No politics... but seriously How long do you think we have left with these cars?

[b5blue]

Could there be a better name for an electric car? 

[lloyd3]

Well.....economics will most likely be the cause of the end of these "toys" (gasoline and possibly insurance) but environmental laws could very well be the death knell as well.

[John_Kunkel]

  Can anybody agree on anything anymore ?

Not when people cherry-pick the info sources that suit their pre-conceived notions.

[Mike DC]

If there's no reliable data then why where protections put in place? Within the same sentence we went from no reliable data
decades ago, too protections decades ago.

I'm not the one setting polar bear policies.  Go ask the Canadian & Alaskan govts.  I'm just pointing out the facts.  

I believe it's part of the "Globe" or we going by area now?

There are measurable air quality differences within a few miles when a factory/city is polluting.  It's not hard to fathom how the air might be clearer in the farthest place from human activity on the planet.  Atmospheric/weather currents also play big roles in that stuff.  

As previously stated it's still there and it's not supposed to be according to the science, also if it's the furthest place on earth
from modern human/industrial activity that would make any activity a natural occurrence and not caused by man, no money in
that way of thinking.

You say that as if there's no money in defending the FF industry, or something.  As if they haven't been actively funding research to say what they want for decades.    

The greater warming in the Arctic is thought to be a combination of weather currents + a snowballing sunlight effect.  Reduced ice cover --> less sunlight gets reflected by the ice --> the area warms more--> there is less ice cover.  

The whole mess isn't understood very well IMO.  The effect seems to be happening in the Arctic more than the Antarctic.  But the poles have always had differing conditions.  The Antarctic has a mile of ice piled on it but the Arctic has not had anything like that much (even before human climate damage).  The Arctic is also water and it's closer to human civilizations.  The Antartic is land and it's more isolated.  Lots of complexities.  

What is understood pretty well, is that atmospheric C02 levels track with higher & lower temperatures.  More CO2 in the air = higher worldwide temps.  The historical pattern is there (going back millions of years) and the mechanism is clear (greenhouse effect).   IMO the case for this is not airtight but it's pretty strong.  

Reasonably speaking it's becoming tiresome that the biggest advocates for climate are the biggest offenders, whether it's
3 or 4 mansions, private jets, etc. while pricing the average American out of the market trying to combat such.

Having 3-4 mansions is basically a requirement before you get a voice in the MSM, period.  Cable news & Hollywood award shows deal in the rich & famous.  That doesn't mean there aren't working normal people who care about the environment.  

If a news network wants to show a pro-gun-rights opinion, they will start by looking for a celebrity like Ted Nugent.   But that doesn't prove that only rich/famous people care about gun rights.  Same principle.


And realistically, I think working people have a gut-level understanding of how this stuff works.  We can demand environmental protections but that's not how it will work.  The govt will use it as leverage to milk the poor for a few more dollars while they continue to let the big industrial offenders pollute.  

. . . . but that doesn't prove that the big industries aren't in the wrong.  It doesn't prove that humans aren't causing climate damage.  It just says that we need some functioning govt for a change.

[NHCharger]

  Can anybody agree on anything anymore ?

Not when people cherry-pick the info sources that suit their pre-conceived notions.

Yup. and that's a two way street.
Problem today is no one seems to even want to hear the other sides point of view. And then from there it just escalates to the point of "I'm going to jam my opinion down your throat weather you like it or not".
This is the result of today's "keyboard society". Instead of a civil face to face discussion you can hide behind a keyboard with a cool nickname and be as rude and disrespectful as you want with minimum to no consequences. 

[odcics2]

The rest of the world is going electric.
As they say, "Lead, follow, or get out of the way. "

[Todd Wilson]

We wont go all electric until the earth is out of fossil fuel.

Todd

[Mike DC]

            
The stone age didn't end because we ran out of stone.  Nor the bronze age, or the iron age.  

In the 1800s our ships & trains used to burn coal.  We switched to oil in the 1900s.  It wasn't because we ran out of coal.  


