HLPAG - Luedtke Auto Group reputation - Should I buy from them ???

[kripledbybuick]

I was about to seal a $35k deal with Oscar at Luedtke for a 440 general lee replica but had the good sense to check around a little first. I have heard nothing but horror stories since looking into it, but I wonder if they are still capable of turning out a nice example. I see a trend in the bad expeiriences, mostly people who wanted cheap cars and were only wanting to pay about $5k.  I don't think $5k gets you much anymore and wanted the car built to my specs... an agreement was made to my wish list on a particular 383 car including tax and shipping for $35k to my door. I will be holding off on the deal until I determine the risk involved with this seller. Any help with this would be helpfull as well as alternative builders to talk to about building what I want. I realize this may spark a debate about ANOTHER general lee replica, but I have wanted this since I was 10 years old, and my life aint getting any prettier, so I want what I want, and I'm going for it. Thanks for all of your help out there...  Jason-

[beedees]

 :oOh boy, here it comes. Spend 35k with them, and you might...just might get a 5k car.

[Charger1973]

Hell no.  I wouldnt give them a dime of my money.  For that kind of cash you can have the car you want, and dont have to deal with anyone like them.  Hang around here for a little while and keep an eye on the classifieds you will find alot of good guys with nice cars to sell.

[Troy]

It's rare that they have anything that nice but... on occasion they sell cars on consignment. If they haven't "restored" it yet then it might actually be ok. If it's a General Lee I'd bet they worked on it and I'd be checking every single inch of that car before handing them a dime. Whatever you do, do NOT allow them to ship the car to your house sight unseen.

Troy

[bull]

Type the word hlpag in the search box above for a good read. Here's a good place to start: http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,6464.0.html
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,3692.180.html

Their typical modus operandi is to locate and buy rusted Chargers cheap, give them a half-assed "restoration" (consisting of little more than a coat of orange paint and a GL decal kit), advertise them at four times what they paid with just a few pictures of the car (good angles only), take payments in full through the mail or other immediate venues and deliver the cars under the cover of darkness. When the buyer finally gets a good look at the car in full daylight they discover that "GOOD FATHER/SON PROJECT!!!!" means "parts car at best" and "TRUNK METAL CUT OUT AND READY FOR PATCH PANEL" means "trunk rusted out and fuel tank gone," etc. And when the customer calls to complain that the car was not as advertised hlpag will not return their messages. They are very fond of the phrase "YYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAA" as well as UPPERCASE letters and lots of !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! when describing their scrap iron for sale.

[Doc MoPar]

PLEASE do a search on this site for HLPAG and be prepared for some painful reading ("Update to my HLPAG woes" was particularly difficult).  I used to live and work in North Chicago not terribly far from where HLPAG does their "work".  I used to look at their web site for fun but now it just pisses me off.  There are no less than 6 Chargers on e-bay right now including this 68 RT 4 speed, item # 140071871849 if the link does not work, for less than you are willing to spend and undoubtedly in better shape. 
(http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dodge-Charger-R-T-68-CHARGER-R-T-4-SPEED_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6199QQihZ004QQitemZ140071871849QQrdZ1)

If you are still considering buying from HLPAG I'm sure someone from this site who lives in IL would be willing to go look at it for you and be brutally honest.  Heck I'll even do it when I fly back for a visit in early Feb if nobody else will.

[dads_69]

I smell a rat. Look at the guys sig name. Couldn't think of a better won? The company has a bad reputation. I find it strange you wouldn't know that. After coming so close and then backing out. If the guy who posted here about HLPag, after a few months of being logged, then maybe I'll apologise for what I've wrote here.
Mark
Edit:
Bull, I find it very strange that someone would even consider sending that amount of cash w/out even seeing the car or anything in person first, then paying for it. thats why I have chosen to call B.S.
I call it intuition. The guy even pm'd me to call him to verify hes legit, no thanks!

[bull]

I smell a rat. Look at the guys sig name. Couldn't think of a better won? The company has a bad reputaion. I find it strange you wouldn't know that. After coming so close and then backing out. If the guy who posted here about HLPag, after a few months of being logged, then maybe I'll apologise for what I've wrote here.
Mark

I initially thought that too but after seeing his last post here http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,18332.0.html I think he's legit. Forgive us, we're all kind of twitchy when it comes to hlpag.

