Does anyone work for a bus company or into buses?

[GTX]

Some people think that we car nuts are really odd and some of us are but lately I've been toying with another crazy idea.
I've been thinking of buying a bus for a conversion, correction, I've pretty much decided. Yep, like a Greyhound, 40 feet long, 11 feet tall and 15-20 tons!

This comes for many reasons and after quite a bit of thinking and deciding that I must be quite insane now.
Is anyone else around here a busnut or does anyone have first hand bus mechanic knowledge?

I'm thinking along the lines of an MC-9 or maybe even a 102A3 but wouldn't turn down an Eagle for a good price.
If anyone else is into Mopar's and buses give me a shout - private preferred.

[TruckDriver]

Our moderator Chris does.

[GTX]

Really? I never knew. We should chat.


Oh Chris, paging Chris!

[TK73]

Doesn't Bull work with busses down in PortholeLand?

[bull]

Yes he does.

We have Flex Metro, Gillig and New Flyer buses in our fleet. The problem with buying a city bus (at least from us at TriMet) is that they're so old and worn out by the time they go to auction they're hardly worth dumping any money into to convert them to usable RVs. The feds are convinced (despite research to the contrary) that light rail is the way to go so we're still using buses built in the early '90s with more than a million miles on them (I'm not just throwing that number out there. I really do mean a million miles). I saw a news story a while back about some kid who stole a bus from a boneyard fleet in some other city and we were all surprised how nice that agency's boneyard buses looked compared to the ones we have on the road. I immediately thought TriMet should call that place and see about buying their junk to put into service in Portland.

You can check with your local govt. to find out when there might be an auction that would include transit buses and find out how old they are. The good thing about city buses is that the maintenance schedule is pretty strict. Since the feds help pay for bus buys we are required to maintain them on a very strict schedule. And if they are having an auction, try to get ahold of the maintenance dept. of that transit agency for some inside information and ask them which buses to avoid. All our buses are numbered and some of those numbers are notorious. They might also be able to tell you which buses have newly rebuilt engines, transmissions, etc.

[GTX]

Good info, aren't the transit buses geared lower for city use making them rather unsuitable for highway driving as compared to an intercity bus?
I'm also not a fan of the double doors like the MC-9 Jersey cruisers had nor a second mid entry door. I hear that they are loud, leaking air and a pain but I know they can be changed out...for a fee.

I'm a bit worried about old worn out fleet buses, especially ex 'hounds' since I hear Greyhound flogs the hell out of their fleet now and the MC-12's they are dumping out there are all pretty much junk although I'd like to get my hands on a 102 with an 8v92 and Allison auto. There are many places advertising MC-12's for 15k ( and up) and the prices are dropping but I'd be afraid to touch one of those.
I've heard nasty things about the Dallas auctions where all of the buses were really flogged and many needed to be towed off the property and many were sold for scrap.
I need to educate myself on what to look at and the weak areas including common corrosion zones on the MCI buses so I can make a decent choice when the time comes.  Also need to find me a good Detroit Diesel mechanic who can look the engine and trans over and help me make a solid choice there.
I have a couple of sellers in mind unless something better comes my way but need much more education and some more money before I am ready to commit to anything this large. The boss lady here finally gave me the ok though!

BTW, I have no doubts on the million+ miles.

[Lowprofile]

A friend of mine just picked up a coach similar to this one!  I'll see if I can get any specs. 

[Shakey]

Yes he does.

We have Flex Metro, Gillig and New Flyer buses in our fleet. The problem with buying a city bus (at least from us at TriMet) is that they're so old and worn out by the time they go to auction they're hardly worth dumping any money into to convert them to usable RVs. The feds are convinced (despite research to the contrary) that light rail is the way to go so we're still using buses built in the early '90s with more than a million miles on them (I'm not just throwing that number out there. I really do mean a million miles). I saw a news story a while back about some kid who stole a bus from a boneyard fleet in some other city and we were all surprised how nice that agency's boneyard buses looked compared to the ones we have on the road. I immediately thought TriMet should call that place and see about buying their junk to put into service in Portland.

