Fitech hot start issues

[flyinlow]

Anyone have hot start issues with their Fitech fuel command center?

Last summer I had problems after being stuck in traffic and then shutting off for 10 mins. Cranked a lot  would not start , started after 10 mins. or so. Showed normal high side pressure. (58psi) 

Fitech said to slow the pump down at low power settings. I set it at about 37 % per their instructions. Seamed to help.

I went to the Chrysler Classic Power Event last month at National Trails. A buddy was driving the car we where stuck in the line to get in for 40 minutes (thank you National Trails) .  He thought he would be nice to my engine and shut it off....then it won't start.

The fuel center is behind the passenger headlight bucket where it would appear to stay cool .Temperature reading of the command center are 110-120*F after driving for awhile in 80*F weather. The fuel lines are steel or braided with insulation and routed away from hot areas as much as possible. The throttle body has a 3/8 insulator under it.

I am wondering if a non- return system is going to work.

[JR]

I would bet fuel is being cooked in the command center while the car is sitting still and no air is circulating in the engine bay.

Do you have a return line running from the FCC back to the original fuel tank?

You could probably band aid the problem by adding electric fans that run at low speeds and after engine shutoff, but I still wouldn't depend on it.

I'd strongly recommend selling of the FCC and going to a proper submerged in tank fuel pump with a return line. It's a much better solution than keeping a couple gallons of fuel cooking in the hot engine bay.

[flyinlow]

I have a 1/4 " vent line from the FCC to the gas tank.

The outside of the FCC gets warm to the touch but not boiling hot. The gas inside being churned by the pump might be hotter?

I like the idea of the Fuel Command Center because its  ability to drive the car down to lower tank levels without fuel starvation issues. The FCC has a reservoir of fuel do draw on like a carb with its fuel bowl. Temporary uncovering the inlet in the tank would not be an issue like a pump in tank retro solution. I try not to drive around with an 1/8 tank of gas, but I don't want to go around a corner and have the engine flame out because the pump sucked air for 1/2 a second. The FCC set up also allowed me to reinstall the carb if I needed to on the road. My car was towed home for the first time with this system when the front of the FCC low pressure gauge blew out leaking fuel . If I had a pipe plug(do now) I would have been back on the road.

I am looking into the pump in tank with a return.

[flyinlow]

When I was running a carb I  used a filter with a return line 3/8" in,  3/8" out to carb , 1/4" out return to tank with a restriction in it. I never had issues with this set up. I went with AN lines and AN6 filter on the line between the engine pump and the Fuel Center. The 1/4" return is now used to vent the Fuel Center.

[JR]

Spectre and Tanks Inc fuel tanks come with built in baffles so fuel starvation around corners isnt an issue.

I autocross my car often and never once have had that issue.

That issue only happens when people convert stock fuel tanks and dont add the baffles.

If youre absolutely determined to keep the fcc, you really should get more air flowing around the engine bay. Electric fans, ceramic coated/wrapped header pipes, electric fans, relocate battery, etc.

Personally, i think youre fighting an uphill battle considering how much heat big blocks radiate, and how tight our engine bays are.

The fuel command center seems better suited to full size pickup trucks, or 50s land barges, in my opinion.

[flyinlow]

It's good to know that tanksinc work that well. Thanks for the info.

I have ceramic headers , dual electric radiator fans, lots of insulation sleeves, battery in trunk and dual 4 inch cold air tubes bringing air from in front of the radiator support to the air cleaner. The right air intake draws air  past the FCC. The only place left to put it was in front of the radiator support.

I talked to Tanksinc and they confirmed what their website showed , no 3rd.gen tanks. They said their retro pump kits have a  sump that helps but not as well as a purpose built baffled tank.

I looked at other tanks Coronet, non-Mopar, they suggested a Cuda tank might be made to work.    I have a new stock tank I can play with.