[kripledbybuick]

I thought the sig would get the most attention! I guess it worked. I will find a builder, just not these guys. I did get lucky not sending that check! But better lucky than screwed!

[kripledbybuick]

Holy crap! What is up with you guys? DADS69 you need to relax buddy, I'm just tryin to be nice and you're all over my case! I already agree that buying from hlpag would end up another horror story. Do you guys always treat newbies like this? 

[dads_69]

Holy crap! What is up with you guys? DADS69 you need to relax buddy, I'm just tryin to be nice and you're all over my case! I already agree that buying from hlpag would end up another horror story. Do you guys always treat newbies like this? 

I am relaxed. Like I said before, I smell a rat. If your still around after a few months, then you'll get my apologises, in the mean time, I just find it strange thats all, so you chill out!

[kripledbybuick]

I guess Dads69 just don't like me or something - oh well - whatever! This is the list I sent to Oscar and will be sending to any builder I can find as a jumping off point for my project.

Hello Oscar,

Here is the final list as of 1-8-07 :

General Lee 1969 Dodge Charger
1975 Corvette flame red
all body panels in good shape - no wrinkly or damaged valance panels, quarters, fenders or doors
no rust or fully repaired solid everywhere
no saggy doors - must line up nice
Throttle on left side of brake peddle
blowout proof motor mounts and super durable tranny mounts...( something like Schumacher Creative Services -"poly loc"- )
tubular headers with ceramicoat - jetcoat or equivalent long lasting, durable heat insulating ceramic coating ( not heat paint )
blowout proof header gaskets and collector gaskets
dual exhaust with turbo mufflers (2.25" tubing min dia - 2.5" even better-)
square mopar exhaust tips ( placed to exit below each reverse light and at slight upward angle like stock )
healthy auto 727 (inspected and serviced)
Trans cooler in front of radiator
8&3/4" suregrip rear (inspected and serviced) limited slip unit dana or borg warner fine... ( 3.23/1 gearing & 1.75 or 1.875 pinion shaft)
very good to new U-joints ( inspected and serviced if needed )
proper torsion bars for Big Block
power steering
properly aligned after suspension work completed
front & rear suspension rebuild ( The real deal kit )
front 11" disk power brake conversion
front and rear anti sway bars
factory AC in dash disconnect at firewall ( all AC components still in dash )
Clock replaced with tach
black dash gage cover
black interior
reupholstered and very good to new carpet
very good to new headliner
black console
dash pad in very good condition or new
factory sport steering wheel
am fm factory radio
series 2 wide push bar welded to frame ( high quality gloss black paint, automotive if possible, powder coat a big plus )
12 notes of Dixie air horn
4 new 15 inch vectors ( 7.5 width front & 8.5 width in back) and good (or new) rubber black wall out
remove all traces of window tint
hi perf 7-9 year 3m vinyl graphics with proper DIMs and spacing
good to excellent condition window molding, trims, and gaskets... ( all window registers should work flawlessly )
chrome strip added around sail panel area and inside tunnel back area of rear window ( no plastic stick on )
excellent mechanical condition throughout

Here is the engine detail list for 440:

440 cube big block (orange block paint - all aluminum to remain natural)
hardened valve seats or stelite inserts ( unleaded fuel survival )
forged steel crank
windage tray
no greater than 10.5 : 1 compression ratio - no less than 9.8 : 1
quality gaskets through-out ( felpro would be fine but up to you )
rebuilt block with quality bearings and quality bore job ( no flex hone quicky - torque plate honed a big plus )
good quality oil pump or high volume pump
good quality water pump or high volume aluminum water pump
cast aluminum valve covers ( black wrinkle )
mopar performance unsilenced air cleaner ( black wrinkle finish ) with 1969 commando pie plate insert (orange) picture attached
edelbrock performer-RPM intake
true roller timing chain
comp cams kit part # k21-223-4 ( link = http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CC&Product_Code=K21-223-4&Category_Code= the over the phone price was $475.48 - online shows higher price )
double angle 30 degree back grind on valves ( improves flow )
quality rings
holley double pumper 750 cfm 4 barrel carburetor

The list is complete at this point and we can move to a contract with your approval of all items listed. I will be sending the signed contract and $35k check tomorrow fedex overnight. Thank you for working so closely with me to finalize these details and help facilitate the out the door price including shipping and tax for $35,000.00.

