Illegal Immigration!

[squeakfinder]

George W. is the first President in are lifetime's to state that you should speak English and assimilate into are culture if you want to live in this country. Oh, and that the national anthem should be sung in English.
And then you have Ted Kennedy trying to make this the next civil wrights movement. He sees this as nothing more than a new voting block for the socialist... oops, I mean the Democratic party. By the way, Kennedy is rich like those evil Republicans your talking about. His daddy got there wealth the old fashioned way by running moonshine.
 I really don't see where current politics has anything to do with this thread. Something should have been done about illegal immigration 50 or so years ago.

[squeakfinder]

By the way, the INS doesn't exist anymore. Its the ICE. If anybody cares.

[Big Lebowski]

George W. is the first President in are lifetime's to state that you should speak English and assimilate into are culture if you want to live in this country. Oh, and that the national anthem should be sung in English.
And then you have Ted Kennedy trying to make this the next civil wrights movement. He sees this as nothing more than a new voting block for the socialist... oops, I mean the Democratic party. By the way, Kennedy is rich like those evil Republicans your talking about. His daddy got there wealth the old fashioned way by running moonshine.
 I really don't see where current politics has anything to do with this thread. Something should have been done about illegal immigration 50 or so years ago.

Oh don't bring that drunken Irishman (Ted "the swimmer" Kennedy) into this. please.

[Vainglory, Esq.]

And in response to those who disagree with me but can't come up with factual bases to counter me, I've lived in about 8 states and two countries, I've worked in construction alongside and even under Mexican laborers, I'm anything but a commie, I didn't participate in any protests today, and there are literally millions of acres of habitable but uninhabited land in this country. 

You're avoiding the basics; for every acre of "habitable land" how many more acres are needed to support those living on that land? How many acres will need to be sacrificed to build roads to that land? Is there a source of drinkable water? How much more pollution will the new inhabitants produce?

There is a distinct advantage to leaving unihabited lands uninhabited.

I think Vain is oblivious to the fact that most of the "vacant" land in the United States is used by farmers to feed a vast portion of humanity. Not to mention all the natural resources we export and utilize for our own use.

You seriously need to look up the facts on what we do with the 2,230,000,000,000 acres of land in the U.S.  Only about 13% is used as cropland, and with policies in this and other countries supporting unsustainable farming, paying farmers not to produce, and supporting price floors for crops that simply rot away in storage, much less is actually needed.  The simple fact is that, literally, millions of acres are habitable, not being used as farmland, and able to support a whole lot more population.  Claiming that the US can't afford any of its room for newcomers is simply fatuous, but it's another typical scare tactic of those who are afraid of immigration.

[71440charger]

well you have to think of more then just the people areound here what about the wildlife they have to live to not just humans haveto have land to live animals do to everybody and everything takes its part and us humans are takeing the land of animals and if i am not able to hunt and fish beacuse they let illegal immigrants into the country i am going to be pissed!!

[bull]

And in response to those who disagree with me but can't come up with factual bases to counter me, I've lived in about 8 states and two countries, I've worked in construction alongside and even under Mexican laborers, I'm anything but a commie, I didn't participate in any protests today, and there are literally millions of acres of habitable but uninhabited land in this country. 

You're avoiding the basics; for every acre of "habitable land" how many more acres are needed to support those living on that land? How many acres will need to be sacrificed to build roads to that land? Is there a source of drinkable water? How much more pollution will the new inhabitants produce?

There is a distinct advantage to leaving unihabited lands uninhabited.

I think Vain is oblivious to the fact that most of the "vacant" land in the United States is used by farmers to feed a vast portion of humanity. Not to mention all the natural resources we export and utilize for our own use.

You seriously need to look up the facts on what we do with the 2,230,000,000,000 acres of land in the U.S.  Only about 13% is used as cropland, and with policies in this and other countries supporting unsustainable farming, paying farmers not to produce, and supporting price floors for crops that simply rot away in storage, much less is actually needed.  The simple fact is that, literally, millions of acres are habitable, not being used as farmland, and able to support a whole lot more population.  Claiming that the US can't afford any of its room for newcomers is simply fatuous, but it's another typical scare tactic of those who are afraid of immigration.

Apparently you failed to address one portion of my argument, ie., land containing natural resources, not just farmland. And don't forget all the protected land that's been set aside in the US, never to be used for anything but hiking and sight-seeing. You bring up a good point by mentioning farm subsidies, a point that your mentors in the oil industry should learn, and that's the concept of planning for the future. Although I'm not a big fan of subsidies (since much of those wasted crops could have been used to make ethanol) there will come a time when we will need those crops to feed the ever-increasing population, not due to immigration here but reproduction.

BTW, just because you can pack millions of people into buildable areas doesn't mean you should.

[hemi68charger]

George W. is the first President in are lifetime's to state that you should speak English and assimilate into are culture if you want to live in this country. Oh, and that the national anthem should be sung in English.
And then you have Ted Kennedy trying to make this the next civil wrights movement. He sees this as nothing more than a new voting block for the socialist... oops, I mean the Democratic party. By the way, Kennedy is rich like those evil Republicans your talking about. His daddy got there wealth the old fashioned way by running moonshine.
  I really don't see where current politics has anything to do with this thread. Something should have been done about illegal immigration 50 or so years ago.

