Vibrations

[Belgium R/T -68]

My excuses for the bad picture but the only thing I find on the pump is that the left part seems not to have sealed towards the block.
No dirt inside pump or valve, will use silicone this time.

[aifilaw]

My excuses for the bad picture but the only thing I find on the pump is that the left part seems not to have sealed towards the block.
No dirt inside pump or valve, will use silicone this time.

^^  see story about silicone and how to use it above.

[Belgium R/T -68]

New "old" pump installed, will wait 24 hours and retighten before I start up again. If it still will p**s out oil I'm out of idés.

[Belgium R/T -68]

Car doesn't want to start With fully charged battery it's almost starts but then nothing, could it be because it's almost 0° C (freezing)
and I need to give some extra gasoline to the eddy 750?

[BigBlockSam]

I need to give some extra gasoline to the eddy 750?

these big blocks with eddy's need a lot of gas to start . especially in the cold . i use a little carb cleaner down it's throat . gives it some help  or just pump the shit out of the gas pedal before starting . like twenty pumps then turn the key .   good luck.

[Belgium R/T -68]

My ex challenger had also a eddy carb and needed one full battery to start when it was cold, just when you thought the battery was dead it started.
Tomorrow I will try warming up the engine a little with my propane blower. 

[firefighter3931]

Per, is there any fuel in the carb ? Those Eddy carbs are known for allowing the fuel to evaporate after sitting for a few days. 

Try filling the bowls up and see what happens. 


Ron

[BigBlockSam]

Tomorrow I will try warming up the engine a little with my propane blower.  Wink

you don't need to do that . here's the deal . full charge on batt. crank it while pumping the the gas . after a little while stop. so you don't over heat the starting circuit.  then crank again and pump the pedal again . when it pops like it want to start , stop . pump the pedal again, with out cranking. like 20, 25 times . then crank again , if it trys to start keep pumping it and keep it running till it warns up. if it doesn't start . stop cranking it . and pump the pedal again , 20 , 25 times and that big bitch will start . 440's are cold hearted bitch's . it will start doing this . it may take 3 or 4 trys . i don't run chokes on a couple of my 440 with eddy's . and this is what it takes to get them started in cold weather . if your running a holley , this will flood the carb out . not with eddy's . good luck Rene

[BigBlockSam]

Those Eddy carbs are known for allowing the fuel to evaporate after sitting for a few days.  yesnod

IS THAT WHAT HAPPENS?   

I've always thought that it was that the gas kinda went back to the tank.    when you try to start the cars with eddy's that have been sitting . it takes a while to get the gas back into the carb . you gotta crank the hell out of them . if it was just the gas in the carb. i think it would came to life a lot quicker . 

[Ghoste]

I find I have to follow the same procedure whether its a Holley or Eddycarter, after sitting for a while they need the fuel at the front end of the car.

[aifilaw]

When it really comes down to it, cranking a cold carbed block will require a happy mixture of fuel and air, and spark. If you soak the plugs in gas, then you will have problems, if you soak the cylinders in fuel, then you will have wear.
Does your new fuel injected vehicle require 10 minutes and some luck to get started in the winter? No, then what are they doing.
The answer is, slightly more fuel (and I'm talking very little, and only when temp is below freezing), nothing different on the air, and advancing the timing by a few degree's initially.

If it really is that cold, use your choke, if it is wired open, then take a shop rag and make it a team effort. If you've flooded it, then you will see either fuel on the plug, or smell it coming out the exhaust... take a 15 minute break and let it evaporate before trying again.

Bigblocksam's method doesn't flood the engine as badly as a Holley because the edelbricks accel assist is much smaller than a Holley.

[Belgium R/T -68]

I've tried all above without luck        I don't think anymoore it's only the cold.
This is what's happend so far:

-First startup 2 weeks ago, immediatly started, ran 20 minutes without any problems concerning heat or oilpressure.
- 5 hours later, starts good but oilfilter shoots after a few seconds.
- Few days later with new oilfilter engine runs badly for a few seconds, oil is pooring from the pump/filter.
- Last days, refuses to start although I tried everything regarding fuel and distributor (180° from oilpump change).

I do have 70 PSI at cranking, is that normal? Time to pull a valvecover? Did something else happend the second start? 

[firefighter3931]

Per, are you getting fuel at the carb ? Does the carb have a choke ?

If the engine has been flooded you might have fouled the plugs.


Ron

[aifilaw]

You primed the new oil pump with a drill to check your oil pressure and ensure everything is lubricated, correct?

70psi at cranking is what?
If it is your cylinder pressure then you have one of three problems.
1. You are only checking one cylinder, the others still have spark plugs in them
2. You are not cranking the motor over fast enough
3. Bad cylinder pressure.

Start with the basics, the very basics...this thread/your engine seems to be causing you inordinately more trouble than it should. So make sure you aren't missing anything along the way.

Remove your driver-side valve cover to unveil the tops of #1,3,5, and 7 so you can check valve movement of cylinder #1.
Rotate your crankshaft by hand to cylinder number 1 TDC on the compression and combustion stroke.
Rotate your distributer such that spark plug number one is on the rotar.
Close everything back up. Hook up battery cables to another running vehicle, let charge for 10 minutes to ensure both batteries are at full capacity.
Manually drop 1/2 a cup of fuel down the primaries of the carberator.
Turn key.

If that fails, now you know your timing is correct, ensure you have spark by pulling a spark plug out, leave it attached to the plug wire and set the threads on the block while turning over the engine, should visually see good spark.

