Give me a parts list. WWCD? **Update on page 2**

[bull]

WWCD? What would Chryco do?

I need to put together a list of parts for the place that's going to rebuild my engine. Not only am I talking about specs I'm talking about brand names too. Seems they will use any part with any name you dictate so long as it all fits together performance-wise so I need you fellas to drop some names and specs, if you'd be so kind. It's going to be a 383 rebuild, basically to the 383 HP factory specs even though it was born a 2bbl 383 with the 290 hp rating. I'm not going to be racing other than the occasional light to light goofing around stuff. Basically I want pump gas compression with enough poop to get me and my family somewhat excited/frightened when I step hard on the gas. Also, just to confuse and irritate people, I may occasionally switch the aftermarket intake and carb to the original 2bbl and intake so I'd like everything underneath to respond well to both a 750 cfm 4bbl or a 2bbl with say 600 cfm, if that's possible. I'm not sure what the original cfm ratings were on the '68 Dodge 2bbl carbs so I'm just throwing that number out there. Anyway I need cam name and specs, piston opinions, compression ratios, carb and intake setups, the works.

Thanks.

[firefighter3931]

 

[cudaken]

 MP-1 P4529462 intake look's stock when painted.

MP P44527783 Cam, stock 383 /440 HP cam

MP P4452770 Roller Chain

Felpro 1214 Intake Valley pan with heat block off

MP Windage Tray P4120998

MP P4529101 Rocker Shafts (they ware out as well)

MP P4529476 and 477 rocker arm's (they all so ware out)

Stock HP exhaust Manafolds (only can be had used)

74 440 AC water pump, worth 5 HP

HP Fule Pump, I think a Carter look's stock

906 or 915 heads, Neil like's the 915 or 516's with bigger vales. Ported matched, some pocket work and 3 angel vale cut.

Have the block bored with plate's, till then you will not know what piston's sizes you will need.

God, make sure you have a blue printed deck height then have custom made push rod's. Maw Mopar was so bad about deck height it is unreal. Main reason they run like they could or where road kill.

74 400 Police Converter with the counter weight knocked off, cheap and 2400 stall.

Will not get into, or carb. My self I love MSD with either points (make sure you have it recurned and fresh) or electronnic (have it recurved as well) but most here like the MP stuff. I all so like the Holley 750 1310 but I know there is better out there now. What can I say, I am old.

Depending on the gears (did not say) that should get you into the 14's with 3.23 gear's and good tuning. Will but a smile on most of the people here that are not hard core speed freaks. If you neve went 14's, only sound's slow, does not feel that way when you are steering  

You all so never said how fast you wanted to go. Above should work sort of OK with the the stock intake but think some of the holes will run lean.

           What little I know.

                                         Cuda Ken

[8WHEELER]

This is the Mopar M1 dual plane intake I run, very little performance over stock intake
but being aluminum its easy to install    Running a Holley carb hides the M1 on
the intake, plus my coil is relocated about 1in forward and pointed a little different.

Dan

[bull]

Don't just sit there eating popcorn, Ron. Your opinion is valued.

[bull]

Ken,

I forgot to mention that I have a four speed, not an auto. How fast? Low 14s would be nice. High 13s would be nicer but I'm probably never going to know how fast it'll do the 1/4.

[firefighter3931]

Don't just sit there eating popcorn, Ron. Your opinion is valued.

Sorry Bull...was running late and didn't have time to post so i hit the popcorn smiley. I never used that one before so i just wanted to try him out  

Ok, here we go :

(1) block bored .030 over, finish honed with a plate, square decked, stress relieved
(2) crank polished or turned if need be and balanced
(3) speedpro pistons: 9.5:1 static compression
(4) Stock rods resized, magged and shotpeened
(5) ARP rod and main bolts
(6) 452 open chamber heads (unleaded fuel friendly) 3 angle valvejob with a 28* back cut on the intake valves
(7) Intake manifold : vintage dp4b edelbrock dual plane available used on e-bay and makes excellent power down low and up high. Looks stock with a little paint with no hood clearance issues.
holley 770 street avenger vac secondary carb. Easy to tune, electric choke for the cold morning starts
(9) hp manifolds with 21/2 mandrel bent exhaust system with x-pipe from tti. Super turbo mufflers from dynomax
(10) electronic ignition conversion from mopar performance : timing 15* at idle and 38* at 2500-3000
(11) cam : engle custom ground k56 intake lobe/k58 exhaust lobe ground on a 112* lsa. The wider lobe seperation will work better with a restrictive type exhaust manifold. Powerband 1800-6000 rpm
(12) MP heavy duty non adjustable rocker arms and chrome moly pushrods
(13) Valve springs matched to the cam from Engle
(14) high volume oil pump, windage tray and MP hemi 6qt oil pan with matching pickup


This combo should make an honest 400 crank hp and be a blast to drive. Good manifold vacuum and excellent street manners. Cam will lope slightly but won't be obnoxious to drive around or idle in traffic. Pop the clutch, drop the hammer and be prepared for lots of tire smoke !   You'll have the rustang boys seeing those pretty '68 taillights whenever you want to  

Ron

[cudaken]

 Reason I said use the stok HP cam is because you said you wanted to beable to use the stock 2 barrel intake. Thought you wanted to pass it off as a stocker.