You can check with your local govt. to find out when there might be an auction that would include transit buses and find out how old they are. The good thing about city buses is that the maintenance schedule is pretty strict. Since the feds help pay for bus buys we are required to maintain them on a very strict schedule. And if they are having an auction, try to get ahold of the maintenance dept. of that transit agency for some inside information and ask them which buses to avoid. All our buses are numbered and some of those numbers are notorious. They might also be able to tell you which buses have newly rebuilt engines, transmissions, etc.

I'm familiar with New Flyer & Gillig but I've never heard of Flex Metro.

I have heard about Flexible buses but they went under years ago.

Please tell me more about these Flex Metro buses you speak of.

[Shakey]

Prevost also makes a good highway coach.

[bull]

Yes he does.

We have Flex Metro, Gillig and New Flyer buses in our fleet. The problem with buying a city bus (at least from us at TriMet) is that they're so old and worn out by the time they go to auction they're hardly worth dumping any money into to convert them to usable RVs. The feds are convinced (despite research to the contrary) that light rail is the way to go so we're still using buses built in the early '90s with more than a million miles on them (I'm not just throwing that number out there. I really do mean a million miles). I saw a news story a while back about some kid who stole a bus from a boneyard fleet in some other city and we were all surprised how nice that agency's boneyard buses looked compared to the ones we have on the road. I immediately thought TriMet should call that place and see about buying their junk to put into service in Portland.

You can check with your local govt. to find out when there might be an auction that would include transit buses and find out how old they are. The good thing about city buses is that the maintenance schedule is pretty strict. Since the feds help pay for bus buys we are required to maintain them on a very strict schedule. And if they are having an auction, try to get ahold of the maintenance dept. of that transit agency for some inside information and ask them which buses to avoid. All our buses are numbered and some of those numbers are notorious. They might also be able to tell you which buses have newly rebuilt engines, transmissions, etc.

I'm familiar with New Flyer & Gillig but I've never heard of Flex Metro.

I have heard about Flexible buses but they went under years ago.

Please tell me more about these Flex Metro buses you speak of.

Flexible is the name, or Flxible. I don't know, we call them Metros. The company is kaput but we still have them. They are actually pretty good buses considering their age. Easier to work on than some of the new ones.

GTX, I don't think it's really the gearing as much as it is governed engines that keeps the buses at -60 mph. Most city buses I know of can easily be "repaired" to achieve greater highway speeds.

[Shakey]

We can ask Chris about what happened to Flxible.   

In Toronto, the TTC is still using GM buses that have been on the road since 1975.  These old beasts have been rebuilt from the ground up numerous times.  They lack some of the creature comforts that the New Flyer, Orion and Nova buses but are still solid workhorses.

I've had customers in town visiting and they see them and think that they've stepped back in time.

[GTX]

Prevost also makes a good highway coach.

Yeah and so does Setra but I doubt I'll ever own one of those any more than a Cuda 'vert.

I'd be really happy to have a 102:

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Yes its true I work for the NYC Transit.   I will also say & agree with others that you would NOT want to buy one of our old buses!   These things have been patched up & rebuilt so many times before they become available to the general public that I am amazed that they actually are still in one piece.

As far as our fleet, the only over the road coaches that we use that are any good are the MCI's..some depots use the Nova/RTS as well but the MCI is the biggest.

My depot (The Jackie Gleason Depot named after the TV show) uses strictly CNG (Compressed Natural Gas) powered buses Orion V, Orion VII low floor & New Flyer low floor.

I haven't worked personally on any of the "new" multiplexing & emission buses though.  As a supervisor I don't get much hands on anymore.   The only ones I have worked on were the old Grumman's, TMC's & RTS's with the 6V71 & 6V92 Detroit Diesel engines with blowers...non-turbo

Bull is correct on the gearing of the buses now a days.   Although the MCI's do have a different gearset, all it takes to "up the speed" is a keystroke on a scanner (Pro-Link)  Every parameter is computer controlled.  Our buses can do double duty if need be....and they do for trips to New Jersey & upstate NY for vendor repair (Atlantic Detroit Diesel)

What Mike is referring to about Flxible is the fact that the NYCTA has put numerous bus companies out of business in the past....they were a casualty as well.   NYC is so demanding of a bus that mostly a lot of companies don't want to sell the NYC....especially offer a warranty.   Just ask ADDA & New Flyer about that

Parts for the newer Series 50-60 stuff can become quite expensive as well.....$300-$400 for an O2 sensor  3k for a PSV etc...  granted these are emissions parts but they do fail....and quite often

[GTX]

Gee, it's not sounding encouraging to find a decent project. Do you guys who work with these think that's pretty much how all are?

