Police Raid Car Enthusiast Gathering, Generate Revenue

[gasoline_24]

I think based on these comments maybe I will build my 68 RT into a 4 cylinder.  I wonder if I could get one from an 80s Daytona to fit.  That way I stay low on the ol hp.  I would not want to accidently hit that long vertical pedal and get out of control.  I think 4 cylinders is plenty for these cars.  The rest of you that have some need to go fast are out of line.  If anyone has some plans on how to retrofit a 4 cylinder with some smog equipment built in let me know.  This may turn out to be a one of one car after all.

[Ponch ®]

Ponch like you said, there are parts for vehicles that literally state not for street use! Now if those are under the hood of a car that is at a car show and is not trailered there mean the car was on the road with illegal parts?

Maybe Im just the rare one here that thinks street racing is wrong... personally if someone has NOS on their car its no different that a huge assed blower sticking up from the hood. You don't need those things in a daily driver!

You drive around here with a huge assed blower sticking out of your hood you will get pulled over, simple as that. Same with illegally tinted windows! Some of these laws were put in place to save lives of innocent people! No one needs a 600hp daily driver anymore in my opinion, but you want to have that car on the track/strip, I'll be the first person in line drooling over it.

You are all mad that the cars were being fined at a show, but how did those cars get there?! If they have parts not for legal use, registered for daily driving, and were not trailered there....

Once again NONE of us know the full story of what happened. We don't know if they had an event like this before and things got out of hand so this year the cops put a stop to it. So far the fines they state exactly in the story such as no front license plates, some tinted windows, and some cars being confiscated (most likely due to the illegal parts) are all valid reasons.

Calling them street racers without seeing race though IS bullshit!

True...we really don't know the whole background of the story.

For me, at least, the issue is not whether the parts in the cars are legal or not. I'd be a hypocrite to grandstand about that - we all have or have had something that wasn't exactly legal in our cars at some point or another, so let he who is without sin cast the first stone. If you're just cruising around in your car responsibly, then you're not causing any harm (maybe except the environment, but that's a topic for another day  ), and I find that MOST cops will look the other way. However, like I said earlier, if you're driving in an irresponsible or dangerous manner, then they have justification to pull you over and cite you for the illegal parts/modifications.

[Blown70]

I think based on these comments maybe I will build my 68 RT into a 4 cylinder.  I wonder if I could get one from an 80s Daytona to fit.  That way I stay low on the ol hp.  I would not want to accidently hit that long vertical pedal and get out of control.  I think 4 cylinders is plenty for these cars.  The rest of you that have some need to go fast are out of line.  If anyone has some plans on how to retrofit a 4 cylinder with some smog equipment built in let me know.  This may turn out to be a one of one car after all.

[PocketThunder]

I think based on these comments maybe I will build my 68 RT into a 4 cylinder.  I wonder if I could get one from an 80s Daytona to fit.  That way I stay low on the ol hp.  I would not want to accidently hit that long vertical pedal and get out of control.  I think 4 cylinders is plenty for these cars.  The rest of you that have some need to go fast are out of line.  If anyone has some plans on how to retrofit a 4 cylinder with some smog equipment built in let me know.  This may turn out to be a one of one car after all.

how about a leaning tower of power?  22 mpg even.  AMHIK 

[Chad L. Magee]

Same with illegally tinted windows! Some of these laws were put in place to save lives of innocent people!

Yes, but there can be abuses of power with that:

Back in 2000, I got pulled over in a Ford Probe GL (yes, I know it is a POS, good mpg with the 2.2L) with legally tinted windows in Iowa.  I was going to pick up some parts over in Storm Lake traveling on a backroad, was going 2 mph below the speed limit (53 in a 55), and was pulled over by a state trooper wanting to check my car.  The only modifications that I had done to it was the tinting of the windows and penstriping, everything else was bone stock.  He tried to say that I was speeding and it looked like I was racing, but did not have me on radar breaking the law (I knew it was a crock, but just kept quiet and answered the questions he asked).  He tested my windows and they were within the limits of the law, but he still wrote me a fix it ticket for it to have the tint removed, even after he admitted that I broke no law and he could not fine me.  According to him "all cars should not have tinted windows or modifications".  At the time, I lived in SD but also traveled quite a bit to Kansas with it.  It is a blessing to have tinted windows in those states, not just from the heat but also from the glare.  That event is one reason why I prefer to stay out of the back roads when I visit that state.  I think the problem lies with the interpretation powers that can be given to certain individuals.  Not all policemen or policewomen are bad, just the ones who go on a power trip beyond what the law actually says......

