Repair/restoration of wrecked 1969 Charger

[mariusjh03]

Hey guys,

Just wanted to quickly introduce myself. First post to the forum, although I joined some months ago in preparation for my newest project. Although I've restored mostly Mustangs in the past, I was a long-time engineer at Chrysler (Michigan) and have now relocated to the Bay Area, California.

Now, the car. I recently picked up a wrecked 1969 383-2 Charger (green/green - I know not everybody's favorite color combination). It was listed on CL for a long-time, as some of you may already know (http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,127542.0.html). It just pained me to see the poor thing wrecked like that and after working out a deal with the owner, I brought it home so that I could restore it to it's former glory.

Now the good and the bad:
Although the owner stated that it "runs well," - it does not. The water pump blades had crushed into the block through the front. The radiator was completely trashed (and 90% empty of coolant), the front engine and transmission motor mounts had all been sheared off (the entire engine slid forward over an inch in the wreck!), the passenger-side manifold is cracked, it leaks oil like hell out of the passenger-side valve cover, pulleys are rubbing each other, etc. And god knows what else. What a mess!

However, for the good, the car is mostly original (does currently have a darker-green than original paint job - it used to be F5), the interior is okay, does have some annoying die on the headrests and unoriginal black carpeting - but everything does work. Radio, lights, etc. Also came nicely equipped from Hamtramck with power steering/brakes, disc brakes, hood signals, remote mirror, light package, A/C. It also included numerous spares (wheel covers, master cylinder, rotor/caliper/knuckle assemblies), the spare wheel/tire, jack, wrench and original '69 Calif. black plates.

The frame isn't damaged, but the radiator support is crushed-in and inner fenders wrinkled up front. The fenders, grill, headlight support, hood, bumper, bumper mounts are all trash.

I plan to disassemble the entire front end, pull the motor, repair the rad support & inner fenders, paint the engine compartment back to it's original medium green metallic (it's black now), replace the fenders/hood/grill etc. and restore it 100% to the original build plate and spec. sheet. I know it will never be an R/T. But should be a wonderful big-block Charger in good driving condition once repaired and restored!

Please wish me luck!

[68RT440]

I do remember seeing that car. I'm glad that someone is going to fix it. Good luck with the repair and post pics of the progress!

[darbgnik]

I remember that one I think?
They're all worth saving! And I'd much rather build a damaged one than a rusty one.

[tan top]

 Hello & welcome    good luck with your project 

[JR]

Welcome to the site.

That car was a great find. X2 on repairing the wrecked car over the rusty one.

That restoration will be a breeze. Replacement K frames are easy enough to find.

Make this a build thread and post progress pics. We love build threads here.

[charge69]

You've got a good head start on it considering how bad some of the restoration-in-progress Chargers we have here on the board now!  I am confident you will make a beautiful restoration on it !

Good luck and fair winds for you on this future project ! !

[BDF]

Good luck!
Love the color!!!   
I'll be watching this one. 

[Lennard]

Welcome, good luck and enjoy!

[VegasCharger]

Welcome aboard 

Good luck 

Let me know if the inner fenders and rad support is too much of a challenge.

I have some nice OEM sheet metal. 

[Charger_Fan]

Welcome aboard! That looks like a good project you have there, looking forward to seeing your future progress updates on this car. I hope you were able to talk the seller down quite a ways from his original asking price. Other than the wrecked parts & some of the interior, it looks like a really clean Charger.

the front engine and transmission motor mounts had all been sheared off (the entire engine slid forward over an inch in the wreck!)

Same here, when mine got wrecked years ago...all three mounts sheared, sending the engine & trans forward into the radiator. The driveline popped out & it drained ATF all over the ground, along with all the coolant. I bent the steering wheel & collapsed the column in the crash.

[CDN72SE]

Welcome to the site and I will be following along to watch the transformation, don't see many builds like this.

[mariusjh03]

Thanks, everyone!

I hope you were able to talk the seller down quite a ways from his original asking price. Other than the wrecked parts & some of the interior, it looks like a really clean Charger.

Yep, worked out a fair deal... in hindsight I may have overpaid a little, but it'll be a really fun project and it is pretty clean from the A-pillars back. A little rust at the bottom of the C-pillars and in the trunk (probably from sitting at the wrecking yard for a year or two), but nothing extensive. The underside of the car is solid. Really solid. It was southern California after all! It has a newer vinyl top, nice headliner, almost-perfect upholstery, door panels, chrome, trim, etc. Just the front end is a mess! Plus, I discovered that it can't make right turns, haha. The idler arm of the steering hits the exhaust pipe where the motor/transmission assembly sheared the mounts and slid forward in the car.

Let me know if the inner fenders and rad support is too much of a challenge.
I have some nice OEM sheet metal. 

