Car will need a new engine.

[keith88]

The engine in my charger is a 318 and i was taking it to work the other day when i started to miss so i took it back home. Now when i bought it i had no idea about the drive line at all and neither did the guy i bought it from..he says. So far i have redone the trani,and rear end so its only fitting the motor would be next the bad part,and it went 2 days before i was going to go to a car show that Tom Wopat was going to be at and he would have signed the car if it had made it(he signed the glovebox I took out instead)
The plan is to replace my 318 with a 360 this winter. Has any done this? So far I've been told i will have to get a oil pan and a balancer and i will need to shim one motor mount. And some tell me i need a different flex plate but can use my converter if i do that. Any help on this would be much appreciated.  

[1969 R/T SE]

Why not a 440?

[Dino]

You could get a 360 with factory efi out of a truck! That would be sweet!

Do you know the 318 is done for or do you want something else regardless?

Oh and by the way, his name is Wopat, not Wolpat. 

[bull]

Why not a 440?

I was about to suggest that myself but then remembered that the 318 and 360 are so similar it would make a lot more sense if you're just wanting to get back on the road quicker.

Before I bought my 68 I test drove a 69 with a 340 transplant. That thing had some serious balls. I was surprised.

[1969 R/T SE]

Ahhh... ok, but why not buy a dodge motor home, they normaly have a 440 and if you look, you can normaly find one cheap

[c00nhunterjoe]

Why not a 440?

Mopar small block powered- runs 149-150mph in the 1/4 on a throttle stop. Dont underestimate what you can do with a small block. You only need a big block if you want a big block.

[bull]

Ahhh... ok, but why not buy a dodge motor home, they normaly have a 440 and if you look, you can normaly find one cheap

Motorhome engines are usually dogs too. One popular example is the Roadkill Charger.

[Homerr]

Ahhh... ok, but why not buy a dodge motor home, they normaly have a 440 and if you look, you can normaly find one cheap

Motorhome engines are usually dogs too. One popular example is the Roadkill Charger.

Plus the disaster of demoing the motorhome!

[polywideblock]

find a 340 and you don't need all the 360 specific stuff

[keith88]

Why not a 440?

The car is set up for a small block ...has a 904 and a 8 1/4 rear both just redone in the last couple years and i dont really want to thought all that money away just to put a big block in.  I already have a 360 that im eyeing it a new reman from a company that did my jeep engine several years back.  340 had to find and big bucks.

[tan top]

 sorry to hear about the motor ,   have you thought about one of these ......


https://www.summitracing.com/int/search/make/dodge/engine-family/mopar-small-block-la/department/engines-components/section/engine-assemblies?N=4294951331%2B4294951325%2B4294949512%2B4294881857&SortBy=Default&SortOrder=Ascending&retaillocation=int

[keith88]

Yes but im getting my for half that price paying just over 2 grand using my intake carb and waterpump and assorted stuff.

[Mytur Binsdirti]

Damn, you missed Luke Duke's potential signature. I'm sure that's more of a bummer than the engine. What went wrong with the engine that warrants a complete replacement?

[keith88]

Couple things started off with going though 2 quarts of oil in a short time and finding out buy the lifter noise it made with when i got on it passing a slow truck. Put oil in it it it seemed fine than the other day i dropped a cylinder have bad compression in one cylinder ..the side my son seen smoke come out of when he was behind me once. I always said if the motor gives me issues i will change the engine to something a little bigger but i have to keep it a small block for know.

[Mytur Binsdirti]

Before you pull it, might as well have some fun with it. Drain the oil & water, start it up and block the throttle halfway open.   

[keith88]

See how long it will go before it stops!

[Mike DC]

      

Mopar small block powered- runs 149-150mph in the 1/4 on a throttle stop. Dont underestimate what you can do with a small block. You only need a big block if you want a big block.

. . . says the guy with an aluminum big block for an avatar pic . . .  

---------------------------------


Nothing wrong with a decent smallblock though.  The 360s can pull pretty hard with some decent parts.  Stroker crank setups to bring them up to 410" cost pizza money these days.  The car is better balanced with 100 lbs missing off the front end compared to a big block.