If you want 13's then I would get some Hooker's or TTI Header's as well.

                                                 Cuda Ken

[Shakey]

I've heard Ron's engine recipe's are killer! 

I know of a fellow member that is getting his done as we speak.

I recall the conversation at Moparfest where it was said that it will be surprising if the car ('70 Charger 440-6) does not squeal at 50 km/h.

Can't wait to hear that car rippin' up the streets in Oakville. 

[694spdRT]

I think Ron's cam choice is a good one for you Bull.

I have the Engle K56/K58 on a 110 LSA in my 440 and love it. It has an idle that is a little healthy but, nothing that screams NON STOCK. The powerband is perfect for a street car with moderate gears. With my 4 speed and 3.54's I can be in 2nd gear at 30mph and it will light up the tires....granted I have 14" poly redlines so that maybe cheating.

I am also running a stock intake and exhaust system that have been ported some. With a smaller 383 I would bet the K56/K58 on a 112 LSA would act nearly the same in your car.

[bull]

Thanks Ron. Much appreciated. I wonder if my 383 has ever been bored? Hopefully if it's already at .030 it will clean up ok. I know zero history on the car other than the last owner let it sit for 6 yrs.

[bull]

Reason I said use the stok HP cam is because you said you wanted to beable to use the stock 2 barrel intake. Thought you wanted to pass it off as a stocker.

If you want 13's then I would get some Hooker's or TTI Header's as well.

                                                                         Cuda Ken

Yea, that's a big thing I have to consider. Since it's a rare combo (383/2bbl/4spd) I need to make sure the engine will accept the 2bbl intake and carb and still perform well. This brings up a question I've had for a while: what's the biggest cfm 2bbl out there? Is it possible to retain the stock look with a 2bbl intake and carb and still have all the parts Ron listed above?

[694spdRT]

Bull

Do you intend to use the factory "log" exhaust manifolds that the 383 2 bbl had or would you go with HP exhaust manifolds? The logs will limit your performance even worse than HP's.

[firefighter3931]

Bull

Do you intend to use the factory "log" exhaust manifolds that the 383 2 bbl had or would you go with HP exhaust manifolds? The logs will limit your performance even worse than HP's.

    

The factory logs are horrible and will choke that motor down.   You want at least a set of HP manifolds if you want to keep the stock look. The x-pipe works extremely well with manifolds because it pulls spent gasses out of the chamber and helps scavenging. Headers will make slightly more power on a combo this mild....but with the right exhaust i wouldn't be adverse to running the HP manifolds. I got them on my 440 6 pack 70 R/T and plan to use them when i "tweak" the combo some time in the future.

Ron

[firefighter3931]

This brings up a question I've had for a while: what's the biggest cfm 2bbl out there? Is it possible to retain the stock look with a 2bbl intake and carb and still have all the parts Ron listed above?

Holley makes a 2300 series 500cfm 2bbl. That is the biggest 2bbl carb that i'm aware of. Actually, the fuel economy will suffer with that carb because the venturi's are so large. It will work on the combo i outlined above....but power over 4500 rpm (or so) will suffer. The idle quality will be good enough to run that carb if you so choose.

Ron

[bull]

I don't really know what a 'log' manifold is but mine go up from the exhaust ports instead of down and the main body runs alongside the valve cover just like 8WHEELER's picture above.

As far as switching from 2bbl to 4bbl, I doubt I'll be using the 2bbl much if at all but in case I ever have to sell the car it will be more marketable if it can be returned to its stock form. Therefore I need a setup that doesn't take me too far away from the ability to return to the stock 2bbl and still have a decent running engine. Also, I hate to remove metal from the cylinder walls if I don't have to so if it's already at its original bore, and will clean up at that bore, I'll most likely leave it that way. Sorry if I'm being difficult.

[bull]

What was/is the stock cfm rating on the Carter 2bbl for the 383?

[Chryco Psycho]

I guess I missed this post while I was locked out of the site for a week or more
Rons advice is sound , I would use a Melling High Pressure oil pump , Clevite / Michigan 77 full groove brgs , windage tray , new good quality rod bolts  & main studs , & the L2295 F Speed Pro pistons

[cudaken]

 I think they where around 350 CFM, need dig out the book's. If your exhaust look like the one in the PIC they are stock HP's and work well till you go to a big cam and high CFM carb.

