Bonds Is About To Do Something Historic...Does Anyone Care?

[Chris G.]

Does anyone care? I mean this guy is breaking a major record. I just don't see the hype that I was expecting when, or if the Babe was passed. The whole HR's in a season thing was big a few years back, but it seems as this isn't such a big deal. I kinda know why it's not that huge (no pun Mr. Bonds), but seriously, this guy is a about to pass the biggest name in Baseball history. I thought 3 records would never be broken...1. The hits record, 2. The hitting streak record, and 3. The HR record.

Thoughts?...

[Brock Samson]

 FYI:
   I took the call from the original annon. tipster. asking if we would be interested in a little company named BALCO,.. Sometimes I actually do something around here... 

[chargerboy69]

He is a steroid freak. Thats why I don't care. . . . Oh, and I am a ATLANTA BRAVES FAN. . .John Smoltz for President .

[MassCharger73]

He's a cheater. And besides Hank Aaron holds the record, not Babe Ruth.

[69_Hemi_Charger]

Personally I think that he shouldn't even be allowed to get the record. He's a cheater and why should he be rewarded for doing so? I even say take away all of his records, but allow him to keep playing. Cheaters never win, and will always be found out eventually.

[BigBlackDodge]

I think Aaron holds it with 755. He broke Ruths record back when our beloved muscle cars were fairly new..........'74.

Zero respect for Bonds.


BBD

[TheGhost]

Ah, but the Babe didn't use steriods.  I doubt that Hank Aarons did, either.



Bonds does not deserve this honor.  I hope he chokes the rest of the season.  I will laugh my ass off if that happens.

[Blown70]

HMMM I do not reacall a positive test?  Yes he has a black eye from the BALCO deal  You have a guess how many pros are doing that?

I have been and am encouraged.  I hope he continues toward his goal.

Tom

[Lowprofile]

Most people don't care because of the obvious reason..........

[dkn1997]

Aaron and Maris should be the only recognized home run kings. 

Ruth deserves special consideration 1. because maris took more games to break the single season record and 2. Ruth did it in an era where 20 in a season was a very big number.  He had more homeruns than a couple of entire teams that year!!

Aaron is the only one who you can truly say is not up for discussion.  100% legit, he did it, no cheating, bla bla bla.

Even Ruth was probably credited with, by some accounts, with a couple that bounced over the wall (ground rule double today)

[HDCharger]

Bonds went from about 175 when he first came into the league to about 225 solid muscle.  Did he do it on weights and protein?  I doubt it.  Just look back at his ballcards and pictures, its pretty obvious.  Aaron did it fair and square.  When the Babe played the pitchers mound was 6" taller giving a much bigger advantage to the pitcher.  In addition, they used way less balls the entire game than they do now.  Pitch in the dirt gets a new ball.  Balls got soft in the old days and didn't fly near as far. 

[69charger2002]

aaron should not be passed by bonds.. simple as that. breaking ruth is not really breaking the record.. have you ever looked at hank aaron up close? he wasn't even that big of a guy.. that's IMPRESSIVE.. no real hitter's ballparks.. they were usually all 330 down the line. 400 in center. period. PLUS the fact that he never hit over 47 in one season. that's incredible. consistent, legit, and record holding. aaron should keep the record.. at least for now
trav

[Old Moparz]

Bonds? He's just an obnoxious player that happens to be good. I don't like him, but he is entertainment I suppose. Without any doubt, I do think he & many others used steroids. Just like Bill Clinton never had sex, what a crock of s**t all that is. It's all a big circus with tons of money pumped into it, just not my money. I love baseball, but the last time I was at a game was in the early 90's & it was when someone gave me a ticket. I follow the games in the paper, but rarely watch on TV since my satellite company won't pay Steinbrenner his fee to get the Yankee games.

Personally, I have more respect for players from years ago that played for the shear love of the game. I just saw an interview with Willy Mays & think that he was a big fan of the game as well as a good player. I don't care what players earn, all the more power to them. If the dumb ass owners are willing to pay stupid money, then they have no right to complain about high priced players. It's no different when some bonehead pays $1 million dollars for a Hemi car & wonders why he can't sell it for more later.

