop   

I had it up for sale several months ago and only had one person inquire about it. Did you decide to finally have your vert made?

Sounds like you got your mind mostly made up anyway.   But I got  here anyway.  Do the EFI 5.9.  Screw the temporary carb conversion... do it once.

Rick's Savoy runs freakin great with the EFI 5.9 magnum crate and it turns decent times with 2.94 gears.

Most of it's based on factory parts.  It looks fairly stock except for a few extra gizmo's here and there and he's got a unsilenced air cleaner on top.    I'm sure a '70ish air cleaner would cover up most of the injector stuff even better.

It starts right up, idles great, dam good mileage.   Sounds killer with the 3" TTI system. 

I'm just not convinced that a non RT 340 car is THAT historically signifigant to go all original.   Your opinion may differ.

Yes, I keep an eye on that. Didn't know he was running a 3" exhaust though. Mopar's pricing policies have left a bad taste with me in the past and their EFI kit is no exception. I'm still interested but for those prices it needs to be tunable. See my description of the A66 package above.

Troy

[Troy]

Here's my 

E-bay the 5.7....it's not a real  hemi anyway.   

Spruce up the low milage 5.9 Magnum (awesome little engine with excellent cylinder heads  ) with a 4bbl and a nice mild performance cam, headers/dual exhaust and call it good. A proper  rebuild of any engine (insert 340 here) will cost 3k if not more.

And most importantly, finish of that E-headed 440 that i sent you parts for !   



Ron

Yeah, yeah, I almost had myself talked out of it before I even posted. Should have just told people I couldn't find a 340. The 5.9 has a ton of potential and really doesn't look that different from stock.

Oh, and I sold off most of my "real" Hemi stuff to buy what I have now. The 440 goes in something else...

Troy

[pettyfan43]

I agree go with the 5.7 and drive the hell out of it !    but if the 340 is cheap enought pick it up also and keep it . Thats alway a good selling point down the road if you decide to move it.

[BrianShaughnessy]

See my description of the A66 package above.

Troy

YAWN.  Too many words.      Sorry but I'm still not convinced that it rates a full original resto. 

Otherwise...  plenty of time to scope out alternate EFI systems.    But you don't pay for wide open throttle tuning - just about anybody can do that.   What you pay for is part throttle,  cold start, warm start, idle quality, etc. tuning.   

At least you could use it for a 6 months / year driver. 

[WingCharger]

Plop in the 5.7, put in A/C, Power Steering, Power Brakes, and a good cam, and daily drive!

[Troy]

Sorry but I'm still not convinced that it rates a full original resto. 

Yeah, neither do a lot of other people since most seem to turn them into R/T clones. It's basically all the R/T stuff without the R/T badges.

As for the EFI, technically, I already have it since all the EFI equipment still attached to the engine. I even have the exhaust manifolds (which flow extremely well) and sensors. The stock computer will run the 5.9 Magnum just fine as long as I don't make too many changes - the automatic transmission computer with an A518 overdrive transmission or the manual transmission computer with an older automatic or any manual transmission. Hotrod98 is running the 5.9/A518 setup exactly as it was pulled from the donor vehicle. The Mopar MPFI "kit" is more for a total conversion. I believe it uses the 390 hp crate engine programming so it will handle some modifications but it isn't adjustable at all. The Savoy is using a 390 hp crate engine with no mods so it works well. I'd need to change my engine a wee bit to get into that range (cam, intake, and possibly heads). Optionally, Hughes sells a modified Edelbrock RPM Air Gap intake for roughly the same price as the Mopar EFI M1. The Air Gap is the king of intakes for those Magnum engines and I could run one with a carb for a while until I decided to add the EFI system - no major changes! I guess I have all winter to sort it out so perhaps going with EFI from the start is the best course.

Unfortunately, I have to get most of the information about tuning and upgrading these engines from truck sites (and LX sites in the case of the Hemi) since the swaps just aren't widespread yet. There are a bunch of places that will reflash a stock computer to any specs and also sell chips and programmers. The selection of performance parts is pretty good as well.

Troy

[General_01]

Just a little background on the 340 cars in 1970:

They weren't badged as an R/T although the A66 "Challenger 340 Performance Package" included R/T bits such as the performance hood, HD brakes, HD suspension, bumble bee stripe, and Scat Pack (Bee) decal on quarter window. The wheel lip moldings were deleted as well. Road tests and personal accounts show that the 340 would generally beat a 383 in the 1/4 and the lighter weight (mine says just over 3200 lbs on the sticker) improved the road handling over the big blocks. I found another source stating 6,933 340 4bbl Challengers were made and I know about 1,800 were 4-speed cars leaving about 5,100 automatics. Dodge made 70,000 Challengers so this is a relatively small number (7%). I can't find a break down of colors (or even a good "guess") but all of the high impact colors are rarer than standard colors.

I am looking at Galens little white book and here is the breakdown of 340 Challengers:

6,933          340-4
343             3SPD
2,819          4SPD
3,771          AUTO

It is up to you, but if you want to drive it ALOT, I would go the 5.9 route.

[Troy]

General_01: I modified my number in a later post to the one you just listed. I didn't have the breakdown of transmissions though. Seems to be an inordinate amount of 4-speeds in 340 cars. I think it's somewhere near half of the AARs and T/As and, according to that, over 40% of 340 4bbl cars.

