***PROBLEM SOLVED****OVERHEATING PROBLEM SPECIFIC TO DAYTONAS

[kevs1969daytona]

So i finally get my new engine (don't ask how much) but I am driving home on the highway and the temp is 190 degrees, it about 65 outside give or take.  Get into the build up area hit a couple of traffic lights and poop 220 WTF.  Get it home and call the shop.  They send the mechanic over and he installs a pusher fan.  I put some "wetter water" and take it for a rip.  Nothing changed.  Now my car had the the nose cone grill covered up when I got it (have no idea why).  Can that be the problem no grill at idle???  I ran my old 1970 charger with the hood closed it went up to 180 sitting running at idle.  This new engine 185 190 with the hood open at idle. Close the hood and to the moon it seems that there no place for the hot air to escape.  New engine has a be cool 10016 Radiator, fan shroud, 16 inch pusher becool fan.  WTF any ideas.  Will be calling the shop tomorrow.  Were Daytona known for this  Just checked again hood open 190 hood closed 210 and rising

[62 Max]

I see no reason in gods world to have the grille covered !!

[kevs1969daytona]

I know its getting fixed

[C5X DAYTONA]

103f here today.   I have AC on my Daytona and it was running 170f.      Check your timing..   AT 2500-3000 RPM.   Vacuum disconnected should be 45-51 and Vacuum Disconnected 30-36.      Higher numbers tend to ping on  pump gas when engine is warm/hot and after you have some miles on the motor.. At idle it's not that important but in the 5-15 BTC is ok.   Higher timing number on the idle could make it drag a little trying to start it hot..        A new engine will not often ping as there is no carbon built up.      You want the fan only IN the shroud ONLY 1/4 of the way.   DO NOT USE A CLUCH FAN.   I have found that the HAYDEN 7 blade stainless flex fans have worked the best for me on the 3 Daytona's I have and my dads.   Also check to see if your lower hose is sucking in.  Make sure it has a spring in it.   Freeway driving will suck in the hose when hot.     Test thermostat.    Radiator plugged?   I also use 6 impeller water pump with baffle welded to the impeller..    As far as you not having a grill..   As long as the bottom is opened up so you have the same TOTAL AREA OPEN you will be ok..   The bigger the hole the better the cooling. 

[Unwind]

Kev  
Go to page 2 and look for Thermostat Temp.  HemiGeno sent links to a huge amount of info.   You will be amazed at what you can learn.....

- is pusher fan actually pushing?   Check rotation.  
- Is thermostat installed correctly?   upside down?
- Does thermostat open at temp stated?   New stuff can be junk.
- Latch tray - help direct air to rad.  
- Confirm ignition timing
- What temp thermostat?

[kevs1969daytona]

Thanks for the reply, this really sucks I cant drive my car anywhere

[DAY CLONA]

Wingcars run hot regardless, check all the obvious mentioned above to eliminate mechanical issues, lack of a front grill, the lack of the Z bars being in the proper location, along with a lack of the seals required inside the nosecone and radiator to tunnel/direct air flow thru the radiator are all contributing to your problem 

[hemigeno]

Go to page 2 and look for Thermostat Temp.

Here is the link to the Thermostat Temp thread Unwind referenced (it won't always be on Page 2 of the board):

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,129973.0.html


To make it even easier, here are the other links embedded in that thread:

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,48725.msg1474150.html#msg1474150

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,60599.msg946205.html#msg946205

[kevs1969daytona]

I noticed as soon as the car starts the pumps send fluid thru the rad, spoke with the engine shop they think its not regulating and the thermosat is stuck open.  changing it out hopefully that causes the overheating issues.

[Daytona R/T SE]

I NOTICED AS SOON AS THE ENGINE STARTS THE PUMP STARTS SENDING FLUID THROUGH THE RAD, i THOUGHT THAT ONLY HAPPENS WHEN THE THEMOSTAT OPEN AT A CERTAIN TEMP

So...they left the thermostat out?

