"NEW" Power Disc Brake Master Cylinder?

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Have I stumbled onto some breaking news or has this been hashed before?  If so why was'nt I told about it?

The story goes.....

Some might remember my saga of my power brake conversion for my 69.  Gathering all the "correct" parts (booster, linkage, MC, lines etc) took a while because the booster & master were slowly becoming made of "unobtanium" and were hard to get.  After about 3 months of searching I found the correct A1 Cardone rebuilt booster & MC.
  Opening my #10-1475 Cardone box revealed a nice 1/01 rebuilt Bendix 2226821 master cylinder.  Long story short after fighting to try and get the crappy cap & lines to seal on the crappy 40+ year old casting I wound up stripping the threads in the master for one of the fittings.  The threads were pitted pretty badly & it was just a matter of time.  Returning the master to Cardone for an attempt to retap the threads with no luck......now what?   I have a $50 paper weight.

On a whim sporadically I'd try to reorder the master from all the big online suppliers (Rock Auto, Parts America, NAPA etc) get the confirmation email, then get the rejection email a day later saying they are out of stock & cannot fulfill my order......until last week.   for the hell of it I made my rounds & tried NAPA.  Got the familiar confirmation email.  Waited for the rejection email but WOAH!  I got a "your item has shipped" email!  Crikies!  What piece of crap MC did they send me instead of the correct one?

Heres what I got.....

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Looking at the box, the first thing I see is the black "Made in China" label.
Opening the box I was floored to say the least.  On the underside of the flap the words" New Unit" was stamped & sure enough this was a BRAND NEW Casting!

The following is a comparo pictorial of an original Bendix 2226821 & the new "copy"

1.Side by side pics (only visual difference is the large, hokey bail that is supplied & the plain, no lettering cap
2. Rear side by side
3. Piston diameter New
4. piston diameter old

You can see the diameter of the pistion of the new one is a teeny bit smaller but the bore is the same size on both.   I just attribute the smaller size to a truer shape (the old one was nicked up a bit

[Brock Samson]

  that's nice,..  Congrats!  the mounting plate looks a bit wider and it's built by child slave labor but hey 
i actually have noticed alot of folks givin mine a really close look  at shows and i'm allways amazed that they care... 
is that cause they are so rare/hard to get now?..

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

More....

1. pic of bottom old & new.... piston retaining screw is same diameter & in same location
2. close up of date stamping.... did I get # 258 made in 4/07?
3. pics of wells....notice the beefier walls & laser flat sealing surface?  No leaks there
4. another

The overall dimensions are exactly the same all over.  The threds are new & crisp..... Looks like a great repro


www.napaonline.com   get 'em while they last!

Sadly I think I will wait to install it.  Carlisle is coming fast & my current master is working perfectly for now.....

[GreenMachine]

   I have a '70 and was just in the market for a master cylinder and my local Napa ordered one for me and a rebuilt one arrived like yours. My lines are on the left side of the master so I couldn't use it. I had them cross reference the part # on my old one and it showed for 71-up. Are 68 & 69 different from '70?

[Chatt69chgr]

Now all they need to do is make the correct 69 power booster.

[resq302]

Wow.  Thats great to hear.  I have one all torn apart and was waiting to send it out and have a stainless steel sleeve put in.  Maybe I will just get this as a spare since it is a new unit.  Nice find!

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

   I have a '70 and was just in the market for a master cylinder and my local Napa ordered one for me and a rebuilt one arrived like yours. My lines are on the left side of the master so I couldn't use it. I had them cross reference the part # on my old one and it showed for 71-up. Are 68 & 69 different from '70?

It shouldnt be.  AFAIK power disc brake cars up to '70(with the exception of Hemi engines) have the lines exiting the master on the engine side

[GreenMachine]

   I have a '70 and was just in the market for a master cylinder and my local Napa ordered one for me and a rebuilt one arrived like yours. My lines are on the left side of the master so I couldn't use it. I had them cross reference the part # on my old one and it showed for 71-up. Are 68 & 69 different from '70?

It shouldnt be.  AFAIK power disc brake cars up to '70(with the exception of Hemi engines) have the lines exiting the master on the engine side

   Oh, OK, makes sense, my car was originally power drums. My old master cylinder was one that came with the kit. Thanks.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Yes power drums is a totally different master with the lines entering on the fender side

[Mfr426]

And a flat sealing edge? What a concept!

Nice find. What did that cost Chris?

Mike

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

$46 to my door

[Mfr426]

That would be a good investment as a "hot-swap spare"....

Just ordered mine. I'm hoping for a new unit as well.

NAPA has always been a great source when the normal channels dont have what you need.

[resq302]

Just got mine in today and it is a NEW unit as well.  Thanks for the heads up Chris.  Now I have a spare also.   Mine is also stamped 04-2007 and #258 above it.  Wonder if #258 is the casting number for whatever company repro's them.  According to NAPA at the store where I got mine, they said that everything is reman'd by A1Cardone so maybe Cardone is now making castings of stuff?

[Mfr426]

Got mine today too. Same number as well.

Four months ago I could not source anywhere now I can order from my lazy boy.

Nice find Chris!

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Good deal guys

master cylinders for everyone!

[Mfr426]

What I want to know is how the hell did that "new unit" stamp catch your eye? I have the same thing.

This is really, really cool! I'm putting mine this weekend. I want to get it powder coated (vs. paint) if I can...