We change resources when the tech improves and/or the financial math changes.  Natural resource industries always grab the cheapest/easiest supplies first.  We started using the cheapest oil a century ago.  Now we go to great lengths to get the same stuff.    

Oil will never "run out".  And I doubt we will ever stop using oil entirely (at least not in the foreseeable future, like the next 100 years).  The tech and financial math will just continue to change.    

[green69rt]

My thoughts agree with Mike.  Economics will be the factor that drives ICE cars off the road.  How you get to those economics is the big question.  Do we tax gas away or subsidize EV's till ICE cars can't complete.  Personally I am putting my bet on technology.  Batteries will keep getting better and better until they overwhelm any alternative. But how long to get there and at what cost??

[Davtona]

           
The stone age didn't end because we ran out of stone.  Nor the bronze age, or the iron age.  

In the 1800s our ships & trains used to burn coal.  We switched to oil in the 1900s.  It wasn't because we ran out of coal.  

We change resources when the tech improves and/or the financial math changes.  Natural resource industries always grab the cheapest/easiest supplies first.  We started using the cheapest oil a century ago.  Now we go to great lengths to get the same stuff.    

My thoughts agree with Mike.  

X3

Battery technology is improving fast which is improving range and lowering the cost of EV's. Soon within 5 years or less EV's will be cheaper to produce than ICE vehicles. At that point its game over. Have you ever ridden in a Tesla? Have you seen the specs on a Model S Plaid Performance version. Zero to 60 in under 2 seconds and 1/4 mile time under 9 seconds. Under 9 seconds on a fully street able car you can not distinguish from any other car on the road. The fastest "Production car" ever built bar none. Look I am as big a fan of our cars as anybody & have been a muscle car enthusiast since I bought my first car in 1973. I'm not getting rid of them either. But times change and technology improves. EV's are not our old cars they are just drivers. Fast drivers however hence their appeal. There is no working on them swapping parts, restoring or modifying them. Cost of operation is however considerably lower than ICE vehicles. Fuel cost per mile comparison somewhere in the 140 mpg range. My brother has a Model 3 he ordered in March 2016 and took delivery of in August 2018. The first in our area. Its a blast to drive and at 27,000 on the odometer he has has to do nothing to it except charge it and add wiper fluid. For a year he did not show it to me because he knew what cars I loved. He did not think my reaction would be good. He could not have been more wrong. A lot of changes are coming in the next 10 years or so due to technology. We will see more and more of this coming because our generation will be driving the future less and less. The younger generations realize what we are doing & have done to this planet that they will inherit and are changing things slowly but they will pick up speed going forward. I frankly don't blame them I support them.

[AKcharger]

           
...In the 1800s our ships & trains used to burn coal.  We switched to oil in the 1900s.  It wasn't because we ran out of coal...We change resources when the tech improves and/or the financial math changes....

Mike for the Win!!! 

[Nacho-RT74]

now I'm wondering how boring will be the electric performance parts market!!!!

[Nacho-RT74]

Could there be a better name for an electric car? 

I guess our cars should be rebadged DISCHARGER ?

[Mike DC]

Mike for the Win!!! 

Thanks 

[ACUDANUT]

A short video worth watching.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqppRC37OgI

Winner winner

[MoparMike68]

A short video worth watching.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqppRC37OgI

Winner winner

 Thanks           

[Mike DC]

 
Whatever floats your boats.   

[hemi-hampton]

Tesla Charging Station, what could go wrong?

[Kern Dog]

I love that picture!

[Ghoste]

How long will we want them is the better question.  Mike is spot on, the technology is changing even without government influence (a bipartisan statement) and subsidy, the demographic is changing and societal perception is changing.  No matter what you feel personally, the interest in our cars is shrinking and although gasoline may be around for a long time yet (possibly 10-15 years or more), it is going to become increasingly expensive.  The profit margin will shrink and costs to produce will go up and let us not forget taxation.  Road taxes made from gasoline will need to be increased and the new carbon taxes are turning into an enormous windfall for the governments.  Expect them to increase.
My point is that it is going to become exceedingly expensive to drive the old technology very soon.  It isnt just that the new one is getting cheaper, ours is getting higher.

