I am Disappointed!

69RTSE · July 22, 2005, 12:28:15 AM

It is ashame we lost the Dodge-Charger.Com site. I am sure there are reasons beyond anybodies control and appreciate the moderators of this site for acting quickly and getting another site up and running. However, the Dodge-Charger site had a huge history of valuable restoration information that now has to be re-developed through years of posts. It seems to me that this is the way all good mopar sites eventually go...out of business. Look at dallas mopar, heminet, etc. This is not a personal attack, but just a warning, that if this site becomes good, we do not lose this one! A concerned poster!

Silver R/T · July 22, 2005, 12:42:12 AM

i dont think we can do anything in our control if administrator of site just decides to ditch us. Im with you though...we'll have to get over it, still PITA that all this happened

Headrope · July 22, 2005, 01:02:53 AM

I think the only way to ensure information from any Web site will always be around is to print what you want to keep. This includes information in PM accounts.
Just a suggestion.

Ghoste · July 22, 2005, 04:59:01 AM

The one big drawback to the electronic information age.

Telvis · July 22, 2005, 06:09:52 AM

Hopefully Troy will put some type of contingency plan into place so that someone else could come in and take over if something should happen to him or he find himself in a situation like Jesse. I think that was part of the problem with D-C.com. Jesse held all the cards. When he hit bottom there was no way for anyone to step in and salvage things. Jesse went down with the ship or vice versa. Troy is a smart guy. I'm sure he realizes the situation and will plan for the worst case scenario. I think this site should eventually be like a club with officers. That way no one person holds the fate of the entire group.

Troy · July 22, 2005, 07:52:41 AM

For the 50th time.... the information from the old site is NOT lost. Ok, some of it is but that was mainly the 5 word story thread.

There are many reasons behind what took place and what we have now. When I have the time I'll explain most of them the best way that I can. Things I can promise:
1. This site will not be a copy of D-C.com.
2. A large majority of tech info will reappear (albeit in a different format and we'll have more of it).

You shouldn't have to print your PMs to save the information because, as I mentioned earlier, they should be going to your email address so you automatically have 2 copies. If you're going to delete one, make sure it's the one on this site to free up some resources.

Web sites, whether owned by a group or individually, take up a huge amount of money and time. If the ownership makes the decision that the effort to keep it going is just too much then no one else's opinion really matters. Car related web sites are just like any other business except that they rarely seem to turn a profit. Usually, the sites are started from a love of the cars themselves and are initially seen as a novelty. Eventually, things hit critical mass and the "site management" outgrows the hobby level and becomes lots of work. Legal, monetary, technical, and time issues all play a part in the decision to shut down a site. Many times the ideal situation doesn't exist and what people really want isn't possible. It's hard to see things from both sides of the fence sometimes so forgive me if I sound a bit cynical.

Troy

Drache · July 22, 2005, 08:33:50 AM

Wow Troy is like the car website apostle!

Anyways it's just weird that the Rosetta Stone which had the most important words on it known to man lasted for centuries out in the middle of the desert with no one looking after it in the wind and storms and such.

Computers need almost constant care, need to be hooked up to a powerbar incase of lightning, and if someone drops a magnet onto your hard drive you can kiss it goodbye.

GO FIGURE!

73dodge · July 22, 2005, 09:09:45 AM

Quote from: Troy on July 22, 2005, 07:52:41 AM
For the 50th time.... the information from the old site is NOT lost. Ok, some of it is but that was mainly the 5 word story thread.

There are many reasons behind what took place and what we have now. When I have the time I'll explain most of them the best way that I can. Things I can promise:
1. This site will not be a copy of D-C.com.
2. A large majority of tech info will reappear (albeit in a different format and we'll have more of it).

You shouldn't have to print your PMs to save the information because, as I mentioned earlier, they should be going to your email address so you automatically have 2 copies. If you're going to delete one, make sure it's the one on this site to free up some resources.

Web sites, whether owned by a group or individually, take up a huge amount of money and time. If the ownership makes the decision that the effort to keep it going is just too much then no one else's opinion really matters. Car related web sites are just like any other business except that they rarely seem to turn a profit. Usually, the sites are started from a love of the cars themselves and are initially seen as a novelty. Eventually, things hit critical mass and the "site management" outgrows the hobby level and becomes lots of work. Legal, monetary, technical, and time issues all play a part in the decision to shut down a site. Many times the ideal situation doesn't exist and what people really want isn't possible. It's hard to see things from both sides of the fence sometimes so forgive me if I sound a bit cynical.

Troy

Troy is absolutely correct.

Computers and Bandwidth tend to get maxed out as soon as you add more of either. It seems that there is never enough. And since it keeps growing exponetionally as you add either processing power or bandwidth they tend to get hammered as soon as it's added. And the person that is tasked to to manage it seems to always end up at the back end of the power curve so to speak. So someone that is having personal problems like the owners of D-C.com keeping up a web site is not high on the priority list and I can understand if they loose intrest in trying to keep something running that they have no desire to.