Or is it stuck open?

[kevs1969daytona]

Stuck open they say

[Swampwing2]

Find out what brand water pump they used and the style. If they used a 440Source pump, that could be a big reason.

[moparstuart]

My car used to over heat all the time on the highway ,  Fixed it dumped the Automatic and   put a 6 speed viper trans it , never gets above 160 anymore .   

[hemi68charger]

I had extreme problems with heat when I first got my Daytona, so hot the white plastic loops that hold the washer bottle squitter hose melted !!!

BUT, I drained as much coolant I could from the radiator AND block. I installed a hi-flow thermostat from Jegs I believe, 180 I believe... I put in nothing but distilled water and Water Wetter. I have never had a bad situation since... Sure, the temps go up in the middle of Summer, but I don't get the boil overs any more and the temp, according to the gauge, isn't too bad actually..... I drive my car all the time..... Also, a brand new motor is probably going to run warmer until everything is "broken in"........

[Aero426]

Lots of good advice above.     Pusher fan should help in traffic.   Temp will come up in traffic, but should be manageable.      Car should not run real hot when driving, esp with that big aluminum radiator.       Lack of the top latch tray and hood seal to rad support is a minus.     You want as much air forced thru the rad as possible.    Front spoiler helps too.    Some of these things are like stacking nickels where they add up.       

[ksquared]

I had extreme problems with heat when I first got my Daytona, so hot the white plastic loops that hold the washer bottle squitter hose melted !!!

BUT, I drained as much coolant I could from the radiator AND block. I installed a hi-flow thermostat from Jegs I believe, 180 I believe... I put in nothing but distilled water and Water Wetter. I have never had a bad situation since... Sure, the temps go up in the middle of Summer, but I don't get the boil overs any more and the temp, according to the gauge, isn't too bad actually.....

I would question the use of only distilled water and Water Wetter.  The way this is written, it appears that refraining from using antifreeze contributed to the elimination of the overheating symptoms.  I would find that highly doubtful, as many other areas were greatly improved, and as the 50/50 mixture raises the boiling point by ten degrees, you therefore have that much more leeway before boil over.  The Redline Water Wetter instructions say strictly water can be used in racing situations, but states "or reduce antifreeze levels in warm climates."  I would definitely agree in the use of distilled water vs. regular tap water though.

I'm not sure this really applies to the Daytonas, but will the Water Wetter lower the freezing point enough to prevent the engine block from cracking?  I'm not sure what percentage, but I thought at some point even if the mixture froze it wouldn't expand enough to crack a block or head.  Everybody always says 50/50 though.

[odcics2]

Wingcars run hot regardless, check all the obvious mentioned above to eliminate mechanical issues, lack of a front grill, the lack of the Z bars being in the proper location, along with a lack of the seals required inside the nosecone and radiator to tunnel/direct air flow thru the radiator are all contributing to your problem 

I'd say sealing everything so 100% of the air going into the nose goes thru the radiator is most important.   

[ksquared]

Wingcars run hot regardless, check all the obvious mentioned above to eliminate mechanical issues, lack of a front grill, ...

That is interesting, I really thought that front grill would impede the airflow, especially at the higher speeds.  I suppose it is so rocks don't destroy the radiator, but from strictly an airflow perspective I thought it would have a noticeable effect, as the opening is so small, and then all the small wires forming the grill take up space and block air.

[DAY CLONA]

Wingcars run hot regardless, check all the obvious mentioned above to eliminate mechanical issues, lack of a front grill, ...

That is interesting, I really thought that front grill would impede the airflow, especially at the higher speeds.  I suppose it is so rocks don't destroy the radiator, but from strictly an airflow perspective I thought it would have a noticeable effect, as the opening is so small, and then all the small wires forming the grill take up space and block air.

