Holley Sniper EFI. Who's done it?

[BrianShaughnessy]

Messing with Sinnamon yesterday and stripped a float bowl screw hole.  (FYI they are 12-24 threads and you have to order heli-coil kit because NOBODY carries them!)   Getting kinda old and tired of messing with carbs. 

So I'm getting a plan together to put on a Sniper kit.    Maybe not the ignition part as yet, just the EFI since it seems straight forward with a self learning computer... and I'm too lazy to learn how to program this crap.

What I'm curious about is the fuel pump / tank situation.     If what I'm reading is correct,  Sniper is a dead head and doesn't require a return line ? 

So the options are to use an 1. external pump with filters as supplied with the 'master kit'  2. EFI fuel tank with built in pump ( either Holley, Tanks Inc., CPP or whoever else... ) or 3. Holley 255 LPH OE Style Efi Fuel Tank Module.    Lazy me would probably just go with this Holley 255 module.

So what's the good / bad on Sniper from anyone that's converted?

[cdr]

If this is how you feel about it , DO NOT put EFI on your Charger" quote . and I'm too lazy to learn how to program this crap.

[chargerbr549]

I would try an edelbrock thunder series AVS 800 cfm  before going the FI route if it was me. I put one of these on my 512 in my 69 Charger and it idles great and has great throttle response, just a possible option?

[darbgnik]

I've installed a Sniper EFI on my car and used the complete EFI tank. Inside the tank is usually the quietest place for a pump.

It does need a feed and a return line. The whole thing wasn't a terribly big job, but not insignificant. The wiring takes a little finesse if that isn't your thing. You have to use a diode or similar solution around the ballast resistor if you still have one.

[BrianShaughnessy]

I would try an edelbrock thunder series AVS 800 cfm  before going the FI route if it was me. I put one of these on my 512 in my 69 Charger and it idles great and has great throttle response, just a possible option?

My 800 spreadbore DP holley isn't bad idling and runs decent most of the time.   I'm just looking for something more.     I'd probably be a lot happier mounting electric fuel pumps to stop the hassles of starting after either of my 2 pigs sit for 2 weeks between startups.     But if I'm gonna do that...  then it just keeps on going. 

And carbs seem to have gotten ridiculously priced of late.    Go figure.

[BrianShaughnessy]

If this is how you feel about it , DO NOT put EFI on your Charger" quote . and I'm too lazy to learn how to program this crap.

Too lazy to learn to program fuel / timing curves etc with some other EFI systems - especially multi-port.   Set it up and forget it is about all I care to do.

[BrianShaughnessy]

I've installed a Sniper EFI on my car and used the complete EFI tank. Inside the tank is usually the quietest place for a pump.

It does need a feed and a return line. The whole thing wasn't a terribly big job, but not insignificant. The wiring takes a little finesse if that isn't your thing. You have to use a diode or similar solution around the ballast resistor if you still have one.

Thanks.   I had conflicting info on the return line.   Considering that, the tank is probably the best option for me.   I'd probably have to run a larger return line that the 1/4" I have now.   I'm not thrilled with running the rubber lines all the way like I see in some of the videos.  I know I can always order another 5/16 or 3/8 line from Fine Lines or whatever.

The 'kits' external pump video show a pre-filter, pump and after-filter which would be a hassle to mount somewhere with the diff / tank clearance available.   Meanwhile that module Holley sells doesn't have a return line - which I'm not sure why but for as much as they're charging,  would have seemed to be a no-brainer to me   

[darbgnik]

Well that in tank fuel module you referenced doesn't need a return line, as the regulator is in the tank.....

[BrianShaughnessy]

Well that in tank fuel module you referenced doesn't need a return line, as the regulator is in the tank.....

https://www.holley.com/products/fuel_systems/fuel_pumps_regulators_and_filters/fuel_pumps/muscle_car_efi_modules/parts/12-314


Thanks...   Getting myself confused...   

[fastmark]

I've gotten several friends who have given up on the fi tech unit and one who had the MSD unit. The Holley seems to be better on a motor with a stock cam. My best friend has one on his Chevelle. It has a big cam. His cheap Holley does not like the big cam and can't seem to learn the correct file curve. He messes with it all the time. Richard Nebal told me the more expensive Holley unit works better because the computer has more parameters to work with. Idk. I have no trouble with carbs for me and my customers. I've goy one guy who insists on a fuel injection unit. The best ones have the return line system. I'll buy mine through Richard Nebal so I can get a tuning program and help. Fastmanefi.com. He's a mopar EFI guru. He trains all the Holley techs support guys. Good luck.

[BrianShaughnessy]

I've gotten several friends who have given up on the fi tech unit and one who had the MSD unit. The Holley seems to be better on a motor with a stock cam. My best friend has one on his Chevelle. It has a big cam. His cheap Holley does not like the big cam and can't seem to learn the correct file curve. He messes with it all the time. Richard Nebal told me the more expensive Holley unit works better because the computer has more parameters to work with. Idk. I have no trouble with carbs for me and my customers. I've goy one guy who insists on a fuel injection unit. The best ones have the return line system. I'll buy mine through Richard Nebal so I can get a tuning program and help. Fastmanefi.com. He's a mopar EFI guru. He trains all the Holley techs support guys. Good luck.

Thanks     Computers don't like cams with lobes at 108 that I recall...  the wider the better.   

[Paul G]

EFI is not an install and forget it thing. Self learn is misleading. You must give the the EFI some parameters to shoot for. A non stock engine will want different parameters than a stock engine, and there is a lot more in between. Setting up the EFI is easier than modifying a carb, but you will have a learning curve. I guarantee it wont run right out of the box. You will have to learn how to tweek it. 

