I'm confused w/engine mounts!

[charger_72_318]

Hey guys, this is my first post in the new site, i had to re-registry myself cause my nick dissapeared.
well... i have a problem with my 72 engine mounts, around 3 months ago i put the engine in the car again (a 318) after a general overhaulin but the engine/tranny components never assemblied one to each other.
when i finally decided to dissasembly everything again and be carefull with the clutch plate, everything went ok! and assembled, except for the engine mounts,if they drop in place then the gearbox monut bolts can't be placed, obviously most be the positioning of the gearbox mounts, does anyone can help me out, maybe with a pics of it?'
i have the Haynes repair manual but it doesn't show the gearbox mount/ support.
Thanxx!

Aldo M.

[Ghoste]

I'm missing something here.  Is it the same engine and trans that came out of the car in the first place?

[Charger71]

I'm not trying to be funny, but do you have them in the right position

Sometimes you mount them forward or upside down. They look right until you lower the mounts to the k-member.

Charger71

[charger_72_318]

Hey, thanx for reply guys.
It's the same tranny and same block, i didnt' changed anything outside the block, and if i had a doubt when i took the block to the machining shop, and they didn't returned me inmediatly the mounts ( sorry, i forgot to unscrew them from the engine before carrying it to the shop) i bought a second par to insure i'm not doing it in the wrong way, the only part i'm not sure about is the front and back of the gearbox/tranny support (where goes 2 bolts on it).

[Ghoste]

It's a spool type trans mount isn't it?

[charger_72_318]

This is the one, it's the brown w/red in the middle:
http://www.performancesuspension.com/images/Chrytransmt.jpeg

[Ghoste]

That's the type I thought.  I don't know.  I think it must be like Charger 71 is saying.  Do you have anything backwards?  Is it off by a lot or just a bit?

[Charger71]

What your are showing is the transmission crossmember mount.      It is installed under the tailhousing of the transmission.

I thought you were only referring to the engine mounts on the block.     My bad...

I replaced this item in my 71 Charger.     Install it with the angled edge to the front of the car. (Mount it with the vertical edge facing the u-joints.)     You may need a shim, too between that mount and the bolt before it goes into the tranny.     You'll have to work with the whole engine/tranny combo to get the bolt holes aligned.

I hope this helps some.

Good Luck,
Charger71

[charger_72_318]

Yes, that's exactly what i needed to know , now i'll try it that way, if it doesn't fit at least i've already   eliminated the wrong assembly of the torque converter, and the tranny crossmember. it's off by 1 inch aprox. and it's backwards. I hope not to request more tech help for a while, but do post soon when i start that engine again after rebuild.

Thank you very much for the help gentlemen...

charger_72_318

 

[charger_72_318]

Well it results i overchecked and it is installed in the right way, (the crossmember support), but the tranny don't slide to the right place so i can't do anymore about it, even my neighbor told me i wasn't keeping my deathline of three monts for starting the engine, so i went to the mechanic's place, and tomorrow we're going to inspect about what's wrong, he's good working with hi-performance engines, 'cause he's one of those crazy guys who live for it, just like the guy in the dukes of hazzard hehehee...
This turn out into a death end proyect     

[Ghoste]

Well let us know when you figuer it out because it just doens't sound possible.  There is some little thing that must have been overlooked.  Good luck.

[Charger71]

If that information doesn't help,   you really might check the position of your engine mounts.     Are they on the proper side?   Are they positioned correctly on the engine mount tabs?   Make sure the mounts are on the rear portion of the mounting tabs...     (I have enclosed a picture)     If these aren't right,   your engine will be too far backward.  

Hope this helps.

Good Luck...

[charger_72_318]

I took some pics of the problem, but i don't know how to post them here yet, so i placed them in my site:

http://www.geocities.com/car_nos_system/tranny.html?1129918725031

apparently the only way to make it fit, is placing the center crossmember backwards, I'm going to meassure it, 'cause if i turn it backwards, then the tranny/ block will move the 1 1/2 inch necessary to fit the engine mounts.  
And in the photo you took charger71, i saw a gasket? between the bracket bolts and the engine, is that it? because, my car didn't have anything there...

