just a wage rant.

[C_stripes]

I just felt like writing something.  So here it goes.

                                                                                        Subject,    Jobs and the American Economy

        Anyone that has a job right now will be noticing one thing. The price of living, IE. Price of Fuel, Food, Rent. etc... Is increasing fairly fast. The products that we are selling at work are getting more expensive, The Fuel to get to work is getting more expensive yet our wages are not changing. So what can we as the public do?  The only thing we can do is to keep working at our decreasing pay as the American dollar is getting worth less and less all the time. The Government does not car about the public. If they did. They would make shore that we would be getting help with our wages. I look at rent for instance. The place I live when I moved in in Oct. of 2006 was $650 a month. Now in January of 2008 it is at $750 a month. In Oct. of 06 Gas was just over $2.00 a gallon. Now in January of 2008 it is Over $3.00 a gallon. The gas bill for the appt. is up about $12 a month. The power is up about $10 a month. In November of 2006 I was making $9.50 an hour as the detail manager of a car dealer. In January of 2008 I am STILL making $9.50 an hour. They cut my holiday pay. They wont let us have over time and the American dollar is worth less than it was in 06. The Gov. should make it mandatory to give us all a raise of some sort. It is not fair to the American public to raise the cost of everything and lower our wages. I am guessing that anyone that does not have a high paying job will soon not be able to have any luxuries. It will be all we can do just to survive.

Rant over.     Jeremy

[charger_mike75]

Even if you got a big raise to overcome the rising costs, the result would still be higher prices. Every company would have to increase their prices in order to pay everyone. It's a sad fact but it's true.   

[C_stripes]

I know.  There is nothing we can do.

[A383Wing]

I haven'y had a raise in 2 years......everything goes up 'cept my paycheck.....can't cut out much more from our budget

Bryan  (ranting along with ya)   

[TK73]

I earned myself a raise, it is called a Bachelors degree.  That allowed me to stop working low-paying sh!++y jobs... living the American dream I am... 

[A383Wing]

Now if you could only fix yer TV!!!!!!!!   

Bryan

[TK73]

Now if you could only fix yer TV!!!!!!!!   

Bryan

Damn it, gonna have to hire some good help... Guatemalans maybe? 

[69CoronetRT]

I know.  There is nothing we can do.

Accept the fact that will never make what YOU think you are worth. You will only make what someone else thinks YOU are worth. Pretty much any way to make a living depends on someone else giving you their money for your labor or services.

If he thinks you are only worth $9.50 and hr that's what you'll make. What have you done to increase your worth to him? Are you doing the same thing you were doing when you started or have you developed a new process to speed up the detail process? Have you come up with a way to lower his costs? Are you faster than you were before? Have you come up with a new way to make cars shine better? What have YOU done to make yourself worth more to your boss so he can justify paying you more for your labor?

Looking somewhere else (the government) is the wrong solution to your problem. Learn how to do something to make you worth more to your current or next boss like TK73 did.

[bull]

The govt does care insofar as the economy is concerned and how it reflects on them and that's why both sides of congress and the White House will soon be passing another phony stimulus package pretty soon to "boost" the economy wth another short term "shot in the arm." The money will either be spent or saved and the "boost" will end as fast as it started. Don't get me wrong, I want my money back, but it's just a crock of you-know-what if anyone thinks it's going to do any long term good. IMO I hope the American consumer continues to put the strangle hold on the businesses of America until they figure out that their prices are too high. They also need to figure out that it's probably not a good idea to pay some lame-a$$ white collar executive more than Shaq makes to sit on his brains and lay people off for three years before getting fired himself and taking a huge severance package to his next white-collar executive assignment where he will repeat the process. Big business has been gouging us for too long, and I don't mean with tax exemptions. Too many people think higher taxes is what they need and that's pure BS. The govt raising taxes has never solved any real problems. We as consumers should punish big business by keeping our money, paying down our collective debt and making them pay for pricing everything in this country based on the wages of two-income households. We should also make them pay for making 70% of their products in China and for fostering a debt-happy populus and for allowing oil companies to get too powerful and for trying to make us suppliment their bottom line during Christmas, Easter and Valentine's Day. Screw them, they charge too much and it's about time some of them withered on the vine. I'd rather buy my fuel and food from the farmer and barter for the rest.

