2nd generation charger or new version challenger?

[h76]

Just wondering what's the thoughts out there on people paying big money for these 2nd gen chargers versus buying a new gen challenger for the same or even less $? I can see reasons for both. Just curious how people see what's a smarter buy?

[Kern Dog]

My common sense response is that the Charger will appreciate VS any new car. The Charger offers a tactile experience that no new car can match: The styling, the smells, the feel are all unique to old cars.
The Challenger will ride better, be more comfortable, get better mileage, protect you better in an accident and probably be more reliable...but it lacks the soul of a classic.

[Baldwinvette77]

i have to agree, i love my modern challenger, but it has no soul (maybe it will in 30 years) my 68 charger isn't really a 68 anymore but still it just has a personality to it, and i just enjoy my surroundings more when im in it.

[chargervert]

Our cars had to earn their souls too! They were once new modern cars that people said the same thing about.

[Edelbroke]

I had to laugh when I saw this thread, I have a 68 Charger RT project I've been looking to trade for a 08+ SRT8 Challenger....I've been waiting for my listing to pop up in the delusional sellers thread

[Mike DC]

  
Define "smarter."  


Financially, the smartest thing to do is to never mess with owning cool cars, old or new.  But that outlook is not us.   

What's smart or stupid is gonna depend on how much money you have, how much driving you do, how important reliability is, how much you carry other passengers, etc.  
 

[70B5Cuda]

I love my 69 Charger but it's not the most fun I have had driving. I absolutely LOVE driving my B5 blue 2010 Challenger SRT8 with a 6 speed manual. It is the most fun I have ever had DRIVING. That's why I'm going to build a 68 Charger with an SRT8 drivetrain. I really want the classic styling of a 2nd gen Charger but I also want fuel injection, a 6 speed manual, good mileage, rack & pinion steering, coilovers, etc.

[Kern Dog]

That idea is so tempting to me as well. The flow of even stock 5.7 HEMI heads is so amazing, a smooth idling  late model engine can run as strong as a mild 440, weigh less and get double the MPG.
I would REALLY love to use the 8 speed auto trans but they are so damn complicated...the wiring is impossible to integrate so far.

[440]

I've never owned a car newer than 1977 so I would sink "new car" money into modernizing my old car.

[Kern Dog]

The technology in cars was on a steady climb since the mid 70s but in the last 10 years, it has exploded. Fuel injection and computers in the early 80s, air bags, anti-lock brakes and crumple zones in the 90s and 2000s, extensive NVH improvements, direct fuel injection, connectivity, navigation, self parking, self braking, adaptive cruise control....all of that is here today.
I read posts from guys like the one above...dudes that own all old cars, never have driven newer stuff.  For most of my life, I was under the belief that there was nothing a new vehicle could do that was worth the payment. In 2002 I still was driving an '84 Chevy C-10. It was a nice truck, lowered, nice paint job but the body had over 400,000 miles on it. Old cars...over time you get to the point where you are constantly replacing stuff. Parts store replacements are never as good as the factory stuff that no dealer stocks anymore. Alternators that conk out at 50,000 miles, starters too.
I bought a 2002 Ram 1500 in April 2002. Same basic truck compared to the Chevy...Regular cab, shortbed, 2wd with a V8 and an automatic. What did the Dodge have that the Chevy did not? 440,000 fewer miles on the body. More interior room. NO leaks anywhere. Steering precision, confident brakes, cold A/C, quieter interior, better ride...and maybe 3 more miles per gallon.  I have been convinced that a newer vehicle is what I want to drive day in, day out. The classics are great for recreation and cruising but since I often face long commutes, I want the seat to be comfortable. I want a good heater and A/C. I don't want to smell raw gas leaking, I don't want to add oil every day or worry that it will stall in traffic and not restart.

As far as classics with late model engines...I really do like the idea. From what I read, the 3G HEMI engines run a LONG time before needing a rebuild. This means adding one to a classic means that it is likely to be the last engine the car would need, given the meager miles many of us put on our cars.

[Mike DC]

  
   
Modern drivetrains are very good but IMO the pre-modern stuff gets a bad rap from car guys now.  We are gearheads.  We only remember and want the "cool" old tech.  But that's not all there was before modern EFI.  
 

Your grandmother drove a carbureted vehicle every day for decades without knowing how to work on engines.  She didn't carry 30 lbs of hand tools in the trunk at all times.  She commuted 12 months a year in all weather.  She got tolerable MPG with tolerable acceleration.  She didn't stink like gasoline after every ride.  She went 70 mph on the highway without wearing earplugs and killing engines.  According to car guys today none of this stuff is possible with old car tech.  

