starting daytona nose cone fitment

[thallium]

Thanks chargervert. I appreciate the input. There is a lot of estrogen in the air, but I guess it makes for a good read. haha.

[chargervert]

I have found that even when the threads get a little out of hand,there is still a lot of good info that gets passed around! My car is not finished yet,and I am still learning a lot of things that I didn't know about these cars! I am planing to build a second Daytona after I get some of my other cars done. I may do one in race trim,or maybe a replica of one of the racecars! I have a spare Charger body out back.

[hotrod98]

I agree with you Pete. I think that a little rumbling and rambling are good. I enjoyed this thread very much. I don't think Tabor feels like we hijacked his thread. We've weaved back and forth and a lot of new stuff always seems to come out. Bottom line is we all love wing cars. I'll probably never own a real one, but I might buy one some day. My wife and I had even thought seriously about buying Dave's (BK) '69 500/daytona conversion. We decided in the end that we would probably enjoy a couple of wing car clones more.
Personally, I get just as excited seeing a nice looking clone as I do a real one and in some cases even more so. I absolutely love Mike and Gary's third gen cars. I may build something similar out of my 74 Charger just to drive around town. I don't have the access to the knowledge that they have but I can probably throw something together.
BTW, thanks for the great thread Tabor.

[69_500]

Well at least I can see that even with some comments going back and forth at least everyone is being civil.

There is nothing wrong with offering up suggestions. I really like reading the thousands of different ways people have done things over the years. I for one love that. Because I know that I'm the type that tries to do things differently and see if I can either have a better result or at least the same result with less work, or less money involved. If there is a way to cut a corner and still get the job done right, then I'm all for it. Now if that means something doesn't work, or doesn't fit just right then its also good to hear it from someone who already tried to cut that corner adn found out you can't.

[dayclona]

Thanks chargervert. I appreciate the input. There is a lot of estrogen in the air, but I guess it makes for a good read. haha.

      Well, if there's Estrogen in the air, someone's "leaven a trail like a snail"...........I think you mean Testarone,.......Jerone!

[hotrod98]

And maybe a little testosterone to boot...

[genlee1970]

Thanks chargervert. I appreciate the input. There is a lot of estrogen in the air, but I guess it makes for a good read. haha.

      Well, if there's Estrogen in the air, someone's "leaven a trail like a snail"...........I think you mean Testarone,.......Jerone!

No Mike, I think he's talking about all the bitching and cat fighting, like it's some sort of heavy flow day. 

[chargervert]

I guess thats what they mean by go with the flow!

[thallium]

yep, I meant we are acting like sissy lala's or little girls. ha!.

[Daytona Guy]

<<< It wasn't that long ago Dane was saying that you don't need to run wing washers, or wing braces! Dane has changed his tune on that one!>>>

Just to note. I never said, ever, that one did not need to use wing washers. That is a miss quote. I said that depending on the use of your Daytona clone, you may not need wing bracing. If you are not planning on going 120+  it is not necessary to use wing bracing. I stand by this because it is a fact. Here is a 70 Charger RT that had a dealer installed original Daytona wing. NOT fiberglass. We bought it from the original owner who worked at Tektronix in Beaverton, OR, who had the wing installed. Came with wing washers only. I raced this car at PIR in Portland. I had it over 120 plus (Not in the Q) and never ever had a problem in 15 years of this wing on this car with the quarter panels. I have been consistent with my opinions. Do what you want, it is up to you, depending on your use.





I do see a deference in those wings regardless of the measurements. The radiuses of the base of that steel wing looks off.

I have never owned a fiberglass wing. I do not make my wing castings from a fiberglass wing. They are made from an original that came from this 70 Charger RT. Using an original wing assures the same shape, but not the same size. I have never said otherwise and my postings in context bear that out.

About "Aberrations" and "Clones". I have been doing this a long time. People will usually use words to try to convey an opinion. Either they want to belittle someone or they want to show respect. For example if someone did not like what I did they called my car a "Fake". Which by the way is the most accurate term for all none originals. For to clone something is not possible with a car, or if one did a exact copy it would be illegal. A clone is the exact copy, all the way down to the genes, plant or animal. For example, my fraternal twins are clones. They share the exact same genes. The only thing different with a fraternal twin is their finger prints.

So lets all be honest, aberrations, replicas and clones are fakes (Imitation), but fake could have a disrespectful flavor to it along with aberration and the intent is to belittle. I hope that is not what we are about.