[C_stripes]

I am working on getting a better job. As for what have I done to benefit the company. Lets just say that I have done allot. We used to need a crew of 8 people to get the cars done. Since I have been in the position I am. I have lowered it to 3 full time and two part timers.  The cars get detailed and put on the lot faster. The quality is better (My boss is always telling me that). and we do more now than we did two years ago. I figure were I cut out 5 full time jobs and turned them into two part time jobs. I should get something.  Its hard to be happy when you see the guys up in the office that do no labor. Just come in 3 to 4 days a week and work out issued making over $5k every two weeks when I am back there busting my balls. Finding cheaper chemicals and cutting down labor costs and they don't give me shit. The only reason I am still there is because it will look good on my next resume that I was a manager of a department for 2 years. The worst part is when they keep promising you things and they never come.  Its always talk to me next week, Talk to me next week etc..  Speaking of next week. The manager that works on the other side of the detail shop is doing a shitty job and will be loosing his job next week.  He does not know that yet but because they are going to put me in charge of his crew also. I know. So now instead of having only 4 people under me. I will have 9. I am guessing no raise.   But at least it is job security. Right now I think it will be hard for people to get jobs.
The reason I was saying anything about the gov. Is they need to figure out how to make our $$ quit dropping in value. Or It would be nice if the could slow down all the price inflation.  I know a few people that can only afford their housing and live on mac and cheese. It's only going to get worse.  Right now I am doing OK.  I am just worried for the future.  I also don't realy want to find a new job here as I don't really want to be here for much longer. Anyway.  Sorry for boring you all,       Jeremy

[69charger2002]

The govt does care insofar as the economy is concerned and how it reflects on them and that's why both sides of congress and the White House will soon be passing another phony stimulus package pretty soon to "boost" the economy wth another short term "shot in the arm." The money will either be spent or saved and the "boost" will end as fast as it started. Don't get me wrong, I want my money back, but it's just a crock of you-know-what if anyone thinks it's going to do any long term good. IMO I hope the American consumer continues to put the strangle hold on the businesses of America until they figure out that their prices are too high. They also need to figure out that it's probably not a good idea to pay some lame-a$$ white collar executive more than Shaq makes to sit on his brains and lay people off for three years before getting fired himself and taking a huge severance package to his next white-collar executive assignment where he will repeat the process. Big business has been gouging us for too long, and I don't mean with tax exemptions. Too many people think higher taxes is what they need and that's pure BS. The govt raising taxes has never solved any real problems. We as consumers should punish big business by keeping our money, paying down our collective debt and making them pay for pricing everything in this country based on the wages of two-income households. We should also make them pay for making 70% of their products in China and for fostering a debt-happy populus and for allowing oil companies to get too powerful and for trying to make us suppliment their bottom line during Christmas, Easter and Valentine's Day. Screw them, they charge too much and it's about time some of them withered on the vine. I'd rather buy my fuel and food from the farmer and barter for the rest.

lol i'll admit i agree with most of what you said. well spoken. sad fact is america is too dumb to come up with a scheme that has to be so collective to work. there will always be 7 figure overpaid executives that really kill "profit margin" of big companies, and they do nothing to earn that salary except stay at the first company enough years to get up the scale.. of course my money isn't in the stock market too much anyway, what do i care? lol.. i make sure to stay out of debt at all costs. even if i did make $9.50 an hour, i wouldn't be in debt if at all possible. but regardless of what companies do there are always some people who make $9 an hour but live like they make $25 an hour, and that just doesn't cut it no matter how much inflation rises.. c stripes, i know that isn't you, don't think the comment is directed to anyone in particular.
trav

[RallyeMike]

The govt does care insofar as the economy is concerned and how it reflects on them and that's why both sides of congress and the White House will soon be passing another phony stimulus package pretty soon to "boost" the economy wth another short term "shot in the arm." The money will either be spent or saved and the "boost" will end as fast as it started. Don't get me wrong, I want my money back, but it's just a crock of you-know-what if anyone thinks it's going to do any long term good. IMO I hope the American consumer continues to put the strangle hold on the businesses of America until they figure out that their prices are too high. They also need to figure out that it's probably not a good idea to pay some lame-a$$ white collar executive more than Shaq makes to sit on his brains and lay people off for three years before getting fired himself and taking a huge severance package to his next white-collar executive assignment where he will repeat the process. Big business has been gouging us for too long, and I don't mean with tax exemptions. Too many people think higher taxes is what they need and that's pure BS. The govt raising taxes has never solved any real problems. We as consumers should punish big business by keeping our money, paying down our collective debt and making them pay for pricing everything in this country based on the wages of two-income households. We should also make them pay for making 70% of their products in China and for fostering a debt-happy populus and for allowing oil companies to get too powerful and for trying to make us suppliment their bottom line during Christmas, Easter and Valentine's Day. Screw them, they charge too much and it's about time some of them withered on the vine. I'd rather buy my fuel and food from the farmer and barter for the rest.

Something tells me all the people working for "Big Businees" and need their jobs would not be happy with your plan.

[1969chargerrtse]

The only way to make more money is to do good work and move around.  The old days of being dedicated and staying with a company are way long gone.  You need to go out there and research and ask around and ask other dealerships.  Think about other departments and what they make and what it would take for you to get in that position?  Always keep moving but make sure it's up.  I'm in the elevator trade.  It's a dangerous business in ways but not really if you pay attention to what the dangers are or what your doing.  I was making a lot less, I asked a car buddy what he did as a living and he told me of this trade, and I did what ever it took to get in it and I'm so glad I did.   It was hard to get in it, and I worked with some of the biggest jerks at first, but now I'm on my own as a service tech and really like what I do and it pays well.  Look around , move around, don't give up.  Your as good as you make yourself but by human nature you will be taken advantage of, you need to go where you are better appreciated by what they pay you, not tell you.  Good Luck and never give up and stay positive.