[timmycharger]

 
   
Modern drivetrains are very good but IMO the pre-modern stuff gets a bad rap from car guys now.  We are gearheads.  We only remember and want the "cool" old tech.  But that's not all there was before modern EFI.  
 

Your grandmother drove a carbureted vehicle every day for decades without knowing how to work on engines.  She didn't carry 30 lbs of hand tools in the trunk at all times.  She commuted 12 months a year in all weather.  She got tolerable MPG with tolerable acceleration.  She didn't stink like gasoline after every ride.  She went 70 mph on the highway without wearing earplugs and killing engines.  According to car guys today none of this stuff is possible with old car tech.  

Although my Dad did teach my Mom how to start our 72 slant 6 Dart when flooded by taking off the air cleaner lid and jamming a screwdriver down holding the choke open LOL

[GreenMachine]

To answer your question about the money thing, In 20 years that 2018 SRT Challenger maybe worth 1/5 of it's MSRP if your lucky, that is if it hasn't been sent to the scrap yard. The 2nd Gen Charger will most likely be worth more than you paid for it. IMO modern Challengers will not be collectible except for maybe the Demon, and the Hellcat will probably retain some of its value too. The body style has been in production waaaaay to long, just look at the Mustang. The fit/finish of these cars seems cheap to me too, as far as the body.

As far as drivability, I daily drove my '70 for a few years and loved it. I think it's all about how you build it, the engine needs to be built with more power, but for the street, not the 1/4 mile. A reliable carb or FI, 3.23/3.55 gears, a fairly quiet exhaust, rebuild the suspension and add a big sway bar. If you keep the older drivetrain, it will require more maintenance than a modern drivetrain even after it's been rebuilt. The ONLY things that a 2nd gen. (after mods) can't do better than a modern car is less wind noise and crash safety due to design (and maybe built in gadgets if you're in to that).

And I agree with everything Mike DC said.

[70 sublime]

Most of our Chargers are getting to the 50 year old mark now

Imagine what a 50 year old 2015 Challenger would be like ?
The newer stuff has lots and lots of wires running every where
Every wire has something on both ends
How many sensors or computer things will still be working

How about the modern Hemi with the ability to turn off 4 cylinders to save gas
How many moving parts and wires are involved with that 

I have a modern Hemi in my modern Ram truck
Think the best plan is to keep trading in before it gets too old

If you have the cash to buy a toy then buy the older already going back up in value car then buying something new and fancy and going down in value as soon as you drive off the lot

If you can only afford one vehicle get a modern car with a few extras to have fun in your every day life

[Challenger340]

Just wondering what's the thoughts out there on people paying big money for these 2nd gen chargers versus buying a new gen challenger for the same or even less $? I can see reasons for both. Just curious how people see what's a smarter buy?

Depends what you want and for how long as to which is "smarter" ?

From a strictly monetary standpoint based in recent valuations the 2nd Gens DO seem to be retaining value, versus, the same day you drive a new Vehicle off the lot it seems to depreciate substantially.

If we then roll out 5-6 years ?
good bet the 2nd Gen Charger you bought will have retained far more value, than your now 6 year old "used" Challenger that pales miserably in the "new fangled" comparison scale to the then 2024 Challenger Daytona with a 920hp 8.1 Litre
"fly by wire" robomill with standup shower option.

[Aero426]

This is an apples to oranges comparison.   One car will continue to have "evergreen" collector status.    The other is a deluxe toaster.     Which one is right for you? 

[h76]

 Ok, so let's put a twist on the question..... would a lot of you feel different about the new gen dodge 2 door car if it was a charger and had the styling of the 68-70 charger, instead of the 4 door they came up with? I think dodge did a real nice job with the styling of the new challengers. I think they missed the boat, using the charger nameplate on a 4 door.

[F8-4life]

Buy a badass 69 RT 4 speed car for the weekends and then buy a Toyota corolla for another 1500 to battle traffic during the work week.

[JB400]

Just be like Cody, and have one of each.  Problem solved.

However, you can restomod the older one, to where it'll close any advantage that the new one can provide.  Little hard to undo some of the factory goodies on the new one to make it comparable to the old one

[myk]

Apples and oranges.   Buying an antique vehicle is NOTHING like buying a new one, in principle.  You do not buy an antique vehicle for the same reason you buy a newer one.

Oh and I would rather take the bus than be caught in a Corolla...

