Fast 1/4 mile car

[Moparer]

I own a 71 charger 500 with a 383 and since owning it I have put on a fair amount of performance parts and my best 1/4 mile time is 15.9 @ 85 mph. I have a so called "friend" with a GMC cyclone that he claims runs 12's in the 1/4 and he assurers me there is no possible way my car could ever beat his and I would love to prove him wrong. I plan on completely rebuilding the motor over the winter and am open to ANY suggestions that will help me beat him. I also am planning on puttint  390 gears in the rear end to help me get down the track better.

[Mefirst]

I think the best bang for the dollar is to build a 440 stroker with Edelbrock heads, mek. camshaft, etc... There are a couple of guys here who built 496cid strokers and those engines produce quite easily such an amount of power that you'll blow the doors of your buddys GMC...

Then again you also have to do some work on the car suspension if you want to get the car to haul ass down the track.. High engine power alone does not make a fast car...

-It also comes down to how fast do you want to go and how much money are you willing to spend on your car???

/Tom

[Ghoste]

Never mind what the magazine tests report, I'm also curious to know if your friend has any real timeslips to show that HIS Cyclone with HIM driving has achieved 12's?

[70charger_boy]

The fastest time I've seen on a cyclone is 13.349 sec at 96 mph
http://www.dragtimes.com/GMC-Syclone-Timeslip-6427.html

[Moparer]

I'm sorry I forgot to say that my charger has a 383, are there stroker kits available for it still and what kind of suspension mods would you recommend? No my friend has never been to the track in his truck, all he does is talk about all the cars he has raced on the street on beat so bad. I really don't believe him but either way I still want to know that my car will hand him his ass when we get to the track in the spring.

[moparguy01]

if he's never raced his truck he wont hit 12's. maybe high 13s or low 14s. thats pretty easy to do with a streetable charger.

get it up around 9.5-10:1 compression with a good cam, you have to match the cam to the converter and everything else. but you could pretty easily make that time.

[Ghoste]

Yes, there are stroker kits for the 383.  Also, before the big day comes be sure you go to the dragstrip and practice.  Go on a tune and test day and just make run after run to get used to what's going on and how the lights work.  It isn't as easy as a lot of people think and guys like your buddy usually discover the hard way that women are the only greater ego crushers than a dragstrip. 

[Moparer]

Yes I will defiantly be going to at least one test & tune to make sure I can nail the lights and get the car set up. Do you know what company makes a stroker kit for a 383 and also what kind of heads, pistons, and crank do you recommend?

[aifilaw]

www.440source.com

has kits for the 383 and they come highly recommended around here.
Until some new ones come out I believe the list as far as performance vs price in order of the best to worst is as follows from what people run with the rest of the setup being in stock locations.

Edelbrock performer heads
indy EZ heads


spend your money on the heads, that's where the power is made, choose your cam wisely and keep the rest of it in mind and what you want to do with it, run that whole scenario out in the form of a question in detail and you can get a lot of answers here.

[Moparer]

I put a purple stripe cam in the motor when I changed the intake manifold and went to a all MSD ignition, should I stick with it or change it? With the edelbrock heads is there anything I should change or just leave them the way they are? What kind of suspension modifications do you recommend?

[aifilaw]

to start off with, there is pretty much a better cam out there from any other vendor besides the mopar purple lineup, their grinds are extremely outdated, and make good power but only if you design the head flow around them, which never happens. depends on the intake. edelbrock heads can have the valves widened, and a lot of porting done, but they don't yield more than about 10% greater power potential with even the most extreme porting, so they are fairly maxed out... unless something has changed in the past couple years since I looked at them.

Suspension depends on how you drive, but I certainly suggest a much larger torsion bar, front and rear sways, and complete set of much better shocks to start, unless your dragging, in which case upgrade the rear leafs, put in ladder bars and a pinion snubber and your done.

[Moparer]

First off I want to thank everyone for all the great advice, I know its really going to pay off at the track !! Also should I change to roller rockers or some other kind off better preforming rocker and I am currently running a edelbrock dual plane intake manifold with a Holley 750 double pumper should I stick with those or should I upgrade to something else?

[Ghoste]

If you are going to stroke, then the upgrade to a roller rocker is a "might as well, you've gone this far" decision.  Which Eddy manifold is it?  Some are good, some are less than good.  The carb is a good choice.

[Moparer]

Its the dual plane preformer

[Moparer]

I am also wondering if the trany will be sufficient to handle all the new power I have 727 torque flight with new TCI performance clutches, a 2800 stall converter and a B&M shift kit its only got 5000 miles on it. If its not going to be able to handle the power what should I change?

[Ghoste]

The Performer is junk.  The Performer RPM is a good intake.  Your 727 should be able to handle it but of course it depends how far you go.

[Mean 318]

The Performer is junk.  The Performer RPM is a good intake.  Your 727 should be able to handle it but of course it depends how far you go.

You are better off keeping the stock cast then going with the performer... junk! The RPM is the best bet, got it on the 440.

