Advice on taking my car in to get the tail painted black

[68charger383]

My 68 tailpanel is body color. I read some threads on the topic.... and I've decided to take the car in to get the back sprayed flat "organisol" black. Based on the size of the job, I don't expect it to cost that much, but I want the job done perfect.

Should I have them spray over the blue or have it taken down, primed and sprayed? On the other threads, they recommened just spraying over the color.

Anyone with body shop experience estimate the cost? I'm in California so I know that will add a few bucks and I figure they will have to buy at least a quart of the paint.

What should I have done...how many coats, should they spray clear over it?

Since its flat, should it be rubbed out or have any after paint work done?

Any recommendations for which brand paint to use?

Anything specific I should ask to make sure they are going to do it right?

Sorry for all the questions, but I always seem to find people that do half ass or less than perfect work no matter what I pay?

Thread on topic
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,38644.0.html

[Charger-Bodie]

If there arent any dents or rust on the tail panel, you should not need to strip it down. Just sand it, mask it, seal it, and paint it flat black.


You can save youreself some cash by removing the trim and the t-lights youreself.

As far as the paint to use I would seal it creating texture with the sealer, then spray the black in basecoat, after you have reached coverage with the base clear it with the properly flattened clear. ......Do not rub it out as this will bring shine to the clear.


As for cost ? I have a shop and I would quote some one about 350.00 to do that job assuming it doesnt need anything more than sanding , masking , and painting.

[68charger383]

To bad your not local, would love a person who has charger knowledge doing the job.

I planned on taking off the lights/trim/emblems just to make sure that they don't snap off any of the spikes.

Thanks for the advice,  I'll post after I get it done.

[LeeBoy]

To bad your not local, would love a person who has charger knowledge doing the job.

I planned on taking off the lights/trim/emblems just to make sure that they don't snap off any of the spikes.

Thanks for the advice,  I'll post after I get it done.

These guys are in Reseda, CA if that is close to you, they should be able to help. http://www.musclecarrenovations.com/

[hemi-hampton]

The factory used Ditzler (ppg) DDL 9355 If I remember right. This is a textured flat black Laquer which you can still buy but getting harder to find & more exspensive. About $75 a quart when it used to be more like $10 15 years ago. Since the Laquer is getting hard to come by there is now a single stage enamel made as a substitute for this but I dont like it, It sucks, to glossy. I'd just buy the real thing if I was you, DDL9355 Laquer. Scuff original paint & spray using light coats & fast dry thinner to prevent any lifting. LEON.

[68charger383]

Thanks guys,

The Reseda shop might to to far since its hard to get a ride.....but when I go to Van Nuys for work, I'll stop by to take a look.

I'll try and work the deal using this paint-Ditzler (ppg) DDL 9355

[bill440rt]

If there arent any dents or rust on the tail panel, you should not need to strip it down. Just sand it, mask it, seal it, and paint it flat black.


You can save youreself some cash by removing the trim and the t-lights youreself.

As far as the paint to use I would seal it creating texture with the sealer, then spray the black in basecoat, after you have reached coverage with the base clear it with the properly flattened clear. ......Do not rub it out as this will bring shine to the clear.


As for cost ? I have a shop and I would quote some one about 350.00 to do that job assuming it doesnt need anything more than sanding , masking , and painting.

Great advice, Brian! Price seems about right as well, if you go for a 2-stage job.

I did mine fairly low-buck, & achieved great results. I dry-sprayed it with PPG black epoxy primer (sealer, lacquer primer, etc will also work). Holding the gun about 24" away, I lightly misted the primer on. I gave it several light, even coats until I reached the desired "texture." I let this dry for about 20min, then spray-bombed it with a good, quality semi-flat black spray paint (I think it was either Dupli-Color or Plasti-Kote). Sem's Trim Black is also great.

[68charger383]

Went and got an estimate for the painting of the tailpanel, $250, so it was right in line with what you guys estimated. 

The problem is the paint. The  Ditzler (ppg) DDL 9355 is a lacquer and not available or illegal to spray in CA. They did say that if I could get it, they would spray it. I checked out E-bay did a yahoo search and went to the Ditzler website and could not find it available.

They did have a can of DDL 9381or 9383 (can't remember which it was) which they used on a 69 Mustang and looked cool, but it also kinda looked like a "crinkle type texture"

I came across a substitute for the DDL 9355, on a website they stated the replacement paint is DDC 9355, but I could not find that one available either.