[bigdsul]

I just got the complete Holley EFI system for my project car and will have it on the car once the bodywork is done.

The setup looks pretty straightforward and adjusts itself on the fly after successful installation. I spoke with a tech over at Holley and he said the only issues people have had with the setup were those who winged the installation without using the instruction manual.

I've talked to a couple local charger guys here in town that have the EFI system and they like it over the traditional carburetor.

[Challenger340]

If this is how you feel about it , DO NOT put EFI on your Charger" quote . and I'm too lazy to learn how to program this crap.

That's some REALLY good advice right there from Charlie !  

and that said....
because we see this all the time as we typically run the Engines in on a Carb on the Engine Dyno before switching over to EFI...... and yes we've tuned/power run the Carb first before switching over to EFI.
Generally speaking....
we see between 15-20 hp up to 25 hp and same Ft/Lb Torque losses going to a Holley Sniper System on a 500hp 500ft/lb BB Mopar from a well tuned 750 cfm downleg booster Holley Dyno Carb(which is small for those Engines).
and yes....
we've spent time with the Holley Sniper's trying to tune back UP to where we were with the 750 Dyno Carb..... we must be doing it wrong as we never get there.

[cbrestorations]

I've driven cross country many times in the last few years with these big block chargers and carb sucks when traveling. Spent many a hrs tuning at home before the trip with air bleeds, jets, blade positioning, idle jet restrictors to get my AFR ratios tits 13.5 idle, 13.2 cruising and 12.8 wot. Just 3hrs  out of town headed to North Dakota from vegas the elevation changes 4,000ft. Pull over lower the floats and change air bleeds, then hrs later it's dark and temps drop 20 degrees. Pull over raise floats. This happend several times over a 2 day trip trying to keep AFR's perfect. I could have just left it alone and ran rich pretty much 80 percent of the trip like everybody else did but that's also why engines didn't last aslong, washed out cylinders and fouled plugs every oil change...I saw about 1.5 point change in AFR ratio just in cruising speeds. Roughly close to that at wot. Idle AFR was only about .75 point change.

On that last trip with carburetor I got 11mpg In a 69 charger with a 426" 550hp engine, 2600 stall, 727, 2.93 gear and 255/60 tires. Pulling a car trailer with another charger on the trailer doing 70-75mph avg.

This is why efi is great, it self tunes itself to elevation and temperature change, something carburetors can't do in their own and most of the people who think they know how to tune carbs have only changed jets, which does nothing at cruising speeds or idle which is 95 percent of what you drive on. Takes a lot of know how to get a carb really good street tuned. I like carbs and I run them on most my cars but cuz it's local driving most of the time but everytime I'm on a long trip I'm thinking...soon as I get home I'm ripping this m*%#?=?  F@$%ing dinosaur toilet off and going efi. But I don't cuz soon as I get back home where it's calibrated to it runs tits again 🤷‍♂️ If I didn't have an AFR gauge in the car I wouldn't even realize how much temp and elevation changes how ur carb is tuned as it still drives normal but I can see how off it really is

[cdr]

For those that dont know, I obviously am not against EFI, my point was learn about HOW to use it & set it up. This is my STREET car, Hilborn Holley EFI, 14 mpg.it has 8 separate Throttle blades , 8 injectors.  tune each cyl

[cbrestorations]

For those that dont know, I obviously am not against EFI, my point was learn about HOW to use it & set it up. This is my STREET car, Hilborn Holley EFI, 14 mpg.it has 8 separate Throttle blades , 8 injectors.  tune each cyl

Looks killer

[cdr]

For those that dont know, I obviously am not against EFI, my point was learn about HOW to use it & set it up. This is my STREET car, Hilborn Holley EFI, 14 mpg.it has 8 separate Throttle blades , 8 injectors.  tune each cyl

Looks killer

Thank you Chris !!!

[BrianShaughnessy]

For those that dont know, I obviously am not against EFI, my point was learn about HOW to use it & set it up. This is my STREET car, Hilborn Holley EFI, 14 mpg.it has 8 separate Throttle blades , 8 injectors.  tune each cyl

Great looking setup and car!   Congrats!   However far beyond what I had envisioned for my own needs.

Thanks to a medical wake up call 6 months ago..  I'm not going to be a slave to either of my cars.  I just want easy peasy.   The other week I almost hatched another car build plot to possibly make a Silver Bullet clone deal but that didn't come to pass.  I'd have made that easy - wrecked hellkitty drivetrain.   

[Armycopter]

My dad put one in his 1964 Ford Galaxie 500 Convertible earlier this summer. It's still not running correctly. He has had a ton of problems with it. I think it will be great once he gets it sorted out.

[fastmark]

I've got a bud who is still having trouble with his Holley unit. After a year of struggling, he contacted Richard Nebal and paid the tech fee to help him learn how to tune it. He developed  the fuel injection system for Ford years ago with several other guys. He trains all the Holley techs. Good luck getting anyone at Holley right now. I can even get them to answer my calls to buy parts! My bud says he would never have figured it out without Richards help. He has figured out the the "learning " program is part of his problem. He has a big cam that barely works the power brakes. I'm not sure of the numbers. As it learns, it wants to increase the fuel to much at lower rpms. It is ruining the O2 sensor with excess fuel. He is having better results now that he has turned off the learning feature for under 2000 rpm and just sets the fuel mixture manually. It seems to work better now. Went with him to the dragstrip last Friday and it would just spin the street tires at full throttle most of the way down the track. He's looking for cheater slicks now!
Yesterday, I was talking to another friend who was having the more expensive Holley unit installed and was having the same problem, it's fueling too much at idle. I asked him about the vacuum and he can't work the power brakes. His cam is 240 degrees on the intake at .050. I don't think his installer is smart enough to figure out how to work the computer. Lol!