[TommyGun]

Look in to the Holley Hydramat product.  Gets good reviews seems like it would be an easy retrofit.

[Dreamcar]

Someday I'd like to have an FI so I'm only asking this because I have no knowledge of how it's supposed to be set-up:  Does the FCC have to be close to the engine or could you mount it further away from heat? Trunk?

[flyinlow]

You could mount it farther away. It is designed to be filled with your stock engine driven fuel pump. So if you did not mind running longer lines  .

[Midnight_Rider]

Aeromotive looks like it should work for in-tank? But... $$$
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/aeromotive-phantom-fuel-pump-and-baffle-system/


Thinking about fuel injection down the road myself, so trying to plan ahead.

[JR]

I got curious how many others were having similar problems with the FCC, and found a huge thread on a Chevelle forum, and this YouTube video describing the same problem.

https://youtu.be/KvdBOc5vBeE

Granted, the Torino in that video does have the FCC mounted right beside a header, but the concern is valid.

In my opinion, storing fuel in a steel, heat absorbing canister under the hood is a very bad idea.

[Dreamcar]

Why not use the fitech inline pump kit and eliminate the FCC altogether?

[69wannabe]

This was a problem on my car also and was something I was trying to eliminate by going to EFI. Anyway I hate to say after some hot start issues and some problems running the car in warmer/hot weather period I pulled the Fi tech off and put my holley back on there and traded the fi tech for a paint job on my truck. I checked into the tanks inc stuff and making the move to do an in tank pump and that was going to be almost another 1000 bucks so I decided to go back to the carb. Sorry folks, i'm a quitter. I put my carb back on, put on the cool carb spacer kit and put thermo wrap on my fuel lines around the engine and it starts hot better than the fi tech did and runs fine so oh well......

[AZMoparboy]

Hi all,

I've got the small Fitech, 3003 system with a tanks inc. fuel system. This is running on my 1971 Challenger with stock 383. I've had a hot start  issue just a little.  I realized that if I came off the freeway and the engine was working hard and very hot to begin with, then shutting the engine off, that is when I got the hot start issue once I wanted to start it immediately after shutting it down.  I think that my engine bay is getting extremely heat soaked and then trying to start it again. The fuel lines are all exposed and I think that I am boiling the fuel in the fuel lines next to the engine coming off the lower right frame rail, and that is where I have my fuel filter as well. I'm going to put some kind of heat wrap on that area of the fuel lines and see if that helps. I have no problems with the Fitech system running when it's hot, I've had it in traffic, stop and go for over half hour with  temperatures at around 100, with no stalling or engine showing signs of heat problems.

I'm  so glad that I have transitioned to an EFI system and gotten away from the carburetor. Today's cars don't have carburetors. EFI systems are now the norm and I am glad that I personally went this direction with my newest project. Good Luck to all  that are venturing out of the carburetor era.

Have nice weekend All,
Steve

[flyinlow]

I got curious how many others were having similar problems with the FCC, and found a huge thread on a Chevelle forum, and this YouTube video describing the same problem.

https://youtu.be/KvdBOc5vBeE

Granted, the Torino in that video does have the FCC mounted right beside a header, but the concern is valid.

In my opinion, storing fuel in a steel, heat absorbing canister under the hood is a very bad idea.

Yea I found that video last week. His installation is a little poorly planed, On top of the headers, black rubber fuel lines in hazardous areas

He does make a comment about the internal pump churning the fuel and possibly heating it up. If it was a return system the pump and fuel around it would stay cooler. Some OEM EFI systems use a deadheaded (non-return) set up with pulse width modulation. These pumps are in the tank surrounded by lots of fuel and away from engine heat.

I have not given up on the FCC ,yet. I need to talk to Fitech some more.

[JR]

While I would ditch the FCC so fast, I do admire your determination.

Have you read the big thread on the Chevelle forum discussing the FCC? The consensus over there doesn't seem optimistic about it either.