Please give me a full list of the items provided in the brake conversion and the suspension rebuild kit ( the real deal kit ) . Please also include a full list of engine build details ( block numbers, head numbers, valve sizes, crank grind diameters, rod type, cam specs, bore size, bearing, seals, gaskets, stock items, aftermarket items and compression ratio ) . I am also a picture fanatic so as many pictures along the way as you are willing to snap would be thankfully received. Any pics of the build up will be used in a web site devoted to this car and will showcase the hard work you put into the product. It will also be good advertising for your product and may even help you sell more cars in the future.

As soon as you have completely reviewed all final list details pending your approval, please send me a response e-mail including any details you feel important including all item listed and spell out the arrangement details to move into contract.

Again thank you for all your help,
  ****************************************************************
I will leave out all of my personal info as to avoid any further wrath from dads69

Jason-

[bull]

Here's some pics of Airborne Silva's sorry hlpag acquisition:

[kripledbybuick]

OMG!   That is hidious!! I will go get the pics they sent me and post here shortly.

[dads_69]

I'm not picking on you intentionally, read what I wrote dude. HLPag finds ways to get us to buy they're crap. They suck ass! If you had done your homework, oh nevermind, you'll just piss and moan some more about me pissing in your corn flakes. I'm not gonna go over this crap again w/you, gees dude, get over it already.
Later................

[kripledbybuick]

Heres a composite of what they sent me, I have more detail shots in trunk, under backend, engine bay ... everything looked good to me, but these are just pictures, no replacement for the real thing. I know the resolution is low but I shrunk the file to send it, guess I shrunk it too far. I can't believe the photos of that rust bucket with no trunk! I would kill someone if that happened to me! And dads69- let's just start over here... I'm just tryin' to be friendly, and this is me doing my homework, - forgiven - forgoten - I just got my ass saved by you guys showig me the true luedtke operation, I am thankfull. But now I need help finding a better builder to continue with... I will probably have to change my sig if I stick around here, way to contaversial the way it is!

[bull]

Heres a composite of what they sent me, I have more detail shots in trunk, under backend, engine bay ... everything looked good to me, but these are just pictures, no replacement for the real thing.

I've seen better pictures of that car (at least I think it's that car) recently here: http://midwestgeneralleeclub.com/index.php?topic=123.0

If nothing else it's another place to get some insight into hlpag. The least I would do, if you're still tempted to buy a car from them, is go see the car in person or hire someone who knows what they're doing to look at the car in person. If you really want a General Lee replica though I would go with Smith Bros. loooooooooong before I would get anywhere near hlpag.

[kripledbybuick]

Smith Brothers? Please give me all the info you have so I can start over with them... web adress, phone numbers, contact names... the works. Thanks again

[bull]

This is all I've seen: http://www.richardcummins.com/comingsoon.html

Looks like the site might not be active at the moment but I've never heard anything bad about the Smith Bros. like I have about hlpag. The Smith Bros. are up in Washington somewhere. I started a thread about them once but didn't get much info: http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,12792.0.html

[kripledbybuick]

Thats' great, I'm in cali so that's much closer to me... I changed my sig name to something more accurate, so as not to stir up any controversy. I will try finding a contact there tomorrow morning and sending them my list. I think I should be able to get what i want for $35k don't you? Or am I asking the impossible for a custom build in the real builder circle?

[bull]

Thats' great, I'm in cali so that's much closer to me... I changed my sig name to something more accuate, so as not to stir up any controversy. I will try finding a contact there tomorrow morning and sending them my list. I think I should be able to get what i want for $35k don't you? Or am I asking the impossible for a custom build in the real builder circle?

I really don't know what they charge but I know they have different levels of service for different prices. I would hope to think that $35k would get you what you want though.

By the way, why do you want the throttle on the left side of the brake pedal?

[kripledbybuick]

MAN! that took a minute to stop laughing... you have a good eye, I wondered who would catch that first. By my sig and avatar I bet you already guessed - my right leg no worky no more - left one still works good so all my cars have an auto and the throttle on the left. here is a pic of the left side gas pedal in my old mazda rx8, flyby wire throttle modified with custom fabed reverse pattern ABS pedal and billet aluminum adapter arm.