Much appreciated, Vegas! I'm going to try to salvage as much as the original metal as possible, but inevitably it's going to need something. I'll let you know!

Welcome, good luck and enjoy!

Thanks!

Good luck!
Love the color!!!   

Me too, actually!

Make this a build thread and post progress pics. We love build threads here.

I'll give it a shot and try to upload as much as I can!

[mariusjh03]

Hello & welcome    good luck with your project  

Thank you!

I am confident you will make a beautiful restoration on it !

Appreciate the confidence!

I'm glad that someone is going to fix it. Good luck with the repair and post pics of the progress!

On it!!

By the way - one of the seller's photos - but here's the front-end damage. Ouch!!!

[mariusjh03]

Some more pictures of the damage:

[mariusjh03]

Fortunately, being a southern California car with minimal rust, all bolts came out easily with an impact driver and the front end was easy to take apart. Aside from the whole front end being trash, the bolts are probably salvageable along with a few brackets and other odds-and-ends.

For example, although the entire grill was trashed, the vacuum canisters and brackets were just a little tweaked, but okay! Can be straightened easily. Plus, the headlamp bezels are mint! Bonus! 

[cdr]

DO NOT throw ANYTHING away even if it looks like junk,trash ect,, until the car is put back together

[Lennard]

DO NOT throw ANYTHING away even if it looks like junk,trash ect,, until the car is put back together

Great advice

[darbgnik]

DO NOT throw ANYTHING away even if it looks like junk,trash ect,, until the car is put back together

Great advice

Hahaha, yeah, I don't even bin old u joints till the new ones are in........ might need a c clip... lol

[VegasCharger]

DO NOT throw ANYTHING away even if it looks like junk,trash ect,, until the car is put back together

And even after that. 

[Mopar Nut]

Welcome aboard!

[Charger_Fan]

Looking good!
Did the previous owner say what he hit? I'm guessing he rear ended a truck with a trailer hitch, but I can't figure out how the bumper got creased offset, on the driver's side.

[marshallfry01]

I wondered if someone ever bought the car! I'm glad it was someone here. A few months ago I made the post about it but I never called the owner. Looks like a great car to start with. New front clip and some other minor fixes and you'll have a nice charger. Good luck to you!

[tan top]

DO NOT throw ANYTHING away even if it looks like junk,trash ect,, until the car is put back together

And even after that. 

yep what they said   

[qwick68]

Very cool, congrats

[Mytur Binsdirti]

Looks salvageable. An accident repair like that is better than working with a rotted hulk.

[Dans 68]

Marius,

It was a pleasure to meet you today. Looks like a good project.     I will sure try to help you get her back on the road. 

Dan

[mariusjh03]

Did the previous owner say what he hit? I'm guessing he rear ended a truck with a trailer hitch, but I can't figure out how the bumper got creased offset, on the driver's side.

Unfortunately, the seller was not actually the previous owner, just some guy that ended up with the car post-wreck... So there was no information about the accident. I wish I knew! If anybody here knew the previous owner, let me know!

I wondered if someone ever bought the car! I'm glad it was someone here. Looks like a great car to start with. New front clip and some other minor fixes and you'll have a nice charger. Good luck to you!

Thank you!

It was a pleasure to meet you today. Looks like a good project.     I will sure try to help you get her back on the road. 

You too, Dan! Thanks a lot! Looking forward to helping you out with your '68 LL1!

[mariusjh03]

Got everything off down to the front clip. Doesn't look too bad, but definitely will have a few challenges in front of me. Frame rails are straight, but the very forward leading edge is flared out a little. The inner fenders are wrinkled up pretty bad, but I'm going to try my best to straighten them out with some duck-bill pliers and mallets. Front condenser got hit, but no leaks as far as I can tell. Just needs ribbing straightened out and paint. Radiator support may have taken the brunt of the impact, the whole center is bowed-in towards the engine pretty bad.

[mariusjh03]

Better view of the inner fenders, rad support and frame rails.

[Lennard]

That doesn't look bad at all. 

[mariusjh03]

A couple more. Does anybody know the best way to flatten/straighten the leading edge of the frame rail? Blow-torch and a heavy hammer? You can see in this pictures where the surface with the two large bolts has bowed out a little...

[mariusjh03]

Also, why anyone would paint black over the beautiful medium green metallic paint in the engine compartment is beyond me! Here you can see some of the original paint shiny through under the rear fender bolt near the cowl.