[Kern Dog]

All Toyotas are appliances. I see nothing exciting about a Toyota car. The trucks? Yeah, I like 4 wheeling and all that but as for cars, I'd prefer something fun.
The Wife's car:

[HPP]

Your grandmother drove a carbureted vehicle every day for decades without knowing how to work on engines.  She didn't carry 30 lbs of hand tools in the trunk at all times.  She commuted 12 months a year in all weather.  She got tolerable MPG with tolerable acceleration.  She didn't stink like gasoline after every ride.  She went 70 mph on the highway without wearing earplugs and killing engines.  According to car guys today none of this stuff is possible with old car tech.  

This is very true, and can certainly still be possible. A big difference between now and then is back then everyone had the same technology under their feet. Now, depending on where this driving is taking place, an older car may require some upgrades to avoid becoming a casualty in the commuter wars. Plus, there are millions of distracted drivers out there now who will ram a classic with the same disregard as a new car.

It all boils down to what does one want, what does it cost to get there, how comfortable are you when you're there, and how much will you risk/pay to update/insure/fix it when you're there.

[Challenger340]

Ok, so let's put a twist on the question..... would a lot of you feel different about the new gen dodge 2 door car if it was a charger and had the styling of the 68-70 charger, instead of the 4 door they came up with? I think dodge did a real nice job with the styling of the new challengers. I think they missed the boat, using the charger nameplate on a 4 door.

I think Mopar did a far better job recreating the Challenger styling genre, versus, either Ferd with the Mustang or GM's Camaro
that said,
and as already mentioned, IMO, no "new" vehicle will ever match the genre driving experience of any classic, let be a 2nd Gen 2 door styling or not.

Just me, but I personally don't want slot car handling, computerized Engine & Brake/Traction control, and digital wazoo's with stand up shower options ?

I get into my 2nd Gen R/T to get away from all that crap myself and everybody else has in ALL our other vehicles, because I want the sounds, smells, and experience of 500 ft/lbs of Detroit Torque expressing itself, felt and heard through the ROAR of the Big Engine &  4 Barrels, groaning suspension/squealing tires, or even just the way it "floats" down the highway at 70 mph when cruising.

Pretty strange.... and don't ask me to explain the dynamics because I can't....
but I can roll down both windows in my 2nd gen R/T at 70 mph on the highway cruising ? and still be able to "talk" to someone beside me WITHOUT raising my voice ?
Just for shits & giggles.... try that in your new vehicle.
 

 
 

[69bronzeT5]

Just be like Cody, and have one of each.  Problem solved.

It's true  I love my old stuff but my SRT8 gives me a whole different type of excitement when I drive it. Myk said it well. They don't compare. They each have their own type of excitement and feels. That being said, I have plans to slap a 6.1 SRT Hemi into my '69..... 

[Ponch ®]

Depends on what you want it for. A daily driver? New challenger. A weekend toy? the 2nd gen.

My 15 R/T is my daily driver, and i consider it somewhat of an appliance, albeit a nice one. But I see 17,000 modern challenges along my daily commute (one way).

The new cars are great, but they simply lack the gravitas of a classic. More than once ive rolled up into a gas station in the Satellite and there's a guy/girl in a $100K porsche or Hellcat thinking they're hot sh*t.  You should see the look on their faces when other people start coming up to my $10Kish 50 year old car and telling me how awesome/badass it is while totally ignoring theirs.

[HeavyFuel]

On the way into the store yesterday, a young man half my age said, "That's a very nice car you have there, Sir."    Me: "Thanks a lot, beautiful night for a drive."

I can't get enough of this old thing.  I can't keep my eyes off of it when we're in the same vicinity.   I'm more passionate about it than almost anything else in the world.  If I'm ever in a serious accident (in it), the meager personal protection will probably fail to do it's job, and I'll likely be killed or maimed.

Smart move to own it?  Not really.   But I can't think of any physical possession that means more to me.    

[comet_666]

Last week I was at the gas station and there was a new Camaro Z whatever there getting gas too. An older guy that was also there yells.."hey that's a awesome car man!" and proceeds to walk over. The driver of the Camaro says, "Oh Thanks! fastest car on the street!"
The older guy says, "I wasn't talking about your car, I was talking about this beautiful mopar here"

It was kind of funny.
I have a '17 Challenger as my daily driver but there is no replacement for getting behind the wheel of the 69.

[Kern Dog]

That is GREAT!
It reminds me of how much attention I used to get in my '70 before I "restored" it. The old, worn out look seemed to resonate with people more than the fresh paint and shiny rims.

[Polygon]

 The 2013 gets over 30 on the highway. V6. Nothing fancy, but suits me.

The 1970 I drove daily for about 6 months, and as another said, it's just plain fun. Puts a smile on my face. Now, just once in a while.

