2009 Dodge Ram 1500 will get a Cummins Diesel!

[PocketThunder]

2009 Dodge Ram 1500 will get a Cummins Diesel!  Finally the exact truck i'm looking for.  I'm saving my pennies right now.

http://www.allpar.com/model/ram/2009-ram.html

"According to Automotive News, the Ram 1500's V8 Cummins turbodiesel will have about 260-300 hp and 460 lb-ft of torque, with gas mileage is likely to be about 20 mpg city, 25 highway (compared with the Hemi's 13/17). Acceleration is about 1 second longer 0-60 (9.6 seconds rather than 8.6 seconds) and is good even by car standards. (Remember, that's mileage similar to the Sebring)."

[shawnmd]

Finally, a half ton we can afford to drive everyday.

[694spdRT]

Finally, a half ton we can afford to drive everyday.

I will wait to see the price before talking about how affordable it is. Still is a move in the right direction though. 

[Troy]

Finally, a half ton we can afford to drive everyday.

Seriously, not picking on you - just using this as an example. Let me be the first to say that if you think you're gonna save money with the diesel then you're in for a shock! The diesel is like a $6,000 option isn't it? Diesel is still 60-80 cents more expensive than regular gas so you'd have to drive approximately 102,662 miles before breaking even (based on a Hemi getting 10 mpg vs 18 mpg in the diesel with a $.70 price differential). If you drive in the winter you'll most likely need some additives as well. My diesel costs more than my other 7 cars combined for insurance. The maintenance costs are higher as well considering it has a 2.75 gallon oil capacity and a $28 fuel filter that needs changed often. I spend ~$200 for every four oil changes if you add in the air and fuel filters and that's on Rotella T 15W40 and not synthetic. Once the miles start piling on, diesel replacement part costs get added into the equation. They are like Hemi parts - meaning the cost is approximately four times higher than the comparable gas part. Fuel pumps and injectors are good examples of this.

Now, if you *need* 600 ft/lbs of torque on a regular basis then there's no question about which engine to get. You just need to be prepared to pay for it. I made the mistake of overestimating the benefits and underestimating my usage before I bought mine so it's my fault I have a money pit. I'm not blaming Dodge or their product either but I've spent almost as much on the truck in 9 months as I paid for my Barracuda and I'm still looking at ~$5000-8000 in repairs and "routine" maintenance in the near future. Kinda makes the price of gas seem insignificant. Anyone want to buy a 4x4 Ram 3500 diesel dually? 

Troy

[694spdRT]

I agree Troy and have said for years that unless you roll a lot of miles and need the power a Cummins it really is more a case of want than need. They are great trucks for pulling heavy loads and mine will click off 20mpg empty and 14mpg loaded down with an enclosed 24' trailer and Charger (aka brick). The one thing is the trade in value on a Cummins will hold up much better than a comparable gasser. Especially as the trucks get up in mileage or get older.

A friend and I were talking about gas vs diesel debate and I think it boils down to people being reminded every few days how much they are paying out. For a lot of people I think the car payments, insurance, etc. don't often get figured into the equation because it is an infrequent bill or spread out over such a long time period that it becomes tolerable.
 
FWIW: I bought my '05 diesel when it was less than a year old because the guy who bought it new wanted something cheaper to drive. So he traded it in on a Stratus and was almost 10K dollars upside down on the truck after the trade was all done. That would have bought a lot of diesel.

[bull]

No to get too far off track but I heard DCX was going to lose the Cummins contract and start using Mercedes diesels exclusively. Of course it was suppose to happen like two years ago and didn't (so I have to wonder about my source) but was there ever any truth to this? Did something happen that kept the relationship as-is or am I all wet?

[Vainglory, Esq.]

Chrysler needs to keep the Cummins contract - people who buy those tend not to buy anything else.  It's like a cult following.

[694spdRT]

No to get too far off track but I heard DCX was going to lose the Cummins contract and start using Mercedes diesels exclusively. Of course it was suppose to happen like two years ago and didn't (so I have to wonder about my source) but was there ever any truth to this? Did something happen that kept the relationship as-is or am I all wet?

Are you thinking about the "Ford owns Cummins" rumor from a few years ago? That one was not true....too bad for Ford.

[Orange_Crush]

No to get too far off track but I heard DCX was going to lose the Cummins contract and start using Mercedes diesels exclusively. Of course it was suppose to happen like two years ago and didn't (so I have to wonder about my source) but was there ever any truth to this? Did something happen that kept the relationship as-is or am I all wet?

Yes and no.

Back when the current generation of heavy-duty Ram came out, Dodge was in the process of renegotiating their contract with Cummins.  At the time, they were talking to Caterpillar to see if they could supply a diesel engine for the trucks.  No one seems to know what really happened, but we all know how it worked out.

If Dodge ever did decide to stop using Cummins engines (or Cummins decided to stop supplying them), DCX has several other places they can go. 

1.  They could go to Caterpillar and use their c7 engine which is approximately the same size and weight as the cummins ISB
2.  They could go to Detroit Diesel (a DCX subsidiary) and use the MBE900 engine which, again, is of similar size and weight.
3.  Go to VM Motori and/or Mercedes-Benz and and engineer a dedicated engine.

