Original or modern?

[tgif]

I've been flipping back and forth about the drivetrain for my '70 Charger.  I want to be able to afford to drive the thing when finished, and was originally going to build a 500 inch stroker RB. That probably wouldn't be a very good long range cruiser.  I'm also thinking about going no more than 0.030 over stock bore with stock stroke (440).  Either way, I was leaning toward Edelbrock's long ram fuel injection setup.  On the other hand is the Gen3 hemi with a modern automatic.  It seems like most of the guys on here are for the original drivetrains.  This car, while an original big block car, was a 383-2 with automatic on the column. Even if I build a RB engine, I will convert to a factory console.  I also intend to make this into an R/T SE clone as I have all the parts for that.  I guess I am wondering if the value would be much different in a few years either way.  What does everyone think?

[BDF]

Hello tgif & welcome!
I think whatever you build ought to be something you want. You're headed the right direction asking questions here, that's for sure

[Baldwinvette77]

i'd personally go with the late model stuff, so many people i know locally don't drive their old cars simply because they're.. well.. old, i love a 500 hp 440 as much as the next guy, but gas up here is like $5 a gallon at times 

[Mike DC]

  
Late model stuff works well.  But it won't save you any money overall.  After driving the car 150,000 miles you might break even or something.  


EFI is a tossup.  It definitely works better in the real-world sense.  But watching muscle car guys deal with carbs, you'd think no reliable vehicle ever existed before EFI.  Carbs can be fairly consistent/reliable if you are willing to choose and set up the carb for that purpose.


Overdrive - yes, get it, EFI or not.  Just to spare the revving on the motor and the noise, if not the gas.  The trans tunnel won't clear a Chrysler 4spd overdrive without hacking.  You can hack the tunnel for it, or use a Gear Vendors OD, or retrofit a GM 4spd auto (no hacking).


Gen-3:  It's basically a very good small-block V8.  If you go into it wanting a better 360 Magnum then you will like it.  Just don't expect it to match a B/RB stroker.  

[Fitz73Chrgr]

May not be a factor for you, but it is for me:

Late model Chrysler GenIII V8's are all built in Mexico. 

[Bad B-rad]

I have and love both style cars!!(69 and 2016 Chargers)
The vintage Mopars are what got me into the new ones.
Let me say this, a modern 6.4 is a bad mo fo, but huge cost on top of the motor price, to make it fit, it will out run a stockish Big Block, but it wont have the off idle punch in the gut torque of the big block.

That is my current issue, I even bought a 5.7  Hemi to build for the 69 Charger,but I havent yet given up on the big blocks torque!!


Good luck either way.

[70 sublime]

Why not just have two cars one with each motor in it ?

I think that is what I have
My old 69 Charger has a 383 ( for now) and I have a newer truck with a 5.7
When I feel like being invisible and just go I drive the truck with the A/C and power windows etc
When I want to go for a spin and wave at every one that waves at me I take the car

You are going to have to buy a car to wreck to get all the parts why not just find something a little better and have two drivers

[303 Mopar]

I have a 505 stroker in my '68 Charger and a 392 Hemi in my '70 Cuda.  Each car is completely different, so it depends on what you want and what you will enjoy more.  The Charger is just old school street bruiser with a nice cam, the sound fits the look, and torque for days but it has the typical things like sometimes hard starting.  The Cuda is built more like a resto-mod road course car so the new engine fits well, starts anytime every time, is very quick off the line but the Charger runs it down easily. The swap from a 340 to the 392 was around $14k total cost and to stroke the 505 was around $6k total cost.

I love driving both of them but for very different reasons.

