Dash & Classic Auto Air A/C-Heater Box Install in Project '69!!

[bill440rt]

It's been a while since i posted some progress photos on this car. It's been moving a bit slow, I don't get to work on it as much as I'd like.

I managed to pick up the A/C conversion kit from Classic Auto Air. I decided on their kit after doing a bit of research & talking to other people that have used their system. After receiving their kit & inspecting all the components, I am very pleased so far. Everything seems to be of decent quality, & the box went in with no problems. I ordered their kit without the compressor, as I'll be purchasing that from another source (more on that in the future, heh-heh  ).  I described the 6-pack plans to CAA, who was nice enough to leave the fittings on the compressor lines uncrimped. Once the compressor is fitted on the engine the way I like, I can mark the lines for a custom fit & CAA will crimp them at no charge.

Their A/C-heater box replaces the stock unit. It mounts in the same location, & takes up less space. You need to drill 2 extra holes in the firewall for the heater lines, & another for a vent tube. I installed some rubber grommets to clean up the holes, & will trim the vent tube shorter later in the build. In the first photo, the silver-zinc bolt on the firewall holds the heater box, which also gets attached to the original bracket inside the car. It also gets screwed to the passenger side vent on the cowl. CAA provides a template for drilling the extra holes. It is also very easy to wire up.

It uses the original heater controls. They give you new cables, & a blower switch that replaces the original. There is a new linkage for the switch, & a replacement harness that is also very easy to connect.

The unused bolt hole in the upper left corner on the firewall is where I routed the heat shut-off cable, & wire to the compressor. I also installed a rubber grommet there to clean up the hole.

[bill440rt]

Once the box was in, it was on to install the dash. I was unable to get pictures as it went in, as you need a few sets of hands to help. It's a little bulky & heavy, & I didn't want to risk scratching anything.

I pre-assembled the dash prior to installation. It's much easier that way rather than lying on your back contorted in some wacky position trying to assemble it in the car. I don't bend like I used to. 

I slipped it in from the passenger side. There are 7 measly bolts that hold the whole enchilada in place. 5 across the top, & one on each hinge pillar on the inside. That's it. Once it's bolted down, I simply snapped the bulkhead connector on the firewall, connected the steering column harness, door jamb switches, & a few other small connections.

The dash pad was a decent used one found on eBay, & I did a white face gauge conversion from Duranged Design. I painted the needles with florescent orange paint out of an airbrush.

I had to remove the glove box door & liner to finish the connections for the heater box, I can almost reinstall them now. The steering wheel is just temporary for now, the car is a roller & I don't want to damage the new one.

I'm currently installing the A/C vents now, I'll post more pics once everything is done. As soon as this is finished, I can have the windshield & back glass installed.

[General_01]

Looking good! I am hoping to get a kit for my 71 Bee.

[nitrousn]

Looking good Bill. Can you use the right fresh air vent or do they include a block off plate?

[bill440rt]

The right vent is not used. They include a block-off plate that covers it. The left one is still operational.

[Shakey]

This is something that I have been thinking about adding to my car as well.  As you may recall, I am at the same stage as you, no glass and gutted interior, and I'm thinking that now would be the time to do it.

What brought you to decide on the Classic Auto Air products?

Do you have any more photos of the parts in the kit?  Condenser, water valve etc?  What size compressor we're they offering with the kit?  Was is a Seltec or a Sanden?  You mention the refrigerant lines, we're they the new reduced barrier style?

Pardon all the questions but....

[bill440rt]

Hi Shakey,

No problem!!

I spoke with several people that installed the CAA kits in their cars, there were mostly good things to say regarding fit & quality. My car didn't have air conditioning originally, & the CAA kit appeared the most complete & simple to install. On the flip side, others I've spoken with that had the Vintage Auto Air kits were nightmarish.
The retro-fit kits for cars with existing A/C are out there by several manufacturers as well.

I must say that although it is advertised as a "Perfect-Fit" system, there is still drilling to do, trial fitting, etc. I had to call tech support a few times also for the wiring under the dash, I just wanted to be sure I had it right. I'm not the greatest when it comes to electrical, & their drawing was a little unclear & confusing to me. I didn't mind the drilling or modifying, though. This car is a non-matching #'s resto-mod, so it was actually fun to install. I'd think twice if I had an original R/T, though. 

