What modern features have you integrated into your car?

[marshallfry01]

Front disc brakes that clear 14 inch wheels
Electronic ignition
Holley 750
Thumb wheel radio restored with modern internals
New speakers

Other than that it's pretty much a stock 383 69 charger.

[Kern Dog]

Looking at some videos, it seems like installing a 518 in a 66-70 B body includes some transmission tunnel work. The torsion bar crossmember follows the shape of the transmission tunnel and it is in the tunnel where the modifications are needed. The 500 and 518 are thicker at that point than the 904s and 727s. The crossmember gets cut out where the arch is and a 1/4" thick steel bar replaces it. This provides more room and adequate strength. The bolt in section below has to be modified and be made deeper to compensate for the thicker housing there.
This gets you a good overdrive transmission that is just as durable as a 727 but with a .69 overdrive gear. This allows you to have a final drive of 2.69 with a 3.91 diff and a 2.82 with a 4.10 gear.

[Mike DC]

Looking at some videos, it seems like installing a 518 in a 66-70 B body includes some transmission tunnel work. The torsion bar crossmember follows the shape of the transmission tunnel and it is in the tunnel where the modifications are needed. The 500 and 518 are thicker at that point than the 904s and 727s. The crossmember gets cut out where the arch is and a 1/4" thick steel bar replaces it. This provides more room and adequate strength. The bolt in section below has to be modified and be made deeper to compensate for the thicker housing there.
This gets you a good overdrive transmission that is just as durable as a 727 but with a .69 overdrive gear. This allows you to have a final drive of 2.69 with a 3.91 diff and a 2.82 with a 4.10 gear.

The A518 is a good tranny but it has clearance issues.  You are definitely cutting the crossmember in a big obvious way on a 1960s-70s B/E body.  The fit is not close.


Also, the A518's oil pan hangs down about 1 inch lower than a 3spd 727/904.  (Swapping the pan won't fix it.  The A518's pan is lower because the valve body inside the pan is lower too.) 

If you are already running full-length exhaust headers, then those collectors are probably hanging down the same inch in the same area. So the A518 oil pan won't make it any worse.  But if the car has iron manifolds & stock exhaust pipes then the A518 pan will be the low point under there.  That could be big trouble if you hit it on a speed bump.   

[Nacho-RT74]

Aren't A500/518s available just for Small Blocks?

Or it does exist a modified bell housing?

I'd like to add the overdrive unit from gear vendors on my 727, but is out of budget. Once I found on a Mopar Facebook group this unit being sold by a member on $1500 and I was tempted. But I have A LOT of priorities yet.

[Kern Dog]

The A518 pan will be the low point under there.  That could be big trouble if you hit it on a speed bump.   

Yeah, for those with soggy .88 torsion bars!

[Mike DC]

Aren't A500/518s available just for Small Blocks?

Or it does exist a modified bell housing?

I'd like to add the overdrive unit from gear vendors on my 727, but is out of budget. Once I found on a Mopar Facebook group this unit being sold by a member on $1500 and I was tempted. But I have A LOT of priorities yet.

Mopar didn't make a big-block overdrive but you can convert it.  You have to manually saw/grind the bellhousing off the stock A518 case, and then bolt on a different (aftermarket) bell in its place.

If I was doing the job I might look into having the aftermarket bell welded onto the OEM case.  Cast aluminum is pretty weldable.  (I don't really know if this is wise or not.  I'm just saying I would look into it.)   

IMO a good A518 conversion is a better end result than a 727 + Gear Vendors.  The A 518's OD ratio is 0.69.  And it doesn't shorten the driveshaft too radically (which increases U-joint angles).   

This is gonna sound weird in the hot-rod hobby, but . . . I would consider using an A518 model with a lockup converter too.  It lowers the revs a couple hundred more RPM.  Yeah, I know it's conventional wisdom that lockup converters are fragile on hi-po cars.  But that same logic would say you shouldn't replace a 727 with an A518 tranny in the first place.   Do you want lower cruising revs or not? 

(Downside for sourcing the A518 tranny itself:  You don't want a fully electronic version from the later 1990s.  But you do want the 4th overdrive gear.  And if you want the lockup converter too . . . that narrows it down to just a couple of model-years to choose from.  Maybe a single year. )   

Yeah, for those with soggy .88 torsion bars!

Depends on where you drive. 

The (intentional, planned) height of speed bumps in Chicago is 3-4 inches.  The city is covered in them.  There are outliers over 4 inches. 