[nh_mopar_fan]

I know.  There is nothing we can do.

Get an education.

[hemihead]

Chalk it all up to one ever present factor - GREED . If someone has a million dollars , they want 2 . Businesses want everyone to believe that the guy working the assembly line or doing the menial labor is what is making everything cost more . If his wages go up , then the price of a product goes up twice that amount just so the company makes more profit . I think some of these white collar people need to live in the real world for awhile . Cut their wages , benefits , and perks. Make them accountable for every hour of their working day and have a Boss breathing down their neck everytime they stop to take a breather from their job they are doing . Education is a good thing but you need to get a break along the way also . And in the world of everyone for themselves , that break is hard to find . Too many greedy people out there who would kill their mother to get ahead . I honestly don't know how some people sleep at night .  If you come up with a better idea to be more productive or save the company money all you get from your boss is a pat on the back and then your boss takes credit for the idea . Nice  , isn't it ? And people wonder why the world is they way it is .

[rusty lee]

I work for a union we get a raise every year guaranteed.

[RECHRGD]

I am working on getting a better job. As for what have I done to benefit the company. Lets just say that I have done allot. We used to need a crew of 8 people to get the cars done. Since I have been in the position I am. I have lowered it to 3 full time and two part timers. The cars get detailed and put on the lot faster. The quality is better (My boss is always telling me that). and we do more now than we did two years ago. I figure were I cut out 5 full time jobs and turned them into two part time jobs. I should get something. Its hard to be happy when you see the guys up in the office that do no labor. Just come in 3 to 4 days a week and work out issued making over $5k every two weeks when I am back there busting my balls. Finding cheaper chemicals and cutting down labor costs and they don't give me shit. The only reason I am still there is because it will look good on my next resume that I was a manager of a department for 2 years. The worst part is when they keep promising you things and they never come. Its always talk to me next week, Talk to me next week etc.. Speaking of next week. The manager that works on the other side of the detail shop is doing a shitty job and will be loosing his job next week. He does not know that yet but because they are going to put me in charge of his crew also. I know. So now instead of having only 4 people under me. I will have 9. I am guessing no raise. But at least it is job security. Right now I think it will be hard for people to get jobs.
The reason I was saying anything about the gov. Is they need to figure out how to make our $$ quit dropping in value. Or It would be nice if the could slow down all the price inflation. I know a few people that can only afford their housing and live on mac and cheese. It's only going to get worse. Right now I am doing OK. I am just worried for the future. I also don't realy want to find a new job here as I don't really want to be here for much longer. Anyway. Sorry for boring you all, Jeremy

C_Stripes, It appears that your "boss" recognizes that your doing a good job.  He tells you so and is putting you in charge of more people.  But, you don't say that you've approached him seriously about your lack of a raise given your performance and amount of time on the job.  If he keeps putting you off, before looking for a better place of employment, write him a letter or an e-mail.  Tell him that you've been past any probationary period for a long time and would like to be re-evaluated based upon your performance.  Detail the cost savings that that the company has seen since you took over the department and that you're now expected to take on more responsibilities because of your good work, thus providing additional labor cuts and savings.  I'm sure you know about what these people were making that are now no longer on the payroll.  Put a dollar value and percentages of cost savings versus your loss of income due to inflation over time to it.  You can bet that he is taking credit the increased efficiency with his higher-ups.  Do not sound angry, just layout the facts and tell him how much you enjoy working with the company and hope that you will have a long and mutually benefitial relationship.  Give him a date and time that you want to meet and leave it at that.  If you still get the runaround then start looking for another job, but my bet is that he knows a good thing when he has it and will take care of you.  Getting more education, as mentioned before, is always a good idea, but not everyone is cut out to be an executive or brain surgion.  Bob

[tkkruzer]

why is it that you want the Gov. to supply you with more money? why not get out and start your own business, and make the kind of money you want?  if we want the Gov. to supply our every need then we had better be ready to surrend more of our rights. if you want more money , get the Gov. out of the business of micromanaging things and you will see things get more affordable. just my humble opinion. thanx,,,,Tom

[bull]

Something tells me all the people working for "Big Businees" and need their jobs would not be happy with your plan.

Doesn't really matter if they're always being downsized anyway. Besides, it's not my job to keep them employed by buying iPods and Cheetos.

[hutch]

With me its taxes.  My property tax has gone up year after year where I live.  This current year of 2008 the county jacked it up another 100 bucks a month on my home and then they gave themselvs a pay increase.  I make good money and my boss gives us 4% every year plus a bonus when he can and its great.  But whats the point.  My family would be better off if I could just keep more of the money I make but the local govenment would rather take more of it so they can all live better.

I think our local, state and federal governments need to back the fuck off when it comes to just taking what they want and then spending what they want.  I work hard for my money and I need it to put food on the table.

