starting daytona nose cone fitment

[Daytona Guy]

The question I have is on Lee Scilios record breaking daytona .Thats been over 200 MPH .Are his fiberglass parts .Any different than the ones someone building a street clone would use?The 70 daytona clone I sold from being built in the early 80-s.Was subjected to high speeds.And 1/4 mile duty.And these were the early 78 quaility line of parts.And not the improved materials of today .And not even a stress crack.It had a real 500 back glass with fiberglass window plug .I feel alot of parts failure comes to the workmanship methods of the installer

You may have a good point. Good work on your clone.

[Daytona Guy]

Gary Scelzi let me drive his HEMI in the last Nationals and I went 330 MPH and this plastic body fell a part at 180 MPH. 

[BigBlockSam]

aren't those bodies made of carbon fiber?

[Daytona Guy]

I'm sure they use the latest tec, I was just having fun. I guess I would need to go back a few more years 

[hotrod98]

Way back maybe.
This is the actual car that I owned in the mid 70's after Dick Harrell was killed. That car body was so heavy that it took two guys to lift it or one really strong guy. It was  one of the reasons that I decided to sell it in '77 right before I got married. That and the fact that I needed the money for college.

[Old Moparz]

Cool looking car Larry, I had to do a double take thinking it may have been a Challenger at first.   

[BigBlockSam]

very cool car larry. i thought it was a challenger at first too

[hotrod98]

It looks a lot like the challenger funny car that was at the Columbia swap meet this last weekend.
I think RD posted a pic of it earlier this week. My funny car was a 69 camaro.
I owned a real SS RS 396 4-speed camaro a few years later.

[triple_green]

Here is the calculation for down force (on teh wing) from our Philadelphia Wind Tunnel Manager:

The force generated by a wing is directly proportional to the square of the speed.  So if you double the speed, the force goes up four times.  It's a squared relationship.  You can do a rough approximation of the force with the following:

Downward Force = 0.00384 x (wing area) x (speed in MPH)

Assuming the wing is 2 ft by 6 ft, the wing area = 12sqft

At 50 mph the force =  0.00384 x 12 x (50)^2 = 115lbs
At 100mph the force = 0.00384 x 12 x (100)^2 = 460 lbs

3X

[hotrod98]

So a 6" X 5' wing would have 96 lbs of downforce at 100 mph and 384 lbs of downforce at 200 mph? Sounds plausible.
That would mean that the wing on my Top Comp dragster which was approximately 1' x 4' would have had approximately 433.5 lbs of downforce at 168 mph. I could believe that easily.

[BigBlockSam]

 at what speed do you feel a daytona or superbird  squat?  i've heard that you can feel the car get tighter to the road. Rene

[dayclona]

So a 6" X 5' wing would have 96 lbs of downforce at 100 mph and 384 lbs of downforce at 200 mph? Sounds plausible.
That would mean that the wing on my Top Comp dragster which was approximately 1' x 4' would have had approximately 433.5 lbs of downforce at 168 mph. I could believe that easily.

additional data is required, such as wing "inclination" to determine a truer downforce end result, also if airfoil section is inverted, also what design airfoil/ profile,.(ex. Clark Y, D or SW design,etc,etc).............as this can substantially change the above formulas............food for though?


Mike G/ DAYCLONA

[thallium]

Pics of the nosecone attached. I took this picture before I got the rubber moulding the surrounds the nose cone on. The headlight doors are secured shut. Next week I'm going to try and pull out the engine and trans and get those rebuilt. Then it's time to paint....  As I get crap done, I'll keep this thread updated.

[Daytona Guy]

You are doing a freaking great job. Fitment is always fun. On my yellow one I redid my sides on my nose to match perfect. Even the originals had their issues. I find that because mine is a clone people seemed to be more critical, so I just made it look better than the original. Notice the '70 the fender how it bows ... the nose cones did not quite match up to the radius of the fender.

Keep up the great work... Your getting it done.

[Daytona Guy]

Got an idea for your headlights. You can get a tinted plex-glass that is similar to the turn signal color and put it over the lights. (Not too dark, just enough to trick the eye)  In the daytime they will appear to be turn signals, but at night the power of the light will show bright and the yellow will not be noticeable.  It could make them even more stealthy. Just a thought.

I love your idea. I might look into doing that on my next Daytona, but try to find a headlamp that is similar is size to the turn signal. I will also be joining the nose to the fenders like the Mystery 70 Daytona.

