WARNING! DANGER! If you are or will run a flat tappet cam read this!!!

[Ghoste]

Part number is 88862586 but be prepared because Government Motors doesn't give the stuff away.

[c00nhunterjoe]

how bad are we talkin? and how much do i need?

[Ghoste]

You'll only need one but from what I've been hearing the going rate seems to be around 24 bucks a bottle.

[c00nhunterjoe]

 

[b5blue]

Look in your oils for "Off Road" and check the mix...no need for 25.00 additives. look for "Racing" ect. 

[squeakfinder]

 I got a bottle of Zzdp plus at a local parts house about a month and a half ago. It was around 10 buck's.

[74roadrunner440]

so why not post what a guy should get or buy and does it affect hydrolic lifters too not just solid lifters any sugjestions would be help full im rebuilding my 440 and if i need or should change any thing please let me know email me at m16king@netscape.net what oil should i buy is my ? with hight zink or should i put roller cam lifters and rockers can some one let m eknow what a guy should do im not going to put thousans of dollar in to this motor to have to rebild it again thanks pat

[c00nhunterjoe]

if its not roller its affected. so yes, you need the additive as well.  from what i have gathered from this it is a dealer part in my area. no aftermarktet parts places know what i am asking for.

[Ghoste]

This is very much about hydraulic lifters as well.  A roller cam is an option but it isn't a cheap proposition and with the variety of zinc additives coming to the market now you shouldn't have to.  As to specific cominations, read through the whole thread and you should be able to easily come up with one of your own.  There are a few additives out there now and they all seem like they are doing the job.

[b5blue]

Ghoste is right a flat tappet is any lifter that isn't roller! Slant six to Hemi...that's why this thread is so important. I still think this is just another way to get old cars off the road. I'll bet there are old cars dropping left and right all across the country by now.

[Long Island RT]

Anybody try this stuff?

"Product Description

Hughes Extreme Pressure Oil Additive - (1 Pint)
Over the past 10 years or so all cam manufacturers have seen an increase in flat tappet cam failures, particularly in the high performance arena. We have spent close to a year researching oils and additives to try and find a product that could eliminate this problem. We have found it! Hughes Engines Extreme Pressure Lubricant is a state of the art additive package that is compatible with standard (mineral based) oils or synthetics. To complement this highly specialized additive package a proven friction modifier, Micron Moly® is further blended into the oil treatment. Micron Moly® is a liquid soluble type of moly that plates to the metal surfaces of the engine. Once plated, the moly forms a long lasting lubricant film which prevents the metal surfaces from coming into contact with each other. By preventing metal to metal contact, damaging frictional wear is eliminated, which leads to less downtime and longer engine life. This additive should be used with all flat tappet camshafts. We suggest using this with your break-in oil and at every oil change. One pint will treat up to 5 quarts of oil.

Soluble molybdenum carbamate integrates into your base oil and cannot be filtered out by the oil filter like many other after market additives do. Why do we sell this particular Extreme Pressure Lube? Simple. Our first priority is to give our cams long life and this product does just that. We are happy to share this technology with others who have flat tappet cams who have had to struggle with this same issue.

Soluble Molybdenum carbamate has been used for 50 years or more in the industrial and H.D. trucking industry. We are offering this product as an oil additive. Hughes Engines Extreme Pressure Oil additive is recommended specifically for flat tappet camshafts in all applications. It can be added to any oil, good or crap. It will not affect catalytic converters. Yes, you can use it with roller cams, too! It is super slippery (slick) so if your rocker, pushrod tips and wrist pins live longer, don't be surprised. With products like this you can expect manufacturer claims of, better mileage, improved fuel mileage and reduced oil consumption, stops global warming, helps you lose weight etc...... All of that is possible, I suppose, but we kow it will protct your cam & lifters. That is why we use it and recommend it.
$9.95
MREHU3690"

[ACUDANUT]

Anybody try this stuff?

"Product Description

Hughes Extreme Pressure Oil Additive - (1 Pint)
Over the past 10 years or so all cam manufacturers have seen an increase in flat tappet cam failures, particularly in the high performance arena. We have spent close to a year researching oils and additives to try and find a product that could eliminate this problem. We have found it! Hughes Engines Extreme Pressure Lubricant is a state of the art additive package that is compatible with standard (mineral based) oils or synthetics. To complement this highly specialized additive package a proven friction modifier, Micron Moly® is further blended into the oil treatment. Micron Moly® is a liquid soluble type of moly that plates to the metal surfaces of the engine. Once plated, the moly forms a long lasting lubricant film which prevents the metal surfaces from coming into contact with each other. By preventing metal to metal contact, damaging frictional wear is eliminated, which leads to less downtime and longer engine life. This additive should be used with all flat tappet camshafts. We suggest using this with your break-in oil and at every oil change. One pint will treat up to 5 quarts of oil.

