A real Barn Find instead of a story-The Bird in the Barn for 43 years!)

[taxspeaker]

Yeah we are still planning on no body work. The vinyl top today after the 4th careful scrub looks brand new. The glove box open door for 40 years responded well to 12 hours of penetrating oil and now closes! My boys removed the front seat today after work and says it shows no mouse homes, but the rips will need repair. The back seat however has some bad stuff-they tell me the front lip along the bottom of the back seat has rusted away-probably from mouse pee and they are having trouble getting it out-will wait for me to get home in 10 days. Found 1 little remnant of a build sheet on the floor in front of the seat so it is not looking good for whenever we can get that seat out, and will probably need to buy a new back seat frame unless we can somehow get it out without breaking it in two.

Does anyone rebuild voltage regulators or alternators? I really want to keep these originals and not replace them. Have decided to pull the original radiator hoses and clean them and see if they are acceptable for use. Voltage regulator is date coded 479-47th week of 1969 so I think it is clearly original for a late build date like this

The boys detailed a small section of the hood and it buffed out very well-see attached.

The carpet reeks of mouse pee, but we are still going to try and clean it and reuse it because it is in good shape. Other than the rear seat frame and the ripped fornt seat everything in the interior will be cleaned and used as is-the door panels are excellent, the armrests are excellent the chrome base plates are dull but acceptable and the chrome door handles and window cranks just need some gentle steel wool. The dash is excellent as are the gauges, shifter, heater, etc and even the glovebox cardboard is excellent, so the interior will be cleaned and left alone.

My original plans were to get it all running with everything merely cleaned and reusing or rebuilding the original parts and then selling it. At some point the rust will need to be dealt with, but it inside a heated shop, so I am unsure where we will go on it. My wife says keep it and fix the body in a year or two, but I don't think I want to do that again now-in the meantime we will have a load of fun just cleaning and rebuilding without replacing.

On the plug wires I am not sure they are original. They say "silicone core suppressor cable pat no. ...."-I thought these were date coded-anyone know?

[taxspeaker]

Forgot to mention-the windows all crank up and down flawlessly-unheard of in an old car like this! The radio tested out ok today, just a cut wire that we fixed so it will go back in as is. We will soak the PCV valve and reuse it and clean the carb and try to reuse it without rebuilding. The "key-in" buzzer worked when we hooked up the wiring the other day.

The engine compartment is nasty-lots of scrubbing and degreasing to occur there. The pie pan cleaned up somewhat acceptably maybe a 6 on a scale of 10.

The trunk mat has been removed and we are slowly degreasing it to reuse-it is also a mess after 43 years. It does have the rear bumper jack and arm, as well as the front jack tie down plate and jack arm, but is missing the front jack. I am still hoping they will find the starter, bellhousing cover and this jack up in Elkhart on the next trip up there. No other parts appear missing or visibly broken.

[Redbird]

Really nice story and writing.

[PettyMower]

Awesome story!  Make sure to look under the carpet BEFORE cleaning....you may find even more documentation.

I didn't look under mine until owning it for close to 30-years. And sure enough, a second build sheet.

[charger_fan_4ever]

Are those rust spots on topsides of fender where the brace is ?

So was only driven for 4 years. Was it always stored inside after that ? Did all that quarter rust happen in first 4 years ?

Id think buying AMD 1/4's and cutting out what is needed for patching the quarters and blend it up to first line with some urethane base paint would do wonders clean the rest and drive it as is.

is your white bird 4 speed and #s match ?

[rob-dirt]

    i want the trailor hitch off it      if you decide to take it off  LOL great find ENJOY it 

[aerolith]

Exactly right Charger fan!
Only fix the rust holes with bare minimum patching and leave her in all her beautiful Limeyness!!!
Original vinyl's are made of strong stuff and always look good with age.
She is worth as much as a restored birdie, without the resto costs in my booky wook...
Its only original once and patina can't be faked.

Aerolite.

My Dad always said, '' don't fix what ain't broke''.
Never a truer word said when it comes to old Mopes.

[odcics2]

Nothing like a good scrubbing with dish soap and a toothbrush.
Simple, but works wonders. Very gentle on old materials like vinyl.

Found the original #88 Engineering Daytona's headrest at Don White's shop, sitting in a box since 1973,
along with a bunch of other stuff.  At first, looked trashed!
But, after some elbow grease and then sitting in the sun to get rid of creases, its ok to use, as is.

[taxspeaker]

Actually thinking about leaving the trailer hitch and pulling the white bird behind it on an open trailer to some car show somewhere for kicks!

[thehemikid]

Cool idea.

[73rallye440magnum]

This is great! Exciting to see the preservation efforts.

