one more time................alt. questions

[roger01]

2 wires here do they all go together for a total of 4 wires with new one

[Nacho-RT74]

I can't see clear those instructions.

mechanical regulators, or same looks but internally electronic system have to wires tu plug. One blue coming from ignition switch running to input on reg and one green running to alt brush field from reg output.

If you have two blue wires spliced from input side then mostly probably the second blue wire running from there is running to ballast. Remember ballast also needs blue wire source.

Newer cars with Electronic igniton  original from factory have the Main blue wire splice source hidden down the tape on a solded point, with excetion on the blue jumper wire on double ballast input prongs. Then also have a splice point on choke control unit on teh way to alt, but thats a different story

I can't see the 4th wire you telling me.

[roger01]

the fourth wire is the one the instructions are telling me to add to run to the other field on the alternator

[roger01]

ihave 2 wires coming in here ...do they all go together?

[roger01]

heres the instructions:

Basically, a wire is added to the second Field brush on the alternator. On the orignal alternator, this brush is grounded to the case of the alternator, so you'll need to either change the alternator to a 1970 or new style, or adapt the newer brush set to the old alternator. The brush set costs about $5 at your local parts store. The second field wire is connected to the outside plug on the newer voltage regulator. (two plugs, one is in the middle, one is on the outside). The original field wire that ran to the "FLD" plug on the original regulator (green wire) needs to be connected with the wire that ran to the "IGN" side of the original regulator. This wire (both the old FLD and the old IGN) need to be connected to the center plug on the newer regulator as well. One other important thing is, the new regulator must have a good ground (-) signal to its case. Mount the new VR to a fender or the firewall and be sure to sand a little paint off the fender and the case so you have a good ground. If there isn't a good ground to the new regultor case, the charging system will not work properly!

[Nacho-RT74]

you don't need the wire to ground the other brush, that's just an option. You can also REPLACE the isolator washer what keeps brush in place and also isolating attaching screw from brush prong for a metallic regular washer and that will be enough to ground the brush. Is a more clean instalation IMHO. BTW I would choose to ground the vertical mounted brush ( 90º against rotor coil )

First you need to define what you want to do.

If you have a double field alt you have two options:

-ground one of the field brushes ( with a wire or using a metallic washer ) to use the earlier mechanical regulator system or same old kind regulator but electronically upgraded to keep same old fashion charging system by positive regulation.

-use the lates electronic regulator, runing a new wire from blue wire up to alt brush and then using a electronic regulator pigtail to plug the new regulator. This time then green wire attached to pigtail will drive negative coming from regulator what takes the source from firewall ground. Blue wire will be constant positive from ignition switch everywhere ( brush and regulator ). this system regulates by negative. Both brushes needs to be isolated.

If you have a single field alt, you won't have any problem. You can also change a one field alt  to double field, just need to get isolator and brush and open a hole on back alt housing to install the isolated brush and convert it on to double field alt.

[roger01]

i have a double fiel newer alternator with the post facing the innerfender grounded now for the mechanical ....im going to upgrade the regulator to 70,s and up version ...in the pic on the left i have added a red line to the ignition side of regulator because i have 2 wires there
             it says to connect   original green wire ...to ignition side of reg (i have 2 wires here )and connect both into centre of new regulator ...........iguess i connect them all together.....
      regulator is on order no one has it in stock ......

[Nacho-RT74]

no reg in stock ? wow that's amazing... where you search them ?

I will make diagrams I can see in your installation and what you will make to work a newer reg. Coloread and better explained.

[Nacho-RT74]

you have actually this:

[Nacho-RT74]

and will have now this

[roger01]

GOTCHA....now i see that blue wire continues over to the ballast resister.....you think i should solder that splice for a better joint ?
            as for the new regulator ...itried dealer ,nappa parts source and a few others .....nadda....most of them had my old mechanicall in stock though ....go figure ....so i had to do it i got yet ANOTHER one.....and guess what .....it worked ....but now the alt is putting about 15 at idle and higher as it revs ....the battery is 13 at idle
    iwent a few times around the block and fluid was coming out of the battery im still switching to electronic ......hopefully will solve the problem ............thanks for everything

[Nacho-RT74]

fluid coming out from bat is signal of overcharge... as I stated is not safe run it on that way to the batt, to the terminals at bulkhead and ammeter, but works in case of emergency.

if you make a splice, yes, of course solding point will guarantee to you a better job and power flow. In fact I allways sold also terminals once crimped myself.