The compressor used in the kit is the stubby Sanden 508 model. I did not order mine with the compressor, that will be included with the pulley set-up I plan on using. I wanted the front of the engine all to line up with no problems, so I decided to order the compressor with the pulley kit. The serpentine belt set-up I'm going with uses a 7-rib belt, the compressor CAA offers for serpentine belts only comes with an 8-rib.

Here are some pics of the water valve. Sorry if they're a little blurry, I've had too much coffee today! This gets mounted on the passenger fender apron, along with the drier in the stock location. The drier is smaller than the original, not as long. It is a Chrysler piece with a pentastar on it, probably used in modern cars today.
Sorry I don't have any of the condenser right now, if you browse their website you'll find lots of other pictures, the instruction manual, etc.

As far as the hoses, not sure if they're the barrier style or not. The do have the correct fittings for the Sanden compressor, & have color coded caps  & fittings for pressurizing the system with R-134. Hope that helps.

[bill440rt]

Here are some pictures of the finished dash in the car. There are only a few wires I left hanging on the left side for the console & foot dimmer switch.
The slim vents are mounted below the dash, which I think look quite nice. Almost factory. 

Now, on to the next thing.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Here are some pictures of the finished dash in the car. There are only a few wires I left hanging on the left side for the console & foot dimmer switch.
The slim vents are mounted below the dash, which I think look quite nice. Almost factory. 

Now, on to the next thing.

Umm...it would help if you actually posted the pics 

PS---that watervalve is the same one used on the front defrosters on the buses that the NYCTA uses....they are CRAP! They tend to leak after a few months....  Hopefully the consumer line is better than the fleet junk they sell us

[bill440rt]

Whoa!! I guess I DID have too much coffee! 

Here they are, for real this time.

And, thanks for the tip on that valve. I haven't heard anything bad about them before, but I'll keep my eye on it.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Looks like a clean install Bill....the center console fits under the center vent correct?

[bill440rt]

Looks like a clean install Bill....the center console fits under the center vent correct?

Thanks! Finally, you can see the pictures. I could have sworn I attached them.

CAA has a picture on their website of this vent setup with a console. The vent has to be mounted far back enough to clear both the ashtray & the screws along the bottom that hold the ashtray in place. I'd say it's a good 2-1/2" back.

[Shakey]

Hi Shakey,

No problem!!

I spoke with several people that installed the CAA kits in their cars, there were mostly good things to say regarding fit & quality. My car didn't have air conditioning originally, & the CAA kit appeared the most complete & simple to install. On the flip side, others I've spoken with that had the Vintage Auto Air kits were nightmarish.
The retro-fit kits for cars with existing A/C are out there by several manufacturers as well.

I must say that although it is advertised as a "Perfect-Fit" system, there is still drilling to do, trial fitting, etc. I had to call tech support a few times also for the wiring under the dash, I just wanted to be sure I had it right. I'm not the greatest when it comes to electrical, & their drawing was a little unclear & confusing to me. I didn't mind the drilling or modifying, though. This car is a non-matching #'s resto-mod, so it was actually fun to install. I'd think twice if I had an original R/T, though. 

The compressor used in the kit is the stubby Sanden 508 model. I did not order mine with the compressor, that will be included with the pulley set-up I plan on using. I wanted the front of the engine all to line up with no problems, so I decided to order the compressor with the pulley kit. The serpentine belt set-up I'm going with uses a 7-rib belt, the compressor CAA offers for serpentine belts only comes with an 8-rib.

Here are some pics of the water valve. Sorry if they're a little blurry, I've had too much coffee today! This gets mounted on the passenger fender apron, along with the drier in the stock location. The drier is smaller than the original, not as long. It is a Chrysler piece with a pentastar on it, probably used in modern cars today.
Sorry I don't have any of the condenser right now, if you browse their website you'll find lots of other pictures, the instruction manual, etc.

As far as the hoses, not sure if they're the barrier style or not. The do have the correct fittings for the Sanden compressor, & have color coded caps  & fittings for pressurizing the system with R-134. Hope that helps.