[Brock Samson]

This sure touched a nerve in me... 
First thing is, I hate it when folks come up with a one line solution, Like "get an education", that blows,.. 
Do you know how many PhD are compeating for the same B.S. jobs?.. Today due to Affermitive Action Quotas "Young Women Of Color" and Job Applicants with friends in High Places, have the upper hand in the job market, make no mistake.
I live in one of the most competitive job/real estate markets in the world, and have seen first hand the effects of N.A.F.T.A. And the last few administration's handing the balance of power to the Major Corporations,.. they are WORLD based and not just U.S.Corporations anymore and so as the repercussions of this shift have resonated throughout the GLOBAL economy,.. we all will feel the effects. I sure did when in one year (2005) after 27 years as a loyal employee, my Cost Of Living jumped nearly 20% yet my pay was cut 12%, and my vacation was cut by a week, and i lost 4 sick days, and two holidays, and had to pay much more for my health benefits, and lost two co-workers meaning I had to pick up the slack and my union which had fought many decades for the previous gains?.. sold out my job classification to ensure the higher classification's stability, if only for the short term. So don't think that unions are the answer either... cause they'll throw you to the dogs when push comes to shove...
We are living in a time and location of lowerd expectations, the sooner we adjust by whatever means, the better we'll cope. I know unions are weak and corporations are strong and I'll have to find my own solution/s with God's help.
rant off.

[SFRT]

I decided 22 years ago I never wanted to have a boss again, and struck out on my own. I started small ( I'm talking 300 bucks and no car) and worked my businesses from the ground up. Over the years there have been ups and downs but the end result has been great.

I am a high school drop-out, btw, and the only advantage I ever got was 4 years military training. best 4 year education you can get IMHO...and I got paid to learn.

'wage' labor is a trap. it keeps you down.

you want high costs of everything? try living in San Francisco Ca. its insane.

[Ponch ®]

Look, komrads...the government this, the government that. You guys get pissed off and start crying about Big Brother when the government does something you don't like (like making some cars subject to smog regulations, or outlawing certain weapons). But as soon as you're in trouble, then the government is the panacea to all your problems and its not doing enough.

We live in a free market economy, which is already overregulated as it is. What you some of you guys are advocating is a form of welfare state (as if it wasn't bad enough already), and redistribution of wealth. Move to Cuba...I hear over there they don't have rich people.

[SFRT]

Castro does OK.

[Charger_Fan]

I work for a union we get a raise every year guaranteed.

And that's just wrong. Not to slam you personally, but a raise should be something earned, not something automatically received because you've managed to keep breathing & punching the time clock for another year.

Then there's my current situation...if I don't go begging for it when I think I'm due, I'll be ignored. Employees here don't get annual evaluations, it's just handled with "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" approach. The brown nosers in the company can get raises without much problem...I don't brown nose. I don't get raises often. You'd think I'd work somewhere else by now, huh?

SFRT, out of curiosity, what's your business?

[SFRT]

I have had a few..started out doing designs for tshirts and posters for music venues, then eventually set up a a press, then a shop, then it sort of morphed into a flatprinting silkscreen shop, which then sort of grew into a design and printing shop..then I started releasing vinyl singles for obscure bands and printed the covers then that grew into a full on record label and print biz and design biz...then I started designing toys and stuff and sold off the print and label end to concentrate on just design and now I am manufacturing (again)and designing 'art toys' and clothing and stuff. I also have a small fabrication shop ( sort of a side business) where I make 'museum grade'  1/6th-1/15th scale 1 of a kind vehicles ( mostly ww1 and ww2 armor and some sci-fi stuff) for rich guys who collect that sort of thing.

at one point I had like 20 full time employees,and was 'completely vertically integrated-design,manufacture, wharehouseing, sales and distro) but that got to be a real hassle so a few years ago I decided to 'semi-retire' and now its basically just me and 1 part time person and all the other stuff gets farmed out to larger toy companies and ditributors. So my 'volume' is really large, but I dont deal with it anymore.

[C_stripes]

OK. A few things,
1. Thanks for the advice.
2. I have been asking for a raise about every week.
3. I was NOT blaming the government. I was saying that they should step in and help. If our wages keep going down and the cost of everything keeps going up. Then even people like PONCH will go broke.  So try not to read things that are not there.    But I do agree that they need to watch why they decide the need more money and decide to tax us so that they can get a new car.

Also.  At work today, They fired 5 people.  No notice.  Nice of them huh?   

[Brock Samson]

' know how they say "a picture is worth a thousand words"?..