[bull]

Oh, I gotcha. So you had some trouble while driving a Buick? Sorry for your misfortune. There are a couple of awesome Charger buddies here in chairs too, both in Washington. 8WHEELER (Dan) and 472 R/T SE (Mike) whom I've met and hung out with on several occasions at the dodgecharger.com meet in Kent, WA and at the Mopar Nationals in Woodburn, OR. Mike even let me come to his house and drive his '70 4spd R/T before he sold it and got his purple '70.

Sorry if I'm bringing up a sore subject here. I never really know how to deal with conversations about wheelchairs but if anything I think these guys are more courageous than the average guy for what they've been through and yet continue to do. They seem to have more energy to hit more car shows than I do and I really look up to both of them on many different levels. Don't tell Mike I said that.

[JMF]

That list you made I very much doubt HLPAG could get anywhere near that, go elsewhere, try these places

www.classicmusclecars.com

www.southernmotors.com

[JimShine]

I am the guy you spoke to earlier. I am glad you found this site.

Listen to these guys here about HPLAG.

Didn't know about your leg. I screwed my right leg up in a accident too. My left leg is the one I have to use.

[AKcharger]

YES buy that car from them

[ChargerSG]

The thing that they start new Ebay users and sell those ghkjr GL, now they are known around the world, the europeans who got tricked by them before have spread the word but still there are people getting screwed by them. Years ago i allmost bought an 69 RT from them, but when i checked it it was thanks but no thanks(but i must say they where very nice even when i was offerd them half the money), and then when i joined old DC i really got stories about them, and like just 1 years later the stories about them turned up here in Sweden.

[Charger1973]

They have been around for quite a while now actually.  I have seen them advertise in the regional car trader magazines for years.  Made me wonder how they always had a General Lee for sale.  Before I knew anything about them I just assumed it was the same car and no one was buying it. 

[kripledbybuick]

Oh, I gotcha. So you had some trouble while driving a Buick? Sorry for your misfortune. There are a couple of awesome Charger buddies here in chairs too, both in Washington. 8WHEELER (Dan) and 472 R/T SE (Mike) whom I've met and hung out with on several occasions at the dodgecharger.com meet in Kent, WA and at the Mopar Nationals in Woodburn, OR. Mike even let me come to his house and drive his '70 4spd R/T before he sold it and got his purple '70.

Sorry if I'm bringing up a sore subject here. I never really know how to deal with conversations about wheelchairs but if anything I think these guys are more courageous than the average guy for what they've been through and yet continue to do. They seem to have more energy to hit more car shows than I do and I really look up to both of them on many different levels. Don't tell Mike I said that.

\
No problemo, I lived through the hard part, I don't mind questions. Two years ago I was riding my ducati 900ss with a touring group in modesto when two illegal hispanic males with no DLs or insurance plowed me into the pavement because of their combined stupidity.

[bsakal]

Sorry to hear about what happened. Good luck in your search. When it comes to HLPAG, turn around and run away very fast and don't look back. BTW, they also advertise on www.collectorcartraderonline.com

[pettyfan43]

Hey Kripled by Buick. Check out Smith Brothers Restorations and Scott Lea Idol Rods. You can get info on both at WWW.CGLFC.COM
The Scott LEa cars are absolutely astounding. They are GORGEOUS and the guy that owns the place is a firs class guy. they may even have a car almost built to your specs.

The Smith brothers build really nice cars as well, the can build them DEAD ON accurate, and have restored a couple of real TVcars.

You can also do a search on HLPAG and you can get a feel for what they are about. I will say this. the car you got pictures of is one thing, what you would have gotten is SOMETHING ELSE again!!!!!!!!!

[JimShine]

They only did one TV car and it ended up being redone due to cracking bondo.

[Daytona R/T SE]

Anybody know who the guy in Kentucky is that builds General Lee's?   

[4cruzin]

I wouldn't do it just because I've seen some of their public relations . . . not real professional.   

[JimShine]

Anybody know who the guy in Kentucky is that builds General Lee's?   

Are you thinking of Danny Johnson in Tennesee? I know a guy who bought one there. He has had lots of work done to it since to get the paint looking decent and even had to replace the trunk lid and valence. Most everything in the engine bay was painted over as well.

[Chris G.]

