Is the Mopar Market Softening?

[h76]

Do you guys think the Mopar Market is in the beginning stages of a slight decline/recession-or am I completely wrong?

[Charger1973]

I dont think its limited to Mopars.  Money is tight all over right now. 

[PocketThunder]

I dont think its limited to Mopars.  Money is tight all over right now. 

Yep.     and its gonna be that way for the rest of the year.   So hold onto your cars and drive them if you can afford the gas

[41husk]

I agree! I don't believe it is a sign of the car market as much as the economy in genneral.  The next few months may be the time to buy your dream car.

[nakita7]

This is nothing.

Right now everybody's house has gone up, interest rates are good, jobs are plentiful. People have all these 'equity' loans, buying boats, cabins and overpriced Mopars. Just wait till all the good times change. Not trying to be a prophet of doom, just a realist. What goes up, comes down. No rocket science here. Everything is cyclic. Personally, I would think twice before I went hoarding Hemi cars when times are good....

[Shakey]

 

However, things are already starting to change, at least up here North of the 49th.

I just renewed my mortgage two weeks ago and the rates my neighbours are getting are 3% different than what I got.  There are far too many people in this town that are living beyond their means.  I personally think this is good as we're also looking at homes and we've seen one drop $17K and another one drop $31K in the past three weeks. 

My Mopar is back on stands as I've got lots of work to do, I have no plans of selling it and no plans on buying another right now.  Everything is falling into place.   

[Mean 318]

Looking at the prices of parts... I don't see a change! Maybe the price of restored cars is dropping

[hemi-hampton]

Nakita7, What State & Town do you live in? I need to move their where everything is so great? LEON.

[pettyfan43]

The market is due for an adjustment. It simply can't keep climbing like it has been for the past few years. I read something that makes sense. when the new Challenger debuts, expect the market to take a hit, particularly where project cars are concerned.

A lot of people who have projects are going to take a step back and come to the conclusion that they can buy a Hemi Challenger with a Warranty, killer sound system and new car reliability with Muscle car looks and attitude and they are gonna take the leap. That very well could lead to an influx of builders and projects.

[JimShine]

Nakita7, What State & Town do you live in? I need to move their where everything is so great? LEON.

No kidding! My brother had to relocate 1000 miles to get a job. Though I guess there are plenty of minimum wage jobs around if you can afford to live off that.

[Charger1973]

The market is due for an adjustment. It simply can't keep climbing like it has been for the past few years. I read something that makes sense. when the new Challenger debuts, expect the market to take a hit, particularly where project cars are concerned.

A lot of people who have projects are going to take a step back and come to the conclusion that they can buy a Hemi Challenger with a Warranty, killer sound system and new car reliability with Muscle car looks and attitude and they are gonna take the leap. That very well could lead to an influx of builders and projects.

Or it might spark more interest in Mopar muscle and no one can afford an overpriced new car so they go looking for a project car.   

[JimShine]

I would suspect if they can't afford new, they probably can't afford the gas to run an old ark. They would probably be looking at a couple year old car to get them by.

[69charger2002]

my personal opinion is that we are going through a leveling off period more than anything. they (mopars in general) are still super hot, but many of those people who "had to have one from childhood" have now found their car, and the few that are looking now are the few 18 year olds trickling into the mopar hobby that can't afford much, or late 20's 30's type people who are finally able to squeeze in a project car between life, kids, job etc..
i don't expect a decrease unless the economy crashes, but i don't expect them to be double what they are now in 5 years either
trav

[Dan T]

However, things are already starting to change, at least up here North of the 49th.

I just renewed my mortgage two weeks ago and the rates my neighbours are getting are 3% different than what I got.  There are far too many people in this town that are living beyond their means.  I personally think this is good as we're also looking at homes and we've seen one drop $17K and another one drop $31K in the past three weeks. 

My Mopar is back on stands as I've got lots of work to do, I have no plans of selling it and no plans on buying another right now.  Everything is falling into place.   

Yes, alot of people are living beyond their means. I was talking to a co-worker of mine who recently  bought his 1st house, a big one I might add, and put as little down as they would allow him. He told me how much his mortgage was and I really have no idea how he sleeps at night.
As far as my mopars are concerned, I could care less what they are worth. My Dart was purchased for $300.00 back in '78 from someone who used it to deliver chinese food with it.
In my opinion, these cars have been overpriced for the last 10 yrs or so.

