Similar to "I need a VIN number"

[rav440]

dealerships would also remove the wings after a period of  time due to the BIRDS not selling .

[62 Max]

Although for the Superbirds they weren't done by Creative Industries. Only the parts were made by them, but was assembled by Chrysler. As far as them forgeting on their own to put the wing on, well thats doubtful, but then again they did some pretty odd ball stuff on the assembly lines anyways.

I think you will find your statement is incorrect.If you have access to the Suoerbird vin list.You will see the date they were shipped and returned to Chrysler.If Creative only furnished the parts there would be no reason to send a car to Creative.

[Aero426]

I personally know of only one Bird that was delivered new without a wing.  Was removed by the dealership at the first owner's request.   

The removal of wings is very much an urban legend that seems to get larger as time goes on.     It is possible that additional cars had wings removed, but with almost 2000 cars available, its a very small percentage. 

[Nekid_a12]

Doug, I'm the one that emailed you looking for information on this car. Can you help?

[Nekid_a12]

Guess not
Thanks to those of you who saw fit to participate in this thread.

[moparstuart]

neat car and story ,hope you can find it !!!!

[Nekid_a12]

I was counting on some help, but it doesn't look like I'm gonna get any.

[Magnumcharger]

What I'm thinking is that there is definitely a VIN database, no doubt in the hands of the administrators of the Daytona/Superbird club.
There are people who participate in discussions on this very webpage that in all likelyhood, know more about the past and present disposition of ALL of the remaining "Wing Cars".
However, I can also surmise that by having that knowledge, it carries a certain responsibility; namely confidentiality.
So, getting the location and/or current owners name might very well prove to be the impossible dream.
The best that you can hope for is that your interests are duly passed along.
Then it's up to the owner to contact you.

Providing the car still exists, that is.

[Nekid_a12]

Thats the thing. I never asked for current owner info. All I wanted to know was if it was still alive, had it been restored, and were there any pics. I have 3 69 runners right now (one of each) and while I would like to have many of my old cars back, I am in no position to acquire anything else, especially if it needs a resto. I just sold my Lil Red to get it out of my way!

Besides, since I DO have the VIN, it is possible to run that number to see what pops up. So if that was what I wanted, I wouldn't have bothered with posting here. I would have made a call and had the number run.

[n9671x2]

I was just curiuos on the wing, mine left the dealership floor without ever having the wing installed, quarters weren't drilled for it, but had trunk braces, just wondering if your old one could have been this way also.

I find that hard to believe.Can't imagine Creative Industries not finishing a car.I also doubt Chrysler would have accepted an unfinished car.

I know it sounds goofy, but I am the 4th owner.   The 3rd owner became friends with Mike Crawford who was/is pretty reputable in the car hobby.   Mike found the car in 1973, his buddy became the 2nd owner.   I have personally spoke with Mike and he verified the story that it did not have a wing, and that the 2nd owner purchased one from the dealer and installed it in 1974.

The car was sold new at Monicatti near Detroit.   A couple months ago I finally sent a letter to six addresses that had the same last name as the original owner, Jack V Coleman in the town of Washington MI.   2 days later I get a call from Ron Coleman, who turned out to be his first cousin and best friend.   He was the first person to get a ride in the car when Jack bought it new.   One of the first things he said is I don't know if he ever put a wing on it, that was an option you know.   We talked for a while, said Jack was alive and doing fine, lived outside of Detroit in Canada and would get a hold of me when he was back from vacation.

Few weeks later Jack called me.   Bought it off Monicatti's showroom floor when he got back from vietnam.   Sold it in 73 to buy a new Thunderbird.   Verified it did not have a wing "that was an option".    Was offered to purchase the wing they had in the parts department but passed to save a few bucks.   The braces were installed, but top of quarters not drilled.

Jack and Ron plan on coming up this way to take a spin in it for the first time in 35 years this summer.   Nothing special is denoted on the broadcast sheet.   One other oddity is it is a 14 WSW tire car with deluxe full hubcaps.

[62 Max]

I was just curiuos on the wing, mine left the dealership floor without ever having the wing installed, quarters weren't drilled for it, but had trunk braces, just wondering if your old one could have been this way also.

I find that hard to believe.Can't imagine Creative Industries not finishing a car.I also doubt Chrysler would have accepted an unfinished car.

I know it sounds goofy, but I am the 4th owner.   The 3rd owner became friends with Mike Crawford who was/is pretty reputable in the car hobby.   Mike found the car in 1973, his buddy became the 2nd owner.   I have personally spoke with Mike and he verified the story that it did not have a wing, and that the 2nd owner purchased one from the dealer and installed it in 1974.

The car was sold new at Monicatti near Detroit.   A couple months ago I finally sent a letter to six addresses that had the same last name as the original owner, Jack V Coleman in the town of Washington MI.   2 days later I get a call from Ron Coleman, who turned out to be his first cousin and best friend.   He was the first person to get a ride in the car when Jack bought it new.   One of the first things he said is I don't know if he ever put a wing on it, that was an option you know.   We talked for a while, said Jack was alive and doing fine, lived outside of Detroit in Canada and would get a hold of me when he was back from vacation.