[nh_mopar_fan]

This sure touched a nerve in me... 
First thing is, I hate it when folks come up with a one line solution, Like "get an education", that blows,.. 
Do you know how many PhD are compeating for the same B.S. jobs?.. Today due to Affermitive Action Quotas "Young Women Of Color" and Job Applicants with friends in High Places, have the upper hand in the job market, make no mistake.
I live in one of the most competitive job/real estate markets in the world, and have seen first hand the effects of N.A.F.T.A. And the last few administration's handing the balance of power to the Major Corporations,.. they are WORLD based and not just U.S.Corporations anymore and so as the repercussions of this shift have resonated throughout the GLOBAL economy,.. we all will feel the effects. I sure did when in one year (2005) after 27 years as a loyal employee, my Cost Of Living jumped nearly 20% yet my pay was cut 12%, and my vacation was cut by a week, and i lost 4 sick days, and two holidays, and had to pay much more for my health benefits, and lost two co-workers meaning I had to pick up the slack and my union which had fought many decades for the previous gains?.. sold out my job classification to ensure the higher classification's stability, if only for the short term. So don't think that unions are the answer either... cause they'll throw you to the dogs when push comes to shove...
We are living in a time and location of lowerd expectations, the sooner we adjust by whatever means, the better we'll cope. I know unions are weak and corporations are strong and I'll have to find my own solution/s with God's help.
rant off.

Yeah, whatever. The simple and indisputable fact is that for the overwhelming majority of people an education means high income, higher standard of living and a better life. So yeah, maybe "get an education" is overly simplistic. But, it's also damn good and proven advice.

[dkn1997]

I have been a laborer, top level skilled technician, and manager.  I have sort of seen both ends of the general work food chain.  more the lower than the upper, though.  Here are a few things that I have learned, sir, that I will pass on to you and maybe it will help:

1. Nobody helps you but you. Don't count on the gov't, union (don't get me started on that one), or your boss/company to do it for you.

2. It's not even worth the time getting mad at the company or the boss for not paying you what you consider to be enough.  Let your actions speak for you and get another job lined up.  Then go in and let them know, politely, that while you like working here, you cannot continue to do so at the curent wage.  If they say no, then give the 2 weeks notice and work the full 2 weeks unless they tell you not to. 

3. Don't burn your bridges.  You never know when you may have to ask for your old job back because the new one sucks worse (I am going through this now, but my old employer was very happy to have me back partly. because I showed my integrity by busting my ass up until the moment my 2 week notice period ended)

All of this works very well if you do the things that nobody else generally will today:  Don't complain, show up every day, work as hard as you can and do what you are told and ask questions when you don't know something. 

If you combine extremely hard work, a polite manner, and balls enough to pick up and leave if you feel yourself hating your job or salary, then you will go very far.  The balls part is very effective if you put yourself in a position where they are screwed if you leave because they know they cannot get anyone else who works like you do and who they can count on. 

I am not the smartest guy by any stretch of the imagination, but everywhere I ever worked, I always worked the hardest and went to some pretty nutty lengths to get jobs done.  It has served me pretty well and I can honestly say that I would be welcome back at any employer that I have worked for in the last 20 years.  That's no joke.

The big ugly secret in the work world today is that employers are dying for people who show up every day and don't bitch and moan constantly.  That's all you need to do, you don't even have to be particularly good at what you do.  When you are reliable, you totally seperate yourself from the rest of generation "x box" whose only goal in life is to sit on mommy's couch and conquer guitar hero. 

[hemihead]

Funny how all the white collar people people hate the Unions but you NEVER hear anything about breaking up Unions like the Actor's Guild , Teachers Unions or ( Lord Forbid ) the NFL , MLB , NBA , or NHL PLAYERS UNIONS . People complain about some guy who makes $20 / hr. doing an honest days work on an assembly line but think nothing of a half educated athlete making $10 MILLION a year playing a stupid kids game . In fact , most people worship them .
And why is it when any mention of taking money from the rich , the rich right away cry communism and want less government interference ? Then , when the Banking and Real Estate markets take a dump , they want the Government to help . What about the interference that the Government ran when they sued the Tobacco companies ? I am not one for much Government control of any kind but is it asking to much for a little justice ? Wasn't anyone raised with any morality or compassion ?

[69CoronetRT]

I have been a laborer, top level skilled technician, and manager.  I have sort of seen both ends of the general work food chain.  more the lower than the upper, though.  Here are a few things that I have learned, sir, that I will pass on to you and maybe it will help:

1. Nobody helps you but you. Don't count on the gov't, union (don't get me started on that one), or your boss/company to do it for you.

2. It's not even worth the time getting mad at the company or the boss for not paying you what you consider to be enough.  Let your actions speak for you and get another job lined up.  Then go in and let them know, politely, that while you like working here, you cannot continue to do so at the curent wage.  If they say no, then give the 2 weeks notice and work the full 2 weeks unless they tell you not to. 

3. Don't burn your bridges.  You never know when you may have to ask for your old job back because the new one sucks worse (I am going through this now, but my old employer was very happy to have me back partly. because I showed my integrity by busting my ass up until the moment my 2 week notice period ended)

All of this works very well if you do the things that nobody else generally will today:  Don't complain, show up every day, work as hard as you can and do what you are told and ask questions when you don't know something. 

If you combine extremely hard work, a polite manner, and balls enough to pick up and leave if you feel yourself hating your job or salary, then you will go very far.  The balls part is very effective if you put yourself in a position where they are screwed if you leave because they know they cannot get anyone else who works like you do and who they can count on. 

