Sox and martin bird pics

[THE CHARGER PUNK]

[Magnumcharger]

Why would a professional race team willfully choose to race a car that has to weigh at least 150 lbs more than a standard Roadrunner coupe?

[Aero426]

Why would a professional race team willfully choose to race a car that has to weigh at least 150 lbs more than a standard Roadrunner coupe?

I can understand why you'd ask the question, and it's a good one.    However, you forgot two important words, which explain most things.  Those two words are  "FACTORY SUPPORTED".

In the case of the Werst 5/50 Superbird, they actually added more weight to the back of the car. 

The factory wanted at least a couple of those cars out there.     

[69_500]

The would run a heavier car, due to the proportion of the weight. Weight isn't always a bad thing in drag racing, its the displacement of the weight.

[Brock Samson]

  i wonder if the better areo helped offset that weight though?..   

[Ghoste]

The car was built specifically to take out a specific Chevrolet that was causing problems for Chrysler in a certain drag class.  I forget the particulars now but I'll look them up.  My memory says that it was cheater car but it was successful in knocking the Chev off the ladder and then they wouldn't allow NHRA to tech the car, they just busted it out of there.  I believe the weight was needed to get into the class?

[nascarxx29]

[tan top]

The car was built specifically to take out a specific Chevrolet that was causing problems for Chrysler in a certain drag class.  I forget the particulars now but I'll look them up.  My memory says that it was cheater car but it was successful in knocking the Chev off the ladder and then they wouldn't allow NHRA to tech the car, they just busted it out of there.  I believe the weight was needed to get into the class?

yeh thats what i,m remembering ( ghoste) some thing like that  not sure if it was the sox car 

[Aero426]

Ray Allen's Chevy.   I know that story was attributed to the 5 and 50 Superbird.     I was going to call Herb McCandless last night about it, but I have lost his dang number. 

[nascarxx29]

A friend of mine..Was Jack Wersts chief back in the day .He currently owns and races a sox and martin duster.He told me some details about the 5/50 superbird.Which later became the Tosten Jennings superbird better known as the PHOENIX with a change of a paint job from the 5/50 paint scheme.Tail lights that weighed 150 LBS solid steel speaker shelf.Its sole purpose for being built was to beat RayAllens LS6 Chevelle

[Ghoste]

That's right, it was the 5 and 50 car.  Okay, so was the S&M 'Bird built to take on the same car?  They were both in that modified production class.

[THE CHARGER PUNK]

What do i spy???

[70charger_boy]

You would be correct sir

[Ghoste]

The window markings seem odd though.  Did S&M prep both cars? 

[69_500]

I'll have to do some digging, and Maybe GENE can chime in. but I think that there was a discussion about that above photo in a WW newsletter about 6 months ago. it was mentioned that it was another bird, but that it wasn't one prepped by the race team. Might have been someones actual Bird that was just in the shop that day. I don't recall will try to get time to dig it up.

[Aero426]

As I recall from the previous discussion it looks like a Daytona based on the angle of the wing.   Could have been a customer car, or anything. 

[THE CHARGER PUNK]

yeah but the other wing car u can see its rear tires and its wearing monster slicks on keystones as well

[Aero426]

yeah but the other wing car u can see its rear tires and its wearing monster slicks on keystones as well

Yeah.... so what.   Where are you going with this?     There was only one Sox Bird.

[THE CHARGER PUNK]

Oh ok

[Ghoste]

Well Chrysler said they only made two (S&M and Jack Werst) so unless someone supplies 100% proof that Buddy Martin purchased a 2nd Superbird out of his own pocket and did it up nearly identical to the other S&M 'bird except for a hood scoop and the lettering style on the side windows, I say there's one.

[69_500]

I'm still sorting through the stack of newsletters trying to find it. I know it was mentioned not too long ago, but then again not too long ago to me could have been 3-4 years ago in a newsletter. Sometimes I'm so forgetful.

I think your right though doug, on that it was mentioned it was probably a Daytona.

As far as the other comment, I'm going to stick with 99.99% sure it isn't another factory super stock Superbird.

[hemigeno]

As I recall from the previous discussion it looks like a Daytona based on the angle of the wing.   Could have been a customer car, or anything. 

I think your right though doug, on that it was mentioned it was probably a Daytona.

We've discussed that picture before, although it may have been on the old site - I don't remember when. 

HOWEVER, a few things are known:
That is definitely a Daytona wing and not a Superbird.  Not even any question about that.

The onus is on someone (ChargerPunk?) to produce evidence that there was ever more than the one S&M factory 'Bird.  Since the car in the picture is a Daytona and not a 'Bird, and all the recollections of those involved point to only one S&M 'Bird, I'd say the chances of any credible evidence to the contrary actually surfacing is about as likely as me believing the London Drug photo guy ruined those ModTop Daytona photos. 


If I remember the discussion about that car in the picture, it was said that the Daytona was probably Chuck Neely's car in for some tweaking and tuning by the S&M crew.

Sorry for the delay in chiming in...

Geno

[greulings]

Anybody have pics of the Sox & Martin bird after it became Superchicken, or after that?  Who owned it after S&M? 

Heard it was wrecked in the late 70's.  Anybody have hard facts on the car or where it was raced?

[Aero426]

I believe the trail goes cold at the Superchicken.   There are rumors of it being wrecked.  If the car were to exist in any form today, it would be a very major find.   People have been looking for this car for decades, so the chances of it being out there in hiding are slim, but possible.    The internet made the world a lot smaller.

I don't think there is any hard evidence to more than one S & M Superbird.

[nascarxx29]

Its suppose to be in LA

[Aero426]

Its suppose to be in LA

Most likely in storage with the King Daytona. 

[nascarxx29]

Reed in NE was looking for it

[pettybird]

Its suppose to be in LA

Most likely in storage with the King Daytona. 

It's at MCG headquarters so they can fabricate more irrefutable proof of its existence like the mod top daytona

[greulings]

Yeah, I've heard it's in LA, too.  Read an article once (moparmusclemagazine?) saying a guy had trouble with his girlfriends and was constantly moving the car to keep it away from them.

[greulings]

Anybody know when/where this pic of Jake King was taken?  Could that be the Sox bird before paint over his shoulder?  It's awfully close to the S&M rig.

[nascarxx29]

Maybe Hemi Fred at WWW.PROSTOCKHEMI.COM He was good friends with Ronnie and Diane he was also Jack Wersts crew chief back in the day and lives near me.He told me details about the Jack Werst superbird solid heavy tail lights 1/4 steel speaker deck to name a few legal cheats.Email is HemiFred@aol.com