Who do you see as the most common things that are wrong with these?
Are those MCI's pretty much beat as well?
I know that tons are out there on auction and private sales but I'm really Leary of how old and beat they likely can be. Personally I'm pretty scared of the auction buses since they seem to be the ones that are left over after all the better ones are bought by other operators, private dealers, parties etc. Pretty much the bottom of the barrel from what I've heard. I keep hearing of auctions where the buses are running large quantities of fluids out on the floor while being auctioned and won't start, air up or move.
Maybe at least the ones on private sales are less worn out?

[Charger_Fan]

This is one of the absolutely COOLEST buses I've ever seen.
I snagged this pic last year, after it sold at JB auction for something like 4 Million. So that means it's pretty damned rare, too.


Lots more info HERE, if'n you have lots of time to spend.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Our MCI's are fairly new late 1999's so it will be a while before you ever see one of ours on the block...

Our most common defect with our older models in the fleet is chassis damage/rot.   A lot of our RTS's were scrapped due to the bulkheads being severly rotted.  Salty roads don't help much here.

The newer fleet like the New Flyers & Orion VII's use Stainless steel components a lot to avoid this problem.   Lately we have been developing a lot os cracks in the welds though.

Drive train wise they are fairly reliable......like I said before emissions components can get pricey......

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Oh yeah....if ya need old parts you can check here

http://www.mta.info/nyct/materiel/cursales.htm

[GTX]

That thing is really cool! Where can I pick one up??

This is one of the absolutely COOLEST buses I've ever seen.
I snagged this pic last year, after it sold at JB auction for something like 4 Million. So that means it's pretty damned rare, too.


Lots more info HERE, if'n you have lots of time to spend.

[bull]

That bus looks like something the Rocketeer would drive. It's cool.

[Ponch ®]

This is one of the absolutely COOLEST buses I've ever seen.
I snagged this pic last year, after it sold at JB auction for something like 4 Million. So that means it's pretty damned rare, too.


Lots more info HERE, if'n you have lots of time to spend.

This one used to be parked on Ventura Blvd in Sherman Oaks for years - it was owned by a guy who owned a hair salon (go figure). Then a couple of years ago, it was parked a few blocks away from my house. I thought it looked cool, but I had no idea that it was such a rare/desireable thing until I saw it on the B-J auction last year.

[Dan T]

I'm a Transit operator in Mississauga Ontario (Toronto)
All of our buses are either New Flyer or Orion. Most have become low floor so that they are acceptable for the elderly & handicapped.
The oldest ones that we have now are 1991 models, soon to be replaced. Ours are used for both city and hwy applications. Although, at speeds of 55mph, the older ones don't feel very stable, and just plain suck in the snow.
I agree with Shakeys comment about the old GMC buses used in Toronto, it's like a timewarp to the '60's!!

[Shakey]

I'm a Transit operator in Mississauga Ontario (Toronto)
All of our buses are either New Flyer or Orion. Most have become low floor so that they are acceptable for the elderly & handicapped.
The oldest ones that we have now are 1991 models, soon to be replaced. Ours are used for both city and hwy applications. Although, at speeds of 55mph, the older ones don't feel very stable, and just plain suck in the snow.
I agree with Shakeys comment about the old GMC buses used in Toronto, it's like a timewarp to the '60's!!

You've got some new buses coming soon from Riverside, CA.  Twelve of them I believe.  Sometime in the late Spring.  These ones are new to you folks as it's my understanding that this will be the first ever delivery from this company.

[bull]

These ones are new to you folks as it's my understanding that this will be the first ever delivery from this company.

Oooo, scary. Guinea pigs for first-run buses.

[Shakey]

These ones are new to you folks as it's my understanding that this will be the first ever delivery from this company.

Oooo, scary. Guinea pigs for first-run buses.

no, no, no, the first delivery of this brand of buses to Mississauga Transit.

[Dan T]

Hey Shakey,

Looks like we'll have to get together and talk transit & Chargers!!