Bill, thanks for the feedback.  As mentioned, I am also considering this for my car but I am still up in the air.

Also, thanks for the photos of the dash vents as that was next on my list of questions.

Also, as Chris had mentioned, the metal water valves will cause you a lot of grief.  They will leak coolant as they will corrode quickly and not seal properly when shut.  Ask CAA if they have a plastic version or check your local auto parts supplier for a Ranco brand water valve.  Make sure you get the proper flow direction and keep this in mind when installing it - very important.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Mike, the crappy ones are made by RedDot no?

[Shakey]

Red Dot uses numerous types of valves - why their Engineering department chose to use those is beyond me.  On the other hand, the OEM's may have specified a metal valve for some unknown reason.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Red Dot uses numerous types of valves - why their Engineering department chose to use those is beyond me.  On the other hand, the OEM's may have specified a metal valve for some unknown reason.

Actually IIRC some of the replacements for our Orion VII fleet are plastic now....

[Shakey]

Red Dot uses numerous types of valves - why their Engineering department chose to use those is beyond me.  On the other hand, the OEM's may have specified a metal valve for some unknown reason.

Actually IIRC some of the replacements for our Orion VII fleet are plastic now....

And some of your new Orions will not be using Red Dot defrosters anymore!   

[bill440rt]

I spoke to tech support at CAA about this water valve. Of course, they have no records of any past problems with this valve. It is the red dot valve that comes in the kit.

What they did say, is that it's a common error is to place the valve on the wrong heater hose. They told me it should be placed on the return hose closest to the water pump on the water pump housing, not the hose closest to the block.
He said this is a common mistake, & could lead to valve failure as there is higher pressure in the other hose. Hmmm...

I think I'll still keep an eye on it. He reminded me of the 3-year warranty...   

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Good to know Bill....Im sure you'll have no problems with the valve.....the NYCTA is the only company getting the crappy rejects!

[bill440rt]

Good to know Bill....Im sure you'll have no problems with the valve.....the NYCTA is the only company getting the crappy rejects!

Haha! If there's a problem, it's SURE to find me!!!! 
I almost EXPECT this thing to leak now.     

The glass guy was supposed to show up today to put the windshield & back glass in the car. Kept playing phone tag all day. Ahh well... maybe tomorrow. 

[AKcharger]

Hoorey for me I got bought some A/C ducts! are they metal, haven't got them yet?

[bill440rt]

Yes, AK. They are pot metal.

BTW, Classic Auto Air NOW offers center dash vents with the pad. 
I think it's based off the '70 plastic repro bezels, not pads like '68 - '69.

http://www.classicautoair.com/68_70_Mopar%20B-Body_Air_Conditioning_Mopar_AC.html

[squeakfinder]

    I've been sitting on the factory AC vent's for a few years. The center with the dash pad. And side vents like the ones in AKcharger's pics. Can all of them work with the CAA system? I realize my non AC dash would need the sides hacked up...

[bill440rt]

   I've been sitting on the factory AC vent's for a few years. The center with the dash pad. And side vents like the ones in AKcharger's pics. Can all of them work with the CAA system? I realize my non AC dash would need the sides hacked up...

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,87688.0.html

[Skull-1]

 

Nice!

[MxRacer855]

Hey Bill,
I know this is a really old thread, but I'm debating throwing A/C in '68 (non-factory A/C car).

did this kit replace the heater box completely?

Jeff

[bill440rt]

Hey Jeff,
Yes, CAA supplies a new heater/AC box in their kit for non-A/C cars. It replaces the standard OE heater box. You can see it in the 2nd pic in the first post.
So far I've been very pleased with the kit, someday I may also install one in my '68 (non-A/C as well). A/C blows nice & cold.

The only issue I had was with an electric servo that switches from defrost to dash to floor mode. Two of them went bad internally. CAA did replace them both for free, and the second time around the system was well out of warranty. So, that says something for CAA. Since I installed my kit several years ago they did redesign their box, which is now totally electric so perhaps it's been improved.
Hope that helps! 