I am not the smartest guy by any stretch of the imagination, but everywhere I ever worked, I always worked the hardest and went to some pretty nutty lengths to get jobs done.  It has served me pretty well and I can honestly say that I would be welcome back at any employer that I have worked for in the last 20 years.  That's no joke.

The big ugly secret in the work world today is that employers are dying for people who show up every day and don't bitch and moan constantly.  That's all you need to do, you don't even have to be particularly good at what you do.  When you are reliable, you totally seperate yourself from the rest of generation "x box" whose only goal in life is to sit on mommy's couch and conquer guitar hero. 

      

Great post!

[SFRT]

I have some deeply ingrained habits that have served me well over the years:

1. NEVER use credit. It's a trap and kills future potential

2. Multiple income sources. Even when I had 'regular jobs' I always had 2 or 1 and some sort of side gig to make extra cash.

3. Avoid complexity.

4. Get up earlier than everyone else. Get there sooner than everyone else.

5.The Government...I leave it alone, it leaves me alone. They just want money, so I have always been super uptight about taking care of the paperwork and the taxes, while using every possible legal loophole to pay the minimum. Never been audited in 20 plus years of doing corporate and individual filings. Correct paperwork.prompt payment.

6. Not afraid to fail. You win some, you lose some. Learn from the failures, then forget them emotionally.

my dumb

[nh_mopar_fan]

I have been a laborer, top level skilled technician, and manager.  I have sort of seen both ends of the general work food chain.  more the lower than the upper, though.  Here are a few things that I have learned, sir, that I will pass on to you and maybe it will help:

1. Nobody helps you but you. Don't count on the gov't, union (don't get me started on that one), or your boss/company to do it for you.

2. It's not even worth the time getting mad at the company or the boss for not paying you what you consider to be enough.  Let your actions speak for you and get another job lined up.  Then go in and let them know, politely, that while you like working here, you cannot continue to do so at the curent wage.  If they say no, then give the 2 weeks notice and work the full 2 weeks unless they tell you not to. 

3. Don't burn your bridges.  You never know when you may have to ask for your old job back because the new one sucks worse (I am going through this now, but my old employer was very happy to have me back partly. because I showed my integrity by busting my ass up until the moment my 2 week notice period ended)

All of this works very well if you do the things that nobody else generally will today:  Don't complain, show up every day, work as hard as you can and do what you are told and ask questions when you don't know something. 

If you combine extremely hard work, a polite manner, and balls enough to pick up and leave if you feel yourself hating your job or salary, then you will go very far.  The balls part is very effective if you put yourself in a position where they are screwed if you leave because they know they cannot get anyone else who works like you do and who they can count on. 

I am not the smartest guy by any stretch of the imagination, but everywhere I ever worked, I always worked the hardest and went to some pretty nutty lengths to get jobs done.  It has served me pretty well and I can honestly say that I would be welcome back at any employer that I have worked for in the last 20 years.  That's no joke.

The big ugly secret in the work world today is that employers are dying for people who show up every day and don't bitch and moan constantly.  That's all you need to do, you don't even have to be particularly good at what you do.  When you are reliable, you totally seperate yourself from the rest of generation "x box" whose only goal in life is to sit on mommy's couch and conquer guitar hero. 

Nice! 

We now return you to the whining about how unfair the world is, already in progress.

[Brock Samson]

 relevent and well written:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2008/01/21/onthejob.DTL

excerpt:

"Recently, it was brought to my attention that my personality sucks. Or rather, something more aggressively tepid than sucking. At the keg party of life, my personality is a plain tortilla chip that falls behind the couch and years later is swept away by a bored landlord.

That was the good news. The bad: I needed to do the hard work of improving. This was not just so I could enjoy being less of loser. No, it was for a very specific reason — the reason that had brought me to the offices of Peggy Klaus, author of the forthcoming "The Hard Truth About Soft Skills: Workplace Lessons Smart People Wish They'd Learned Sooner," and the workplace communications expert who'd shown me the errors of my ways. I came to Klaus because I was going to ask my editor for a raise for this column, and I wanted to learn how."

[Mike DC]

 

If you lower the poor's costs of living (instead of raising the MW) then both sides win.  The businesses don't get driven to hiring more mexicans & more outsourcing.  And the poor have a little more incentive/ability to earn their own living & better themselves. 

IMHO we should take money away from social programs for the poor and dump it into trying to cheapen the poor's basic living expenses. 
 

[hemihead]

If you lower the poor's costs of living (instead of raising the MW) then both sides win.  The businesses don't get driven to hiring more mexicans & more outsourcing.  And the poor have a little more incentive/ability to earn their own living & better themselves. 

IMHO we should take money away from social programs for the poor and dump it into trying to cheapen the poor's basic living expenses. 
 

Another plus would be that the poor could buy the businesses products keeping more people working .

[twenty mike mike]

The Gov. should make it mandatory to give us all a raise of some sort.