[Troy]

Ok, dialing back to the original topic...

1. You can get a 318 practically for free (and you already have one). A 360 will be only slightly more. A 340 blows the budget.
2. All the small blocks will allow you to use your existing (newly built) transmission, rear axle, exhaust, radiator, wiring etc.
3. A small block won't require any suspension or A/C changes.

So, let's ignore the big block option (like you started out). Realize first off that if you add much power your transmission will complain. A 360 is balanced differently than a 318 - and they even differ depending on the year. You'll need a weighted converter (or possibly just the flexplate depending on which route you take). The motor mounts are an easy fix. Depending on what you get the 360 out of you may need the oil pan and pickup specifically for a car 360. If you're going to rebuild the motor (didn't sound like it), you could also have it internally balanced so you won't need to screw with the converter. However, realize that most car/truck 360s came about after the smog changes and, even with 42 extra cubes, likely won't have as much power in stock form as your 318. Primarily because the pre-smog engines had higher compression. My 68 Charger with the stock(ish) 318 with headers and a big 2bbl would surprise a LOT of people. My 73 Barracuda 318 was a dog even with upgrades. A smog 360 will likely get worse mileage and I don't believe a 360 is a whole lot lighter than a 383 so you could be fighting more weight, less power, and worse mileage all at the same time.

I have a newer Magnum 5.9 that I had planned for this swap (but I sold the car) and it's fairly simple. The reason I went with a Magnum is because the power is way up in a late 90s/early 2000s EFI motor over a 70s/80s smog engine. The heads are great compared to the "LA" engines. These engines respond very well to upgrades like intake and exhaust. The main issue with the Magnums is the EFI and serpentine belt system as the whole front of the engine is different (but you can use the accessories and timing cover from your 318 and a "cam eccentric" to make it look stock).

If you want to rebuild/spend money, yes, stoker kits can make a small block surprisingly powerful. Again, then you have to upgrade everything else in the drive train just like a big block swap. If you have a big budget this conversation changes.

Troy

[c00nhunterjoe]

     

Mopar small block powered- runs 149-150mph in the 1/4 on a throttle stop. Dont underestimate what you can do with a small block. You only need a big block if you want a big block.

. . . says the guy with an aluminum big block for an avatar pic . . .  

---------------------------------


Nothing wrong with a decent smallblock though.  The 360s can pull pretty hard with some decent parts.  Stroker crank setups to bring them up to 410" cost pizza money these days.  The car is better balanced with 100 lbs missing off the front end compared to a big block.

Like my post says, only need it if you want it. Lol.

[cbrestorations]

just throwing this out there, i have a buddy with a freshly machined 1970 340 with forged pistons and 2.02 valved j heads. its stil wrapped in plastic and needs assembled. its all brand new parts and freshly machined. he wanted 2k

[keith88]

Im buying a 73/ 360 remaned engine non-smog moter and a mild cam ($2090 shipped) all i will have to do is put my top end on and i know about the pan stock car pan cost($55) going to use a B&W weighted flex plate($110) so i wont need to get a converter -iv been told, and a stock balancer cost about ($80) my 318 is not a 69 318 either its several  years newer i found out. Plus when i had the trani redone i had it beefed up a bit to handle a little more but not a big block. It should have no issue with what im putting in but not much more.Compression on the 318 is 8.5 to1 and the 8.7 to 1 360 according to the info i found on the net.

[keith88]

just throwing this out there, i have a buddy with a freshly machined 1970 340 with forged pistons and 2.02 valved j heads. its stil wrapped in plastic and needs assembled. its all brand new parts and freshly machined. he wanted 2k

Tempting but i would have to pay for shipping and its a little more than im looking for, not sure it would cost savvy for my want.

[Troy]

A 73 60 is a smog motor. They didn't come out until the feds already started restricting things.

According to Allpar, a 1968 318 (for example) had 9.2:1 compression while the 1973 version was 8.6:1.
http://www.allpar.com/mopar/318.html

Since you need to put a top end on it you can "adjust" it a little depending on heads and gaskets.