I'd like to see all players become steroid users. Let them experiment with whatever they want to try, or even surgery to add another arm or a pair of legs. Think about it, if you have a guy like Bonds or McGuire with all that power AND a third arm, imagine how hard they could swing a bat. Another pair of legs might set some base stealing records too. Just make them sign a waiver that they won't bleed the health care system when they get some rare disease later on & don't know why.

Let the records happen, it doesn't matter anymore anyway.

[nh_mopar_fan]

He's a scumbag, cheating lowlife as well as being a poor excuse for a human being. Other than the buttswabs in San Francisco, the rest of the fans are booing his ass, as well they should.

[BB1]

 

[RD]

just hypothetically speaking...

is it entirely possible that a man in 10 years can put on 50 lbs of muscle through proper exercise, dieting, and weightlifting?  If that is true (10 years is a long time ya know) then maybe, just maybe steroids only helped a little and the rest was on him.  Who knows? Oh and personally, I do not give a sheit

[Mike DC]

 
I agree that the steriod controversy has basically removed all legitimacy from Bond's achievments in the public's mind.

And part of his problem is that Bonds has never courted the press at all. 
Mark McGwire was probably just as doped up as Bonds is, but his good personality/public image gave people more incentive to lend some benefit-of-the-doubt.  Barry Bonds doesn't have a lot of good will to fall back on when the scandals come knocking.

 

[Old Moparz]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/video/2005/08/01/VI2005080100834.html


       

[RD]

 
I agree that the steriod controversy has basically removed all legitimacy from Bond's achievments in the public's mind.

And part of his problem is that Bonds has never courted the press at all. 
Mark McGwire was probably just as doped up as Bonds is, but his good personality/public image gave people more incentive to lend some benefit-of-the-doubt.  Barry Bonds doesn't have a lot of good will to fall back on when the scandals come knocking.

 

good point mike, i think it's just that bonds is black and palmeiro is hispanic...  ITS RACIST!!!! 

I say that somewhat in jest, but answer me this, WHY ARE THERE NO WHITE GUYS GETTING HEAT ABOUT STEROIDS?

someone answer that one!

edit:   

[BrianShaughnessy]

I'm no Bonds fan.     I just barely keep aware of most sports anymore.    I follow my old Detroit teams from a distance.     So here's my 2 cents.

MLB had a chance to come clean awhile back but instead they took the $.    While there were no rules against what McGwire did at the time,  there probably should have been.     Same with the rest of them at the time and throw Bonds in there too because that's when he started.

Aaron gets his due for being Mr. Consistant year after year in an age when racism was rampant and he lived through death threats if he broke the Babe's record.   Those of us around in then know it was a big deal and there was a lot of hatred.    I don't blame him a bit for appearing angry at times now.    
 
Ruth gets his due just because after all this time,  he is a legend and we still refer to him even tho he's been dead 50+ years.    If you ask me,  he got ph8cked on that SI greatest athletes of the 20th century deal coming in 2nd to Michael Jordan (who ).    He's the guy that started it all.   He was a pitcher for years also and didn't get to bat half the time.   Shorter seasons and dead balls were just a few of the things he had to contend with.

No,  Bonds is not about to do something historic because Aaron already did it...    maybe next year if he's around if he passes Aaron by some chance.    I think he'll probably be on the DL shortly.      

Oh yeah....   Secretariat should have been 2nd on that list with Ruth #1.        

[nh_mopar_fan]

 
I agree that the steriod controversy has basically removed all legitimacy from Bond's achievments in the public's mind.

And part of his problem is that Bonds has never courted the press at all. 
Mark McGwire was probably just as doped up as Bonds is, but his good personality/public image gave people more incentive to lend some benefit-of-the-doubt.  Barry Bonds doesn't have a lot of good will to fall back on when the scandals come knocking.

 

good point mike, i think it's just that bonds is black and palmeiro is hispanic...  ITS RACIST!!!! 

I say that somewhat in jest, but answer me this, WHY ARE THERE NO WHITE GUYS GETTING HEAT ABOUT STEROIDS?

someone answer that one!

Well, Ken Caminiti is dead....