Is normal that when you have been running without alt working, then batt is the source untill dies; for a while of course is discharging. When you get solved the problem IS NOT SAFE charge the batt FROM ZERO in to the car because of course will get overcharged at first moments, better with a battery charger. However it could be safe if you do JUST AT IDDLE and even better running a wire DRIECTLY from alt stud up to batt to bypass the original wiring and save from weak points breakdown and melting.

You don't really need get the newer regulator for the upgrade, you can get the old fashion electronic upgraded one, however you already have the later alt so the more "expensive" part done of the upgrade.

You can get all three kinds of regulators from year one:
http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/headline.asp?hid=112AE4880

another dealers does carry also FULL or constant OUTPUT regulators for some specifical applications:
http://www.buymopar.com/store/electrical.html

another options including pigtail: ( great guy to deal with it )
http://www.marketworks.com/StoreFrontProfiles/deluxeSFshop.aspx?sfid=92390&c=0&search_text=regulator&submit=Search

also I can send DOZENS of regulators from here including pigtails A LOT CHEAPER than you have up there I think.

More options:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Mopar-Replacement-Voltage-Regulator-Free-Shipping_W0QQitemZ170136160183QQihZ007QQcategoryZ80735QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Mopar-Dodge-Plymouth-Factory-Voltage-Regulator-NEW_W0QQitemZ330151976851QQihZ014QQcategoryZ33691QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MOPAR-62-69-REPRODUCTION-VOLTAGE-REGULATOR-ELECTRONIC_W0QQitemZ330151651963QQihZ014QQcategoryZ80735QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[roger01]

i order new electronic regulator will be here on tuesday .....ill let you know how it goes

[roger01]

i only have three words to say .......ELECTRONIC VOLTAGE REGULATER...... its definately the way to go thanks to nacho....and everybody else for there  .....

[myk]

Ok, I'm going to put in the '70 regulator and double field 'alt.  Please bear with me and correct me if I'm wrong in what I understand:

1. blue wire with white tracer from ignition will be spliced into blue wire coming from the ballast, into the positive pigtail connector for the regulator.

2. a new, 3rd wire will be spliced into the two 3 wires from above, and then be routed to the positive field terminal on a doulbe field 'alt.  In total, there are 4 wires spliced together: regulator, ignition, ballast, and 'alt field.  By the way, is there a "proper" way to splice/combine 4 wires together into one, such as a 3 into 1 connector or something?

3. finally, a single, green wire will be connected to the green, negative wire on the regulator pigtail.  This wire will then be routed to the negative field terminal on a double field 'alt. 

My question is this: is that single green wire, which is connected to the negative terminal on the regulator and the 'alt, connected to anything else on the wiring harness, or is it just one green wire connected to NOTHING ELSE other than point A, the regulator and then point B, the field terminal on the 'alt?

I ask this because when I replaced the engine harness years ago, I don't recall just a single green wire floating around by itself, or even tucked into the wiring harness.  Those of you who have been reading my other threads on this matter also know that my harness got hacked and some of the colors no longer match.  If someone could confirm if that green wire goes to only the regulator and then the 'alt and nothing else, and tell me about the proper way to combine 4 wires I'll probably be set.  Thanks to all!

[Nacho-RT74]

Ok, I'm going to put in the '70 regulator and double field 'alt.  Please bear with me and correct me if I'm wrong in what I understand:

1. blue wire with white tracer from ignition will be spliced into blue wire coming from the ballast, into the positive pigtail connector for the regulator.

you can use simply the one you already have arriving to your actual regulator. Use the elec reg pigtail to hook your actual reg blue wire. Cut the terminal and join them.