The government doesn't set the prices of goods and services, why should it control wages?

Sounds like Shrillary is your candidate, since she wants the government to run everything, including how you raise your children, where you live and what you eat.  Have fun in the new United Socialist States.

[hutch]

You know that income tax on personal income does not cover very much at all of the federal government.   its just a way to keep people down.  its less than 10% of the total tax income the federal government takes in.  I would have 1000's in my pocket each quarter if I did not have to pay that crap.

none of what you pay in Federal tax goes to education, roads or the military or fund food stamps.  its used to fund studies on how goats have sex or studies on the growth cycle of mice.

They just burn the money we give them.   It needs to stop.

[Mike DC]

 
It's usually not popular to say this, but IMHO the military needs as much cutting as anything else you could name. 

The DOD has already made a lot of progress in this area compared to past decades, but IMHO there's still a long way to go.  We'e got many billions of dollars in never-used hardware all over the earth, and yet our recent military activities have been short all kinds of basic necessities.   
   
 

[hutch]

 
It's usually not popular to say this, but IMHO the military needs as much cutting as anything else you could name. 

The DOD has already made a lot of progress in this area compared to past decades, but IMHO there's still a long way to go.  We'e got many billions of dollars in never-used hardware all over the earth, and yet our recent military activities have been short all kinds of basic necessities.   
   
 

Yep, I love our boys and girls in uniform as much as the next guy, but we are back to the age of the million dollar hammer like we were in the 80's.

They need to cut spending all around and give us more of our money back and then you will see the auto industry and construction industry come back big time.

[The70RT]

I agree with the one's saying it is all about getting an education. My son just graduated with a bachelor's degree in business & management a month ago and already landed a 50,000 a year job. I will never make that much....too much playing when I was young..........oh well the wife is back in school to support my bad habits 

[Mike DC]

 
The education is good with the SEVERE qualification that you get educated in something that's in real demand. 

Plenty of schools are all too happy to take your $80,000 and give you a degree in advanced d*ck scratching.

 

[TK73]

 
... and give you a degree in advanced d*ck scratching.

Where do I sign up??

[hemihead]

 
It's usually not popular to say this, but IMHO the military needs as much cutting as anything else you could name. 

The DOD has already made a lot of progress in this area compared to past decades, but IMHO there's still a long way to go.  We'e got many billions of dollars in never-used hardware all over the earth, and yet our recent military activities have been short all kinds of basic necessities.   
   
 
[/quote

Yep, I love our boys and girls in uniform as much as the next guy, but we are back to the age of the million dollar hammer like we were in the 80's.

They need to cut spending all around and give us more of our money back and then you will see the auto industry and construction industry come back big time.

Which Auto Industry , the Japanese that everyone raves about ? No thanks , they can spend what they need to to keep me safe .

I agree with the one's saying it is all about getting an education. My son just graduated with a bachelor's degree in business & management a month ago and already landed a 50,000 a year job. I will never make that much....too much playing when I was young..........oh well the wife is back in school to support my bad habits 

$ 50000 a year is good but what is his Student loan payments ?

[dkn1997]

....4. Get up earlier than everyone else. Get there sooner than everyone else.....

I forgot to add that one.  That is such a great thing to do.  Especially if you get made a supervisor.  I have worked for bosses who don't show up as early as me and I did not like it at all!!

[The70RT]

....4. Get up earlier than everyone else. Get there sooner than everyone else.....

I forgot to add that one.  That is such a great thing to do.  Especially if you get made a supervisor.  I have worked for bosses who don't show up as early as me and I did not like it at all!!

I hear ya. We have 3 on our staff other than the boss and we all get there before him.........everyday. I will be glad when he is gone so we can all fight for his job.

[Vainglory, Esq.]

Don't you realize that if the government forced an increase in salary for everyone every year, they would simply be mandating accelerated inflation?

I'd say duh, but apparently common sense doesn't apply anymore.

[hemihead]

As much common sense as it takes to lay off blue collar workers that assemble a product that makes you money and keep 1 CEO that takes $100 Million in profits and does nothing . Or for the government to bail out subprime mortage holders who borrowed money for houses they couldn't afford just to keep up with the Jones .

[Vainglory, Esq.]

Propaganda non sequitur.

Colonel Mustard called.  He said: "get a clue."

[dkn1997]

Don't you realize that if the government forced an increase in salary for everyone every year, they would simply be mandating accelerated inflation?

I'd say duh, but apparently common sense doesn't apply anymore.

if your situation is not to your liking, YOU change it. don't wait for the gov't to step in for you. 

[The70RT]

Don't you realize that if the government forced an increase in salary for everyone every year, they would simply be mandating accelerated inflation?

I'd say duh, but apparently common sense doesn't apply anymore.

I don't think things can get much worse. At least we would have the raise. Teachers get less pay than the jobs they are teaching for.......go figure! Common sense? Our gornment doesn't believe in that  In the mean time give every american a bonus so they will spend it....like that is gonna fix anything. Most people that are gonna get that bonus are spending all there paychecksto make ends meet anyway.