[Chad L. Magee]

I think based on these comments maybe I will build my 68 RT into a 4 cylinder.  I wonder if I could get one from an 80s Daytona to fit.  That way I stay low on the ol hp.  I would not want to accidently hit that long vertical pedal and get out of control.  I think 4 cylinders is plenty for these cars.  The rest of you that have some need to go fast are out of line.  If anyone has some plans on how to retrofit a 4 cylinder with some smog equipment built in let me know.  This may turn out to be a one of one car after all.

how about a leaning tower of power?  22 mpg even.  AMHIK 

What?  Someone wanting to make a second gen /6 Clone out of an RT?  Man, the hobby is really changing.......

[defiance]

Maybe Im just the rare one here that thinks street racing is wrong... personally if someone has NOS on their car its no different that a huge assed blower sticking up from the hood. You don't need those things in a daily driver!

You drive around here with a huge assed blower sticking out of your hood you will get pulled over, simple as that. Same with illegally tinted windows! Some of these laws were put in place to save lives of innocent people! No one needs a 600hp daily driver anymore in my opinion, but you want to have that car on the track/strip, I'll be the first person in line drooling over it.

So you honestly think that performance modification of a vehicle is wrong?  You think it's wrong of me to shoot for 600hp in the build I'm building right now, simply because I "don't need it"?  Well, you know what, YOU don't need a CHARGER either.  Such a heavy body is wasteful and pointless, and the engine has WELL beyond the amount of power you need for daily driving, so you should not be allowed by law to own or drive it.  Seriously, you don't NEED more than a honda, so why should you be allowed to have it?
Think what you want, as long as I can think what I want about the hypocricy inherent in your opinion.  But when legislation begins making these decisions for us, something is broken.

At least we agree that the warrantless searches were wrong.


Having said that, in another article about this subject, there were reports that the owner of the parking lot had complained repeatedly and that the center's customers had been endangered, and that there were rampant skidmarks and burnout marks around, so not quite as black & white as this article paints.  Not condoning the actions of the police, simply saying there is more to it.

[0X01B8]

The cars and the tuners aren't really the target.  It's just the usual harassment that people gathering receive and this is the latest group and the latest excuse.  Every year the cops get another 100 laws to get you with too.  Each of us is prolly in violation of something with our car.  Every hear about a law going OFF the books?  Hardly ever happens.  Lowriders get the same abuse.  Political protesters get it.  Jerry's Kids would get it if a couple hundred of them met up in a parking lot at night.  First amendment "freedom of assembly" is just a concept.  Didn't the British employ similar tactics against the colonists?   Who knows, maybe they hauled people off to jail for having illegal after-market horse equipment.  I'm thinking they must have, or it wouldn't be in the very first amendment, it prolly woulda been, like #9 or farther down the list.  And the colonists went batshit over a small tax on tea!  We put up with so much worse than that.  Civil rights are just a concept.  Anybody see the new George Carlin show on HBO?  We don't have rights we have "temporary privileges."

That concludes my rant, thanks for reading!   

-john

[defiance]

Who knows, maybe they hauled people off to jail for having illegal after-market horse equipment.

[TheGhost]

The CA cops are actually trained to ID aftermarket parts on these cars.

from what I realize they are the only cops who have to go through courses just to be able to do so! Personally I say good for them! 

Really?  Good for them?

And then when they come after you what are you going to say?  Good for them?  Just because it happened to the tuner crowd doesn't mean it can't happen to you.  Grow up.

This is a plain-and-simple abuse of police power.

My thoughts exactly.  I have several friends in the tuner crowd.  None are regular street racers (I say regular because everyone street races at one time or another), but many have added power to their cars, for the track.  Much like many of us here, do.  I find what happened to those automotive enthusiasts very worrying.

[Brock Samson]

i guess it figgures that this thread would generate so much passion,..
drache sure stirred the pot as if it needed it,..
most folks dont remember or know that at the beginning of the last century horse manure in the streets was a very real problem, especially in the cities and larger towns,.. Cars solved that problem. look it up. 

[Drache]

Maybe Im just the rare one here that thinks street racing is wrong... personally if someone has NOS on their car its no different that a huge assed blower sticking up from the hood. You don't need those things in a daily driver!

You drive around here with a huge assed blower sticking out of your hood you will get pulled over, simple as that. Same with illegally tinted windows! Some of these laws were put in place to save lives of innocent people! No one needs a 600hp daily driver anymore in my opinion, but you want to have that car on the track/strip, I'll be the first person in line drooling over it.