[mariusjh03]

Surprisingly, with a new Optima red-top, this Charger runs really strong. The only problem is that it squeals terribly, leaks oil out of the passenger-side valve cover and exhaust billows out of the (probably-cracked) passenger-side exhaust manifold. Oh, that and the two motor mounts and rear transmission mount are sheared. I took out the gut-punched radiator, shroud and condenser and here's what it looks like:

[mariusjh03]

Confirmed the source of the loud-squealing. The water pump did indeed get pushed into the block, and all six-blades on the original pump (PN: 2843290) got shoved hard into the block. Yep, that's not good:

[nvrbdn]

Gotta jump onto follow this. Welcome to the site. 

[Troy]

Having had a few "dinged up" old Mopars...

If the inner fenders took enough of a hit to wrinkle they had to push against something. Usually cowl/firewall. Many times this will cause a tear. The frame rails push against the torsion bar cross member, inner fenders, and floors so you'll see waves.
1. Measure front to back, side to side, and diagonally across the engine bay. Top and bottom. There are frame measurements posted online.
2. Take it to a fame shop. If your frame rails are ballooned out the they can pull them back into place before you screw with any sheet metal!
3. The inner fenders should get better after the frame shop but, honestly, that whole front clip is the same for any B-body (including 4 doors) and I've paid as little as $500 for the entire thing (frame rails, cowl, firewall, rad support, etc.). Save yourself a ton of time flattening metal and just replace it with another "chunk" that's still straight from the factory (well, as straight as the factory made them). I wouldn't replace the rails necessarily - as that's a lot more work and you lose a major reference point.

Troy

[Simonic]

Interesting thread....Looking good so far 

[Bronzedodge]

Having had a few "dinged up" old Mopars...

If the inner fenders took enough of a hit to wrinkle they had to push against something. Usually cowl/firewall. Many times this will cause a tear. The frame rails push against the torsion bar cross member, inner fenders, and floors so you'll see waves.
1. Measure front to back, side to side, and diagonally across the engine bay. Top and bottom. There are frame measurements posted online.
2. Take it to a fame shop. If your frame rails are ballooned out the they can pull them back into place before you screw with any sheet metal!
3. The inner fenders should get better after the frame shop but, honestly, that whole front clip is the same for any B-body (including 4 doors)  (snip)  I wouldn't replace the rails necessarily - as that's a lot more work and you lose a major reference point.
Troy

Correct.  You will have to apply the same amount of force in the opposite direction as the hit.  You'll need chain come-alongs, anchor points, Cable hand winch, and enough know how to not hurt yourself.  Take it somewhere with a PullMax and someone with experience running it.

Then get a copy of this.  Or buy this first and have a go yourself.: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mtf-bfb?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-martin-tool-and-forge&gclid=Cj0KCQjwwevLBRCGARIsAKnAJvfEa1OoIEUzePXw0EKRdAY18vBEfgY28y6PG9tpWkeJdxzMWpK_5IUaArvbEALw_wcB

[dual fours]

hey Bronzedodge go back a edit your post above me and move your ":https://" one place to the right an see if the link highlights blue and then that should make it click-on-a-ble.

Thanks from all Bd.

[dual fours]

Also, why anyone would paint black over the beautiful medium green metallic paint in the engine compartment is beyond me! Here you can see some of the original paint shiny through under the rear fender bolt near the cowl.

You have seen just how crappy the factory paint was in some of the engine bays? Black was the color of choice I think back then. I did the same stupid thing back in 1979, now I'm cleaning it off  and going back to Factory FK5 drips, runs and painted over grit . 

[Mike DC]

   
Here's another vote to have the frame (professionally) straightened BEFORE you cut away any wrinkled sheetmetal.  THEN start doing any necessary sheetmetal surgery. 

[VegasCharger]

I know you have a decision on hand on which direction you want to go but as I mentioned before I have clean sheet metal. In fact I'm in the process of tearing down the 68 Coronet 4 door shell. And I could leave the front box intact (minus the torsion bar x member and floor board sheet metal from firewall to x member). This is an A/C car just like yours with the 26" rad support. Absolutely rust free, straight, clean SW sheet metal. A good candidate.

Here are a few pics.

1st pic was earlier on when the motor was still in it but you can get a good look at the structure of this front clip.

2nd pic was taken yesterday of the front clip being removed from the rest of the body.

[Charger_Fan]

Also, why anyone would paint black over the beautiful medium green metallic paint in the engine compartment is beyond me! Here you can see some of the original paint shiny through under the rear fender bolt near the cowl.

My guess is that the original under hood color no longer matches the exterior, so they took the easy way out and went with black.

[mariusjh03]

Thank you everyone for the advice and feedback! Especially Dans 68 who lives near me and let me take some measurements off of his beauty '68!