[tan top]

 

[keepat]

Very cool, congrats!!
Pat

[Charger_Fan]

Thank you for sharing the informative & detailed story of this car, along with the cool pics! What an awesome find, I'm looking forward to your continued updates & photos.

In your to-do list, I didn't see you talk about changing the trans fluid. Make sure you do that too, since it's probably pretty ripe after all those years.

Oh, and great looking garage!

[taxspeaker]

Here is the latest good and bad news on the limegreen 43 year old:

In the last two weeks we have dis-assembled the entire interior. The floor pans (pictures attached) all have very minor surface rust and will be left untouched. The frontbench seat will need to be recovered as the hole is too bad to fix. The rear seat frame bottom rusted away from mouse droppings and we found a huge nest there. I wore a respirator and gloves to clean all of that out. Sadly there were tiny bits and pieces of the build sheet in the nest, but they were not recoverable. Once cleaned out we have it airing out and have put in a bunch of odor neutralizer and baking soda to remove the mouse smell. Strangely the floor there is also undamaged.

We removed the carpet undamaged in the front and back pieces. It reeks but we will try to clean it and air it out over the next few weeks-it is in excellent condition and if we can vacuum it many times and take it outside to clean and get rid of the smell it is clearly usable. I am trying to figure out a way to shampoo it to also clean out the smell.

The interior wiring is all undamaged or chewed and will not be modified in any way, except to replace all of the old missing fuses, put the radio back in and vacuum it. The passenger air vent is full of mouse nest and there is some rust damage at the bottom of the heater box leading me to believe that either mice lived in there too or the core leaked. It will need to be pulled, cleaned and repaired. The interior kick panels, window cranks, armrest and door pads are all in incredible condition and we cleaned them and have them ready for reinstallation at some point when we decide what to do on the carpet.

In the trunk we have found the complete original bumper jack, base, tie down wing nut and jack arm that we cleaned. We cleaned the original trunk mat for 5 days, but have now reused it-when but original and acceptable. For the nose jack we have found the tie down plate and wing nut and the jack arm, but not the jack. The wiring in the trunk was modified for the trailer hitch and we are leaving it alone-I still want to put the white bird on an open trailer and pull it with the green bird someday just to see people's reactions!

We determined from casting codes and date numbers that the alternator in the trunk was original so we sent it off to Dixie Resto for repair. We have not found a starter. I have an old, date correct starter that was rebuilt at some time 40 years ago but it has a different date code on part of it, so we are still looking. The voltage regulator is badly rusted and I have been unable to find one with the same date code (479) so I am going to put a 469 code on it for now in order to complete the ignition circuit. The plugs, points, wires, condenser and cap are all bad and new old stock is in hand and ready to install. We will also replace the radiator hoses with new old stock I have in my shop.

It looks like the engine bay will clean up very well with some hard work, scrubbing and cleaner. The underside of the hood is a surface rust mess, but we will at least clean it up.

The gas tank is empty!. I think we will pressure test it, blow it out, replace the short rubber hoses, filter and vapor separator and maybe the fuel pump, rebuild the carb and go with it!

So the summary of the good news-other  than cleaning and finding the missing nose jack, the interior is fantastic and will be reinstalled once the carpet and seat issues are addressed. The wiring seems to be fine too, and we already have most of the parts to fix the ignition circuit and missing electrical stuff.

The bad news: we are unable to get the engine to turn-it is frozen. We stopped trying yesterday after an hour and will now fill the cylinders with a mixture of 1/3 each kerosene, ATF and marvel mystery or PB blaster and let it sit for a week. Rather than risk breaking the crankshaft bolt, we are then going to put the car in gear (it is a stick) and try to rock it back and forth to see if we can free up the pistons that way. We have not degreased the engine are or done anything else there until we see where we are on this. I don't want to pull the engine and we are not in a hurry, so we will keep trying.

Will post again in a few weeks.

[Moparpoolman]

Nice Find If it were up to me, I'd get a cheap Harbor Freight inspection camera and stick it down the spark plug holes to see what the cylinder walls look like, But seeing that it's the matching #'s engine, I would probably pull it anyway and rebuild it which is what most of us would do, why risk catastrophic damage to the original block and devalue your investment.  If that's not in your budget then pull it, put it off to the side and put a running 440 in it for now.

[alfaitalia]

If its seized then the very least you will have is marked cylinder walls where the rings are stuck, rusted to it....so even if you free it off, damage to the rings/piston/bores is almost inevitable when you fire her up..imo. At the very least I would be taking the heads off to have a good look after (or if) you get the pistons moving. You might get away with taking the pistons out, freeing the rings in their grooves and honing the bore.....or not!