[Challenger340]

A short video worth watching.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqppRC37OgI

Winner winner

Hilarious !
A video that is MOST DEFINITELY worth watching..... so you understand where it came from and WHY.... thereby answering many questions around mis-information and FAKE NEWS Propaganda !


"PragerU", short for Prager University, and despite the name, PragerU is NOT an academic institution, but rather is an American 501(c)(3) NON PROFIT MEDIA COMPANY....

"PragerU" does not hold classes, grant certifications or diplomas, and is not accredited by any recognized body....PragerU merely creates videos on various political, economic, and philosophical topics from an American conservative perspective


That said....
Gasoline powered classics aren't going anywhere anytime soon.... they will be around for literally many decades

[Challenger340]

How long will we want them is the better question.  Mike is spot on, the technology is changing even without government influence (a bipartisan statement) and subsidy, the demographic is changing and societal perception is changing.  No matter what you feel personally, the interest in our cars is shrinking and although gasoline may be around for a long time yet (possibly 10-15 years or more), it is going to become increasingly expensive.  The profit margin will shrink and costs to produce will go up and let us not forget taxation.  Road taxes made from gasoline will need to be increased and the new carbon taxes are turning into an enormous windfall for the governments.  Expect them to increase.
My point is that it is going to become exceedingly expensive to drive the old technology very soon.  It isnt just that the new one is getting cheaper, ours is getting higher.

IMO, everything is going to get very expensive very soon.... not just driving our old classics ?   Meaning that 'proportionally' Vrs the wider economy, there may be increases to those costs ? but not as dramatic or DIS-proportional as we may think.

Look at the price of a 2 X 4 of Lumber ? 4 X 8 Sheet of Plywood ? and not just lumber.... look into all commodities futures/asset classes/stocks ?
Unless anyone here has any ideas to explain HOW Dow valuations are at 31,000 after a YEAR of COVID ?

[Bronzedodge]

That video - copper is NOT considered a rare earth metal.

[b5blue]

  I've seen reported that 1% control 80% of stock market. Up or down brokers profit. GM is already yammin to Washington about E.V. infrastructure for cars not built yet. Insurance mandates will end our ride now that they have convinced all for to be mandatory. (I can ride a 6 or 200HP motorcycle with no helmet but must be seat belted inside my 2 ton SUV to go 2 miles under 20MPH.) 
  We grow corn to inject fuel with it while some go hungry and are coating the planet with polymers. When is the last time you used something 50 years old?
Yet we persist!

[ACUDANUT]

How long will we want them is the better question.  Mike is spot on, the technology is changing even without government influence (a bipartisan statement) and subsidy, the demographic is changing and societal perception is changing.  No matter what you feel personally, the interest in our cars is shrinking and although gasoline may be around for a long time yet (possibly 10-15 years or more), it is going to become increasingly expensive.  The profit margin will shrink and costs to produce will go up and let us not forget taxation.  Road taxes made from gasoline will need to be increased and the new carbon taxes are turning into an enormous windfall for the governments.  Expect them to increase.
My point is that it is going to become exceedingly expensive to drive the old technology very soon.  It isnt just that the new one is getting cheaper, ours is getting higher.

IMO, everything is going to get very expensive very soon.... not just driving our old classics ?   Meaning that 'proportionally' Vrs the wider economy, there may be increases to those costs ? but not as dramatic or DIS-proportional as we may think.

Look at the price of a 2 X 4 of Lumber ? 4 X 8 Sheet of Plywood ? and not just lumber.... look into all commodities futures/asset classes/stocks ?
Unless anyone here has any ideas to explain HOW Dow valuations are at 31,000 after a YEAR of COVID ?

Well if a 16 y/o makes 15.00 a hour (if he chooses to work) everything else is going to go up too.