[Dodge Don]

Someone at the Napa warehouse is going "what the hell"? Sudden run on them.

[Mfr426]

Just talked to my powder coating guy and he says that powder coating no workie on master cylinders...

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Nope....unless you take it apart so the seals wont melt...

[resq302]

I was going to say, if you remove the guts which really isnt that hard, why can't he powder coat the whole thing?  Might hold up to brake fluid better and probably wont have the cap get scratched from checking the brake fluid.

[Mfr426]

He said that brake fluid breaks down the coating. He's tried it before and the parts came back with the coating coming off...

[HeavyFuel]

Someone at the Napa warehouse is going "what the hell"? Sudden run on them.

Yeah, pretty much...I just got mine today. 

[resq302]

He said that brake fluid breaks down the coating. He's tried it before and the parts came back with the coating coming off...

Thats the problem I am having with using POR-15 on mine.  It basically wrinkled it up off of the metal.

[Mfr426]

Yeah, POR15 wrinkles right off any surface that it does not like. Learned that the hard way...

[y3chargerrt]

DOT 5 DOT 5 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Mfr426]

Who is this DOT lady?

[resq302]

DOT 5 DOT 5 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thing is about DOT 5 is that there are some rubbers that are not compatible with it and will swell causing the part to distort or not function like it should.  Also, if a system is operating properly, it should not leak causing that problem.  DOT 3 and 4 will absorb moisture so it does not cause rusting of the internal parts.  DOT 5 will NOT absorb moisture and allow the internal parts to start rusting.  Personally, I would rather flush out the DOT 3 or 4 every so many years than to have to worry about what moisture is collecting or rusting out the insides of my brake system.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Im sure with this sealing surface leaks wont be a problem.  Spray bomb away I say! 

[Chatt69chgr]

My take on the DOT 3&4 brake fluid is that its basically hygroscopic, ie, it absorbs water and as the water is dispersed throughout the total volume of the brake fluid in the system it is exposed to all the iron surfaces in the system and slowly begins to rust them.  This appears as a mud in the system.  It does take time and if you flush out the system every couple of years I don't think you would have to worry about the rust issue.  And you always want to pull the fluid out of the system preferrably with something like a Vaccula which is a device that creates a small amount of vacuum by way of compressed air.

DOT 5 fluid being silicone based is not misable in water.  If any water does get in the system it would tend to just sit in one place.  It could rust out that place.  I've seen this happen in antenna connectors like the ones that were used for CB radios on car roof tops when the connector was packed with silicone grease.  Any space not filled with grease could capture a water droplet and corrode the diecast antenna base connector.

Which is best?  I don't know.  Both are used extensively.   

[Charger_Fan]

Nice find Chris, thanks for sharing the info & comparison pics!
The only bummer is that it's yet another thing that's made in China, but beggars definitely can't be choosers in this case.

My take on the DOT 3&4 brake fluid is that its basically hygroscopic, ie, it absorbs water and as the water is dispersed throughout the total volume of the brake fluid in the system it is exposed to all the iron surfaces in the system and slowly begins to rust them.  This appears as a mud in the system.  It does take time and if you flush out the system every couple of years I don't think you would have to worry about the rust issue.  And you always want to pull the fluid out of the system preferrably with something like a Vaccula which is a device that creates a small amount of vacuum by way of compressed air.

DOT 5 fluid being silicone based is not misable in water.  If any water does get in the system it would tend to just sit in one place.  It could rust out that place.  I've seen this happen in antenna connectors like the ones that were used for CB radios on car roof tops when the connector was packed with silicone grease.  Any space not filled with grease could capture a water droplet and corrode the diecast antenna base connector.

Which is best?  I don't know.  Both are used extensively.   

That's what I've known to be the case, too.
I'll also add one more thing...DOT 3 & 4 are supposed to attract moisture at such a rapid rate that you want to make sure you don't leave your M/C cap off any longer than possible. Especially on a humid day. It will wick up moisture pretty rapidly.

   I have a '70 and was just in the market for a master cylinder and my local Napa ordered one for me and a rebuilt one arrived like yours. My lines are on the left side of the master so I couldn't use it. I had them cross reference the part # on my old one and it showed for 71-up. Are 68 & 69 different from '70?

That sounds about right. My brakes were swapped from a '71 Satellite, way back when. The '71 & later disc M/C's look like this.
Pardon my dirt, I haven't cleaned in oh...15 years or so. 

[resq302]

 :rofl:Nice heat stove you got there.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

.  The '71 & later disc M/C's look like this.

Yep, thats what I have on the car now....I had to resort back to this one because my first "correct" one crapped out on me

[Charger_Fan]

:rofl:Nice heat stove you got there.

Thanks!   It worked fairly well, but the damned carb still used to ice up on some rainy days.
I finally had the intake boiled out, to uncork the exhaust crossover...that fixed it.


Geez Chris, yours looks so much better than mine for some reason.

[Mfr426]

I just put on the new MC. I replaced the rebuilt one that I got from National about 4 months ago.

All is good and my car now stops like a disc brake car should. Incidentally, disregard the "new and improved" brake bleeding sheet that comes with the new MC. I tried that (again) today the first time and my brakes went to the floor. I pulled out the MC, did the bench bleed procedure (with lines running from fittings into the reservoir) and they worked perfect. So much for "new and improved" technique...