Few weeks later Jack called me.   Bought it off Monicatti's showroom floor when he got back from vietnam.   Sold it in 73 to buy a new Thunderbird.   Verified it did not have a wing "that was an option".    Was offered to purchase the wing they had in the parts department but passed to save a few bucks.   The braces were installed, but top of quarters not drilled.

Jack and Ron plan on coming up this way to take a spin in it for the first time in 35 years this summer.   Nothing special is denoted on the broadcast sheet.   One other oddity is it is a 14 WSW tire car with deluxe full hubcaps.

Wing was not an option,it is part of the A13 package.Had it been an option,probably the nose would have been also.If that be the case why even build one to begin with.

[hemigeno]

Wing was not an option,it is part of the A13 package.Had it been an option,probably the nose would have been also.If that be the case why even build one to begin with.

I actually find it funny how owners from back in the day can remember things that are not exactly right.  One of the early owners of my 4-speed Daytona swore it came from the factory with a Hurst T-handle shift knob (we discussed that in a previous thread). 

Wings were never an extra-cost option on Superbirds.  Since I did not personally inspect each car before it went out the door, I cannot say that each and every Superbird was shipped with a wing due to some weird quality-control problem -- but I dare say that it would have been highly unusual if it did happen at all.  The real truth on that car would have been discovered beneath the quarterpanel's paint, but the opportunity to check that out is probably gone.

Here's an excerpt from David Patik's "Lynch Road Assembly Plant Tour" which focuses on the building of a Superbird:

     None of the Superbirds are completed cars, for the are all missing their nose cone assembly and wing.  These cars were driven onto semi-trailer car haulers for the five mile trip to the Clairpointe Pre-production Facility.  Its purpose needs to be explained before we complete assembly of our car there.  Its usual function was a training area for assembly of next-year's models.  It was complete with scaled down versions of every major area of an assembly plant, so that the new parts and new technologies could be tried under actual conditions before the "real" cars were assembled.  (Clairpointe test cars completed are "pilot cars").  For example, in May of 1969, perhaps twenty of the soon-to-be-introduced E-bodies were completely built at Clairpointe.  In late 1969, this facility was not in use because the 1970 models were already in full production (since August 1, 1969), and the 1971 model pilot assembly had not begun.  Therefore, it was ideally suited for Superbird final assembly;  its close proximity to Lynch Road was an added bonus.
     There actually was little assembly required when the cars arrived in no particular order from Lynch Road.  The first car to arrive was RM23?0A149789, on October 17, 1969.  It was completed and shipped out the same day.  The last car to arrive was RM23U0A172609, which arrived on December 17, 1969, and was completed the next day.  (Superbird VIN themselves range from 149597 to 181274).  Several cars were returned to Lynch Road for repairs, which must have meant major parts were wrong, such as a 1970 Road Runner front end mistakenly attached, or the car was seriously damaged in transit.  Clairpointe normally could repair normal parts malfunctions itself.

David's document goes on to talk about the wing and nose being painted in lacquer rather than enamel, which sometimes resulted in an imprecise match between the body & nose/wing.  Most of the other documents I've seen all reference the Clairpointe facility being used for Superbird assembly, with Creative being not much more than a parts vendor.

[moparstuart]

I was just curiuos on the wing, mine left the dealership floor without ever having the wing installed, quarters weren't drilled for it, but had trunk braces, just wondering if your old one could have been this way also.

I find that hard to believe.Can't imagine Creative Industries not finishing a car.I also doubt Chrysler would have accepted an unfinished car.

I know it sounds goofy, but I am the 4th owner.   The 3rd owner became friends with Mike Crawford who was/is pretty reputable in the car hobby.   Mike found the car in 1973, his buddy became the 2nd owner.   I have personally spoke with Mike and he verified the story that it did not have a wing, and that the 2nd owner purchased one from the dealer and installed it in 1974.

The car was sold new at Monicatti near Detroit.   A couple months ago I finally sent a letter to six addresses that had the same last name as the original owner, Jack V Coleman in the town of Washington MI.   2 days later I get a call from Ron Coleman, who turned out to be his first cousin and best friend.   He was the first person to get a ride in the car when Jack bought it new.   One of the first things he said is I don't know if he ever put a wing on it, that was an option you know.   We talked for a while, said Jack was alive and doing fine, lived outside of Detroit in Canada and would get a hold of me when he was back from vacation.

Few weeks later Jack called me.   Bought it off Monicatti's showroom floor when he got back from vietnam.   Sold it in 73 to buy a new Thunderbird.   Verified it did not have a wing "that was an option".    Was offered to purchase the wing they had in the parts department but passed to save a few bucks.   The braces were installed, but top of quarters not drilled.

Jack and Ron plan on coming up this way to take a spin in it for the first time in 35 years this summer.   Nothing special is denoted on the broadcast sheet.   One other oddity is it is a 14 WSW tire car with deluxe full hubcaps.

Wing was not an option,it is part of the A13 package.Had it been an option,probably the nose would have been also.If that be the case why even build one to begin with.