Any suggestions for another paint number to use for the tailpanel. I'll be heading to San Diego on Monday and Ditzler has a store/vendor where I could pick it.

If familiar with the DDL 9381 or 9383, would that be a good alternative or is it to glossy and textured.

Thanks in advance

[hemi-hampton]

I think Year one sells the paint you need or they did but not sure they will ship to California? The DDC sounds like the enamel substitute I used & I did not like it, It was to glossy & the first time they mixed it they forgot to add the suede or texture additive. This black gets a flattening agent added & then a suede or texture additive & if the people mixing the paint don't know what they are doing they can mess it up, which is typical since most automotive paint stores are non mopar or even old car people & finding the right store or competant guy/mixer can be difficult at times. If finding the proper paint proves to difficult you may have to go with one of the Alternatives mentioned. Good Luck. LEON.

[68charger383]

I actually got an e-mail today from the Ditzler store and they said they would mix me the DDL 9355 for $109 a Qt., a little more than thought, but I'll pay whatever they wanted to get the right paint to do the job right.

Thanks for all your help 

[daytonalo]

Leon , I use BASF in my shop , where do I start to get the right Formula for Org black ?


Larry

[hemi-hampton]

In my older Year one catalog I see a quart listed at $53.95 My newer catalog is at work but last I knew it jumped to around $75 a quart. I get at my local Painters supply store for around $40-$60 I think it was. As far as I know the ppg formula can be cross referanced with any other paint Co. to find their formula. I think if anyone is asking over $75 they are taking advantage of you. I remember when a quart of any laquer was $10.00-$20  LEON.

[68charger383]

Hey Leon,

I saw that Y/O carried the paint when I started to look for a new rear emblem for the car. Your catalog must be a few years old cause online page 423, its $113.00/qt  + I'm sure Y/O will charge another $20 for shipping. 

Considering the amount I'll actually need for the job, I should try and see if they'll sell me a few ounces of the stuff........Hey how much to fill up this empty budweiser bottle 

[Charger-Bodie]

Just a little FYI The reason I reccomended base clear is because youre car probably has base clear , and Laquer is a "hungery" Paint , it likes to "eat" (lift the clear Its being sprayed over) if you arent VERY carful when spraying it over pretty much anything but laquer. 

[hemi-hampton]

OK, Incase anybody thinks I'm blowing hot air or dont know what I'm talking about & I dont want to speculate on the past heres the facts. Dug out my old receipt & can. The receipt said I paid $66.25 for the organosol 9355 paint. Dates less then 2 years ago. About 1 1/2 years ago I used this on my Buddy's 69 Super Bee fj5 440 6 pak car. Had less then a week to fix his cracked up hood in my spare time, pressure was on since it had to be ready for the Henry Ford Mansion Invitational "Eyes on Design" show the next week end. This receipt has the phone # if you wanta call & see if they will ship? LEON.

[hemi-hampton]

Here's the can.

[hemi-hampton]

Here's my buddy's car.

[Brock Samson]

F.W.I.W. (for what it's worth)
I did my own tail panel twice one after each paint job,.. cost me about 6 bucks and probably an hour - if that, in my own driveway.
I've never had any problems with it (including numbers matching nazis complaining about it).

i see Troy allready did the work.. 
  http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,7888.0.html

[daytonalo]

let me see if I have this right , the 9355 is Lacquer Is their a base clear version or low gloss single stage ?? Cant take a chance on lifting with Lacquer



Larry

[hemi-hampton]

Yes, you can get it in single stage enamel but I did not like it. If you seal the area & then apply light coats with fast dry thinner with adequate flash time & watch inbetween coats you should/could be all right. LEON.

[68charger383]

Went to the PPG store today and was able to get a pint for $62.00 (still a lot, but beats the $109 for the Qt.)

Leon, do not doubt that you paid that two years ago, just shows how much paint has gone up in the past two years...plus they are sticking it to everyone on this paint probably based on its limited use ((AAR, T/A hoods, GTX/RR air grabber and A12 hoods etc.) Cheaper to do it other ways, but just trying to do it right.

Thanks for everyones help on this project!

[bull]

Put up some pics when it's done, ok?

[bill440rt]

Good Luck with the tail panel! 
Just MAKE SURE you apply a coat or two of sealer before applying that lacquer paint. DP epoxy primer mixed as a sealer will work good. If not, you run the chance of lifting (wrinkling) the paint underneath.