Nice for noticing rotsparts..
But, there was a President before him, it was Teddy Roosevelt: Here's a copy of his famous immigration quote...


    Theodore Roosevelt on Immigrants and being an AMERICAN in 1907...

    "In the first place we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in
    good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be
    treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to
    discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or
    origin. But this is predicated upon the man's becoming in very fact an
    American, and nothing but an American...There can be no divided allegiance
    here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an
    American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag, and this
    excludes the red flag, which symbolizes all wars against liberty and
    civilization, just as much as it excludes any foreign flag of a nation to
    which we are hostile. . . . We have room for but one language here, and that is
    the English language. . . . We have room for but one sole loyalty and that is
    a loyalty to the American people."


http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/459


Troy

[squeakfinder]

Yes Yes I know about th speech Teddy Roosevelt gave!

He was a another GREAT Republican. But I was talking about a president in are lifetime.

Thank you Hemi for the quote.

[hemi68charger]

Yes Yes I know about th speech Teddy Roosevelt gave!

He was a another GREAT Republican. But I was talking about a president in are lifetime.

Thank you Hemi for the quote.

[Mike DC]

I agree with Vain about the population density.  Theoretically, the entire population of America could probably be crammed into one of the medium-sized states without stacking up into tiny Japanese-style apartments or anything.  China's got three times as many people as the U.S. and they've still got tons of open countryside.

England has 50 million people in an area smaller than Illinois and they've still got lots of beautiful rural countryside.  Of course, the British gov't also doesn't let land developers recklessly build suburbia onto as much land they can buy.

 

[nh_mopar_fan]

Isn't it interesting that anyone who argues for a sane and controlled immigration policy with controls over who crosses in over the borders is automatically labeled as "afraid of immigration" and "afraid of the brown man".

Typical leftist crap.

The WTC would still be standing if a few illegals hadn't made it into the country or had been made to leave when their temp visas expired.

Spare us your knee-jerk leftist labels.

[Mike DC]

Typical leftist crap.

The WTC would still be standing if a few illegals hadn't made it into the country or had been made to leave when their temp visas expired.

Spare us your knee-jerk leftist labels.

Uhh . . . Check your history, dude. 

"Open borders" has actually been a pillar of the Republican party's position for a hundred years.  It holds down workers' pay and helps big business when a fresh underclass keeps flowing in.  It's traditionally only been the DEMOCRATIC party position to support any border or immigration controls, because the Dems theoretically supported the working class. 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

But I don't think this is even a partisan issue anymore. 

Neither party wants those borders controlled at all anymore, because they're BOTH sold out to corporate lobbyists.  Only the Republicans are smart enough to keep their mouths shut about it in public, and let the idiotic Democrats blatantly pander to illegals and continue to lose votes over it. 


So waddiya say we not get this thread locked up yelling over partisan politics, huh?

 

[nh_mopar_fan]

Typical leftist crap.

The WTC would still be standing if a few illegals hadn't made it into the country or had been made to leave when their temp visas expired.

Spare us your knee-jerk leftist labels.

Uhh . . . Check your history, dude. 

"Open borders" has actually been a pillar of the Republican party's position for a hundred years.  It holds down workers' pay and helps big business when a fresh underclass keeps flowing in.  It's traditionally only been the DEMOCRATIC party position to support any border or immigration controls, because the Dems theoretically supported the working class. 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

But I don't think this is even a partisan issue anymore. 

Neither party wants those borders controlled at all anymore, because they're BOTH sold out to corporate lobbyists.  Only the Republicans are smart enough to keep their mouths shut about it in public, and let the idiotic Democrats blatantly pander to illegals and continue to lose votes over it. 


So waddiya say we not get this thread locked up yelling over partisan politics, huh?

 

Go look up the Immigration Reform law of 1964. That's the one that opened the flood gates. Check out who the supporters were and what they said.

Here:

http://www.npg.org/forum_series/socialexp.html

[Steve P.]

Today I did the un-imaginable, since all the taco shops are closed, I made my own lunch. Wow, that was really nerve racking, but I survived the ordeal. It's a good thing this walkout wont go on for days, otherwise I would starve for sure.

I didn't see this topic until this morning and started reading away. I take to heart as my father also came to this country the right way. So I am reading along and eating a PB&J sandwich when I get to The above from the Big Leboski. I now have smeared PB&J all over my monitor...

By the way, I made my own sandwich...

[Steve P.]

I wish I could get a green card or citizenship 

Head South and find yourself an American girl to marry.

If you are already married, knock up you Wife and head South in about 8 months for a six week vacation. 

It'll cost you a bundle to have the Child born out of the country but it's the "fast track" route to getting into the United States.

Actually I have been trying to do it legally for over 25 years , Know any decent women to marry ? it takes roughly 5 years to get citizenship after marrage , I doubt I could live with trash that long
I have been looking for Great woman  for 30 years now    & yes I am stil single

Maybe you should drop part of your name." PSYCHO " is not exactly a ,( MEET THE PARENTS ). friendly name.