I agree

[Aero426]

Guess not
Thanks to those of you who saw fit to participate in this thread.

What is the VIN number?    It's been removed from the post?   

[62 Max]

Guess not
Thanks to those of you who saw fit to participate in this thread.

What is the VIN number?    It's been removed from the post?   



If you go back to the first page,he sent you an email!

[wingfan]

Patik's article states that #149597 was the first Superbird built but it isn't on the Nascar list.  I know some were left off.  Does anyone know anthing about this Bird? 

[Nekid_a12]

Ok, I'll give it another try. RM23U0A174592

[Aero426]

If you go back to the first page,he sent you an email!

Yes, I got that part the first time.    I don't see the email, or know exactly when it was sent.    And I don't know if I responded that the car wasn't listed,  or if it slipped through the cracks and I didn't get to answer him.

Either way, the VIN was there last night, and it isn't on the thread today when I can actually look it up.

So I will politely ask again, does anyone have the VIN ?    It was 174xxx as I recall. 

[hemigeno]

does anyone have the VIN ? It was 174xxx as I recall.

See below:

Ok, I'll give it another try. RM23U0A174592

[Aero426]

does anyone have the VIN ? It was 174xxx as I recall.

See below:

Ok, I'll give it another try. RM23U0A174592

Thanks,

The last report I have of it in the PC is 1989,  owner James Smith.    I can see if there any paper records to match that name later. 

ref# 2114.

[Nekid_a12]

What I'm interested in is if its been restored and if there are any pics. As I've said, I'm not really interested in who owns it or where it is, although I guess it would be interesting if the guy I sold it to still owned it. What I would really like is tag info and pics if its been restored.

Thanks

[n9671x2]

Well, first of all I had never thought the wing was an option, I should have pointed that out.   My point was the original owner and his first cousin/buddy back in the day thought it was, that is why it didn't seem like a big deal to them.   How much research/comparison went into the topic back in September of 1970?   We can sit here nearly 40 years later knowing that wasn't the case, but who knows, some new salesman tell them that, or just their own assumption??

As far as funny what original owners forget, I definately understand that.   However, a shifter handle and a wing are two different things.   

I guess ultimately you can only be sure of what you actually see with your own eyes, but I have a hunch if the original owner clearly remembers the situation, his cousin clearly remembers it, and Mike Crawford, who was one of the founding members of the NHOA who I spoke to personally remembers it clearly from 1973, I tend to believe it.

I didn't post that looking to get into a pissing match with anyone, I was just curious if the car Nekid was looking for had a similiar story.   Why was it built like that, I have no idea, any others, I have no idea.   Other than conversation, does it really matter, not really.   I have been around these cars long enough to know everything isn't always black and white and strange things, along with errors did occur.

Nekid, good luck with your search, I wish I had some information that could help you out

[Nekid_a12]

Thanks man. I appreciate it. And you're right. There aint no tellin what went on back then

[69_500]

Living 39 years later everything is pretty much hear say now anyways. As people age their minds start to remember things a bit differently too. Cars that were fast when younger are now super fast. Little quarks on cars that probably weren't noticeable to the average person 39 years ago, are now huge glarring objects of people's attention. I have only seen one Superbird that wasn't wearing a wing, and it wasn't a factory mistake, but rather just someone who didn't want the wing on the car anymore.

[hemigeno]

Well, first of all I had never thought the wing was an option, I should have pointed that out.   My point was the original owner and his first cousin/buddy back in the day thought it was, that is why it didn't seem like a big deal to them.   How much research/comparison went into the topic back in September of 1970?   We can sit here nearly 40 years later knowing that wasn't the case, but who knows, some new salesman tell them that, or just their own assumption??

You're absolutely right that there is no way to know what prompted the idea that the wing was optional.  All we can do at this stage is guess what the reason is/was.

As far as funny what original owners forget, I definately understand that.   However, a shifter handle and a wing are two different things.   

Of course they're two different things, but the principle is the same.  None of us have perfect memories - with my own faulty memory leading that list.

I guess ultimately you can only be sure of what you actually see with your own eyes, but I have a hunch if the original owner clearly remembers the situation, his cousin clearly remembers it, and Mike Crawford, who was one of the founding members of the NHOA who I spoke to personally remembers it clearly from 1973, I tend to believe it.

While I certainly won't say that all of these people are recalling the situation incorrectly, there are potential explanations for the missing wing besides a factory error.  Again, all that is a guess and we can't know for certain without the car (in a fairly untouched state) to give us clues.

I didn't post that looking to get into a pissing match with anyone, I was just curious if the car Nekid was looking for had a similiar story.   Why was it built like that, I have no idea, any others, I have no idea.   Other than conversation, does it really matter, not really.   I have been around these cars long enough to know everything isn't always black and white and strange things, along with errors did occur.

It's all good - the biggest reason I said anything at all on the subject is that I'd hate to see any comment like that (even though you weren't stating it as a fact, but just relaying the recollections of others) become an assumed fact for the casual reader/lurker.

Oh, and you're absolutely right about the strange things & errors.  That's part of the intrigue with this hobby for me in the first place.



[/hijack]