Tabor, you are doing a great job.

[69_500]

Dane have a question for you.

Is the Yellow 70 charger with the wing, the same car as in the other pictures? As in did you change the color of it while you owned it, or are those pictures of other cars you added wings to over the years?

Clone, fake, abberation, or whatever you want to call it to me is all the same. It not a real Daytona, but that doesn't mean that it isn't a great looking car to me. I like them all, yeah I prefer a real Daytona, but I can't afford one. Will I some day probably build a clone YEAH. But I also plan on one day owning a real one to.

[Daytona Guy]

Yes, the blue and yellow are the same car. The black one was the first one we did back in 1980 the blue in 81.

I agree. I could care less about the name clone, fake, aberration, replica or imitation. I love my car, and I have a blast driving it. I have 4 kids and not a ton of jack and was able to improvise over the years to get them done.

I could never spend 20,000.00 on my cars for parts with 4 kids, collage and a mortgage. What is great though, is when I pull in to a show and take Best Mopar and others who have spent 40,000.00 or more jack don't place. It gives me some satisfaction that I am doing a good job. But, If I had the jack and money was not an issue I would buy the high dolor parts. I will not run down the expensive or the inexpensive parts, but I do think it is OK in a respectful way to point out the differences.

You can spend 2000.00 or 20,000.00 on parts and I think the options are great to have. When I retire and have more jack, It would be nice to make a more identical clone.

[BigBlockSam]

i've always liked how 70 r/t's look with just the wing and no nose. they look fast standing still.

[chargervert]

Well, this is probably going to crank the thread up again,but who wants a car that looks like it could go 200 MPH,but shouldn't go over 120 MPH,for fear that it might start coming apart! This is why I try to stress to build durable,and functional wingcars,this can be done within all different budgets! A stock 440 Charger R/T is capable of speeds in excess of 140 MPH,so wouldn't it be smart to put parts on the car,that would be capable of handling those speeds! I'm not saying that I am going out to drive my cars on the streets @ 140 MPH or more,but I have had my Charger over 140 MPH! If you just want to build cars that look fast,then thats your choice,but I want my Daytona,to be able to do everything,that an original Daytona could do! Chrysler put those braces on because they knew what speeds the cars were capable of!If the Daytona,was just meant to be an appearance package,,then i doubt that Chrysler would have gone through the trouble of bracing,and supporting all the aero pieces! If I choose to drive the car @ 140 MPH plus,then I know that I could! If not,then its a lot cheaper to build YUGOS!

[Daytona Guy]

<<<who wants a car that looks like it could go 200 MPH,but shouldn't go over 120 MPH,for fear that it might start coming apart! >>>

I took my Daytona (pic above) over 120 many times and it did not "come a part". So you are wrong again.  It was in the testing of the Daytona at speeds of over 180 to 200 that they witnessed the trunk buckle. So here are Chrysler engineers testing these Daytona wings WITH OUT wing bracing at speeds of 180 plus to even discover the NEED for wing bracing. So let me see if you can follow this. Theoretically—If they could not get the car to go over 180, and therefore would NOT have had the trunk buckle, the engineers would have considered the wing washers a success. (The 180 would have been the failure—smile)  I have had 9 Daytona's that have all been at high speeds and never had them give me a problem. Yet you can only speak in preventative terms with no facts to back it up. Yet, we do have the results of Chrysler engineers, as just stated, and I feel comfortable about what I have experienced. I will never take my car over 140 MPH. My hat is off to you.

Again, are you completely clueless? My point was not to debate this issue but was to correct your misuse of my Name and a quote that was untrue. That is a fact. The proper response would be, Gee Dane, I am sorry for misquoting you". I would have said, "No problem, have a good one". That is called civility. You said I did not see the need for "wing washers" and then you said I flip flopped on my belief, and that is completely untrue. Do you know the difference between wing washers and wing bracing? I hope so. But you do not know the difference between being a gentleman and being what you are and I think that most on this board can see that.

I understand that most, including me will be putting wing bracing on their cars. For me it is for cosmetics, for others it is because they feel better and secure having them, for still others it is because they are going to do speeds of 140+. I agree with all the above.

<<<I'm not saying that I am going out to drive my cars on the streets @ 140 MPH or more, but I have had my Charger over 140 MPH! >>>

Then you use wing bracing. It is OK. No qualms here. More power to you. Do you see me telling people NOT TO? No, I am saying to make your own choice by what you plan on doing.