2. a new, 3rd wire will be spliced into the two 3 wires from above, and then be routed to the positive field terminal on a doulbe field 'alt.  In total, there are 4 wires spliced together: regulator, ignition, ballast, and 'alt field.  By the way, is there a "proper" way to splice/combine 4 wires together into one, such as a 3 into 1 connector or something?

yes... you can simply untape the harness and get a splicing point there, peeling some of the wire cover somewhere before the ballast and solding the new wire(s). Then tapping the splicing point and taping the harness back... Originally the splicing point is taped with cloth tape, and then the regular tape to the harness.

Or you can simply create a splicing point on regulator blue wire where you already will sold the regulator plug pigtail and run all wires around from there. You can make anything you want as far you get all the blue line hook to all devices.

IMHO for a cleaner engine harness view I would create the splicing point under the tape before the ballast, including the wire to elec regulator, and ballast will have just one blue wire and not a splicing there, just like the diagram... is juts MY opinion

Also hook there the ignition module wire.

I wouldn't use a "3 into 1 connector" simply because that blue wire is very critical on Electrical system to have some loosen terminal around... sold all wires on one point and thats all...  you will have then ECU, Regulator, Ballast and Alt brush to the existant blue wire coming from ignition.

3. finally, a single, green wire will be connected to the green, negative wire on the regulator pigtail.  This wire will then be routed to the negative field terminal on a double field 'alt. 

My question is this: is that single green wire, which is connected to the negative terminal on the regulator and the 'alt, connected to anything else on the wiring harness, or is it just one green wire connected to NOTHING ELSE other than point A, the regulator and then point B, the field terminal on the 'alt?

Simply that!, use your existing green wire and hook on regulator green wire on pigtail, wire still will make the same run up to alt brush that already have, with just one difference, this time will drive negative power instead positive, what will be driven by the blue wire you have to add, but constant instead regulated.

[myk]

Well, thanks for the input everyone.  Not only did I fix the previously bad wiring job of the engine harness, I was able to successfully install the dual field setup.  At this moment I'm getting 14v or so at the battery while idling, even with the lights on.  When the 'highs come on it drops quite a bit but bringing the idle up brings it back up to 14v.
Everyone says that I should seal up my wiring job with tape, but is there a specific tape to use for harnesses, or is it just plain electrical tape?  Well, I'm just going to wrap everything up in that convoluted tubing until I'm sure that everything's working as it should and I don't have to pick into the wiring anymore...

[Nacho-RT74]

original is non glued one. I know YR1 sell it... dunno where else. Maybe some hardware shop around. I'm able just to find a 3M selft bonding one down here.

[myk]

Man, after converting to dual field with the electronic regulator the electrical aspect of this car is that much better.  Lights are brighter, the battery is happier than ever, and I can almost swear that the car itself runs better.  I'm still considering one of those Nippon-Denso 'alts but this will do for now.  Thanks to all for the help...

[Nacho-RT74]

and I can almost swear that the car itself runs better.

sure it does... more stable electric power

[myk]

Hmm...Maybe I spoke too soon.  I took a reading with my voltmeter while the car was idling today and it was in the mid to high 13v's.  During the last 4 days of driving around since I've converted to dual field with the new regulator and alternator the car has been registering anywhere from 14.2 to 14.8v's.  Is there some reason why the voltage readings would suddenly drop almost a full volt after the last few days? 

Another wierd thing too, is that today when the car was reading 13v's if I turned the lights on then the readings would jump back up to the mid 14v's.  Any ideas?

[Nacho-RT74]

at the moment car or batt needs power, regulator increase fields to get more output from alt... that is in amperes and volts. Probably you hade a lightly discharged battery untill get full juice back, that's why got 14 at fisrt instance and then got back to the regular volt reading.

Then same initial idea, when turn on the lights you have on first second a discharge and then get increased the fields to alt keep feeding the car.

did you at the end bypassed ammeter or run a direct wire to starter relay stud ?

PS.: wouldn't be this is the most highjacked thread in the history ? LOL

[myk]

So mid 13v's is an ok reading at the battery then, while the car is running?  Yes, I bypassed the ammeter and I now have a 10 gauge wire running from the 'alt output stud to the starter relay...

[Khyron]

not to rehash a old issue, but I have the problem as well, but I have a MSD 6AL system, new chrome alt from summit, am I grounding the - to the chassis as well?

[Nacho-RT74]

working with elect reg or mechanic reg