[69chargeryeehaa]

I thought i'd jump in here, since i think i can share my story, it may or not help.  You may recognize me from the "paintjob on a budget" thread, yes this is on my old charger painted with a roller.

I used tremclad flat black in a spray can to paint the tail panel on my old charger, since then it has been stored OUTSIDE thru the Canadian winters near Toronto Canada (by the person i sold it too), and it's been 3 years since this was painted and still looks PERFECT.  I noticed that depending on how "heavy" i layed on the coats, I'd get more/less gloss after it dried, this is just a can of el-cheapo flat rust paint, and there was virtually no prep, and no primer was used.  It dried in 10 mins to where you could touch it, and after about an hour i wetsanded it, if you very lightly wetsand flat paint with 1500grit + you can almost get any level of gloss you want from this paint (the more you wetsand, the more gloss you get).  I can't say how many times at cruise nights or shows people have approached me and specifically asked about what paint i used for the tail panel; actually it was annoying as hell, but understandable since i couldn't even believe: 1: how good it looked, and 2: how well it has lasted. 
basically remove the bumper, chrome trim, lights, mask it all off, paint (after prep with about 600-800, just basically scuffing it).  This paint sticks to anything, and virtually the only way to get it off is to sand it off, i wouldn't use primer.   Total cost, $5 for a can of paint.  and a few hours of your time....

Now for some close up pics, and yes it looks better in person, the pics really don't do it any justice, plus as i mentioned you could get any level of gloss from this paint, on my car, just a very light wetsand and it was i'd say in between flat and semi-gloss:

[daytonalo]

NO TEXTURE !!!!!!!!

[hemi-hampton]

Thats what I was going to say, Did it have a textured look to it? The organosol has a very rough pebbly look to it. LEON.

[1969chargerrtse]

I thought I'd jump in here, since i think i can share my story, it may or not help.  You may recognize me from the "paintjob on a budget" thread, yes this is on my old charger painted with a roller.

I used tremclad flat black in a spray can to paint the tail panel on my old charger, since then it has been stored OUTSIDE thru the Canadian winters near Toronto Canada (by the person i sold it too), and it's been 3 years since this was painted and still looks PERFECT.  I noticed that depending on how "heavy" i layed on the coats, I'd get more/less gloss after it dried, this is just a can of el-cheapo flat rust paint, and there was virtually no prep, and no primer was used.  It dried in 10 mins to where you could touch it, and after about an hour i wetsanded it, if you very lightly wetsand flat paint with 1500grit + you can almost get any level of gloss you want from this paint (the more you wetsand, the more gloss you get).  I can't say how many times at cruise nights or shows people have approached me and specifically asked about what paint i used for the tail panel; actually it was annoying as hell, but understandable since i couldn't even believe: 1: how good it looked, and 2: how well it has lasted. 
basically remove the bumper, chrome trim, lights, mask it all off, paint (after prep with about 600-800, just basically scuffing it).  This paint sticks to anything, and virtually the only way to get it off is to sand it off, i wouldn't use primer.   Total cost, $5 for a can of paint.  and a few hours of your time....

Now for some close up pics, and yes it looks better in person, the pics really don't do it any justice, plus as i mentioned you could get any level of gloss from this paint, on my car, just a very light wetsand and it was I'd say in between flat and semi-gloss:

I always thought the rears were just semi flat black?  I like the look here.  Someone post the "textured" look I keep reading about please, and how would one get that texture?

[daytonalo]

Couldn't one just cut back air pressure to give a texture look ??


Larry

[68charger383]

Update on car.

Decided to add a stripe (Performance Graphics) to the car. Paint will be shot on Monday. So far, so good.

[68charger383]

Got the car back today. tailpanel came out perfect....flat/texture finish was really nice. Thanks once again for all your help and input.

[mally69]

  nice

[hemi-hampton]

Looks good How much did they charge you? LEON.

[4cruzin]

[68charger383]

Looks good How much did they charge you? LEON.

$250 for the tailpanel and to put on the stripe....threw in the stripe since I bought the paint.

As far as the work that was done, its nothing new, but I'm happy that finally got my charger back to looking like a charger (no more body colored rear end).

Thanks for the comments. 

[1969chargerrtse]

Adding the stripe was a great idea.  Car looks awesome.