[aifilaw]

the performer is a design based on a chevy engine and modified to fit a mopart, and poorly designed at that. Enough said. I agree with the others

[firefighter3931]

The Performer is suited to a very mild build. The small runner design will make lots of torque but it will choke the engine down up high. The 440 performer is notoriously poor allthough the 383 manifold isn't that  bad. A 1in open spacer between the manifold and carb would help it make more top end power yet still maintain good torque due to the dual plane design. Short stroke 383's need all the help they can get so a dual plane isn't allways the wrong choice....especially in a heavy car.

Headers, a good cam and some solid engine tuning would really wake it up. The 3.91 gears would be a huge bonus....that would be my first upgrade. 



Ron

[firefighter3931]

Further to the 383 intake manifold question ; Here's a good thread to read for head to head comparisons of several manifolds on a mild 383. Basicly a stock type build with unported heads but a healthy solid cam.....this is a race grind that would not be considered very street friendly. The Comp MM lobes are super agressive and not typical of what most of us would run on a street/strip type build. There will be an article coming out soon in Hot Rod, complete with dyno results ! 


http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=3734062&page=0&vc=1


Here's a cut and paste from that thread with some of the more popular manifolds listed :

Street Dominator
3,000: 381, 217
4,000: 449, 342
6,000: 395, 452

Torker
3,000: 395, 225
4,000: 455, 356
6,000: 397, 454

Perf RPM
3,000: 408, 233
4,000: 457, 348
6,000: 392, 448

DP4B
3,000: 419, 239
4,000: 454, 346
6,000: 387, 442

Performer
3,000: 418, 238
4,000: 452, 344
6,000: 382, 436

Six Pack
3,000: 413, 236
4,000: 459, 350
6,000: 391, 447



The Performer held it's own and i'd be willing to bet an open spacer would have helped the power numbers up top. 

Look at those TQ #'s at 3000 rpm....the Performer is kicking azz compared to the single plane SD & Torker.




Ron

[Moparer]

WOW thank you all so much for all this great feed back so far I cant tell you how much I appreciate it! So after re viewing everything I have heard and seen so far I believe that I'm going to go with the 383 to 496 stroker kit, edelbrock heads, roller rockers, the performer intake with my Holley 750 double pumper, track bars and 3:91 gears for the rear end. What kind of pistons should I get with the stroker kit to get the most compression and complement all the other parts in the motor and what cam do you recommend and is there anything else that it sounds like I might be forgeting?

[R2]

I would follow along with Ron's (firefighter) advice,,,,he is pretty sharp on nailing a combo the first time around,,,,and with motor upgrades,,,nothing is cheap,,,so its good to get great advice up front,,,,to avoid the headaches later........... RON = 

In my Charger,,,,i have a 496 stroker in a 440 block,,,ported Edelbrock heads,,,M1 intake,,,holley 850 DP,,,,solid cam,,,compression is 10.75:1,,,,,dana,,,410 rear,,,,with super stock springs,,,,,, runs on PUMP gas only,,,,,and runs in the 11.50 range at 119 MPH with "lots" of slippage off the line,,,,,,, "your results may vary".....
Good luck with your car............
Doug

[firefighter3931]

WOW thank you all so much for all this great feed back so far I cant tell you how much I appreciate it! So after re viewing everything I have heard and seen so far I believe that I'm going to go with the 383 to 496 stroker kit, edelbrock heads, roller rockers, the performer intake with my Holley 750 double pumper, track bars and 3:91 gears for the rear end. What kind of pistons should I get with the stroker kit to get the most compression and complement all the other parts in the motor and what cam do you recommend and is there anything else that it sounds like I might be forgeting?

Moparer, The performer would be fine on a mild 383 but it would be inadequate for a 496ci type build. I assumed you were asking about performance for your current build and not a stroker application. 

Based on the latest info you would definately want a better intake....something along the lines of an Edelbrock TM6 with an 850cfm double pumper to feed all those cubes. 


Ron

[Moparer]

Yea sorry about that I meant to say the performer RPM but if you think the TM6 is a better choice then I will defiantly go with it, but other then that do you think I have included everything else? The only thing I'm still not sure about is the cam, should I get one from 440 source with the stroker kit and have them match it or does someone make something better that I should use.

[firefighter3931]

Yea sorry about that I meant to say the performer RPM but if you think the TM6 is a better choice then I will defiantly go with it, but other then that do you think I have included everything else? The only thing I'm still not sure about is the cam, should I get one from 440 source with the stroker kit and have them match it or does someone make something better that I should use.

Personally, if i was building a 500 cubic inch street motor it would be based on a talldeck 440 block. There are numerous reasons why this is a better choice ;

(1) better rod ratio
(2) less side loading of the cylinder walls
(3) taller pistons will be more stable in the cylinder
(4) the engine will last much longer


A 4.25 crank in a lowdeck (383-400) block is primarily a race motor....not the best choice for a street type build, inmo. 



Ron