As far as the diesel in the upcoming 1500 Rams, That's likely to be a much smaller and cheaper engine than the ones in te 2500 and 3500 trucks.  That one will probably extract a premium of 2500-3000 dollars and is likely to be a lower maintenance engine than the ISB simply because it'll be a much lighter duty engine than the ISB.

The ISB is truly overkill in the Ram.  ISB engines are overengineered because they are used for marine, generation, medium-duty, RV, and light duty truck applications so they basically have to engineer them for the most severe duty that they will see.  You put a Duramax or Powerstroke engine in some of the applications that the ISB is used for and they won't last a month.

[skip68]

I too agree with troy. For me if I want good mpg then drive a car or motorcycle. I've had a few diesels and I use them for towing and I will never buy a gas engine truck again. I like the power, mpg when towing and they will outlast any gas engine. It does cost more now so it should be a need and not a daily driver. JMO. I think it's a good thing for those that want a diesel but don't want or need a HUGE truck to pull thier boats or campers. This is all just my opinion, If dodge does this I bet it will catch on.  Plus, it will help to give the Ford people a new avenue.  I've driven lots of diesels and I love the Ford 7.3L 6spd but the day of the Ford's are gone far as diesels go.  They NEVER, NEVER, NEVER should've done away with 7.3L.  Again, these are just my    Chuck..............

[Old Moparz]

I won't speak out against the use of a diesel, but will only add that depending on what weight you'll be towing, & how often, a gas engine might be a good choice as well. For years, the heaviest things I had towed were camping trailers up to 2800 pounds. Once I had decided to buy my car hauler, I had to think about what my next tow vehicle would be, gas or diesel. I already had my 1995 Ford F-150 with a 5.8 L gas engine & factory tow package, (which I still have) so I used that without any trouble. It's capacity was rated at 8200 pounds if I recall, but it was getting old & had over 100,000 miles.

The car hauler I got is rated at 7000 pounds, & I think the heaviest load I've towed so far was the 1971 Barracuda. The weight of the trailer might be about 1500 pounds, & the Cuda around 4000, for a total of 5500 pounds. It towed well, handled well, & the weight didn't give the 5.8 L gas engine any trouble. When we finally bought a new camping trailer, we moved up to a 24 foot model that is almost 7000 pounds. The F-150 pulled it fine, but I had already found the Ram Quad Cab with the Hemi & a factory tow package to replace it. The Ram with the Hemi does tow better than the F-150, but it's new, has better gearing, & also a longer wheel base.

I have no intentions of ever getting a larger camping trailer, & can't afford to get an enclosed car hauler, so for me I have no need for a diesel. I did consider it, but the much higher price on the purchase, as well as what Troy pointed out with maintenance costs, a gas powered tow vehicle is adequate.

I hate the noise & smell of diesel anyway.

[Orange_Crush]

I hate the noise & smell of diesel anyway.

Bob, the new catalyst equipped cummins diesels don't smell like diesel anymore.  They're still noisy (though not NEARLY as noisy as the older diesels) but they don't stink anymore...at all.

[Troy]

I hate the noise & smell of diesel anyway.

Bob, the new catalyst equipped cummins diesels don't smell like diesel anymore.  They're still noisy (though not NEARLY as noisy as the older diesels) but they don't stink anymore...at all.

But you still have to pump that stuff at some point...

I know the Sprinters use a smaller diesel but it's a Mercedes. I don't think it has a ton of power - more for economy but it seems nice. Is that about the size of the one that would go in the 1500? I think the weight of the 5.9 would create havoc with the handling of a 1500 but I'm not an engineer so what do I know about that?

Troy

[Orange_Crush]

I hate the noise & smell of diesel anyway.

Bob, the new catalyst equipped cummins diesels don't smell like diesel anymore.  They're still noisy (though not NEARLY as noisy as the older diesels) but they don't stink anymore...at all.

But you still have to pump that stuff at some point...

I know the Sprinters use a smaller diesel but it's a Mercedes. I don't think it has a ton of power - more for economy but it seems nice. Is that about the size of the one that would go in the 1500? I think the weight of the 5.9 would create havoc with the handling of a 1500 but I'm not an engineer so what do I know about that?

Troy

No.  The engine in the Sprinter is a Mercedes 5 cylinder diesel (soon to be upgraded to a more powerful V-6).  The Cummins engine they're talking about would be a small V-6 Common rail engine.

[shawnmd]

I hate the noise & smell of diesel anyway.

Bob, the new catalyst equipped cummins diesels don't smell like diesel anymore.  They're still noisy (though not NEARLY as noisy as the older diesels) but they don't stink anymore...at all.

But you still have to pump that stuff at some point...

I know the Sprinters use a smaller diesel but it's a Mercedes. I don't think it has a ton of power - more for economy but it seems nice. Is that about the size of the one that would go in the 1500? I think the weight of the 5.9 would create havoc with the handling of a 1500 but I'm not an engineer so what do I know about that?

Troy

No.  The engine in the Sprinter is a Mercedes 5 cylinder diesel (soon to be upgraded to a more powerful V-6).  The Cummins engine they're talking about would be a small V-6 Common rail engine.

Its actually a small V8 diesel engine.

[skip68]

Is it a cummins V8?