So you honestly think that performance modification of a vehicle is wrong?  You think it's wrong of me to shoot for 600hp in the build I'm building right now, simply because I "don't need it"?  Well, you know what, YOU don't need a CHARGER either.  Such a heavy body is wasteful and pointless, and the engine has WELL beyond the amount of power you need for daily driving, so you should not be allowed by law to own or drive it.  Seriously, you don't NEED more than a honda, so why should you be allowed to have it?
Think what you want, as long as I can think what I want about the hypocricy inherent in your opinion.  But when legislation begins making these decisions for us, something is broken.

At least we agree that the warrantless searches were wrong.


Having said that, in another article about this subject, there were reports that the owner of the parking lot had complained repeatedly and that the center's customers had been endangered, and that there were rampant skidmarks and burnout marks around, so not quite as black & white as this article paints.  Not condoning the actions of the police, simply saying there is more to it.

Wow... just wow....

So just because I dont believe that someone needs a 600hp daily driver means I shouldn't be looking at chargers. Im talking about a STOCK vehicle compared to a vehicle that is done to the nuts with things like NOS and Blowers. A hemi is stock at what, 425hp? Oh well, its a STOCK CLASSIC VEHICLE. The only engines ever been in my chargers were 318's and they were just fine for what I wanted to do.

I helped build a couple "drag vehicles" that were also road worthy and each one of them ended up in the ditch, wrapped around a pole, bounced off a tree, etc. Not because they were bad drivers, but because with that much power most people want to use it when they shouldnt.

If you can CLEARLY explain why someone NEEDS a blower attached to their 440 or NEEDS NOS attached to the car they drive to and from school or whatever Id certainly like to hear it.

[moparstuart]

Maybe Im just the rare one here that thinks street racing is wrong... personally if someone has NOS on their car its no different that a huge assed blower sticking up from the hood. You don't need those things in a daily driver!

You drive around here with a huge assed blower sticking out of your hood you will get pulled over, simple as that. Same with illegally tinted windows! Some of these laws were put in place to save lives of innocent people! No one needs a 600hp daily driver anymore in my opinion, but you want to have that car on the track/strip, I'll be the first person in line drooling over it.

So you honestly think that performance modification of a vehicle is wrong?  You think it's wrong of me to shoot for 600hp in the build I'm building right now, simply because I "don't need it"?  Well, you know what, YOU don't need a CHARGER either.  Such a heavy body is wasteful and pointless, and the engine has WELL beyond the amount of power you need for daily driving, so you should not be allowed by law to own or drive it.  Seriously, you don't NEED more than a honda, so why should you be allowed to have it?
Think what you want, as long as I can think what I want about the hypocricy inherent in your opinion.  But when legislation begins making these decisions for us, something is broken.

At least we agree that the warrantless searches were wrong.


Having said that, in another article about this subject, there were reports that the owner of the parking lot had complained repeatedly and that the center's customers had been endangered, and that there were rampant skidmarks and burnout marks around, so not quite as black & white as this article paints.  Not condoning the actions of the police, simply saying there is more to it.

Wow... just wow....

So just because I dont believe that someone needs a 600hp daily driver means I shouldn't be looking at chargers. Im talking about a STOCK vehicle compared to a vehicle that is done to the nuts with things like NOS and Blowers. A hemi is stock at what, 425hp? Oh well, its a STOCK CLASSIC VEHICLE. The only engines ever been in my chargers were 318's and they were just fine for what I wanted to do.

I helped build a couple "drag vehicles" that were also road worthy and each one of them ended up in the ditch, wrapped around a pole, bounced off a tree, etc. Not because they were bad drivers, but because with that much power most people want to use it when they shouldnt.

If you can CLEARLY explain why someone NEEDS a blower attached to their 440 or NEEDS NOS attached to the car they drive to and from school or whatever Id certainly like to hear it.

i dont like blowers or over nitrious cars either , but thats not the point . Some people do and that is there right or freedom to like it and have it as long as they are law abiding people!   

[68charger383]

In CA there has been a few serious accidents invoving inncoent motorists and bystanders to the races. The cops are justing trying to look like they are taking some action on this issue and getting some free PR. A few months back in this area they crushed a few of the cars that were caught with stolen parts and for street racing (I guess that's the law out here now) and they got national exposure http://blogs.edmunds.com/?7@@.ee9bf91/1

[Brock Samson]

perhaps drache you may want to extend your "argument" to guns,..
do the math.