I do not race mine. I do not plan on ever taking mine over 100 MPH. I just do not care too. Is that OK? Or, am I going to get insulted for saying that?

<<<If not,then its a lot cheaper to build YUGOS!>>> What ever...

Yes it would, but lets see... build a Yugo...... build a Daytona...... Daytona wins.

[chargervert]

Dane,I have heard you tell people that the braces are cosmetic,and I believe you said the same thing about the washers! If your saying you didn't say that about the washers,that is not as I remembered it,but it was a while back,so I may have remembered that part incorectly,and if I did,then I am sorry for the misquote.But it is no misquote about the braces! How much would the rear quarters have had to move to buckle the trunklid! Its not even attached to the wing! The streetcars were not capable of 180 MPH in stock trim,so why would the engineers bother to put them on a streetcar,especially if they were in a mad rush to get the cars done,if they werent needed! I know that I'm not running my car,with that wing on it,without all of the bracing on it that they came with from Chrysler! I paid $2500.00 for the flawless rear quarter cutoffs that I have for my car,and I'm not going to take any chances with them buckling,or stretching!And for someone to run one without them,now that would be clueless!

[Daytona Guy]

<<<I may have remembered that part incorectly,and if I did,then I am sorry for the misquote.>>>

Not a problem

<<<But it is no misquote about the braces! How much would the rear quarters have had to move to buckle the trunklid! >>>

Not the trunk lid, but the trunk. The upper back quarters where considered the trunk as well. I have seen the pics. It was where the back of the wing sits. The trunk lid was untouched. As I recall, it was not some massive failure either that one might envision.

<<<so why would the engineers bother to put them on a street car, especially if they were in a mad rush to get the cars done, if they weren't needed! >>>

Homologation

<<<I paid $2500.00 for the flawless rear quarter cutoffs that I have for my car,and I'm not going to take any chances with them buckling,or stretching!And for someone to run one without them,now that would be clueless!>>

At the speeds you are talking and for your well being that sounds appropriate for you. I would not want to lead you away from that.

[BigBlockSam]

yea, you know what 140 mph is, I've done it 3 times in my life. oh,  i went 170 mph. oh i went 130 mph.  your  ass. thats when all the rules change. if your on a bike, which i have been and you blink to hard it moves you over several feet. I'm certified by the NhRA to go under 10 second. I've done it in a car and a bike,.its scary , we build this cars for fun.  enjoy and build what you want. Peace Rene

[hotrod98]

The fastest that I've driven is 168 mph in the quarter mile and 148 in the 1000 ft with my pro comp dragster. I would never ever drive any of my musclecars at even 100 mph. My dragster is designed to go that fast safely. In my opinion, my street cars are not. I've never had any of my street cars over 90 mph and don't intend to. If I ever get one of my wing cars together, trust me, I will not be testing the structural integrity of wing.

[BigBlockSam]

cool dragster. I've always wanted a nostalgic dragster. like Don Garlits front engine one.

[hotrod98]

I owned Dickie Harrell's 69 funny car back in the mid 70's and later owned and raced one of the rare woody gilmore rear engine top fuel dragsters. Not one of the converted front motor cars, but a real rear engined car. He didn't build very many of those before he quit building cars.
As for the funny car, valerie harrel, dickie's daughter, owns the car now and she and dale pulde are going to restore it. It was the same car that he won the 70 world finals with. I sure miss those old cars, but I don't miss driving them. That rear engine dragster had the old style steering, butterfly wheel and hand brake. It was all that I could handle just getting the chute out and getting of the track without destroying something. I owned three more dragsters after that and I had them all custom built and they drove great.
The good old days weren't all that good sometimes.
Here's a pic of my last car.

[nascarxx29]

The question I have is on Lee Scilios record breaking daytona .Thats been over 200 MPH .Are his fiberglass parts .Any different than the ones someone building a street clone would use?The 70 daytona clone I sold from being built in the early 80-s.Was subjected to high speeds.And 1/4 mile duty.And these were the early 78 quaility line of parts.And not the improved materials of today .And not even a stress crack.It had a real 500 back glass with fiberglass window plug .I feel alot of parts failure comes to the workmanship methods of the installer

[BigBlockSam]

to go 200 mph with a fiberglass wing, yes it has to be reinforced, BIG TIME! I've heard stories of fiberglass wings shaking at 110 mph.

[Highbanked Hauler]

 

[Old Moparz]