So here's what I'm thinking so far, based on your recommendations (some of which I've already done, I'm just late posting to the forum. Pictures to follow):
- Better assess the damage to the frame rails and/or inner fenders
- Compare measurements from Dan's 68 Charger, and from other diagrams/measurements found on this forum (also the 1969 shop manual)
- Put the car on the frame-jig at my pal James' shop and make adjustments to the frame rails (if necessary)
- Straighten the inner fenders as best as I can and pull the rad support forward to determine if any of the front structure needs to be repaired replaced
- Surgery to the sheet metal (again, if necessary)
- Mock-up fenders/hood/bumper/headlamp support/grill to check fitment, gaps, etc. and determine if any other adjustments to the clip need to be made
- Pull the motor and send for paint

... And then about a million other steps later and have a beauty driver '69!!

I know you have a decision on hand on which direction you want to go but as I mentioned before I have clean sheet metal. In fact I'm in the process of tearing down the 68 Coronet 4 door shell. And I could leave the front box intact (minus the torsion bar x member and floor board sheet metal from firewall to x member). This is an A/C car just like yours with the 26" rad support. Absolutely rust free, straight, clean SW sheet metal. A good candidate.

What is the status of the Coronet front clip? Although, I'm not sure yet if I would need it, but thanks for the pics! There are a couple factors that come to mind here: the car is going to be a driver so a slight wrinkle/wave here or there may be okay, so long as it's not in a super-visible place. I do also want to retain the VIN stamped rad support if possible. That being said, if I tear everything down and determine a new front clip is necessary, I will do it.

1. Measure front to back, side to side, and diagonally across the engine bay. Top and bottom. There are frame measurements posted online.
2. Take it to a fame shop. If your frame rails are ballooned out the they can pull them back into place before you screw with any sheet metal!
3. The inner fenders should get better after the frame shop but, honestly, that whole front clip is the same for any B-body (including 4 doors) and I've paid as little as $500 for the entire thing (frame rails, cowl, firewall, rad support, etc.). Save yourself a ton of time flattening metal and just replace it with another "chunk" that's still straight from the factory (well, as straight as the factory made them). I wouldn't replace the rails necessarily - as that's a lot more work and you lose a major reference point.

This is super helpful advice! With Dan's help and the info on the forum, I'm taking measurements everywhere and comparing it to Dan's car and the factory diagrams.


Pics to follow!

[mariusjh03]

Last week Dans 68 and I took some measurements off his '68 Charger. Here's the diagram we used (sorry for some of my scribble on here). I'm posting in case it's helpful to anyone else. If you have any questions, let me know and I'd be happy to clarify any measurements/notes!

[mariusjh03]

Also, here's some light inner fender surgery I did (for the purpose of taking measurements and assessing the status of my front clip). It was actually simple and easy to do. A pair of duck-bill pliers and a collection of pry-bars, mallets and other simple tools.

[mariusjh03]

Radiator support adjustment (pulling the rad support away from the firewall - in the direction of the front of the car - to match the measurement from Dan's Charger and the diagram.

By the way, don't judge me for the technique, just trying to get creative in my SF bay area parking garage!!

[Dans 68]

Nice method to help straighten out the rad support! 

Dan

[moparstuart]

love it , nothing wrong with a little creative engineering . It lets you see where you are and where to go from here

[JR]

"If it's stupid, but it works, it ain't stupid." 

[VegasCharger]

What is the status of the Coronet front clip? Although, I'm not sure yet if I would need it, but thanks for the pics! There are a couple factors that come to mind here: the car is going to be a driver so a slight wrinkle/wave here or there may be okay, so long as it's not in a super-visible place. I do also want to retain the VIN stamped rad support if possible. That being said, if I tear everything down and determine a new front clip is necessary, I will do it.

Front box is removed (see pics below).

No dents, no rust, SOLID!!

Rad support is included and has the VIN stamping.

Also if we were to come to a deal, I can deliver it to you much cheaper than if you were to outsource it. Unless you were wanting to pick it up yourself in Las Vegas, NV.

[Charger_Fan]

Radiator support adjustment (pulling the rad support away from the firewall - in the direction of the front of the car - to match the measurement from Dan's Charger and the diagram.

By the way, don't judge me for the technique, just trying to get creative in my SF bay area parking garage!!

Love it! That's totally something I would do in the same situation.  

[cdr]

Radiator support adjustment (pulling the rad support away from the firewall - in the direction of the front of the car - to match the measurement from Dan's Charger and the diagram.

By the way, don't judge me for the technique, just trying to get creative in my SF bay area parking garage!!

AWESOME !!!!   

[tan top]

 

[funknut]

I am genuinely shocked and completely impressed you're tackling this in an underground shared garage!

[Homerr]

That sheet you posted is well known, but here's a clean copy.

[Charger_Fan]

That sheet you posted is well known, but here's a clean copy.

Thanks, I was squinting to see the original measurements. Much clearer.