[ChgrSteve67]

In CA there has been a few serious accidents involving Innocent motorists and bystanders to the races. The cops are justing trying to look like they are taking some action on this issue and getting some free PR. A few months back in this area they crushed a few of the cars that were caught with stolen parts and for street racing (I guess that's the law out here now) and they got national exposure http://blogs.edmunds.com/?7@@.ee9bf91/1

The cars they crushed contained mostly stolen parts and yes they said it was to make a show or example with them.
Usually the cops will have you remove the stolen parts, charge you for having possesion of the parts and you get the rest of your car back.
I'm sure a plea deal was struck like, surender your car and you'll just get probation. IF the car has soo many stolen parts they don't want to go through removing them they will crush it.
Wrecking yards, collision repair shops and chop shops get raided all of the time and in the end they will crush the cars rather than selling it.

Most of the street racing accidents where deaths occurred (had one occur about 100 yards from my house) occurred in stock vehicles.

The car modification angle is for public sympathy so the cops are not accused of harassing a bunch of kids hanging out. 
Also works well for getting Federal Funding.

When I was 18 or so the cops would secure parking lots and write everyone a ticket for loitering (since we were not technically cruising) they would bust kids for alcohol, curfew, illegal car modification the whole smash (Jacked up 4x4s were the big thing in my area).  This is nothing new. (The Federal Funding probably is)

Got a $550 ticket for engine modification in 1987.
1979 Ford Mustang 2.8 V6  - Some of the smog lines were missing and I had an after market air cleaner.

A buddy of mine got a "Excessive showmenship of power" ticket for doing a donut in a parking lot.
Didn't get a recless driving citation because he did a perfect circle - the cop told him.
Personally I think the cop did not want to go through the hassle of impounding the car that night, probably would cut into his ticket writting time.

Steve (CA Native)

[tkkruzer]

  hey guys, the reason they can get away with it is because it is a federal offence to remove smog equipment from your vehicle,without replacing it. in CA they go through smog inspection every year and you must have all that crap on your car and it must be in good working condition.  problem is the whole thing is crooked because some of that crap makes your car put out more emissions and run worse than without it  so do they really want clean air or just a bunch of worthless junk on a car so they can feel in power? who knows    Tom   

[Brock Samson]

actually it's every other year we have to smog our cars and it's really expensive to get the test and then the state certificate costs on top of that...
It's been a scandel here for decades,.. 
all of this regulation stuff is driving folks into buying new cars from the dealer and an end to shade tree mechanics,.. not to mention filling local, state and federal coffers.
  i sometimes forget how cool it is that 3 of my 4 vehicles are exempt from that B.S.

  http://www.theonion.com/content/video/china_celebrates_its_status_as

[tkkruzer]

yea I forgot it was everyother year,, but that was part of the reason I moved to arkansas. I used to live in colton,CA and my buddy caught a local cop standing on his patrol car looking over his privacy fence and told him he had to dispose of all his old car parts because it was an eye sore  to who? birds? planes? absolutely no one could see into his yard without his permission ,,, the authorities are just too socialist for my blood Now I have land and freedom (for now) and lots of old cars to play with  still miss the beach though,,,,Tom

[superduperbee]

actually it's every other year we have to smog our cars and it's really expensive to get the test and then the state certificate costs on top of that...
It's been a scandel here for decades,.. 
all of this regulation stuff is driving folks into buying new cars from the dealer and an end to shade tree mechanics,.. not to mention filling local, state and federal coffers.
  i sometimes forget how cool it is that 3 of my 4 vehicles are exempt from that B.S.

  http://www.theonion.com/content/video/china_celebrates_its_status_as

Anyone remember a Hot Rod Magazine article from the late 80s ? They took a 66 Chevelle 396, put catalytic converters on it and filled it with unleaded gas. They ran it on a dyno and sniffed the exhaust. It ran as clean as the New Toyota 4cyl.

[Drache]

perhaps drache you may want to extend your "argument" to guns,..
do the math.

nah I live in Canada and getting a gun here is like trying to find an honest priest. I dont see a use for personal handguns but rifles I for one hunt with. 90% of handguns are too weak to hunt with except for the few that were created especially for the purpose of hunting. Why you want to get into that arguement with me too? 