Only 2 things I'll say:

1. If you are looking to plunk down 35K on any car, you better get an appraiser, or fly out yourself and look at the car. If someone drops 35K on a sight unseen car, they get what they deserve.

2. Also, yes I agree with what has been said about Hlpag, but they would not still be in business if they did anything truly illegal. Going back to #1, most guys that bought from them did buy site unseen. That is THEIR fault, and not Luedtke's. I think Hans and crew have learned their lesson about posting on message boards. Now they sit back and watch them, and just hope the next sucker that shows up to buy a car is internet challenged, and has never heard of them. Make no mistake, I hope they fall and fall hard.

[mikepmcs]

Anybody know who the guy in Kentucky is that builds General Lee's?   

Are you thinking of Danny Johnson in Tennesee? I know a guy who bought one there. He has had lots of work done to it since to get the paint looking decent and even had to replace the trunk lid and valence. Most everything in the engine bay was painted over as well.

Hey that's me(not Danny, the guy who bought from him)!! Howdy Jimmy .  I'll answer questions about my experience too though if you would like. 
Overall good experience but the only thing I was a little dissappointed about was the lack of attention to detail.  I've seen some of his other stuff and it looks like I got a rush job and he was breaking in someone new at the time with the body and paintwork.. AFFLYER(bradley) on this site also bought from him and can maybe give you his take on the product he received
v/r
Mike

[hemi-hampton]

If you dont mind going to Detroit I could do a Nice General Lee for you. LEON.

[kripledbybuick]

I was unable to open the smith brothers site... But i sent the info to the conferderate general lee moderator hoping he could steer me in the right direction!

[Judhudson]

Hey, sorry to hear about your unforunate accident

However, you do want to contact Professor Patrick, from Scotlea Idol Rods.  He's based in Oklahoma, and creates some of the nicest replicas around.  Check out his website here:  http://www.scotleaidolrods.com/

[bull]

I was unable to open the smith brothers site... But i sent the info to the conferderate general lee moderator hoping he could steer me in the right direction!

I sent a PM to a member here who's having a GL built by the Smith Bros. and told him about this thread. Hopefully he'll see it and give you some contact info. His username is miamivice and he lives in Seattle: http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=153

Should be seattlevice shouldn't it? I guess it doesn't sound as cool.

[MGBRingo]

Good luck with your search.  From a fellow bike rider sorry to hear about your accident.  It can happen quickly.

I would sugggest you leave the $ amount off of your request for a car.  See what they come back to you with for price first.   Don't let them know how much you are willing to spend until after you see what the best they have to offer will cost.  You may be surprised how much you can get for much less than $35,000.

[JMF]

This is one of Danny's

[JimShine]

Looks like that one got the same paint blown over the parts on the firewall like Mike got.

[skip68]

I just looked at their $29,999 GL. Good lord, you would think for $30,000 you could get a car that's battery was'nt rattle can black and the core support was a little better detailed. Kind of makes a guy wonder what you can't see?  And howcome the fender tags are almost always off the car? And how bad do you think the rust is on those shiny cars that have fender tags with rust wholes?

[mikepmcs]

I really like my interior though, that's for sure.  Danny johnson is a very honest/nice man and will tell you everything about the car when you talk to him.  Just make sure you ask all the right questions.  My lack of intelligence caused my expectations to be too high when I bought this car.  I was thinking show car but for the price i paid and knowing what i know now........  I got a numbers matching car, build sheet etc... 
And it should never lose value.  I have tinkered with just about everything on the car and my engine bay doesn't look like it did when i bought it either, i've put new wheels and tires, disc brakes, rear end, springs, shocks, ignition system, carb, etc....  mostly because i just wasn't happy with it's total performance and that was all my choice.   I could have just cleaned up some wiring and drove the car but i can't leave anything alone.  Most of my changes were my choice.


Like I said i am not unhappy with the car, just expected a little too much for what I paid for.  If you have a chance to go down there and look at his shop and visit with him, that would probably the best thing to do and talk with him and see his product first hand, then make your choice.

He has sold 2 cars to Ben Jones(cooter)  and Ben is extremely happy with his GL's.

v/r
Mike

[MOPARHOUND!]

Anyone know these guys in California, http://www.buildingagenerallee.com/build.php ??