[cbrestorations]

it costs almost the same to restore a car original vs resto mod, the resto mods when done tastefully bring way more money than a restored car (were talking ur basic 2nd gens here). Modern hemi, 6 speed, aftermarket suspension, bigger brakes and nice 17's...will bring 100k+ a restored base model is less than half of that. Restored cars are not fun to drive u less ur looking to re live how crappy classic cars drove. Restomods is where the $ is and way more fun to drive

[6pkrtse]

I like Modern as well as classic. My 2012 Challenger is comfortable, quiet, pretty quick and may even run side by side against my Charger and gets way better mileage doing it. They both have their place. Keep it classic. A Classic is meant to be a classic. So tired of seeing LS or 3RD Gen Hemi in everything. Keep an old Charger a nice Big Block & maybe throw some EFI under the stock air cleaner if needed. I drive my old cars as much as possible carbs don't bother me. Once the weather finally breaks I usually put 5000+ miles on my red Charger almost every year.

[Bad B-rad]

Each have there place.
But I have to disagree with Cbrestrations, a touch about restored cars not being fun to drive, one of the things I love about our cars is they way they drive.
I have no chance of being faster then my wife in our 2016 R/T with my 383 Charger, but I enjoy the way the 69 drives, looks, feels.
Do not get me wrong, I also love tearing it up in my 2016 R/T. so sometimes it is a very tough call, to stick vintage or go modern.
I think we all agree, everyone wants better braking performance then the  manual drums most of our rides came with, so that is an upgrade that everyone will agree with, up untill the point of needing 20 inch wheels to clear the rotors and calipers of a set of "super brakes", LOL!!
So if that's what he is talking about, that a 100% correct restored car running drum brakes, and bias ply tires, is no fun to drive, yeah I will buy that.
But for me I don't need a new coil over suspension, or steering system, or efi engine with a 6 speed manual trans to enjoy my 69.
Just a properly tuned one with parts that are not wore out.

I also think that a lot of people have lost faith in the carburetor, and forget that as long as you are starting out with a  new or properly rebuilt carburetor, set up correctly, and you feed it clean fuel at the correct PSI(not efi 45-50PSI) it will run great and give you years of troube free operation, and enjoyment.
Heck you can even add a manual, electric, or factory spring style choke if you want.

Each person has there own idea of what they want there car to be.
I like like old, I like new, I like a tasteful mix of the two, as long as its Mopar!!!!

[cbrestorations]

I like originals too, don't get me wrong but if you look at it from a value point. The people who are buying those all original cars are dying off. The next generation wants a modern feel but old styling.

[70 sublime]

There is a little bit of pride that goes along with an original type car set up too
When you can open the hood and know what you are looking at and what each wire does if you have to trouble shoot a problem

New stuff you almost have to get the lap top out and plug in someplace to find out a little smog sensor or cam rpm gizmo burnt out is why car only running on 3 cylinders 

A classic car is a classic car

[Bad B-rad]

I wasn't looking at it as a value standpoint.
I see exactly what you are saying. (cbrestorations)

The modern cars have a safer feel. And it is what most buyers desire.

The flip side of that is vintage cars built with all the modern goodies of today,will not age the same as, one with its O.E./Classic parts. Because  todays modern parts will not still be "New" and relevant in 10-15 years?
The parts will be stuck in the trap of not being modern by 2032 standareds, but yet not being vintage enough to the orignial stuff.

I guess we could try and predict the future but in the end it dosent matter.
Build what you like, or want,the thing you will enjy the most, that would be best advice. Thats what I have always done.
You want vintage, do it, you want modern, do it.

Or do what 70 sublime, and 6pkrtse advice and just get one of each!!

[Mike DC]

     

Modernizing a muscle car for 2018 would be adding half a dozen airbags, electronic stability control, backup camera, etc.

Most of the benefits from "modernizing" a 1968 vehicle come from just bringing it up to 1988:

15" radial tires
Front discs
Caster in the steering
Better shocks
Stiffer swaybars
Overdrive tranny
EFI (or a carb that is chosen for street manners)
Electronic ignition
3-pt seatbelts
Electricals/wiring that work
brighter running lights
front seats with some basic side bolstering & adjustments
decent quality paint/coatings


These are not 21st-century luxuries.  This is really basic stuff.  Just changes for radial tires and a lot of general quality & safety issues.  
 