Troy I hope that we can find advertisers for this site that would help with its running.

J

my73charger · July 22, 2005, 09:33:39 AM

I trust Troy. He got us this far and it is miles above waht we had a little iover a week ago...keep up the awesome job Troy!

Troy · July 22, 2005, 09:59:15 AM

Quote from: Drache on July 22, 2005, 08:33:50 AM
Anyways it's just weird that the Rosetta Stone which had the most important words on it known to man lasted for centuries out in the middle of the desert with no one looking after it in the wind and storms and such.

The problem with that analogy is that people would have to make the trek to see the stone yet this web site is delivered to you with no more effort than moving a few fingers. This server could last for centuries out in the desert but that would make it mostly useless to nearly everyone.

Quote from: Drache on July 22, 2005, 08:33:50 AM
Computers need almost constant care, need to be hooked up to a powerbar incase of lightning, and if someone drops a magnet onto your hard drive you can kiss it goodbye.

I wouldn't say "constant". Other than security patches, a decent webserver only needs upgraded every few years or so. I've had several running continuously for over 2 years. Sure they need reliable power but so does anything electronic. Treated right, computers are pretty stable. I've never yet seen any computer that someone could accidently drop a magnet onto and wipe out the hard drive - if your hard drive is that exposed you have bigger problems.

Of course, it's a smart idea to make regular backups of your data and to monitor the performance of the network and the machines but it's not required. Running certain software can be a constant drain but that's not really a computer specific issue since using certain specialized tools (saws, cutter, etc.), vehicles (race cars or anything high performance), or machines are the same way. My grass and bushes tend to require constant care and they aren't plugged into anything nor do they provide me with much valuable information or entertainment.

Troy

Ghoste · July 22, 2005, 01:37:39 PM

Well, hopefully if this one reaches critical mass, we find a way to control the reaction. In the meantime, I'm enjoying the Charger fix and when the time comes for donations, well, a bunch of us will be there and maybe we can keep it going.
Now I understand what goes on at some of theother sites a little better. Why Moparstyle is always trying to sell you something, why Moparts has so many ads etc.

Paul G · July 22, 2005, 04:40:04 PM

D-C.com was set up for failure. It was a huge undertaking to manage it as a hobby. I have a Corvette also and spend a lot of time on Corvette websites like corvetteforum.com and corvetteactioncenter.com. They are designed as a business. They generate income for the site owner. The members are never asked to ante up to keep the site going. I assume that the vendors pay a fee to advertise in the sidebar. I don't understand why D-C.com and even this site cant be set up like the Corvette sites are and actually make some money for the site owner.

Maybe Troy can explain this better.

Silver R/T · July 22, 2005, 05:04:02 PM

he already did, this site is just a few days old and we're not known as big site as old d-c.com used to be, once we've established big site and its all done with design, fonts, pics etc. then we can have vendors that will pay for site advertisement.

dkn1997 · July 22, 2005, 05:31:53 PM

I don't know about you guys, but if I had a few in me, I would throw a bang into the chubby asian broad. I would teach her the real meaning of that sign she's holding.......

Charger_Fan · July 22, 2005, 06:00:25 PM

.......... DKN

Quote from: Paul G on July 22, 2005, 04:40:04 PM
D-C.com was set up for failure. It was a huge undertaking to manage it as a hobby. I have a Corvette also and spend a lot of time on Corvette websites like corvetteforum.com and corvetteactioncenter.com. They are designed as a business. They generate income for the site owner. The members are never asked to ante up to keep the site going. I assume that the vendors pay a fee to advertise in the sidebar. I don't understand why D-C.com and even this site cant be set up like the Corvette sites are and actually make some money for the site owner.

Maybe Troy can explain this better.

The main thing I don't like about sites like that is all the little blinky ads that are seemingly everywhere on the site. I'd rather fork over something like $20 every few months than have to deal with that.

Ghoste · July 22, 2005, 06:07:24 PM

Me too. It annoys me on Moparts when I'm in a hurry to get something and the little ads load and flash away first, and THEN, eventually, the thread comes up. But I'm kinda goofy that way.
OTOH, if I had to pay, I likely wouldn't have just skipped this site altogether. I'm only willing to pay because I've gotten to know it and some of the people.

Troy · July 22, 2005, 06:40:36 PM

Quote from: Paul G on July 22, 2005, 04:40:04 PM
D-C.com was set up for failure. It was a huge undertaking to manage it as a hobby. I have a Corvette also and spend a lot of time on Corvette websites like corvetteforum.com and corvetteactioncenter.com. They are designed as a business. They generate income for the site owner. The members are never asked to ante up to keep the site going. I assume that the vendors pay a fee to advertise in the sidebar. I don't understand why D-C.com and even this site cant be set up like the Corvette sites are and actually make some money for the site owner.