[4402tuff4u]

....................................................................(the sound of crickets)

[mikepmcs]

Knew most of these stats being a 3rd gen Yankees fan(i do believe the first word out of my mouth was yankees)
but thought i'd get some statistical garb for you all to chew on.  Just to end(or not) the discussion on who is and always will be the greatest slugger of all time, not to mention he swung a telephone pole for a bat.
"The sultan of swat" although some of his records have been eclipsed will always be the greatest "slugger" of all time.

Sportswriter Bill Broeg once wrote, "to try to capture Babe Ruth with cold statistics would be like trying to keep up with him on a night out."


Name        Games   At-bats   HRs
=================================
Aaron       3298     12,364   755
Mays        2992     10,881   660
Ruth        2503      8,399   714

Aaron and Mays played far more games than Babe Ruth did, mostly because Ruth spent his first four seasons as a pitcher. Both had many more at-bats than the Babe did. Ruth hit a home run in 8.5% of his at-bats, while Aaron and Mays went yard 6.1% of the time.
To put it another way, how would the career numbers stack up if Mays and Ruth had had Aaron's 12,364 at-bats, assuming that they hit home runs at the same rate over the extra time?
Name     Projected HRs
======================
Ruth               1051
Aaron              755
Mays               750

The thing about Babe Ruth is not only that he hit a ridiculous number of home runs, it's also that he hit an even more ridiculous number than his contemporaries. The Babe out-homered whole teams many times. Someone on ESPN.com (it might have been Rob Neyer, I can't find it any more) once determined that if every season had been as homer-happy as 1998 and Ruth had hit them at the same relative rate to the rest of the league, he'd have wound up with over 2000 for his career. He really was a giant among Lilliputians in his time.

(Astute statheads may be grumbling at this point about Aaron and Mays playing in the pitcher-dominated 1960s, and how they might have done in a more offense-friendly era. I acknowledge the dissonance but cannot give you a good answer. I recommend pestering someone at the Baseball Prospectus.)

Now let's add Barry to the mix. As it happens, his stats through 2002 are a pretty decent match for the Babe's.
Name        Games   At-bats   HRs
=================================
Aaron       3298     12,364   755
Mays        2992     10,881   660
Ruth        2503      8,399   714
Bonds       2439      8,335   613


Name     Projected HRs
======================
Ruth              1051
Bonds              909
Aaron              755
Mays               750

Bonds goes deep 7.4% of the time, meaning the advantage is still Ruth's.

Oh and he wasn't as fat and as slow as everything makes him out to be, for most of his career he was in standards compared to a lot of players today.

Like all those fatties on the red sox 

[nh_mopar_fan]

Oh, and Giambi went through hell last year as well. They wanted to find a way to terminate his contract and dump him.

[41husk]

I thought Mark McGuire was white

[mikepmcs]

I thought Mark McGuire was white

He is, but what is that in reference to?

[Shakey]

Is James Bonds black - or does that matter?   

Who cares if this Bonds character is about to do something Hispanic.  It's a free country.

[RD]

Is James Bonds black - or does that matter?   

Who cares if this Bonds character is about to do something Hispanic.  It's a free country.

ummm... huh?

[66ragtop]

I saw a photo from the AP this week when the Giants were in Philly.  It showed Bonds on his way to the outfield and in the stands there was a group of fans holding up a HUGE sign that read " Ruth did it on hotdogs and beer".  I think that says it all.  He's a cheater period! 

[Charge It!]

This "historic" thing only puts him in second place. The record will still stand.

[dkn1997]

good point mike, i think it's just that bonds is black and palmeiro is hispanic...  ITS RACIST!!!! 

I say that somewhat in jest, but answer me this, WHY ARE THERE NO WHITE GUYS GETTING HEAT ABOUT STEROIDS?

someone answer that one!

Say that when Mark Mcgwire Does NOT get into the hall of fame.  He won't.  His testimony before congress pretty much ruined any chance he had at the hall of fame or any association with baseball.

I am sure that the next white guy who threatens the most sacred record in the game will catch heat if he's on the sauce.