[694spdRT]

Some things to ponder. Who in the government is going to decide what people get the wage increase and when? Is the pay raise going to based on a percentage of income or fixed amount? Where is the cutoff point on earnings or is there one? Is it just people who are paid hourly or salaried too? Does it matter what the cost of living is where you are? If an employer offers benefits or retirement plans do they have to pay the same amount or not? What about the type of work you do? Is the government going to establish mimimum wage standards and increases for every type of employment?  Will employers then be forced to start every new employee at the bottom of this pay scale regardless of experience because they know a mandatory pay bump will now be imposed regardless of an employees worth?

I understand people wanting/needing better pay but I just don't see that setup working even in the best of senario's.

[defiance]

I've gotten a raise nearly every year since starting here, and that's without a degree.  At least in this company, it's all about hard work. 

Now, having said that, here's a little story about how important education is, to those of you who are arguing that it's not.

I was hand-picked for my current position because I did excellent work in a project that involved a director who is now my boss.  However, when he tried to hire me in, HR would not permit it because, on paper, I was not qualified.
In the end, he forced it through, but he had to convince his executive VP to get involved.
I'll tell you right now, I was LUCKY.  No matter how good your work is, most people will still never stumble upon someone who will be that much of an advocate.

First thing I did after that was get my degree

Having said all that, I'll admit that, at least for me, the degree did not provide any actual value as far as quality of work.  Furthermore, I think degrees and experience should both be used as a PROXY for determining the work capabilities of an individual IF direct knowlege with that individual's work in unavailable - using detree and experience as the primary measure if you know what the person can do is just stupid.  However, ANY company with an HR department - and many without - is going to be the same way.  If you don't look good on paper, that's it.  And besides, most times you apply for a job, the hiring manager won't know you anyway.

So yeah, education may not be all that helpful in your actual job, but it's still VERY important in getting it.

All the above, of course, is IMO

[Vainglory, Esq.]

Don't you realize that if the government forced an increase in salary for everyone every year, they would simply be mandating accelerated inflation?

I'd say duh, but apparently common sense doesn't apply anymore.

I don't think things can get much worse. At least we would have the raise.

Yes, you'd have the raise, but it wouldn't buy anything more.

Okay, here's how it goes: 1) an apple costs 50 cents.  Then 2) the government gives every single person a raise so that they earn $10 an hour up from $5 an hour.  Then 3) the price of an apple goes to $1.  Why?  Because money is not fixed to anything.  Prices are signals to the market that a given good or service is worth a given amount of labor and expertise.  This is why a hamburger in 1950 cost 10 cents and costs a dollar now.  Think about that, and then ponder this.  $10 million in Zimbabwe is worth $4 American.  If everyone is a billionaire, then being a billionaire means nothing.

If the government could fix everything by giving everyone more money, why wouldn't we have done that 200 years ago?  The printing press at the U.S. mint is not the answer.  It's only the means to more inflation.

[Brock Samson]

I think we all realize that John, the O.P. (Original Poster) was just venting, I can feel what his intent actually was, and, to hear the spirit of his words rather the the letter of the law... (not "to follow the letter of the Law but the spirit of the Law."  is the actual quote)
In anycase: we all need to improve our condition. financially, materially, spiritually - whatever. and yes even educationally,..
I want to add that myself I am not against education by any means, though there are other ways to achieve it without acquiring extra letters after your name. And i would never argue against or disparage anyone for entering into a pursuit of a higher education for whatever reason, I simply have a problem with one word solutions, like some are only too quick to offer up, without examining the "Spirit" of the complaint. I'm reminded of the scene from the movie the Graduate where the well intentioned but insensitive relative says to the Main protagonist played by Dustin Hoffman, I have one word for you,..
                                                                        Plastics".             
A college education is fine, but by it's self will not put food on the table, neither will Govt. Assistance or any other simplistic verbal broad brush solution.
I know a lawyer who makes six figures a year and has for several years but still owes over $600 K between his School debt alimony and child support.
In my Opinion not everyone is suited to a PH.D. or Section Eight housing or Govt. Cheese.
But costs are spiraling up, it's soon cost eight dollars to cross the Golden Gate Bridge and many other examples of exponentally growing inflation. It may be fine if your earning in the top grossing percentage, but how about for single moms?..
Further education or retraining may well be appropriate, but let's ask some more insightful questions to help the poster solve the problem without going in with the Nukes... 

[Mike DC]

I don't like the MW's buying power where it is right now but I don't think raising it will help anything in the big picture.  The US is already gushing low-end jobs all over the place because most worldwide labor prices are a fraction of what they are here.


IMO it just costs way too much to live here no matter where you are on the income chart.  If you make decent money, then the gov't taxes 1/3 of it away and you still end up pretty poor. 

If you make a low-end wage, then you still make better money than most worldwide poor people.  And you also don't lose much money to taxes.  However it's impossible to live much cheaper than the decent-money people do here, so you're still just as poor as ever.