[Back N Black]

Hi all,

I've got the small Fitech, 3003 system with a tanks inc. fuel system. This is running on my 1971 Challenger with stock 383. I've had a hot start  issue just a little.  I realized that if I came off the freeway and the engine was working hard and very hot to begin with, then shutting the engine off, that is when I got the hot start issue once I wanted to start it immediately after shutting it down.  I think that my engine bay is getting extremely heat soaked and then trying to start it again. The fuel lines are all exposed and I think that I am boiling the fuel in the fuel lines next to the engine coming off the lower right frame rail, and that is where I have my fuel filter as well. I'm going to put some kind of heat wrap on that area of the fuel lines and see if that helps. I have no problems with the Fitech system running when it's hot, I've had it in traffic, stop and go for over half hour with  temperatures at around 100, with no stalling or engine showing signs of heat problems.

I'm  so glad that I have transitioned to an EFI system and gotten away from the carburetor. Today's cars don't have carburetors. EFI systems are now the norm and I am glad that I personally went this direction with my newest project. Good Luck to all  that are venturing out of the carburetor era.

Have nice weekend All,
Steve

I got a carb on my 440, 10,000 miles since restoration, never left me stranded yet. does not hesitate or stall and starts up and idles no problem. With all the issues I see with the EFI, I'm not sold yet.

[JR]

EFI is fantastic. The aftermarket has pretty much solved any issues with throttle body EFI by now.

Now, the Fuel Command Center that is the issue here, that's a whole nother can of worms.

[68CoronetRT]

Hate to say it but my Sniper EFI has yet to have a bad start. Cold or hot.

[flyinlow]

While I would ditch the FCC so fast, I do admire your determination.

Have you read the big thread on the Chevelle forum discussing the FCC? The consensus over there doesn't seem optimistic about it either.

I appreciate the sentiment . Not so sure it is determination or dread over the headaches of building the tank set up for a 73. I have been looking at reviews of Tanksinc., Aeromotive, and Holley retro kit with their hydromat.

Hope to get some garage time this week. I have a new stock Spectre tank to play with. Jeg's is about 30 minutes away, so I might stop down there with the tank and check out those choices in the flesh.

I don't like to take the car out of service for long during the summer (Good Guy's , Carlisle and The Nats are coming up) so I would have to have everything ready to change over quickly if I do it before the shows.

[flyinlow]

Talked to Fitech again. They suggested opening the Fuel center and removing the needle and seat. This would allow the engine driven pump to fill and then push fuel back to the tank ,keeping fresh cool fuel around the electric high pressure pump. I am using the original 1/4" metal vapor return line on the "73 for my Fuel Command Center vent line back to the tank.  I will change this to an 6 Russel push lock hose. The tank has four 1/4" vent lines that could be used for returns. Would have to tee AN6 to two AN4  vent lines.
Goodguys is this weekend (Columbus) and Carlisle (800 mile trip) is next weekend. So I will run the new line as a vent for now and try removing the needle and seat afterwards. The car is dependable on the road currently.

[Midnight_Rider]

I have been looking at reviews of Tanksinc., Aeromotive, and Holley retro kit with their hydromat.

I see FiTech has a couple of new items out -- a 'G Sump' and 'G Surge'... may be worth looking into? The Surge appears to be an evolution of (and possible upgrade/replacement of) the FCC.

[flyinlow]

OK , I am getting ready to mod the new tank for the Tanks Inc. pump. I have a couple questions.

You just run the AN 6 braided delivery line to the throttle body (10 micron filter)and an other one back to the return on the tank. The throttle body regulator will maintain the correct pressure?

The FCC pump setting was set to slow the idle to 40%. Should I return that to 100% al the time?

[68CoronetRT]

Yes and Yes.

Has a built in fuel regualtor. And I'd run the fuel pump off a relay and ditch the stupid "slow down" feature. Fuel pumps do not like voltage changes.