[MxRacer855]

Hey Jeff,
Yes, CAA supplies a new heater/AC box in their kit for non-A/C cars. It replaces the standard OE heater box. You can see it in the 2nd pic in the first post.
So far I've been very pleased with the kit, someday I may also install one in my '68 (non-A/C as well). A/C blows nice & cold.

The only issue I had was with an electric servo that switches from defrost to dash to floor mode. Two of them went bad internally. CAA did replace them both for free, and the second time around the system was well out of warranty. So, that says something for CAA. Since I installed my kit several years ago they did redesign their box, which is now totally electric so perhaps it's been improved.
Hope that helps! 

Thanks Bill!   

That most definitely does help! I really want to pull the trigger and go through with it. After reading your thread, I think I am going to do it.
I know there's going to be those hot summer days where I'm going to hear the girl just absolutely complaining about the heat making her hair frizzy...  

Yours looks great! I know I saw a guy somewhere fabricate that kit into an OEM heater box for some reason (maybe to keep the stock look???). That's really why I'm very curious about it.

My car is coming back from the body shop next week (taking forever and a day!) and I'm really going to have all of this decided by then. I've been restoring everything for the last 7 months it's been gone so that when I do get it back, I can just start bolting things in.
I really don't want to restore my OEM heater box if I don't have to. So that's a lot of the motive behind my question. Not that I'm going to sell it or anything until my build is done, but I DON'T need anything from it, Bill? Classic Air's kit replaces everything?

Again, thanks for everything! 
Jeff

[bill440rt]

CAA's box gets installed in place of the original one. You'll need to drill two holes in the firewall for the A/C lines, CAA supplies a template for that.
They also supply a switch that you'll need to install on the factory heat slider controls.
Basically, the kit should include everything you need to install A/C except the refrigerant. Take a look at their kits and what is included. 

[MxRacer855]

Thanks Bill!

I couldn't appreciate it more

[MxRacer855]

Thanks Bill! 

I couldn't appreciate it more!

Definitely a route I'm going to go. 

Jeff

[bill440rt]

Thanks Bill! 

I couldn't appreciate it more!

Definitely a route I'm going to go. 

Jeff

Good luck!
     

[oldcarnut]

I have my dash out and redone and at a stage I need to reinstall it to proceed with other installs.  I have plans to be installing the CAA kit but trying to decide if the dash in or out makes a whole lot of difference.  No doubt its easier out but if I buy the kit now, it may be a year before I even crank it up to use.  How difference with the dash out already do you think it made?

[bill440rt]

I have my dash out and redone and at a stage I need to reinstall it to proceed with other installs.  I have plans to be installing the CAA kit but trying to decide if the dash in or out makes a whole lot of difference.  No doubt its easier out but if I buy the kit now, it may be a year before I even crank it up to use.  How difference with the dash out already do you think it made?

With the dash out it was pretty easy. I'd assume your windshield is out also? Windshield has to come out before the dash.
It can be done with the dash in place, but yeah it's much easier with it out. Everything was very accessible that way.

[twenty mike mike]

Bill,

Did you cut a relief hole in the firewall insulation for the box, or just mount the box against the insulation backing? I can't tell from your picture.

Thanks.

[bill440rt]

Pretty sure the insulation was in place prior to installing the box. If the box was installed first, it would be tough to install the insulation.
I know there are some pre-punched holes in the insulation for the heater hose bungs to pass through, IIRC I had to cut some additional ones for the A/C lines.
There shouldn't be any interference installing the box due to the insulation.

[twenty mike mike]

Thanks, Bill. I had just cut out the pre-punched areas and the extra holes, but I didn't want to install the nice new insulation just to find out I had to take it back out again.

[Audiguy]

Great thread guys. Just made up my mind about CAA verus Vintage Air. My 69 is a factory air car with a bad compressor, ( it knocks when running) and a tired condenser. Plus I look forward to even more weight reduction on the front end. Again, thanks for the good information.

Dave

[ChargerRT69]

Glad to see some tip and tricks being listed as I complete my assemble. Thought I would give an update on my install. I bought this a couple years back and ran into "Life", but started back into finishing my 69 R/T off so I can get it drivable.

[b5blue]

"So far" I have no issue installing with dash fully in place. (But my interior is stripped bare.)