And you want to talk about racist?  Bonds has said publicly that he only wants to break ruth's record, not Aarons.  Gee, wonder why that is?   Bonds is a scumbag who would be equally scummy if you dropped him into a drum of baby powder... he's a disgrace to his father and his godfather (mays) 

At least we won't have to endure a celebration when he passes the babe, selig has already said "we don't celebrate the guy who got into 2nd place"

Aaron did it fair and square, I hope he has the guts to boycott Bonds if his record gets broken.

[Dans 68]

Hell, yes! Bonds is going to pass a legend. Ruth is the quintessential superstar, and Barry deserves accolades. Do you know how hard it is to hit a moving spheroid? He is one of the best at it. It matters that he has not tested positive for illegal drugs, and that until relatively recently steroids were not considered wrong, or that greenies (amphetamines) during the 60's and 70's were used widely to combat fatigue, especially for a day game following a night game. Is that cheating? How about excessive amounts of caffeine?  Training at altitude? I like Bonds. And the fact that he is rude and abusive of the media is a positive to me  . And, yes, I am a Giants fan.

Dan

And as far as MLB not acknowledging HR 715, special baseballs, per MLB (read Selig) will be used when Barry Lamar Bonds comes up to hit....

[nh_mopar_fan]

Hell, yes! Bonds is going to pass a legend. Ruth is the quintessential superstar, and Barry deserves accolades. Do you know how hard it is to hit a moving spheroid? He is one of the best at it. It matters that he has not tested positive for illegal drugs, and that until relatively recently steroids were not considered wrong, or that greenies (amphetamines) during the 60's and 70's were used widely to combat fatigue, especially for a day game following a night game. Is that cheating? How about excessive amounts of caffeine?  Training at altitude? I like Bonds. And the fact that he is rude and abusive of the media is a positive to me  . And, yes, I am a Giants fan.

Dan

And as far as MLB not acknowledging HR 715, special baseballs, per MLB (read Selig) will be used when Barry Lamar Bonds comes up to hit....

Oh please. Steriods have always been illegal and that lowlife has perjured himself before a grand jury already. Your claim thathe hasn't tested positive is crap. You want to compare taking illegal drugs with caffiene and training at altitude?

It amazes me the extent that the Barry buttswabs will go to in an effort to justify this cheating lowlife.

[RD]

Hell, yes! Bonds is going to pass a legend. Ruth is the quintessential superstar, and Barry deserves accolades. Do you know how hard it is to hit a moving spheroid? He is one of the best at it. It matters that he has not tested positive for illegal drugs, and that until relatively recently steroids were not considered wrong, or that greenies (amphetamines) during the 60's and 70's were used widely to combat fatigue, especially for a day game following a night game. Is that cheating? How about excessive amounts of caffeine?  Training at altitude? I like Bonds. And the fact that he is rude and abusive of the media is a positive to me  . And, yes, I am a Giants fan.

Dan

And as far as MLB not acknowledging HR 715, special baseballs, per MLB (read Selig) will be used when Barry Lamar Bonds comes up to hit....

Oh please. Steriods have always been illegal and that lowlife has perjured himself before a grand jury already. Your claim thathe hasn't tested positive is crap. You want to compare taking illegal drugs with caffiene and training at altitude?

It amazes me the extent that the Barry buttswabs will go to in an effort to justify this cheating lowlife.

buttswabs? now is that really necessary? let's keep it civil at least geez.

synonyms that could have been used to get your point across:

Barry "FANS"
Barry "loyalists"
Barry "sympathizers"
Barry "supporters"

took me less than 30 seconds to think of those.

[nh_mopar_fan]

Well, you're just so much quicker than I am.

If Barry stopped short, these people would have an issue.

[RD]

Well, you're just so much quicker than I am.

If Barry stopped short, these people would have an issue.

smartass LOL hehehehe

[nh_mopar_fan]

 

[69_Hemi_Charger]

I saw a photo from the AP this week when the Giants were in Philly.  It showed Bonds on his way to the outfield and in the stands there was a group of fans holding up a HUGE sign that read " Ruth did it on hotdogs and beer".  I think that says it all.  He's a cheater period! 

Hot Dogs and Beer will get you anywhere.... 

[472 R/T SE]

I saw a photo from the AP this week when the Giants were in Philly.  It showed Bonds on his way to the outfield and in the stands there was a group of fans holding up a HUGE sign that read " Ruth did it on hotdogs and beer".  I think that says it all.  He's a cheater period! 