[hotrod98]

Dane,
I'm sure that you've seen this bird clone before with the nose blended into the fenders. Looks kind of radical with that long front end. I saw this car at the nats a few years ago and instantly wanted to build a wing car. My bird clone won't have the nose blended into the fenders, but it will definitely not look like a stock bird.

http://www.cars-on-line.com/23909.html

[Old Moparz]

Pics of the nosecone attached. I took this picture before I got the rubber moulding the surrounds the nose cone on. The headlight doors are secured shut. Next week I'm going to try and pull out the engine and trans and get those rebuilt. Then it's time to paint....  As I get crap done, I'll keep this thread updated.

Thanks for adding more photos, it's a good source of motivation. If I had some damn heat in the garage I might be out there more this time of year to do some test fitting as well. (In the 20's today, so that means very cold hand tools.)

[Daytona Guy]

What a great Bird. I have not seen that. The Bird's nose fit better from the get go, and the Daytona looks so bad that it looks like a home made job from the start. That is why I want to do one molded with clean lines. I will see.

[hotrod98]

Tabor,
Thanks for posting the updated pics. We enjoy seeing your progress.
What did you finally decide as far as the engine is concerned?

[chargerboy69]

Tabor, I did not see were you posted about this in ealier threads, so I will ask. Are you doing a rear window plug? If so from where? Where did you purchase the nose and wing? I have considered this for my car.  The car is looking great. Thanks. . .

[thallium]

Larry, this is going to sound like a crime, but I'm probably going to rebuild the 318 that is in it and put it back into the car. I've got a balls out 440 for the 68 and it's a really responsive engine and more torque than I can lay down.   People are going to hate this, but to each his own. I'de like to make this into a commuter car so I can drive it to work everyday.  Not only would it get around 15 mpg, but I could litterally drive this car to work every day. It would get more "show time" out on the streets and people would actually get to see one of these things instead of sitting in my garage and only driven on weekends. I want to make this car into something that is driven everywhere for me, not just here or there, but is my main mode of transportation. It's not definate yet, I have a 440 sitting in the garage I can use, but I am considering using the 318.

As for the rear window, I'm going to leave it alone.  I know my limitations and skill level and know when I've bitten off more than I can chew.

The wing I got from a member here on dc.com, but I don't think he's in the business of selling them. He kinda was already making one for himself and I just caught him at the right time and he just made me an extra one. You can buy fiberglass ones as cheap as $800, but I was able to get an aluminum one for $600, so I went with the aluminum one.

The nose cone and front end parts I got from a place called showcars body parts. The parts are reasonable and I was able to get all my parts front end and wing for around $2,000.  The only thing I would suggest is buying the headlight doors from someone else. They were cut sloppy and made it hard to get them to fit right in the nose.

[hotrod98]

Tabor,
I understand the 318 thing completely and applaud you for doing your own thing. Just remember, while you're out cruising up and down the highway, the guys with the big motors are stopping at the gas station every few miles. lol
I myself, have to make a decision regarding the driveline for the bird clone that I'm building this summer. I have an extra complete 440 six pack motor from air cleaner to pan, fresh and ready to bolt in and the 426 crate motor that I bought for the chal convert. However, I've been seriously thinking about using a 5.7 hemi and 5 speed automatic trans. My wife loves her late model 5.9 liter/od tranny setup in her cuda and the 25 mpg is nice on those long trips and it always starts and runs so smoothly. I really want to drive this car and would love to have a reliable good running engine.
I think you're definitely making a good decision with the 318.

[Old Moparz]

Hey Tabor,

I will also say don't worry about the engine size & use what works best for you. I've got 2 cars with 318's in them, & don't care what people think. If I had swapped to a big block like I would have initially wanted to, I'd have parts all over & wouldn't have either of them together at all. By the way, I'm prpobably going to hold off on the window plug too, since I'm in the same postition with body work qualifications as yourself.

Bob

[Daytona Guy]

What is nice about holding off on the rear window it allows you to get the job done. You can then enjoy your car because you can see the end in sight. You can always add the rear window later after you recoup and get geared up for round two. You know what it is like with these cars, they are never done... Just adding the rear window later can keep your focus and energy on that task alone, if you want to do it at all.

[BigBlockSam]

hey Tabor
   your daytona's looking great. put a nice pair of headers on that 318. so it sounds good and  some tunes for the head. then drive the hell out of it. what color you gonna paint it. Rene