Market may not be as out of control as we think

[41husk]

Im just saying there are still deals out there.

[MichaelRW]

Once the market reaches a certain saturation point and that is coming soon, the money will stay in the blue chip cars, i.e., the ones that are rare with documentation and numbers matching. The clones will take a hit though.

[Ghoste]

And the clones I think, are the ones that really piss me off.  Not the people building them for their own enjoyment (I've done it myself) but the ones who are doing expressly to cash in and the fools who pay them for it.
Yes, yes, it's all good marketing and hail to the great gods of capitalism and all that crap but I still reserve the right to whine about it.

[MichaelRW]

And the clones I think, are the ones that really piss me off.  Not the people building them for their own enjoyment (I've done it myself) but the ones who are doing expressly to cash in and the fools who pay them for it.
Yes, yes, it's all good marketing and hail to the great gods of capitalism and all that crap but I still reserve the right to whine about it.

I agree. The clones are going to be problems a few years down the road when the "facts" get a little fuzzy. Some guys are going to get burned big time.

[dkn1997]

The fact that clones are getting big money pisses me off to no end.

sometimes, it seems to me that there are almost no small block or /6 mopars for sale any more, every ya hoo and retard has dumped a wheezing 7:1 compression 440 into them and tripled the asking price.

[Hemidoug]

The fact that clones are getting big money pisses me off to no end.

sometimes, it seems to me that there are almost no small block or /6 mopars for sale any more, every ya hoo and retard has dumped a wheezing 7:1 compression 440 into them and tripled the asking price.

I agree, but you have to remember that the same amount of money goes into fixing up a clone as does an original car. Clones are great hot rods, you can beat the snot out of them without the guilt. I do agree that the flippers out there have been making way more then they should be on clones. Too many eager buyers.. The clones are going to take the biggest hit.

[41husk]

Thats true, I was thinking about doing a 57 Imperial a few years back, it cost more to restore because parts were even harder to get than Charger stuff qand when done did not have a good resale, infact I saw a finished 57 for 19k last month, it would have cost me far more to do the one I was looking at.

[Ghoste]

While it may be true that it costs as much to fix a clone as a pedigreed car, the fact is that a lot of them lately are trying to get pedigreed money or as close as they can.  Do you expect to pay nearly as much for cubic zirconium as a real diamond?
Perhaps part of what pisses me off is that a lot of them shouldn't be called clones because like dkn1997 mentioned, many of them just have a quickie engine swap and some Year One repro badges and suddenly they are an RT clone.  Clone implies an exact duplicate not a pale imitation.
A fool and his money I guess.

[MichaelRW]

While we're on this topic of where the market is now, I just read in the current Old Cars Weekly paper that a 1970 Charger R/T, 390hp, 4 speed, #2 condition SOLD for $98,500. That seems like quite a premium for the 3 - 2 barrels. This was at an auction in Dallas, TX last month.

[66mopar]

Has anyone else noticed how many of the muscle cars are no sales at auctions lately. I'm sure there will be more than one seller with a planted bidder in the audience at BJ ready to bid on their car if the price is to low.

I was around in the late eighties when the 57 chevy convertibles were going for $100,000 now I see the same cars selling between 50 to 60 thousand. Now 50 or 60 thousand isn't cheap but still someone lost money. I wonder if history could be repeating itself? 

The people that paid more for clones than what the original cars are the ones that will loose in the end. I don't see anything wrong with upgrading a car to be more appealing or have an upgraded performance package I have done the same thing to a few cars myself  Any person that has been around cars for a long time knows better than to pay more for a clone (fake) than the original.

Govier will be busy sorting though all of the clones.

[Ghoste]

Yeah, well, auction houses and big collectors are both paying GG to fly around to some of these things and lay his hands upon the real cars for official consecration so he should have a few of them already sorted.

[dkn1997]

While it may be true that it costs as much to fix a clone as a pedigreed car, the fact is that a lot of them lately are trying to get pedigreed money or as close as they can.  Do you expect to pay nearly as much for cubic zirconium as a real diamond?
Perhaps part of what pisses me off is that a lot of them shouldn't be called clones because like dkn1997 mentioned, many of them just have a quickie engine swap and some Year One repro badges and suddenly they are an RT clone.  Clone implies an exact duplicate not a pale imitation.
A fool and his money I guess.

exactly, ghoste....you see cars that are really no better than project cars, and they throw in a $500.00 440 that they got out of a newport, ie: low performance, and all of the sudden the price doubles.  again, it only doubles if the seller pays.  plus buying off of ebay you will pay ultra premium prices.  shop locally and you can do much better, but you gotta be patient. 

whoever said that there are a lot of auctions that end in no sale, especially on ebay, is right.  if you search 68 charger completed items, about 40%  did not sell, so not everyone is getting what they ask for

[Ghoste]

There are a LOT of no sales at the live ones as well.  I do some part time work for one of them and I stated it here before, but there is an enormous amount of smoke and mirrors going on that people just never see.  Even some of the sales are really no sales.
With all the record "sales" at B-J, has it never occurred to anyone that not to long ago Craig Jackson started collecting Mopars?  How lucky for him that he got in before the record prices huh?
The halo effect doesn't just apply to showrooms and motorsports.