I drove my Barracuda as a daily driver for a solid month, on three long road trips to shows, and almost every weekend for the summer and a half I owned it. I'd have driven it more but it leaked a bit and I wasn't taking any chances with rain after I put the new white interior in it. That car got as high as 23 mpg with the 318 and highway gears (even though it had a 4bbl). It wouldn't hardly spin the tires but it was awesome on the highway and (almost) never had any reliability or starting issues. That's what I'm looking for. I probably shouldn't have sold it... 

Troy

[Old Moparz]

I had it up for sale several months ago and only had one person inquire about it. Did you decide to finally have your vert made?

Troy

I remember seeing your 5.7 listed & almost sent you a PM about it, but decided to wait until I have things in order with the junk I have already. At the time, I was thinking about it for the '68 Charger instead of the 440 I have.

About doing the Charger ragtop conversion......yes, I'm pretty sure I will.....but not until after I visit their shop on a side trip from Florida this winter. I did take the Coronet for sale ads down from the few sites it was on.

[General_01]

Oops. Missed your other post.

You are right though. A lot of Challenger owners liked shifting the gears. 

Those were the days when people drove these cars every day. When I got my Bee in 1989, it was my daily driver from May to October until about 1995. Wish I could do that now. Problem is, I know how much it costs to fix these things now.

[Troy]

I had it up for sale several months ago and only had one person inquire about it. Did you decide to finally have your vert made?

Troy

I remember seeing your 5.7 listed & almost sent you a PM about it, but decided to wait until I have things in order with the junk I have already. At the time, I was thinking about it for the '68 Charger instead of the 440 I have.

About doing the Charger ragtop conversion......yes, I'm pretty sure I will.....but not until after I visit their shop on a side trip from Florida this winter. I did take the Coronet for sale ads down from the few sites it was on.

I'll trade you for that ugly brown car you have... Good luck with the convertible! I expect to see it at Carlisle next year.

Oops. Missed your other post.

You are right though. A lot of Challenger owners liked shifting the gears. 

Troy

[Charger-Bodie]

I think you should restore it back to as original as you can, cause thats how I would want it. 

[moparstuart]

larry roper has a cuda with the 5.9 set up he raves about and love the drivablity and mileage , maybe get his advise. I still say use the 5.7 

[oldgold69]

1 had a 69 340 in my 63 fury . i loved the way it would just keep revving. if you can put one in your car i would do it.  all the work of putting of putting in a 5.9 hemi is worth too because it is something different. but it is cool to say i have a 340 in it

[resq302]

Troy,

Here is one thing to consider since I have basically done an EFI conversion on a car.  I had a 85 Jeep CJ7 with the inline 6 cyl and converted it to EFI from the 2 bbl carb.  Had nothing but nightmares with it.  This was my daily driver for me also.  Was out in PA on a trip with it and had something go on it.  The problem was that no one had parts for it and they wanted to look it up by the vehicle even though it was not part of the original set up.

My vote is to keep it original since it would be a daily driver and this way should something happen, you know exactly what part you need, and wont have to play a guessing game with electronics controlled this or that.

[Ghoste]

I like the idea of putting a 340 in it as well.  I've just always liked 340 E-bodies. 

[69charger2002]

General_01: I modified my number in a later post to the one you just listed. I didn't have the breakdown of transmissions though. Seems to be an inordinate amount of 4-speeds in 340 cars. I think it's somewhere near half of the AARs and T/As and, according to that, over 40% of 340 4bbl cars.

I drove my Barracuda as a daily driver for a solid month, on three long road trips to shows, and almost every weekend for the summer and a half I owned it. I'd have driven it more but it leaked a bit and I wasn't taking any chances with rain after I put the new white interior in it. That car got as high as 23 mpg with the 318 and highway gears (even though it had a 4bbl). It wouldn't hardly spin the tires but it was awesome on the highway and (almost) never had any reliability or starting issues. That's what I'm looking for. I probably shouldn't have sold it... 

Troy

lol i probably shouldn't have sold the 70 340 challenger...   

hahaha  hey if  there is something to consider.. the challenger is much rarer and cooler than the plain jane yellow 318 73 cuda i got from you..

put the 5.9 in it(challenger)

[PocketThunder]

General_01: I modified my number in a later post to the one you just listed. I didn't have the breakdown of transmissions though. Seems to be an inordinate amount of 4-speeds in 340 cars. I think it's somewhere near half of the AARs and T/As and, according to that, over 40% of 340 4bbl cars.

I drove my Barracuda as a daily driver for a solid month, on three long road trips to shows, and almost every weekend for the summer and a half I owned it. I'd have driven it more but it leaked a bit and I wasn't taking any chances with rain after I put the new white interior in it. That car got as high as 23 mpg with the 318 and highway gears (even though it had a 4bbl). It wouldn't hardly spin the tires but it was awesome on the highway and (almost) never had any reliability or starting issues. That's what I'm looking for. I probably shouldn't have sold it... 

Troy

lol i probably shouldn't have sold the 70 340 challenger...   

hahaha  hey if  there is something to consider.. the challenger is much rarer and cooler than the plain jane yellow 318 73 cuda i got from you..

put the 5.9 in it(challenger)

whats that supposed to mean!  i think that "plain jane" '73 was a pretty good deal!              

[69charger2002]

oh for sure.. 
i was just being goofy as always..

[charge-it]

I would like to put a 1971 340 in the new Challenger...

[bull]

I don't know what it is about the 340 but I have a lot of respect and admiration for it. If it were any other CID I'd probably just run one of the other modern engines but IMO the 340 is special. I'd go with it.