Maybe Troy can explain this better.

Well, I actually can explain it much better than that. But first, how about explaining this: "D-C.com was set up for failure."? How do you know? Do you know why the site is gone or how it happened? Are you guessing at something that sounds like it would be right? It may have been on a path for failure but not for any of the reasons listed. It was not the money (there was plenty) and we had ads in case anyone forgot. I'd be willing to bet that there are very, very few message boards set up as a business from the beginning - they all evolve as the membership grows (or they implode). I have not asked for donations on this site and I don't think Jesse ever did on D-C.com. People volunteered to help out and asked how they could do it.

Oh, and I guess I should mention this again - the site has been live for less than five (5) days and was built from initial idea to working site in less than 24 hours. I haven't exactly had time to finalize everything. There's lots more to come so please withold judgement until things get stabilized.

Troy

KMPX2 · July 22, 2005, 07:10:07 PM

What would it cost to get it running for a month so guys could download all the info they want off of it?

Troy · July 22, 2005, 08:48:44 PM

Quote from: KMPX2 on July 22, 2005, 07:10:07 PM
What would it cost to get it running for a month so guys could download all the info they want off of it?

It doesn't matter. As far as I know, if the site could be turned on for a month then it would be on now. I've given up on getting the site back up and/or taking over the domain name. Anyone who wishes to continue down that path is free to do so but I've wasted more than enough time on it. As I've said before, I have an alternative for the tech info but it takes time. I could wait until everything is ready before putting up a site but I figured this was better than nothing for the moment.

Troy

Ghoste · July 22, 2005, 09:24:13 PM

It is and take your time.

Paul G · July 22, 2005, 09:47:47 PM

Troy,
What I am trying to say is it's not fair to you, for us to expect you to put forth as much time and effort into growing this site without getting something in return for your time. Sure kicking in $20 or $50 now and again wont hurt me. I contributed on D-C as most of us did. Are you willing to do this for us indefinitely in exchange for pocket change? I doubt it, and wouldn't expect it. This is a hobby for all of us. Eventually a person grows tired of his hobby and wants to move on. That is inevitable.

D-C was not growing. New people were coming in all the time and the site couldn't handle the extra traffic. Eventually you took over and got it running pretty well. An organization must grow to keep up with demand. I don't know what happened to D-C other than it isn't here any more. Jesse must have set the priority of D-C pretty low on his priority list or it would still be here. If it was making money for him and it could have been, I would bet it would still be here.

Figure out a way for this thing to pay you for your time. We will all be better off for it in the long run.

Troy · July 22, 2005, 11:17:35 PM

I already have put a lot of thought into how to sustain the site. I think I posted some info about advertising and other alternatives elsewhere but I'm too tired to look it up. Basically, we've been live for 5 days, there isn't a lot of information posted, the site design isn't finalized, we don't have a name, and the majority of D-C.com members haven't been notified yet. It will be very difficult to draw any advertising dollars on that. So, once things get stabilized and I have some real traffic and user numbers I'll be better prepared to solicit funding. Right now my #1 priority is getting more information on the site and working out the bugs. I'm not worried about trying to duplicate the same numbers as D-C.com within the first week - there's time to do it right.

Speaking of hobbies, two of mine are building cars and building web sites so even if one gets boring I'm still in good shape.

Troy

ChargerBill · July 23, 2005, 12:06:11 AM

I think a chill pill is in order...take one and enjoy the site as is and let it grow gradually and manageably. Troy has done quite a bit behind the scenes that many aren't aware of, even I canonot guess at half the stuff, but being a web designer/creator myself I have a good idea on what has been done just to create functionality and relaibility. My "quick and dirty" designs as i like to call them have taken me a good amount of time, and I don't even have to tackle to scripting/programming end of things (thankfully)...

BTW Troy, if you are interested in putting some of that effort and knowledge towards some cash, let me know....I have projects that I need to contract work out on....just a thought.

Ghoste · July 23, 2005, 12:07:52 AM

It seems a little like we're all searching for an instant duplication of the old site but to tell the truth, I like this one better. Just enough of the old to be familiar and yet it's still fresh.

Charger_Fan · July 23, 2005, 01:09:14 AM

Quote from: Ghoste on July 23, 2005, 12:07:52 AM
It seems a little like we're all searching for an instant duplication of the old site but to tell the truth, I like this one better. Just enough of the old to be familiar and yet it's still fresh.

And the main thing I might add would be for members to have patience! A person can't wave a wand & have things just like before, yet better...just maintain some personal restraint & watch...this new site/home will be D-C.com, but much better!

Like I said in some other thread, Rome was not built in a day...good things take time..let's be patient, folks.

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