[ACUDANUT]

IMO opinion it needs a total restoration, to look good again.  
Original rust is not my idea of cool.   
Great find either way. 

[alfaitalia]

I have to agree....a "survivor" is only cool if its actually survived! ...and that means being drivable, fully functioning and rust free. I think you could get away without a FULL resto.....but the rust has got to go....just do the minimum you need to make it look like a true survivor. The my mind a survivor looks like it did the day it left the showroom....just with age related marks from wear and tear (faded paint, upholstery showing wear and tear from normal use, an engine that's original but actually runs!!). This one has not really survived....its got some rust and does not run. That rust will only get worse so it needs dealing with now....even the floor pan corrosion,...as slight as it is, it wont heal itself. Still a very cool find though. 

[taxspeaker]

Good point on the exterior rust-it must be addressed.

I am torn between making that decision or selling it and letting the new owner decide. My wife surprisingly says keep and restore but I've sunk so much money in these cars the thought of the cost of body work and paint leads me the other way. I can do all the mechanical things, but have no body work or paint skills and my age is catching up now on the mechanical side. The nice thing is there is no hurry to work on it, and I am entering 6 weeks of heavy work related travel so little will be done.

In reading the comments it is fun to see the different opinions-Charger Fan had me leaning towards nothing but getting it running, but Alfa makes common sense. Thanks for all of the suggestions guys, that's why I post the info as we go through it. Look for the Daytona to Alaska trip July, 2018!

Bob

[JB400]

This site could stand to have another bird resto as long as the means are there to do so.

But, is there any more joy in having another wing car in the stable, being that you have one of each already restored?  If so, I'd say keep it and restore it.  If not, let someone else have the joy of the resto.

[moparstuart]

Good point on the exterior rust-it must be addressed.

I am torn between making that decision or selling it and letting the new owner decide. My wife surprisingly says keep and restore but I've sunk so much money in these cars the thought of the cost of body work and paint leads me the other way. I can do all the mechanical things, but have no body work or paint skills and my age is catching up now on the mechanical side. The nice thing is there is no hurry to work on it, and I am entering 6 weeks of heavy work related travel so little will be done.

In reading the comments it is fun to see the different opinions-Charger Fan had me leaning towards nothing but getting it running, but Alfa makes common sense. Thanks for all of the suggestions guys, that's why I post the info as we go through it. Look for the Daytona to Alaska trip July, 2018!

Bob

you have two nice pretty wing cars  , I say leave it as is  , its so cool as is and i bet if you took it to a show and parked it next to your pretty white bird Most of the people will ignore your pretty car and come look at the Green one . 

[70 sublime]

Good point on the exterior rust-it must be addressed.

I am torn between making that decision or selling it and letting the new owner decide. My wife surprisingly says keep and restore but I've sunk so much money in these cars the thought of the cost of body work and paint leads me the other way. I can do all the mechanical things, but have no body work or paint skills and my age is catching up now on the mechanical side. The nice thing is there is no hurry to work on it, and I am entering 6 weeks of heavy work related travel so little will be done.

In reading the comments it is fun to see the different opinions-Charger Fan had me leaning towards nothing but getting it running, but Alfa makes common sense. Thanks for all of the suggestions guys, that's why I post the info as we go through it. Look for the Daytona to Alaska trip July, 2018!

Bob

you have two nice pretty wing cars  , I say leave it as is  , its so cool as is and i bet if you took it to a show and parked it next to your pretty white bird Most of the people will ignore your pretty car and come look at the Green one . 

And I bet you will not be as worried if someone touched the green car vs the white car
I think there is a lot less stress and as much or more enjoyment in driving a less than perfect car

[charger_fan_4ever]

agreed quarter panel rust needs to go. Weld in some new metal and blend the paint in. Fixing the rust at worse isnt going to take any value away from it. As mentioned it didnt survive well in that area, so why not fix it? Id probably address that floor rust too, a wire wheel and some por15 and paint overtop at a minimum. Not like the floor will get wet again so should be fine.

[F8-4life]

Don't listen to the people that are saying fix the the rust/restore it etc...

They are still stuck in the past, the car hobby has grown to appreciate originality in all forms now!
You will get more looks, attention & appreciation leaving the car original(rust & all), and thus telling the story in first tense.
Once you restore it, spot the paint in, you are  not only erasing what you can't replace but you are also making a decision on originality (for the cars sake) that will reverberate into the cars future and future owners, thus changing its history.
Anybody with money can restore a car, and any average spectator can appreciate a shiny "as new" example of a rare car, but the un-tampared originality and history of your car is what makes it special, and to polish & buff that away is not something I would agree with.