Hot Dogs and Beer will get you anywhere.... 

This one? 

[nh_mopar_fan]

That is GREAT!

[MassCharger73]

Nice !

[bull]

He tied the record, but I still don't care: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb

[69_Hemi_Charger]

He tied the record, but I still don't care: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb

i'll never get excited about a cheater

[nh_mopar_fan]

Imagine my luck. I happen to have his rookie card.

[69DodgeCharger]

Imagine my luck. I happen to have his rookie card.

Hey you stole that..........Give credit where credit is due!


Records of note.

1. Cy Youngs 511 wins...This will never be broken. In fact there is a very strong possibility that nobody will ever even reach 400 to threaten Walter Johnson's mark of 417 in second. The only two that even remotely have a chance at this point is Roger Clemens with 352, or Greg Maddux with 340. But time is working against them. In fact they will be lucky to match or pass Christy Mathewson and Grover Alexander with 373 wins for third but it is possible if they can stay healthy.

2. Joe DiMaggio's 56 game hitting streak. This record could possibly be beaten, but it could be a while. The only people to even threaten this record  since Joe D. set it are:

1. Pete Rose 44 games in 1978
2. Paul Molitor 39 games in 1987

Stolen bases:

Ricky Henderson with 1,406 nobody else is even remotely close at this point.

Batting Averages:

Lifetime BA, Ty Cob .367 this will never be broken. Rogers Hornsby was close with .358

No Hitters...Nolan Ryan with 7 Another record that will probably never be broken. It is likely his career strikeout record may never be broken either.

[Troy]

What about Pete's 4,256 hits? I was listening to some commentary about "unbreakable" records and the general consensus was that A-Rod has a legitimate shot at passing Bonds in home runs but a lot of the other records require such a long amount of time that most "modern" players won't have the stamina to even get close. Many records were set due to the love of the game and competitive spirit but that seems lost any more.

One other point I heard last night about Bonds: Babe Ruth ate, drank, and partied but so did the pitchers facing him. Bonds may have done steroids (I don't have medical proof) but many of the pitchers he's faced were on steroids as well. I think more pitchers get caught doing them than any other position.

He's had roughly 2,590 fewer at-bats and 340 fewer games than Hank Aaron to get the record (not counting the intentional walks either). He's got eight Gold Gloves, seven MVP awards, fourteen All Star games, and is considered one of the best - if not *the* best - left fielders in the game. Steroids won't help you choose the right pitch or track a fly ball. His skills are there whether the power came naturally or not. I am not really a baseball fan so I don't have much of an opinion either way. He does his job and sells tickets which is really why any of them are out there.

Troy

[69DodgeCharger]

I agree Pete's Career hit total is incredible. But he has the same thing working against him as Bonds....A negative public image. Obviously he is a no brainer first ballot hall of fame selection. But the powers that be have decided to deny him that. Whether it's right or wrong could be debated endlessly. Bonds career even without the home run record make him an easy hall of fame pick also.

[70charger_boy]

All the steroids in the world don't make up for talent.  Barry, can be an ass or a jerk, but he has alot of talent.  I care that he broke a record

[69_500]

Troy on survery I was reading was saying that the taking of HGH actually does improve eye sight, so some of the stuff Barry is accused or people assume that he took would actually make it easier to distinguish a ball from a strike.

I also attribute many of the HR's that players today are hitting to the ball parks they play in. Consider that when Ruth first came into the league the Yankee's were playing at the Polo grounds, which had a center field wall at 490 ft I believe. Also take into consideration that over the past 15 years there have been multiple expansion teams in the MLB which in  turns water's down the pitching talent on each team. Allowing for more younger/less experienced pitchers to be tossing the pitches to great hitters. Factor in the lack of pitching talent, and the smaller ball parks and that accounts for some of the increases in HR's by hitters today.

Personally I think that Bonds did take something, be it steroids or HGH, or even both. Should he be the HR king? To me NO. Quite simply.  You don't go from having never hit more than 44 HR's in a season to having 73. Granted others have had seasons where they spiked in HR's or Hits or something like that. However no one has ever done it at 37, or at the end of the career. Typical baseball player peaks at 27-29. After that it is typically a gradual decline, not a steady line until 37 and then spike to arcade style stats.