Soluble molybdenum carbamate integrates into your base oil and cannot be filtered out by the oil filter like many other after market additives do. Why do we sell this particular Extreme Pressure Lube? Simple. Our first priority is to give our cams long life and this product does just that. We are happy to share this technology with others who have flat tappet cams who have had to struggle with this same issue.

Soluble Molybdenum carbamate has been used for 50 years or more in the industrial and H.D. trucking industry. We are offering this product as an oil additive. Hughes Engines Extreme Pressure Oil additive is recommended specifically for flat tappet camshafts in all applications. It can be added to any oil, good or crap. It will not affect catalytic converters. Yes, you can use it with roller cams, too! It is super slippery (slick) so if your rocker, pushrod tips and wrist pins live longer, don't be surprised. With products like this you can expect manufacturer claims of, better mileage, improved fuel mileage and reduced oil consumption, stops global warming, helps you lose weight etc...... All of that is possible, I suppose, but we kow it will protct your cam & lifters. That is why we use it and recommend it.
$9.95
MREHU3690"

Good info. You forget to give a link.  Here it is: http://www.hughesengines.com/TechArticles/203engineoils.php

[c00nhunterjoe]

no gm dealers in my area carry eos, 1 week to order, 9.35 per qt, not too bad.
walked next door to chrslyer- they said that chrysler does not make a substitute anymore, i gave thm the part number off this thread and they said it is no good.   so long story short until i can get some braddpenn i picked up vr-1 for now, it seems to be the next best thing at almost 1100 ppm zinc

[bordin34]

I e-mailed Shell today asking about ZDDP levels and this is the response I got.
"Shell Rotella T Multigrade Oil SAE 15W-40 contains approximately 1200
ppm zinc.  Shell Rotella T Synthetic Oil SAE 5W-40 is formulated with
about 1300 ppm zinc."

[The70RT]

I met a guy at one of our cruise nights and he had problem with his 426 Hemi Cam. He said some lobes went flat at around 10K. He more less laughed at me when I mentioned EOS.......He said that was the old days and new parts don't need it anymore............I guess he will find out sooner or later.

[b5blue]

He will know pretty soon too! 

[Road Dog]

Should a guy with 200,000 miles on his 440 worry about the zinc or is it just the new rebuilds during the break in periods?

[Musicman]

Anybody try this stuff?

I have never tried "that particular product", but I remember when you could buy oil that already had it premixed. You added one quart of the premixed oil at each oil change, along with your regular oil. Average Joe didn't like it however because the oil was black, which made your new oil look dirty... therefore they couldn't tell when it was time to change their oil.  ...so they stopped making it for average Joe.

Thanks for posting the link... I didn't know that you could still get the stuff... Greatest sh** in the world as far as I'm concerned. Far better than any of that gimmicky oil additive crap they started packaging after that. I used it for a great many years until they stopped packaging it in your regular everyday motor oils... I have been using RESTORE ever since (it's a close relative).

[Musicman]

Should a guy with 200,000 miles on his 440 worry about the zinc or is it just the new rebuilds during the break in periods?

The break in period is absolutely critical... after that, the concern is less because the cam and lifters have formed their permanent bond in terms of their final shape. None-the-less, there is still metal to metal contact under high pressures, so a good quality lubricant is still a must. 

We just had a fella on another site that used all the right stuff for the break in on his new build, ...but for reasons unknown, he forgot to use a good quality oil or an additive when he did the first oil change... he made it 200 miles.

[The70RT]

Should a guy with 200,000 miles on his 440 worry about the zinc or is it just the new rebuilds during the break in periods?

The break in period is absolutely critical... after that, the concern is less because the cam and lifters have formed their permanent bond in terms of their final shape. None-the-less, there is still metal to metal contact under high pressures, so a good quality lubricant is still a must. 

We just had a fella on another site that used all the right stuff for the break in on his new build, ...but for reasons unknown, he forgot to use a good quality oil or an additive when he did the first oil change... he made it 200 miles.

Damnnnnnnnnnnnn 

[b5blue]

All that steel washing down everywhere 

[elacruze]

Just because I like to stir the pot, and have plenty of my own 'anecdotal' experience with oil additives;

http://www.sunley.ca/oil_add.htm

Keep in mind while you read, that this article is from 1992, only a couple years into the 'roller cam revolution'. Most cars on the road still had flat-tappet cams in them.

Now what?

Eric

[Road Dog]

I just changed my oil a few weeks ago. Valvoline makes oil for engines with flat tappet cams (says so in big letters right on the bottle). Put in some 20-50. Oil is pretty pricey though.

[The70RT]

I just changed my oil a few weeks ago. Valvoline makes oil for engines with flat tappet cams (says so in big letters right on the bottle). Put in some 20-50. Oil is pretty pricey though.

Was it on the shelf and where here did you buy it at?

[six-pack speedshop]

Hi Guy's, i was wondering that anybody use the Kendall GT-1, 20W50 SAE?

We are building +/- 20 engines a year and never had any problem with this oil.

Greets

pascal

www.six-packspeedshop.be