 

[Dino]

I have an adapter to stick a GM overdrive behind the 440, but I'm very likely just going to bite the bullet and install a T56 next year. Back to the plan from 10 years ago. 

[Mike DC]

I have an adapter to stick a GM overdrive behind the 440, but I'm very likely just going to bite the bullet and install a T56 next year. Back to the plan from 10 years ago. 

I've looked into the T56 conversions but I came out leaning more towards a 5spd TKX.  The 6spd is a MUCH BIGGER cutting job on the car chassis, it's physically heavier, and I don't like the gear ratios they sell for it.  The wide-ratio gearset (for the lower 4 gears) on the 6spd does not have very even spacing.  The wide ratio set for the 5spd is better.     

The 6spd might be the better tranny in the mechanical sense (smooth shifting at high speeds, horsepower rating, etc) but the TKX 5spd upgrade made that gap narrower.  And most street cars aren't testing these limits.   

Just my opinion.  If you want tightly-spaced lower gears then the 6spd is suitable.  I just like more of a touring-car feel to the gear spacing.  It's less muscle-car-ish but IMO it feels more natural to drive when you aren't racing anybody.   

[Kern Dog]

The Tremec 5 speed that I installed in mine has comfortable gear spacing and an excellent 5th gear. I don't see the need for a .50 top gear unless I wanted a higher top end. I have only been to 130 in the car and that was with the 727. The .64 overdrive in the TKO is great though, letting me run about 2/3 the engine speed that I run in direct drive.

[John_Kunkel]

Mopar didn't make a big-block overdrive but you can convert it.  You have to manually saw/grind the bellhousing off the stock A518 case, and then bolt on a different (aftermarket) bell in its place.

If I was doing the job I might look into having the aftermarket bell welded onto the OEM case.

 

That's what some enterprising people were doing with factory BB bell before the Ultrabell was introduced.

[cdr]

I did the ultra bell, it was not all that much modification to the tunnel, xmember I made out of the old one.

[Derwud]

I have an adapter to stick a GM overdrive behind the 440, but I'm very likely just going to bite the bullet and install a T56 next year. Back to the plan from 10 years ago. 

I got the A-41 for my Wagon, still deciding if I want to go Gen 3 or stay Small Block.

[Nacho-RT74]

I think this is not really on topic, but since floated on... well...

The GearVendors job is "easily" reversible... having the extra driveshaft for the overdrive tail housing while keeping the factory tail housing and driveshaft storaged. Just couple of hammering on tunnel to clear the speedo wire, as far I recall.

Whatever... neither the GV or any A518 will be on my car anytime soon...

[Mike DC]

I did the ultra bell, it was not all that much modification to the tunnel, xmember I made out of the old one.

Is your A518's tailshaft/U-joint at the same height as the old 727, or is it lower? 

I measured stuff for this conversion years ago. I came out thinking the stock crossmmember would have to be totally gone in the center if I wanted to keep the tailshaft height where it started.   

That top picture shows the A518 ground clearance issue I was bringing up.  The tranny pan hangs down about as low as the header collectors.  That's no problem as long as the headers are there.  On a car with iron manifolds the A518's pan & valvebody would be hanging down exposed. 

[cdr]

I did the ultra bell, it was not all that much modification to the tunnel, xmember I made out of the old one.

Is your A518's tailshaft/U-joint at the same height as the old 727, or is it lower? 

I measured stuff for this conversion years ago. I came out thinking the stock crossmmember would have to be totally gone in the center if I wanted to keep the tailshaft height where it started.   

That top picture shows the A518 ground clearance issue I was bringing up.  The tranny pan hangs down about as low as the header collectors.  That's no problem as long as the headers are there.  On a car with iron manifolds the A518's pan & valvebody would be hanging down exposed. 

Trans is 2.5 deg down. stock I have seen 3 to 3.5 down so mine is better than stock, my drive line angles are perfect car is SMOOTH all the way to 140mph, also I drive the car a lot, it is not babied, been over lots of speed bumps, NEVER have my headers or trans pan hit, lots of people use the deep pan on a 727, makes it the same as my A518. ALSO my car sits very low in the front.

[Kern Dog]

My main gripe with the Gear Vendors is the weak overdrive ratio they have. After all these years, they have never even tried to make a better ratio? .78 is better than nothing but not that great.

[Mike DC]

 
The GV overdrive is a product for bigger industrial trucks & RVs.  The muscle car kits are more of a side deal.  That's why the overdrive ratio isn't optimized for our cars.   