[Reezee]

i'd personally go with the late model stuff, so many people i know locally don't drive their old cars simply because they're.. well.. old, i love a 500 hp 440 as much as the next guy, but gas up here is like $5 a gallon at times 

Im Jealous, in The Netherlands (if my quick math is right) we're at $7.50 per gallon.

As for the original question, I asked myself the same question. But for me, nothing beats the sound of that era V8. The modern hemi's or V8's t dont have that distinctive sound that I fell in love with. Since I already have a 440, a rebuild would be the way to go for me, but ofcourse with some upgraded goodies 

Regarding the value standpoint, I couldnt care less. Im building mine for me. So I think you should build it the way that makes you smile the most when you are blasting down the road 

[tgif]

 I appreciate all the input.  I really thought I would be roasted for thinking about putting a modern drivetrain in.  I have the original 383, a couple of 440s, the original 727, a 23 spline and an 18 spline 833, all gathering dust for more than 30 years.  I've either got to get on with this car, which I've had since 1977, or get rid of it.  I know if I got rid of it that I would regret it later.  I was originally thinking of going with a full XV suspension, Gen 3 Hemi with a 8 speed auto, etc.  Then I figured how much all that would cost, and I would probably never get it finished.  If I ever want to drive this car again, I'm going to have to pick a direction and go.  Being able to sell it when the time comes is a factor as well.  If I go too crazy with it, I'll never come out close to even, which isn't really the point, but I don't want to throw away too much money.

[JR]

Delete, replied to the wrong thread. Whoops!

[Bronzedodge]

30 years?  Man, just drive it.  Pick one of your 440s, clean up the cylinder walls as little as they need - hone it if there's no ridge.  Polish up a stock crank and put ir together.  You can build a 500 inch mega motor while you drive it.   

[Homerr]

30 years?  Man, just drive it.  Pick one of your 440s, clean up the cylinder walls as little as they need - hone it if there's no ridge.  Polish up a stock crank and put ir together.  You can build a 500 inch mega motor while you drive it.   

I agree.  Just get it on the road, change it up later if you want.

[6pkrtse]

If you haven't done anything with it in 30 years maybe it might be time to let it go to someone that will do something with it. You should just give it or sell it to me? I will get it running & drive in in your honor. LOL

[cbrestorations]

Restored cars take a lot of time and money to finish, ratty one on the other hand are just as much fun if not more and it gets on the road sooner

[Bad B-rad]

YEP!!!
And when its on the road and you drive it, even if only once in a while, you "remember" how much you love the cars.
When they sit for a super long time it is easy to forget you love then, or why you even have it, and then you are in no hurry to do anything with it.
It is easier to take small bites off the list, over time, then to just spent one solid month and $10,000 wrenching and restore it at once.
Sometimes its like Bill Murray in what about Bob? Baby steps to the Charger,lol

[DixieRestoParts]

It sounds like you've got enough extra parts there to sell off what you're not going to use and help fund your project. I'm a 440 guy all day long, but depending on what condition they're in, don't dismiss a stroked 383 with aluminum heads, water pump housing and intake. I think I read once where that combo only weighs around 80 lbs heavier than a normal LA small block and is also a torque monster. Running that behind a tremec 5 spd with some suspension mods might give you that modern car feeling  at a cheaper price. Not sure of the mpg, but does anyone really drive these cars enough that an extra $20 for gas a weekend really makes a difference? I have had some modern hi-po stuff as rental vehicles and I couldn't keep my foot out of them either. So, old school or new school, I don't get great mileage because I love to hammering them too much.

The cool thing is you have lots of options, nice stuff to dream about,  plan what you actually want to do, then execute your dream. Let us know what you decide. I'm anxious to see your final product!