[charger01]

Hey, sorry to hear about your unforunate accident

However, you do want to contact Professor Patrick, from Scotlea Idol Rods.  He's based in Oklahoma, and creates some of the nicest replicas around.  Check out his website here:  http://www.scotleaidolrods.com/

I would definately go with Patrick.  He is a great guy and upfront and honest about everything.  He will build you a car to your custom liking and not rape you with the price.  His cars are top notch. 

[bull]

Hey, sorry to hear about your unforunate accident

However, you do want to contact Professor Patrick, from Scotlea Idol Rods.  He's based in Oklahoma, and creates some of the nicest replicas around.  Check out his website here:  http://www.scotleaidolrods.com/

I would definately go with Patrick.  He is a great guy and upfront and honest about everything.  He will build you a car to your custom liking and not rape you with the price.  His cars are top notch. 

When you're talking about Patrick I hope you're not referring to this ass clown, formerly of hlpag: http://sillypatrick.bravehost.com/hlpag1.htm

[charger01]

Patrick Hagerman.  No affiliation with HLPAG whatsoever.  Check out some of his cars at his Oklahoma based website.  Heck of a nice guy, and he knows his stuff.

[1fine69]

I would definentley shop around and whomever gives you the best deal then jump on it. your list is long and has some expensive stuff on there. make them work for you cause it's not like you're buying a popsicle. also get as many pics of the progress and once it's done fly out or drive out and check it out in person and give it the yay or nay! like i said make it work for you it's your dream car they are going to be building. good luck!

[kripledbybuick]

I have been waiting for all the quotes to come back, but I think I will be going with Scottleaidolrods... I like his attention to details and multi stage high quality paint job! I did get a responce from hlpag and was surprised by how nice Oscar was after I told him his reputation was bad... Here is his responce and my original e-mail he replied to:

JASON,

no sweat. sorry for the delay in getting back to you i have been swamped and in n out of the office. i understand exactly where you are coming. from. i do want you to know that unfortunantley our reputation was tainted very bad by people here and since i have moved into the position i am in here i have been trying to make things better. so i work with what i get. and to be honest with you it is very rewarding to see peoples remarks and praises when we do their car exactly how they want it. our offer still stands and will stand. i enjoyed speaking to you all the times we did cause i am always looking to learn and you taught me a thing or two! either way whether we build it or someone else does it for you i hope it makes your childhood dream come true. and if you need anything just let me know either by email or via phone call. thanks sooooo much for your time OSCAR.........847-265-1234




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From:  jason <jason@goodplastics.com>
To:  "MR. MOPAR" <procar426@hotmail.com>
Subject:  RE: headers
Date:  Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:07:35 -0800
>Hi Oscar,
>
>  I am sorry I couldn't get back to you sooner with this info, but
>it has been insanely busy over here. I have decided to find another
>builder for this project, this decision has nothing to do with you
>personally, I have enjoyed working on the details with you and like
>your work ethics. Unfortunately after I looked into the hlpag
>business reputation it came back with terrible results. I am just
>not comfortable doing a project of this size with a builder that has
>such a large number of very dissatisfied customers. It just could be
>that other people who have purchased from you are completely
>unrealistic and that has damaged the reputation of a fine builder,
>but the reputation is out there non-the-less. Please feel free to
>chat with me concerning any details leading to this decision anytime
>that is convenient for you. Again thank you for all your fine help
>and I wish you the best of luck with your business, it seems you
>must have plenty of sales and I bet you have plenty of happy
>customers.
>
>Thank you very much,
>Jason



I sent Oscar an e-mail the day after I joined up here, and I was overly nice about the reputation I have now come to know as beyond disgusting. But Oscar was always nice to me, so I was nice back. It looks like they are very aware of the reputation they have built, I have no idea how they could recover from the damage they have done but I can hope they don't cause any more damage to the unsuspecting future customers. I think some one should post a permanent warning about these guys and put their full name and key words like general lee and reputation in the title so guys like me could find it easily.

[mikepmcs]

If they were so destined to make things right, then they should/would give Tony (Airborne Silva) some if not all of his cash back, or at least attempt to make it right with parts, etc.....  I don't believe Oscar is being totally forethcoming in his email.  Cause he can say whatever he wants in an email(and definitley a savey approach), but had you went with him, who knows what the outcome would be. 
I think you made a wise decision not to go with them and i hope the guy you choose does a great job for you.
my.02

v/r
Mike