[bmoparmofo]

Things definetly arent so great in Michigan, the big three layoffs etc...my house has lost about $20,000 in the last year or so.People leaving the state etc... On a bright note, my taxes still went up.

[Badbob]

Things are great in the northwest, our house which cost $28,000 in 1977 is now worth $300k. I have a great job at the county and they are building a huge new county maintenance facility where I can spend the rest of my career. The Boeing plant right down the road will be rolling out the new 787 Dreamliner next month. Nothing but opportunity out here if you can stand a little gray weather once in a while. With all the new Charger sheetmetal coming out, especially full rear quarters I am going to get excited about the old free blue numbers matching 383 4spd sunroof 69 Charger and get busy again, I've been playing with Harleys lately. I have been tempted to unload the Coronet but I'll keep it and the Duster for a while yet.

[Lurker]

Do you guys think the Mopar Market is in the beginning stages of a slight decline/recession-or am I completely wrong?

i don't think its just the mopar market, its all markets and i think whats happening is 5 years ago (give or take a few years ) consumerism was at its peek and people were at the mercy of the manufacturers and manufacturers etc realized that and started marketing products with flashy advertizing etc and just now more and more people are realizing that just because its got the best TV spots and best looking commercials it might not be the best and they might not really need it. for example a friend of mine bought a sunfire his first year in college and drove it 2 years untill he got out of school, now he has a job and took his 2 year old sunfire in to trade it off on a new car and was informed his sunfire was a writeoff.. less than 80k miles and zero body damage (it looked new still) because it would cost more than the car was worth. with the price of vehicles going through the roof people are being a little more selective and realizing that its not cost effective to turn new vehicles over every 2 years anymore because the market is flooded with junk thats 2 years old and worthless and costs way to much to replace.

[AKcharger]

I think it depends on location, up here in Alaska no one told anyone about a cooling muscle car market, here's what I checked into since I've been home (not really looking for another but if a good deal were to come along...)
- '73 Challenger OK shape with spot rust $15K

- 72 Charger front fenders were salvageable but would need every body part replaced plus engine and trans $1200
- 70 Challenger convertable 318 bare bones car, running but needs front fenders and rear qtrs replaced  $25,0000
- 71 Challenger SE, complete shell needs everything ex-race car with fiberglass front end $12000


Now I have scored some parts at a reasonable price - '68 steering column with VERY good ralley steering wheel - $80 and a 3:23 sure grip for $75

[nakita7]

The market is due for an adjustment. It simply can't keep climbing like it has been for the past few years. I read something that makes sense. when the new Challenger debuts, expect the market to take a hit, particularly where project cars are concerned.

A lot of people who have projects are going to take a step back and come to the conclusion that they can buy a Hemi Challenger with a Warranty, killer sound system and new car reliability with Muscle car looks and attitude and they are gonna take the leap. That very well could lead to an influx of builders and projects.

I never looked at it that way, but that makes sense too. Oh BTW, I live in the the best place in North America: British Columbia. Things are pretty good here, but not like Alberta. They've been booming like crazy for over 10 years.

[01MOPAR]

I myself wish the value would drop on the mopars ,I remember in the late 80's you could buy a nice  69 charger  for less than 7k  now you haft to pay $ 20-30 k for a nice mopar and not everyone has that kind of money to blow.I'll just sit back and see what happens and maybe pick one up priced right. 

[Ghoste]

I think it depends on location, up here in Alaska no one told anyone about a cooling muscle car market, here's what I checked into since I've been home (not really looking for another but if a good deal were to come along...)
- '73 Challenger OK shape with spot rust $15K
- 72 Charger front fenders were salvageable but would need every body part replaced plus engine and trans $1200
- 70 Challenger convertable 318 bare bones car, running but needs front fenders and rear qtrs replaced  $25,0000
- 71 Challenger SE, complete shell needs everything ex-race car with fiberglass front end $12000

Of course, asking and getting...

[Supercharged Riot]

i used to wine about how mopar prices were going up and out of my reach as I kept saving up year after year.  I gave up.  I still want a charger.  But Im expecting rising gas (and other things in general) prices to change everyones taste in muscle cars.

Nobody is selling chargers anymore. if they are, theyre overpriced (someitmes restored) cars.

My max price for a charger right now is 17-18K.  I cant find one for that much anymore. 