[Belgium R/T -68]

Per, are you getting fuel at the carb ? Does the carb have a choke ?

If the engine has been flooded you might have fouled the plugs.


Ron

Ron,
I have fuel to carb and I have a installed electric choke.

The 70 PSI is oilpressure at my new installed gauge.

Why did it start so easy the first time? 

[firefighter3931]

Assuming you have good fuel delivery and spark then i have to believe the plugs are fouled. The timing should be fine because you had it running before...unless you changed the timing or adjusted the distributor.

Pull a few plugs and see if they're gas fouled. What plugs are you running in this engine ? I like the NGK XR5's on those iron head builds....fwiw 

Oil pressure has nothing to do with a cold start problem.


Ron


Ps. This is why i'm not an Eddy carb fan. I've been able to start in sub zero temps with a holley and that is with no choke.

[Belgium R/T -68]

Ron,
Will pull the plugs later this week when the motivation is back.

[Belgium R/T -68]

I guess this means the choke is working very well, and all the pumping I did. You don't see it on the pictures but the plugs are really wet.

You were right again Ron

A new set of plugs and we are ready for startup again.

[FLG]

Just a note. If you flood the engine let it sit for awhile. Have someone or something hold the choke wide open, and put the pedal at WOT and start cranking. Should move enough air to dry the plugs to they fire.

[aifilaw]

Just a note. If you flood the engine let it sit for awhile. Have someone or something hold the choke wide open, and put the pedal at WOT and start cranking. Should move enough air to dry the plugs to they fire.

"new" plugs are rarely necessary. I've been sanding clean and re-using spark plugs about 4-5 times before the electrodes are worn to the point that I replace them. Certain aircraft spark plugs get that treatment more often than that.

[Belgium R/T -68]

New plugs and same thing, it even came gasoline from the plughole. Could it be the idlescrew setting from the first startup
together with the electrical choke making it flooding? Should I try disconnect the choke?
I still come back to the question why it started so easy the first time? 

BTW, didn't do any pumping this time.

[Steve P.]

Per, Sorry I didn't see that you posted back. It sounded to me like you were flooded out and I would have done just as Ron said. I am thinking that maybe you have some water in your fuel that has stuck your needle and seat in the open position. I say that due to your motor firing right up in the video and you have mentioned that you are now freezing.   Also I got it about the oil pressure.

I would have to say you should air out your garage and remove as much fumes as possible and then heat up the space.. I don't really care for open flames inside a shop as the fumes are the problem, not a spill you can see..

A trick I've used in the frozen North was to pull my truck around so the exhaust was close to the frozen gas line or carb and put my exhaust hose from my tailpipe to what ever I thought was frozen.  Always worked like a charm.. That is as long as you have an exhaust hose....

I did this on in a parking lot for a customer once using a wet shop rag. I laid the rag on my tailpipe and got it plenty warm. Then put it in a snow bank to soak up some water. From there it was back to the tailpipe for a good heating and off to the frozen fuel line... It took a few reheats but it worked great...  I heated a frozen door lock this way once too... 

I would go for the basics. Pull the plugs back out. Pinch off the fuel line to keep additional fuel from reaching the carb. With the plugs out I would crank the motor over for a minute to clear the cylinders. (Good time to check the oil for gas too). Once you know the cylinders are clear put your clean plugs in and fire her up...

One note on cleaning plugs:  I never recommend that anyone uses a sand blast cleaner or even sand paper to clean plugs. The sand can lodge in the plug and after it has been reinstalled and heated up by the running motor it can fall free and score the hell out of your cylinders... I clean plugs with a wire wheel and carb cleaner. Otherwise I install new ones...  Cold gas seams to take forever to evaporate.

[Belgium R/T -68]

Steve,
I can only think of no spark or a flooding carb as a reason although my experience with edelbroeck is the opposite. You have to pump untill your
right leg has faded away before it starts in cold weather.
Did I f**k something up while lifting the distributor when I changed the oilpump? I have checked TDC towards sparkplugposition but it can still be
180° wrong although I don't see how that could have happend.
Battery has to charge untill tomorrow before next try.

[Steve P.]

Unless you pulled your distributor your ignition timing cannot have changed. since there is no need to pull the distributor to change the oil pump or it's gasket I took for granted that you did nothing to the timing. Therefor I would expect the motor to come to life as before. That's why I think you may have a ton of fuel soaking the plugs.

I don't like using a shop rag over a carb ever. If it were to fire and suck the rag into a valve you could put your motor into a world of hurt.

The cold weather starting with an Eddy carb is very true. I meant that you may have gas flooding the motor due to a frozen needle and seat. A motor can be started without a carb on it. It won't run long, but you will know it can be run. Then it's a matter of knowing if the fuel is the problem of the carb. This is why I suggested to pinch off the fuel line to the carb. If the bowls are full and the needle is stuck open it will flood out your new plugs.

You could also drop your hood down and place a few 100 Watt lights around the bottom of the motor.. It only takes a few degrees to melt ice. (If that is your problem).

[Belgium R/T -68]

Temp in garage has been a couple degrees above zero the last days and I have used a 300w spot pointed to the engine all day yesterday.
I did lift the distributor because I thought it was necessary but I am sure I put it back like it was.

Is it true that to much gasoline in the cylinders clean the oil and remove compression so it would be difficult to start?
Will try tomorrow to "dry" it out and disconnect the choke.