[Mytur Binsdirti]

On the way into the store yesterday, a young man half my age said, "That's a very nice car you have there, Sir."    Me: "Thanks a lot, beautiful night for a drive."

I can't get enough of this old thing.  I can't keep my eyes off of it when we're in the same vicinity.   I'm more passionate about it than almost anything else in the world.   I refuse to carry my concealed when driving it, because I'm afraid for the person that crashes into me because of distracted driving, etc.   If I'm ever in a serious accident (in it), the meager personal protection will probably fail to do it's job, and I'll likely be killed or maimed.

Smart move to own it?  Not really.   But I can't think of any physical possession that means more to me.    

Pretty car. 

[DAY CLONA]

Just wondering what's the thoughts out there on people paying big money for these 2nd gen chargers versus buying a new gen challenger for the same or even less $? I can see reasons for both. Just curious how people see what's a smarter buy?

If we were concerned with a "smarter buy" we'd be driving the latest fuel efficient import  ... all this talk of a vehicle having a "soul" is kinda BS for me, I look at a vehicle, we're talking "toys" here, as art on wheels, if it appeals to my liking, it can be new or old,... HP/suspension/ride quality/amenities/so-called reliability/etc can always be added or improved in any vehicle... granted stock to stock comparison a new Chubbenger or 4dr Charger SHOULD out perform old iron in all aspects, they've had 50 years to develop the improvements, the only thing lacking in "new" cars, IMHO is the styling, it's just a compromise on behalf of the styling teams, I'm not saying they have to emulate the original cars, but they should be appealing to the human eye, they're disproportion in their own styling leaves them ungainly IMHO, I can't even stomach the 4dr Charger, even if it was named something else, it's just an unattractive vehicle, I've yet to see ONE even heavily modified that is ascetically pleasant on the eyes, the Challenger is a great looking car, as long as your viewing it from the belt line up, below the belt line it's like looking at a 200 lb broad in yoga pants ....

You talk about the "big money" for 2nd gen Chargers, anything is big money today, new or old, sure a lot of hype runs down hill where some wanker thinks his rotted out shitbox of a Charger (any old car for that matter) is worth 5 fiqures...I have no issues with a 2nd gen asking for huge coin, as long as it has that amount of money invested in it at every facet of it's refurbishment, I do however have a total disdain for these high priced "garage/barn finds" that are basically rolling junk, I can appreciate a true survivor that has weathered time and is in exemplary condition, but it too is in elderly condition mechanically....    originality/numbers have no place among my desires in a vehicle, reliability and aesthetics are my prime importance, and that can be had in new or old, but not at the factory level... you won't see me wasting my money on any of the current factory offerings, except for a cheap/disposable daily driver

[DAY CLONA]

The new Challenger will protect you better in an accident and probably be more reliable

I don't know about that?....I wonder which one was driven home after this wreck?... when "new" meets "old" the hard way

[Kern Dog]

The sheet metal in late model cars is pretty thin. The fenders in LC Challengers are just a shell and they bend easily. When ours was just 3 months old, a lady crossed into my lane and hit the RF corner. The contact was barely felt but it bent the fender enough to make replacement a more cost effective deal.
Late models are designed to sacrifice the car to protect the driver.

[Lennard]

In new cars, the strength isn't in the sheet metal. The frames and "cages" are is stronger.

[Dino]

Crumple zones baby! I would not want to be in a high speed wreck in the Charger. That's gonna leave a mark. I feel better with collapsing frame rails and a gazillion air bags in the Audi!

So what's the question? Old Charger or new Challenger? I only have a Charger because the way it looks so easy for me. I'm not interested in the Challenger at all. Doesn't make me tick but that's all subjective.
Depends what you're after. I totally love driving my newly acquired Audi but there's nothing to compare next to the Charger. Two totally different animals. Kinda nice that my daily as well as my toy car have V8s though.   

[440]

Remember this ??






Credit to elanmars

[Kern Dog]

Probably listed on ebay soon with a $12,000 reserve.

[morepower]

I have a 2010 dodge challenger srt and I love the way it rides, handles, accelerates has all the comforts....but it doesn't compare to the thrill of driving my manual steering, manual brakes 68 500 ci stroker with 3.91 gears without a/c and all...

[Ghoste]

I have loved the 2nd gen Chargers for too long to start cheating now.  I'll keep my 69.

[Birdflu]

The new Challenger will protect you better in an accident and probably be more reliable

I don't know about that?....I wonder which one was driven home after this wreck?... when "new" meets "old" the hard way

Looks like the guys wife is still sitting in the front seat like nothing even happened!