[Ponch ®]

Isn't it interesting that anyone who argues for a sane and controlled immigration policy with controls over who crosses in over the borders is automatically labeled as "afraid of immigration" and "afraid of the brown man".

I'm afraid of the brown man.

[hemihead]

The protests won't end until there is amnesty.Then you will hear all the crying about' why are the taxes going up?'. Because every American citizen will have to pay to keep all these new people and give them more benefits than what we get.

[MichaelRW]

I'm a little late to this party but here's my 2 cents:

I am sick of hearing we are a country of immigrants from the media (when used in the context of somehow trying to legitimize illegal aliens). We are a country of mostly native born Americans, our ancestors were immigrants and they were LEGAL.

"The bottom line is that while these demonstrations, I am told, are supposed to make me feel better about illegal immigrants, I feel angry when I see thousands of people who knowingly break American law, yet somehow feel entitled to do so and outraged that they have not been sufficiently rewarded for it." ——Debra Saunders (I just like this statement)

Currently, illegal aliens are demanding to be provided free medical care, free education, automatic citizenship for their children, bilingual interpreters at all hospitals and courts, insisting on bilingual government forms, demanding that the USA accept Mexican ID's and provide sanctuary cities that would ignore their multiple lawbreaking and allow them to remain free from arrest, fly Mexican flags from their homes and cars, insist on courses in Mexican culture at our local schools, demand local driver's licenses and in-state college tuition, and insist that police officers speak Spanish. We, American citizens, are forced to live with this everyday. Enough is enough and it has to stop. Poll after poll has shown that the majority of Americans want this invasion stopped. If our elected officials do not act accordingly on this, which is to do what the majority of their constituents want, I, for one, am thinking aboutl boycotting the next election or voting for those running in the Constitution Party, however, I will support the politicians that protect the rights of the majority. Protecting our borders from invasion is a constitutional law that many elected officials are ignoring. Doing so throws our country into anarchy and a loss of sovereignty.

The debate as to whether there is enough "room" left in the US for more immigrants should be moot, although I do feel this country is full enough already. What matters is the desire of what the majority of Americans want. That is the foundation of this country.

[Steve P.]

This is from August 8, 2005.  I don't remember anyone bitching about this subject then..


http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewCulture.asp?Page=%5CCulture%5Carchive%5C200508%5CCUL20050808a.html

[SirNik73]

Reading all of you posts and I keep asking myself one question, "why hasn't Tory locked this thread?"
I'm glad it hasn't been locked, because it is not a Democrat vs. Republican argument. But they way you guys have been talking, you sure seem to think it is.
I'm pretty darn Right-Wing, but the policy I outlined for this problem back on page 3 happens to be the same policy that Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton is pushing for... how can that be? Check the link!
http://www.washtimes.com/national/20041213-124920-6151r.htm

For the sake of argument, before this thing gets locked, Big Business is not Republican. Big Business is capitalist... meaning they will sell their mother to any political party for a dollar. Republicans happen to believe in business, small and large, but big business only believes one thing... make profit.

[Steve P.]

You can take the LEFT and the RIGHT and toss it out the window. This is here and now and is in our face. It has been here a very long time with little of a watch dog. The problem is growing and maybe not in all parts of the country, but in many, we are overloaded with burden.  From my grandson to as far back as I know, (with the exception of my step father), we go back 8 generations born and raised here in the USA. Now my (tenth grader), daughter will more than likely have to go to school on "B" SHIFT for her final high school years. The school she goes to is only 5 years old and has had to add trailers each year to keep up with the new students.  I'm sorry, for those of you that want facts on this. I don't have them in front of me right now. You can always meet me at my daughters school/trailer.


Did I mention that they have made SPANISH a MANDATORY second language here in Florida schools?

[bull]

Isn't it interesting that anyone who argues for a sane and controlled immigration policy with controls over who crosses in over the borders is automatically labeled as "afraid of immigration" and "afraid of the brown man".

I'm afraid of the brown man.

I'm afraid of the green man.

[Steve P.]

We need to stop the hiring of ILLEGAL immigrants. Everyone that has ILLEGALS working for them knows it..

Owners, partners, presidents, vise presidents, CEO's, chairman and all top board members take warning. You have thirty, (30) days to part ways with ALL ILLEGAL WORKERS.

45 if you turn them in..

Any business caught with an illegal immigrant on the business premises or job site will be fined heavily and it's top people sent directly to jail. Piss me off and I'll send your wife to jail WITH YOU..

[greenpigs]

WOW, we have a bunch from Vietnam and a few from mexico at my shop...some are legal and some are going to be looking for a new job soon.

[John_Kunkel]

The simple fact is that, literally, millions of acres are habitable, not being used as farmland, and able to support a whole lot more population.  Claiming that the US can't afford any of its room for newcomers is simply fatuous, but it's another typical scare tactic of those who are afraid of immigration.

You continue to rant about all the "excess" acreage that could be used to house new immigrants but avoid commenting on the infrastructure needed to support that extra population. It isn't just about the land.