[Kern Dog]

It does help. The 4.10 was knocked down to a 3.20 but with a 518, that 4.10 gets dropped to a 2.82.
The noise reduction with lower cruise RPMs is absolutely fantastic. All the sound deadening in the world still can't compete with a 1000 rpm drop in engine speed.
I've thought it would be interesting to integrate turn signals in the side mirrors. Some guys have changed to LED lighting. The Holley headlights are amazing but quite pricey. I have headlight relays and Hella H1/H4 headlights. These are a lot brighter even with their base level 55/60 watt bulbs. Years ago in my Camaro, I ran 80/100 bulbs and those were amazing! I may upgrade mine to those.
I know a guy that puts a hidden GPS tracker in his classics, a system that helps follow the cars if they are ever stolen.

[Mike DC]

I've thought it would be interesting to integrate turn signals in the side mirrors.

I've thought about this too.  It's probably a matter of time before the Fed makes mirror-mounted turn signals standard on OEM cars. 

IMO it's already getting risky to keep driving these classic cars around without a high center 3rd brake light.  Those do make a real-world difference.  And modern drivers are conditioned to expect the 3rd light to be there.  Those things have been mandated on new cars for 30 years.     

[Dino]

IMO it's already getting risky to keep driving these classic cars around without a high center 3rd brake light.  Those do make a real-world difference.  And modern drivers are conditioned to expect the 3rd light to be there.  Those things have been mandated on new cars for 30 years.     

Hmm that's a good point. I should install one.

[timmycharger]

IMO it's already getting risky to keep driving these classic cars around without a high center 3rd brake light.  Those do make a real-world difference.  And modern drivers are conditioned to expect the 3rd light to be there.  Those things have been mandated on new cars for 30 years.     

Hmm that's a good point. I should install one.

what about installing brighter LED tail lights/brake lights? I would personally try that route before adding a third brake light. All I can think of is my Dad's 72 Dart in the mid 80s with an added third brake light. Looked terrible.

[Derwud]

IMO it's already getting risky to keep driving these classic cars around without a high center 3rd brake light.  Those do make a real-world difference.  And modern drivers are conditioned to expect the 3rd light to be there.  Those things have been mandated on new cars for 30 years.     

I added one and made it flash when brakes are applied.

Hmm that's a good point. I should install one.

[Mike DC]

 
The center 3rd brake light was originally tested by a big taxi company in the 1980s.  They put 3rd lights on half of their fleet (like a couple hundred cars).  The next year they compared the rates of cars getting rear-ended.  The 3rd lights had reduced it a lot. 


What feels normal to us is not normal anymore.  Today the roads are full of people who have never used a crank window. 

Keeping a classic car road-legal is one thing.  Reducing the odds of getting hit is another. 

Other drivers are used to every vehicle the road having a certain amount of brake lights.  Their 'muscle memory' instincts are attuned to that, and our old cars don't have them all.  In the practical sense we might as well be driving around with some of the regular taillight bulbs missing.     



For 3rd brake light retrofits, IMO it makes sense to mount them as high as feasible.  Like at the top of the rear window rather than the bottom.  Classic cars are ALL low-riders by modern standards.  We need the brake lights as high up as we can get them. 

[b5blue]

I saw one that is called "Braking Light" that senses extreme breaking. (?)      https://www.amazon.com/Maxsa-Innovations-Braking-Sudden-Brake/dp/B0CHZ5K46P

[Dino]

I have an adapter to stick a GM overdrive behind the 440, but I'm very likely just going to bite the bullet and install a T56 next year. Back to the plan from 10 years ago. 

I've looked into the T56 conversions but I came out leaning more towards a 5spd TKX.  The 6spd is a MUCH BIGGER cutting job on the car chassis, it's physically heavier, and I don't like the gear ratios they sell for it.  The wide-ratio gearset (for the lower 4 gears) on the 6spd does not have very even spacing.  The wide ratio set for the 5spd is better.   

The 6spd might be the better tranny in the mechanical sense (smooth shifting at high speeds, horsepower rating, etc) but the TKX 5spd upgrade made that gap narrower.  And most street cars aren't testing these limits. 

Just my opinion.  If you want tightly-spaced lower gears then the 6spd is suitable.  I just like more of a touring-car feel to the gear spacing.  It's less muscle-car-ish but IMO it feels more natural to drive when you aren't racing anybody.   

I definitely want a wide ratio. I know I can get a wide ratio T56 with the close ratio 5th and 6th, which would be fun on the highway at high speeds, but is it really worth the extra work? I wish I could try them all out first.