[Old Moparz]

There was a local cruise near me that started out with the majority of the vehicles being older classics & hot rods. As the years went by, the tuner crowd increased to a point where they outnumbered the older cars by a large margin. I stopped going because I wasn't interested in seeing who had the brightest neon lights under their car, or who had the most TV sets inside, or which goofy ass wing looked the most out of place on the back of some compact, 4 door commuter car, with tires that had less than a half inch of sidewall.....lol

Also, one really important reason I stopped going was that it was dangerous walking around the parking lot with my kid. Some of the drivers would do burnouts in the aisles, some would speed excessively, & some were just careless. Not that the tuner crowd is to blame on the whole, but the younger & less experienced drivers in general are. We were all young & did our share of dumb s**t in our own cars & sometimes learned the hard way by having an accident or getting tickets. It's always a few that ruin it for the crowd.

I think most of us are guilty of some kind of vehicle, or traffic violation, whether it's a minor or major one. We've changed things on our cars inside & out, we've modified the engine, & we've probably all driven a little bit above the speed limit. (Just a little though) You take a chance when you knowingly speed or make a mod that is questionable from a legal standpoint, so the expression "You play, you pay" seems to fit. Getting busted in the parking lot sucks, but I think it's a gray area of whether it was total BS or not.

In all likelihood, the complaints from the store or the property owner, from the past are valid. I've seen first hand the stupidity of bad drivers & the garbage left behind from pizza boxes & McD's wrappers. The excuse that they were street racing, or going to race because of the mods they made is pretty lame. I'd go to court to argue it, but as we learn from the past, it's almost a total waste of time in most cases. You still end up paying the fine & then have court fees added.

The younger crowd is just paying their dues that the older crowd has already paid, so get used to it. 

[Silver R/T]

The CA cops are actually trained to ID aftermarket parts on these cars.

from what I realize they are the only cops who have to go through courses just to be able to do so! Personally I say good for them! 

Really?  Good for them?

And then when they come after you what are you going to say?  Good for them?  Just because it happened to the tuner crowd doesn't mean it can't happen to you.  Grow up.

This is a plain-and-simple abuse of police power.

exactly, this bs is unconstitutional to the car owners in general

[bull]

Wow... just wow....

So just because I dont believe that someone needs a 600hp daily driver means I shouldn't be looking at chargers. Im talking about a STOCK vehicle compared to a vehicle that is done to the nuts with things like NOS and Blowers. A hemi is stock at what, 425hp? Oh well, its a STOCK CLASSIC VEHICLE. The only engines ever been in my chargers were 318's and they were just fine for what I wanted to do.

Why does anyone NEED a classic car at all? There are plenty of other cars out there that are safer, more fuel efficient and more useful. Who are you to decide what people need?

I helped build a couple "drag vehicles" that were also road worthy and each one of them ended up in the ditch, wrapped around a pole, bounced off a tree, etc. Not because they were bad drivers, but because with that much power most people want to use it when they shouldnt.

If you can CLEARLY explain why someone NEEDS a blower attached to their 440 or NEEDS NOS attached to the car they drive to and from school or whatever Id certainly like to hear it.

Again, why do you think it's up to you or anyone else to decide what people need? Would you like to come over to my house and explain to me why I don't need my guns or my fishing poles or my Kitchen Aid mixer or fuzzy covers on my toilet lids? Is it really your concern?

[2Gunz]

Wow... just wow....

So just because I dont believe that someone needs a 600hp daily driver means I shouldn't be looking at chargers. Im talking about a STOCK vehicle compared to a vehicle that is done to the nuts with things like NOS and Blowers. A hemi is stock at what, 425hp? Oh well, its a STOCK CLASSIC VEHICLE. The only engines ever been in my chargers were 318's and they were just fine for what I wanted to do.

I helped build a couple "drag vehicles" that were also road worthy and each one of them ended up in the ditch, wrapped around a pole, bounced off a tree, etc. Not because they were bad drivers, but because with that much power most people want to use it when they shouldnt.

If you can CLEARLY explain why someone NEEDS a blower attached to their 440 or NEEDS NOS attached to the car they drive to and from school or whatever Id certainly like to hear it.

We dont NEED alot of things. Actually we dont NEED most of the things we have.

The computer your typing on, the place you live, the TV, the microwave, the charger.

We do things and we buy things because it makes us happy.

Your happy with your 318.

Im kinda happy with my 440, but at some point it will become a stroker.

And if a 3000hp lawn mower engine makes somebody happy..........

Who are you to judge whats best for everybody else?

The REAL issue is you cant go bust people because you feel like it.
If they are drag racing, please arrest them before they kill somebody.
But hanging out in a parking lot?  It screams thrown out of court and lawsuit to me.


And sadly I tend to agree with you about the ricers.
They prolly are up to no good and probably should get ticketed.

But Im also not short sighted enough to think it starts and ends there.

How long before they tow away your charger saying its a gross polluter and not practical.

Then what?