[Brock Samson]

  My feeling is that it's a great money maker for the City and Co. of San Francisco and M.L.B.
We had a spirited discussion about this many many times in the newsroom and the Sports Dept. and after allot of debate my feeling is M.L.B. (Major League Baseball) is now simply a over-blown marketing excercise for advertisers and less spectator sport and is in decline...
Allot of folks were turned off by the strike, and didn't return,.. names of the stadiums are now up for sale to the highest corporate sponsor some, like our own (pac-bell/3 com park have had three different names in just a few years since it opened and the salaries these guys make are simply obscene... 
I used to accompany my dad to all the giants games when he wrote about them in the early to mid '60s,.. And was quite the Mays Fan back then. BTW He was first class prick too in case ya' didn't know. So was Joe but that's another story.
There were no $4.00 hot dogs back then, or $300,000 luxury sky boxes again bought by Corporations,.. it was a spectator sport pure and simple,.. these days it's a religion complete with Idols and Churches. and all bow down to the Allmighty Lord of Advertising,... I know my opinion wont go over well here but I'm a much bigger fan of the average under-paid and over-worked teacher then of these multi-millionaire "Ego Maniacs" and their Marketing and P.R. Departments.
I feel much the same about M.L.B. as modern "Stock" car racing...
 
Plenty of folks are drinking the kool-aid, but I'm not one of them. I'd much rather watch a high school football game.. any day.
including Tuesday's game.
And if ya' still don't know of which I speak, go out to some H.S. sports events and spend a few bucks supporting school sports and indeed schools themselves instead of Bud, Barry's ex-wives and their respective divorce lawyers.

[69_500]

I won't argue with the fact of players being over paid, or the fact that $$$$ seems to fix/mend everything. If there is $$$$$ in it, it seems that everyone thinks its okay. As long as it still makes $$$$$ that is.

As far as the whole selling the names to stadiums and such, I don't much care for that whole thing either. It used to be a rarity for a stadium to bear a corporate name, however now I can only think of a handful of stadiums in all the sports that don't bear a corporate name/sponsorship on them.

[BMOTOXSTAR]

Imagine my luck. I happen to have his rookie card.

[DodgeChargerNeeded]

Steroids don't make you a better hitter. Bonds is not the nicest person but records are made to be broken.

[Afflyer]

I could care less about baseball and far far less about the "juiced up" Barry Bonds.

I'm a FOOTBALL fan! 

Silly wabbit- baseball is for girls!

[Mike DC]

Sorry if this has already been covered:

I remember reading an article making the case that Hank Aaron & buddies showed signs of using steroids back in the day too.  Numerous players/teammates who were all acquainted with each other, all having relatively steady stats for years but then showing a steroid-like climb partway through their adult career, etc.

 

IMHO, Mark McGuire got away with the steroids for a few reasons the Bonds is not.  McGuire has a nice-guy image.  And he was also the first big 'roid-hitter of his kind in this era, so there was less suspicion in general at the time.  (We hadn't seen a whole bunch of smashed records in the last decade yet like we have now to dilute the thrill of it, so it was easier not to mentally attribute all their success to the 'roids alone.)

I live in STL, and McGuire's original record-breaking season was just really thrilling to watch even though we all had our suspicions.  During that season, there was a giddy feeling in the air about the whole thing and it didn't quite seem real that he was gonna break the record for a long time even while he was getting closer & closer to it.  McGuire got away with steroids because he really sold it to us in a nicer package than Bonds.

Barry Bonds is in trouble because he acts like a totally self-interested jerk.  It's not a bias against race, it's just a bias against a**holes.

 

[70charger_boy]

Bonds never took steroids

[Brock Samson]

where's his hair go?.. 

[Afflyer]

Didn't they outlaw those Easton aluminum bats?!

[The70RT]

Looks like his color got lighter too. Did Michael J take steroids?

[Brock Samson]

 

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wk22ENaRCkI&mode=user&search=

[The70RT]

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wk22ENaRCkI&mode=user&search=