I know what killed the 440, God I would have nerver thought they F--k this up!

[cudaken]

 Well I have some pic for you folks of the holes and slugs. At this point, like I know anything don't look that bad to me. PIC of the worst pistons and holes, try to make them as detailed as I could.

Before I listed the big F--k up few other details. Be side painting my push rod's, they painted my timing chain? Oil pick up is full of Race Hemi Orange paint. Found 2 holes where the top and second ring gaps where with in 10 degrees of each other if that much.one oil ring (3 pices) where all the gapps where in a line?

Wonder why the 440 used a quart of oil in 85 miles, same thing the 42sick had wrong.

Few PIC of the slugs and holes, then the prizes.

                                                           Cuda Ken

[cudaken]

 Next worst holes and slug.

Have no clue what caused the mark on hole 3 on the thrust side. Scott seems to think there may have been some water in the hole?

All the pistons look pretty much the same and so do the holes. Cannot really catch them with a finger nail but can feel them.

Know hard to tell from a PIC, but not much looks odd to me. Well next PIC will.

[cudaken]

 Did not take PIC of all the rod bearings, well one. The white cost have marks on them and can see some silver but no much. Sort of feel them, but more see than feel. I would thing this is not that odd with break in but Scott seems to think they all need to go? Will post PIC Friday.

Now for the feast of resistences, the coupde gras. Trying to spell french.

When I got to rod 4, one bolt was not even tight!

As soon as I tried to get a socket on it, it moved?     

Yep that is what killed the $7,000.00 440. Rod bearing is chewed to shit. It all so explains why at first I only heard the racket at 2000 and above RPM's, them at idle. If I had not pulled it when I did it would have been in the oil pan with all the F--king paint!

Good news so far is the crank still feels good.

Will be talking with D&D Friday, if they don't offer this time to do the right thing (Rich from Mopar heaven) is sending his work to another shop and I am heading out there with a screw gun and 5 gallons of 100 ocatne AV gas.   Cant burn it, don't want it to go bad

                                                 Cuda Ken

[max]

Ken, that is some sorry looking machine work. and by the details of your desciption of the paint being on the inside of the engine, it was just a time bomb waiting to go off.

it is clear by the photos that the piston to wall clearance was way to tight. i have torn engines apart that had close to 100k miles on them and didn't have that much wear on the piston skirts.

if you have another set of those pistons, i would use the spares and throw those away.
and i would see if you could bore those scratches out of those cylinders, because you need the extra clearaces for those forged pistons.   

[cudaken]

 Max, feels like .025 to Sott by hand. But will find out when it get to the new machine shop.

I do have a other set of pistons, but have some eye brows in them that are not factory. From Brain 69 440 - Six pack and bad roller rockers.

Mic will tell the tale.

                                      Cuda Ken

[Blown70]

WOW..... IF THEY DO NOT DO SOMETHING ABOUT THAT... WHOLLY CRAP....

[Mefirst]

-Damn

[firefighter3931]

Yep, looks like piston to wall clearance was too tight judging by the scuff marks that are present on the bores and slugs. What a shame... Hope the old shop covers the repair costs. The loose rodbolt is inexcusable ! 

Ron

[TruckDriver]

WOW..... IF THEY DO NOT DO SOMETHING ABOUT THAT... WHOLLY CRAP....

If they don't, personaly, I'd sue them for that

[cudaken]

 So the pistons are junk?

                                             ken

[Chryco Psycho]

pistons are not junk IF the skirts have not collapsed
this is exactly why I went to approx 12 machine shops before finding the only one I use now , all of the other shops produced similar results to what you have , it is hard to find a good machinist 

[Silver R/T]

uh oh someone owes you a refund

[Ghoste]

How can a place that does that kind of work even stay in business?  It's beyond incompetent or careless or negligent. 

[RallyeMike]

Sorry to see that. Good that the crank survived.

It's a pain in the ass, but ALWAYS disassemble, assemble, check the bolts & clearances, and go over everything with a fine tooth comb every time. Just last month I had some valves ground and the shop returned the heads with the rocker shafts full of F#%&ing blast material ! I would have never known if I had not taken it apart to check the work. Even the best shops are going to screw something up every once in awhile. 

[4402tuff4u]

Wow! Sorry to hear that CudaKen. I'm now thinking about my 440 engine presently at the machine shop for a total rebuilt. The machine shop where my engine is at does mostly high performance aircraft engines, so I'm hoping that their quality control is very strict. I'm spending a bit more by going with this shop for this exact reason, but I heard that it has a good reputation. But as mentioned before any shop can make mistakes. Ken I hope they do the right thing for you - Good luck.

[nh_mopar_fan]

Holy cow.

Did this shop have a good rep? How the hell do you eff this up that badly?

I wouldn't hesitate to sue their ass if they don't make it right.

[cudaken]

 Neil. thank you for making me feel a little better. 2 bad pistons I can handle but not all 8 of them.

If the pistons are to tight like most of you think, I just have to wonder why 3 shop's missed that? First shop does mainy stock stuff, OK one of the reason I had it double checked. Thrid shop D&D, turns out Rich mainly sends them there stock egines, I wish I had know that up front. But Dan, the second shop does nothing but HP Mopar work, he should have caught it.

Oh well, no reson to cry over lost 10W-40. Just hope the next shop knows there stuff.

                           Cuda Ken

[firefighter3931]

I agree with Neil on the pistons....if they're not badly gouged then it's salvageable. The block is the key issue here as to whether or not those pistons can be reused. If you can finish hone .004 off the cylinder walls and have it clean up then i'd say you can reuse the slugs. If you need to remove more than that it could possibly require an overbore to the next size up making these pistons obsolete for this particular build. My opinion of course     

Ron

[RD]

damn ken sorry to see that happened.  sounds like you need to lynch your machinist, need some help?   j/k  Let me know if I can help ya out in any way.

RD

[67_Dodge_Charger]

That sucks.   

The machinist should have check clearances.

Robert

[cudaken]

 nh_mopar_fan first nice to see you hear from you and after my little @%$& about the Ugly Charger I gave you. Yes, they had a good rep from Rich at Mopar heaven or I would never used them. Rich and I go way back and he restores Mopar's for a living. AMT and then Lin's Crank have the best rep (Lins did the crank and balances) but there waiting time is 2 months to get the engine in. I was in a hurry back then and spoke with Rich about a nother shop. Rich was using them till what happened to me. They where doing 2 to 4 a month for him. Not now after they treated me this way.

As far as sueing them, I am up the creek on that one. Threw away the recipt for the 440. First, I am a man of my word and use to dealing with people that are the same way. Plus like I said Rich is the one that told me to use them and Rich is the same way as I am. Second, all the recipt showed was they took the 440 apart again, hot tanked, checked clearnes and wrenched it back together and that is it. Warranty was a hand shake and like a fool, that was good for me.

After the block and pistons are checked out, will throw the junk in the trunk in the Road Runner and see what they have to say. Rick knew (Ower son) this engine was getting a Supercharger and told me he had a blowen 440 as well. Maybe a leave blower with a 44CC engine.

                                 Cuda Ken

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

I had similiar findings on my "rebuilt" 440 engine with less than 100 miles on it.....


Did a clean up hone and used higher comp pistons than were in there.....built it up myself and have over 1500 milles on it so far with no troubles

[General_01]

Hope they back up their work. That just looks plain ugly. Good Luck Ken.

[Plumcrazy]

Another thing to nitpick.  I'm not impressed with the crosshatch honing on the cylinder walls.  Looks like it was done by hand with a hand drill.

[Chryco Psycho]

good call that definatly is not a 45* cross hatch