My favorite car, but any more than that.  I might as well buy a newer (faster) sports car

[The70RT]

I haven't noticed them going either way really. I know the cost of living is higher than hell right now.  Hopefully we will get at least a 5% raise this year. If I didn't buy my Charger 30 years ago I couldn't afford a nice one now. My taxes on my house has steadily risen in the last 10 years......but I have invested about as much.

[Ghoste]

Hemi Cuda convertibles and wing cars and ZL1 Camaros and things like that will continue to be blue chip with the hard core investor collector crowd but I think that overall things will soften somewhat.  Someone mentioned equity loans and that brings up a good point.  A lot of retiring boomers are financing the car of their dreams and there is a good reason they didn't buy one until now, they just didn't have the same passion that some of their fellow boomers did.   Everybody gives us the thumbs up in these cars and they all want one but many folks don't realize the amount of work that goes into owning one.  The mechanical demands, the time demands, the fuel demands, and the space in the garage are making many of the 401K purchasers rethink their decisions.  An interest rate bump will send a lot of people scrambling to find a for-sale sign.  There will be more cars on the market and prices will not be going up as crazily as teh last few years.
None of this is fact of course, it's all just my own useless opinion based on the tiny number of people I talk to, so take it for what it's worth.

[aone415]

Perhaps it's a correction in an overpriced, over inflated industry.  Thanks to ebay and especially Barrett Jackson many people believed that their 318 whatever was worth $30k.  As a result the asking prices of everything skyrocketed to obscene amounts and old rich guys gladly paind through the nose for just about anything.  Now despite the economy being in generally good shape, money is tighter and buyers and sellers are all being a little more realistic about what they should ask and pay for. 

It also appears that this market is tied to the housing market.  Boom in the housing market equals a boom in antique and muscle car sales.  Recession in the housing market equals a slowdown in sales.  It makes perfect sense when you think about it; people are not going to buy collector cars when interest rates and taxes are climbing. 

[Mike DC]

 
A Babe Ruth signed baseball is worth something like 100,000x the cost of the baseball & the ballpoint pen ink on it.   

Most (non-rare-factory-Hemi) musclecars are never gonna do that.  There's too many of the 318 cars out there, and too much of the value people have for them isn't linked to the vintage.  Too much of the musclecar market just wants a functional musclecar of any sort.  They won't care if 2/3 of it was manufactured in 2007 as long as it still looks & works like an original.  That puts a certain "ceiling" on the value.  IMHO the value of these cars is always gonna be roughly within sight of the cost of building a fucntional copy.  If it can be cloned for $35K, then I doubt it's ever gonna be worth more than $40-45K even if it's 100% original survivor. 


A few years ago I might have felt differently, but these days the reproduction industry is finally showing signs of producing MUCH BETTER sheetmetal and that changes things.  This new generation of repro metal is finally good enough to start attempting "open air" reconstruction of entire missing chunks of a car.  (You no longer have to cut up & use half of an original part just to make the repro work acceptably.)  That begins to nudge these cars out of the realm of "irreplaceable."

 

[BigBlockSam]

i've noticed that the big money cars have come down a bit but project chargers are hot. there holding up well . it's easier to put out $6000 then to come up with  $60000 . Rene

[kevink]

Well, I think that all the people with "ALL" the money has about spent all they want to spend on investments in classic cars. The stock market has rebounded. The company I work for had less than a $1.00 a share stock 3 years ago when it all went south. Today it is back to over $39.00 a share. I talk to a guy 5 years ago that all him and his partner were doing was going around and buying Mopars to store and sell at a later time when the market hit prime. Barrett Jackson and these other TV auctions leave a false sense of the market but, put the market at prime. You will see a small decline I feel but, just like the price of land, they are not making these old mopars anymore. As far as the new Challenger causing a decline in price, I don't think it will. There are still the people out there that had a 1968 Dodge Charger in High School that wants another now.

[41husk]

Yes Rene, but most people can't get them restored for under $54000.

[Mike DC]

As far as the new Challenger causing a decline in price, I don't think it will. There are still the people out there that had a 1968 Dodge Charger in High School that wants another now.

I disagree.  The new Challenger doesn't have to totally eliminate the demand for old cars just to affect it.  I don't think the Chally is gonna rewrite the Mopar hobby or anything, but I do think it will draw a small percentage of buyers away from medium-driver-quality musclecars.

The new Challenger probably won't make much difference in the project cars at all, though.  If you've got your financial sh*t together enough to be looking at buying & insuring a brand-new Dodge Challenger, then it stands to reason that you probably weren't considering any money-loser project cars for $4000 anyway.