Your small block automatic transmission wouldn't physically bolt up to a big block - which is one reason I said to ignore the big block path.

Troy

[keith88]

A 73 60 is a smog motor. They didn't come out until the feds already started restricting things.

According to Allpar, a 1968 318 (for example) had 9.2:1 compression while the 1973 version was 8.6:1.
http://www.allpar.com/mopar/318.html

Since you need to put a top end on it you can "adjust" it a little depending on heads and gaskets.

Your small block automatic transmission wouldn't physically bolt up to a big block - which is one reason I said to ignore the big block path.

Troy

I just talked to the engine shop the 360 has 9.1 compression it lists as a 71-74 engine as far as years non smog the heads are stock 202 and 168 valves and the cam will be an elger cam i think  not sure on that name 420 &443 lift 204 duration.According to his site you can buy a smog or non smog engine for those years

[Troy]

Engle maybe.

Troy

[keith88]

I found them
Cam; Elgin cams # E937P
Part Type: Camshaft
Application Chrysler SB 273, 340, 360 1964-2003, 318 1967-2003

Cam Style: Hydraulic Flat Tappet
Basic RPM Range: 1500-4000
Manufacturers Description: Needs high compression, 3500 stall converter.
Intake Duration @ .050": 204
Exhaust Duration @ .050": 214
Advertised Intake Duration (@ .006"): 270
Advertised Exhaust Duration (@ .006"): 280
Intake Valve Lift with OE Rocker Ratio (1.50): .420"
Exhaust Valve Lift OE Rocker Ratio (1.50): .443"
Intake Lobe Lift: .280"
Exhaust Lobe Lift: .295"
Intake Valve Lift with 1.55 Rocker Ratio: .434"
Intake Valve Lift with 1.60 Rocker Ratio: .448"
Intake Valve Lift with 1.65 Rocker Ratio: .462"
Exhaust Valve Lift with 1.55 Rocker Ratio: .458"
Exhaust Valve Lift with 1.60 Rocker Ratio: .472"
Exhaust Valve Lift with 1.65 Rocker Ratio: .487"
Lobe Separation Angle: 112 Degrees
Intake Centerline: 108 Degrees
Lifters Included: No
Small Base Circle: No
Cam Gear Attachment: Single-Bolt
Valve Adjustment: Zero Lash Plus ½ Turn
Manufacturer: Elgin Industries
Manufacturer's Part Number: E937P

[keith88]

Changing the cam to a Comp cam will work great talked the the engine builder.


Product Line: COMP Cams Xtreme Energy Cam and Lifter Kits
Basic Operating RPM Range: 1,600-5,800
Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224
Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift: 230
Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224 int./230 exh.
Advertised Intake Duration: 268
Advertised Exhaust Duration: 280
Advertised Duration: 268 int./280 exh.
Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.477 in.
Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.480 in.
Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.477 int./0.480 exh.
Lobe Separation (degrees): 110
Grind Number: XE268H

Should be in the neighborhood of 325 HP with the rest of my set up and make a nice driver.

[ACUDANUT]

Ahhh... ok, but why not buy a dodge motor home, they normaly have a 440 and if you look, you can normaly find one cheap

Motorhome engines are usually dogs too. One popular example is the Roadkill Charger.

True. Avoid a motorhome 440.

[keith88]

might have found a used 360 with 30,000 miles on it  details to come.

[keith88]

I found a 1980 360 4 bbl for $800 has 30k on it going to change the cam to this:

Product Line: COMP Cams Xtreme Energy Camshafts

Cam Style: Hydraulic flat tappet
Basic Operating RPM Range: 1,600-5,800
Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224
Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift: 230
Duration at 050 inch Lift: 224 int./230 exh.
Advertised Intake Duration: 268
Advertised Exhaust Duration: 280
Advertised Duration: 268 int./280 exh.
Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.477 in
Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.480 in.
Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio: 0.477 int./0.480 exh.
Lobe Separation (degrees): 110

Should make it run pretty nice, get the motor in the next couple of days than i have the winter to get it ready and ill be back out in the spring.