Like I said, there was a reason I posted about the stock HP cam. When I did DFS68 Charger his 383 was bone stock 383 HP engine. I had turly for gotten how well tuneda stock 383 HP ran till then. (sure right now he wished he left it stock)

I have never ran the cam's that Neil or Ron as listed. But you must decied something.

ARE YOU A HOT RODDER OR A BANKER?

Worried about resell, sell it now. You love the Charger and power, then throw that stock intake in the trash or some where you will not trip over it!

Good luck and make up your mind.

                                Old School Cuda Ken

Only cam's I have ran was Racer Brown soild cam in the 426 Maxie and MP cam's. But I am old.

[bull]

Well, nothing is going in the trash. Maybe the attic but not the trash.

[bull]

Any changes you'd make to these recommendations, Ron and/or Neil, seeing as how the block will most likely be bored to .040 over rather than .030? Also, it will probably be getting decked but I don't know to what depth yet. Hopefully they can retain my stampings on the dist. pad or go shallow so I can restamp what's there; and I think the compression can be maintained by head gasket thickness. Anyway, Ken is AWOL so I guess we won't be getting his update.

I'm taking the 383 in on Thursday to start the rebuild so any last minute ideas would be appreciated. Thanks!

[Dodge Don]

I've heard Ron's engine recipe's are killer! 

I know of a fellow member that is getting his done as we speak.

I recall the conversation at Moparfest where it was said that it will be surprising if the car ('70 Charger 440-6) does not squeal at 50 km/h.

Can't wait to hear that car rippin' up the streets in Oakville. 

Funny how "as we speak" is still ongoing 

Mike is correct, Ron designed my 440 six pack part by part. Around 500 HP. With 3.91 gears this should be fun whenever I get the fracking body back from the shop. 

Mike and I will be tearing up our town soon enough.

[bull]

I've heard Ron's engine recipe's are killer! 

I know of a fellow member that is getting his done as we speak.

I recall the conversation at Moparfest where it was said that it will be surprising if the car ('70 Charger 440-6) does not squeal at 50 km/h.

Can't wait to hear that car rippin' up the streets in Oakville. 

Funny how "as we speak" is still ongoing 

That's no joke. Did you happen to notice when I first started this thread?

[firefighter3931]

Any changes you'd make to these recommendations, Ron and/or Neil, seeing as how the block will most likely be bored to .040 over rather than .030? Also, it will probably be getting decked but I don't know to what depth yet. Hopefully they can retain my stampings on the dist. pad or go shallow so I can restamp what's there; and I think the compression can be maintained by head gasket thickness. Anyway, Ken is AWOL so I guess we won't be getting his update.

I'm taking the 383 in on Thursday to start the rebuild so any last minute ideas would be appreciated. Thanks!

Hi Curtis, the same build i suggested earlier will be fine, even at .040 overbore...that just changes the pistons and rings. Diamond racing has come out with 383 pistons but those are more expensive than the speedpro's but also lighter. If the speedpro 2315's aren't available, the diamond pistons would be a nice upgrade. 

On the cam, the Engle k56 single pattern would be fine. The K58 (exhaust lobe) would require some additional head work (guides trimmed down/shorter valve seals etc...) so if it's not in the budget just go with the K56 (non custom) off the shelf grind. I will however recommend a 3 bolt timing set.

HV oilpump and 6qt hemi pan with windage tray will take care of the oil system.

The only other change i would make is the carb. The 750 proform vacuum secondary street series carb is better than the 770 street avenger, inmo.

Keep us posted on your progress. 



Ron

[bull]

Thanks, Ron.

[suntech]

I saw that you suggested 9,5:1 CR Ron. Is´nt that VERY conservative?? Would´nt he be able to run at least 10:1 on pump gas, even with cast iron heads??
Just wondering, since that would live it up a little, and he is getting new pistons anyway.

[firefighter3931]

I saw that you suggested 9,5:1 CR Ron. Is´nt that VERY conservative?? Would´nt he be able to run at least 10:1 on pump gas, even with cast iron heads??
Just wondering, since that would live it up a little, and he is getting new pistons anyway.

Inmo, a 9.5:1 static compression ratio is safe for iron heads on a street build. You might be able to get away with a litlle more or you might not...why take the chance. The difference a 1/2 point compression would make is not noticable with that mild a build. 

Now with closed chamber aluminum heads, flattop pistons at zero deck and .040 quench you can safely bump it up another point. 

The Engle cam profiles do an excellent job at building cylinder pressure which equates to strong throttle response and torque. Once properly tuned and dialed in this will be a nice cruiser with lots of low end grunt and strong midrange power. 


Ron