When you have  the front grille and lower cone openings installed, along with all the internal nose seals, radiator seals, proper fan shroud, fixed 5-7 blade fan, you should be able to have a sheet of typewritter/copy paper "stick" to the front grille at idle, this is when you have achieved the best pull thru the nose, it's always been my test when building a Daytona or Superbird

As far as a coolant mix, I've tried them all, the best to date for actually lowering the coolant temp is Zerex G-05 mixed 50/50 distilled water. with 8-12 oz of Redline water wetter on a 180 thermostat, assuming your running at least the equivalent of a 26"/4 row radiator

Mike

[Daytona Guy]

My 2 cents working through temp issues.

1. Got rid of my aluminum radiator, physics do not lie, copper conducts better than aluminum. Use a stock 3 core radiator with a stock shroud.

2. Got rid of the push fan. It restricts airflow. The CFM doesn't compare to a 6 blade flex fan or a 7 Stocker.

3. Got rid of the clutch fan.

4. Use a 318 water pump pulley. 10% increase in moving air

5. Make sure the fan is 50% out of the shroud

6. I went to a 6 blade flex fan. Just holding my hand in the engine bay you can physically feel way more air flow.

7. Use water wetter.

8. Do not use this new impeller they are putting in water pumps (that looks like an import) just use the airconditioning water pump.

My HEMI has 713 HP and is 11 to 1 so if it gets hot on pump gas it is not happy. I ran it on our 110 degree day from sop light to stop light stomping it. Kept cool. It will all boil down to moving air - move as much air as possible. Sealing up the engine bay did nothing. Just make sure the opening is the same Square inches as your radiator shroud opening. The fan working with the shroud does all the work -

[kevs1969daytona]

Ok problem solved, so I took the thermostat off and as per pic it appears upside down to me, and look closer the shaft was out of alignment. Now put a hi flow 160 in correct way in hottest it got was 180 degrees in slow traffic.

[Aero426]

Looks like no one bothered to put a new thermostat in the water pump housing when the engine went back together. 

[charger chris]

 My question is how can somebody put a thermostat in upside down 

[kevs1969daytona]

Well I have no idea, its the same shop that sent my 70 block to the metal recycles that I had to rescue. Anyways the engine runs fine, lots of power, maybe 450 hp plus so I'm happy actually drove it today without a knocking engine or over heating.   I think it's suppose to snow tomorrow here in Canada, lol.  Thanks for everyone input, cheers.

[62 Max]

You need to do two things,get rid of the 160* thermostat,put in at least a 180* and say goodbye to the shop you have been using !!

Also,in the first picture it looks as if the end of fan blade is bent or does it have that much pitch or is it me ?

[kevs1969daytona]

Why a 180 ? and all the fan tips are curved at the end

[62 Max]

One big misconception is that a 160 deg stat will maintain any engine at 160. The only thing the stat manufacturer can control and guarantee (stamp on the stat) is at what temperature that said thermostat will be FULLY OPEN. A 180 stat will be fully open at 180 etc. 195 at 195 etc. That's all those numbers mean...the temp at which the stat is fully open. How that relates to the many engine cooling combinations is anyones guess.

And for what it's worth,my bird has a 180 thermostat, original 3 core radiator,original 7 blade fixed fan and shroud,only change I ever made was going to the 6 blade A/C water pump.This is where if stays 90 % of the time,this gauge and the in dash gauge are 100% consistent and has never been over 200 under any conditions in the 33 yrs I've owned it.

Do a little research and you will find the disadvantages of a 160 in most cases,however in the long run the final decision and results are up to you.
Good luck

[cdr]

You need to do two things,get rid of the 160* thermostat,put in at least a 180* and say goodbye to the shop you have been using !!

Also,in the first picture it looks as if the end of fan blade is bent or does it have that much pitch or is it me ?

also fan blade is on backwards or it is all bent up ,it looks wrong.

[odcics2]

From an efficiency standpoint, the hotter you can run an engine the better.
Obviously, there are other parameters to also consider.