Thanx for the help!

charger_72_318

[Beer]

Not sure if this will help...but if you put the motor mounts in wrong, looks like about an inch difference.
Here are pics of my 73 318 (I mean 402   ) and its mounts.


Drivers side mount


Passenger side Mount


Based on rust markings on old mounts.

[charger_72_318]

Damn, you made a 402 from a 318? Now, that's something!
About the pics, according to the intruction manual i have, and the photo that charger71 took, the right way to install it, is the way you have the drivers side mount, not the passenger's side, yep, I'm trying that way, but the trans it's like moved to the front, and don't go anyway to the back of the car. it's the same block, same tranny, same mounts, but it just don't fit !   the only thing that seems to solve the problem to me, is placing the crossmember backwards. I know it sounds illogical but anyone have a better plan?   , as you helped me guys, i decided to wait for the mechanic, 'cause I've been into a death end before, and just by having nightmares thinking how to solve the problems, i founded answers. I like   fixing my car, but I'm stock with this   engine mounts

[Beer]

Here is a pic of the passenger side mount right after I pulled it


do the 71 and 73 have the same mounts?

[charger_72_318]

Damn that's nasty  
That's how it came, so that's how it leaves... au contraire of the manuals.
You know, there's two parts: bracket and mount, right? so, are the mounts the same? left and right don't make a difference? the brackets do have a difference one has 4 bolts, and the other has 3. Is it possible to be a possible mistake here? I checked on it around 10 times and didn't noticed anything.
And what do you think about the freeplay of the sliding joke and the extension housing in my pictures, guys? If it is fine, then the problem wont be in the center crossmember, right?

Nice photo beer!

[charger_72_318]

...i almost forget, no, the 73 don't have the same mounts, the 72 use a two-pieces mount

[Beer]

My motor cleaned up pretty good  

I would go with would you had, the manual and the photo from Charger71 is the right way for your mounts.
Look to ensure that the mounts are not side specific. i.e. would switching the sides of the motor mounts would that change the position of the motor? Charger71 indicates that the mounts go on a specific side.

Cheers
Beer

[charger_72_318]

Yeah thanks beer, right now I'm going to take a few rounds against my engine mounts, hope I win  

[Beer]

Good Luck!
I find having a few rounds while thinking the job through helps from time to time 

I sense victory when you switch the mounts 

[charger_72_318]

Well, the results are: mounts-0 me-1   there are good news , i took meassures of the missing inches to fit the mounts, there are 1 3/4 " missing, and if i install "backwards" the center crossmember, it gives me 1 1/4 " to move the engine to the back, plus 1/4" the engine hasn't move to it's place (i don't know why), and the other 1/4 inch left, i can steal it by installing washers between the mounts and the engine surface (a 1/4 is just minimal), so what do u think about it? The only thing that could make me hesitate, would be what my neighbor told me : "to take out the driveshaft u just unscrew the bolts and move it to the front a little and then the driveshaft will come out"..., and if i install the crossmember with the vertical edge facing the front (-"backwards"-), there will be no clearance between the driveshaft sliding joke and the transmission tailhousing to do that maneuver.   sorry to many words... so my question is: If everything works perfectly fine that way, do i install it like that?, no matter i leave just a 1/4 " clearance for the driveshaft? (nothing will scratch, I'm sure). i.e. when i need to replace the clutch or the 3spd tranny for a 4spd, i don't think the driveshaft will come out without having to pull engine to the front.   sorry if i wrote too much, but is the best i can explain myself   , so what do you think guys?   or   ? LOL

charger_72_318

[Ghoste]

I don't know any reason why it won't work (maybe someone else does) but it still doesn't make any sense.  How can it be all the same pieces being reinstalled the correct way only now they don't mate up?  I'd still be concerned about how this could be possible.

[charger_72_318]

Well,  i tried what i said, and....didn't work. As the math's don't like me, i forgot to plus an extra 1 1/4 inch so the tailhousing bump with the driveshaft, so the crossmember backwards don't fit either, the only possible thing, is adapt the engine mounts, I'll have to drill new holes.
As u said ghoste, it doesn't make any sense. Even i thought that in a crazy situation, the drive train was moved, i mean from the wheels.
Anyway, the damned mounts are not gonna win this battle 

[Ghoste]

Something is not the same.  I'd concentrate on finding out what that is.