It’s Official: Dodge Viper Is Bowing Out

[lukedukem]

not sure if its been posted, but....

http://blog.caranddriver.com/its-official-dodge-viper-is-bowing-out-special-editions-ease-the-pain/

2017 will be the last year

Luke

[ACUDANUT]

I thought they already stopped making them years ago 

[RCCDrew]

RIP to the greatest American supercar. I know that will be disputed, but the Viper dominated the Nurburgring.

[Mytur Binsdirti]

RIP

[keepat]

  I placed an order for a 2017 1 of 1 ACR with GTS interior a few weeks ago and just got confirmation on the build. Will this be the last winged dodge built? The ACR is a awesome car and if it is the last year for the Viper it will go out on top.
Pat

[Mike DC]

                   
I agree it's going out on top. 

Stupid-fast, still looks good, still looks like itself, manual tranny, etc.

     

The writing was on the wall as soon as they made the Hellcats.  Those things fill the same niche as far as the corporate powers are concerned.  They aren't as fast but they trump the Viper in relate-abiltiy.
             
               

[Scaregrabber]

Yes: I thought I wanted a Hellcat, luckily I drove a Viper first and bought one of those instead. I don't think anything FIAT would develop would be worth a damn, I'd just as soon they cancel it before screwing it up.

Sheldon

[6bblgt]

So, Dodge will be left with Charger & Challenger (~10 year old designs from Daimler) - is that enough to support the brand? 

[myk]

You Viper owners need to post up pics....

[Mike DC]

    

So, Dodge will be left with Charger & Challenger (~10 year old designs from Daimler) - is that enough to support the brand?

Some would argue that the Viper is just a freshly-polished old design.  


The Viper was always about Dodge's image.  It has always succeeded at being fast but it has always failed at feeling very related to the rest of the product line.  How many Neon R/Ts did it really sell in the 1990s?  

From the corporation's POV the Hellcats do make more sense.  They don't match a Viper on the track but they can genuinely help sell more regular Challengers & Chargers.  The Viper is cool but it's basically a mass-produced version of a Shelby Cobra.  Those old Cobras never sold a lot of Mustangs & Fairlanes & Galaxys.  

[odcics2]

   

So, Dodge will be left with Charger & Challenger (~10 year old designs from Daimler) - is that enough to support the brand?

Some would argue that the Viper is just a freshly-polished old design.  


The Viper was always about Dodge's image.  It has always succeeded at being fast but it has always failed at feeling very related to the rest of the product line.  How many Neon R/Ts did it really sell in the 1990s?  

From the corporation's POV the Hellcats do make more sense.  They don't match a Viper on the track but they can genuinely help sell more regular Challengers & Chargers.  The Viper is cool but it's basically a mass-produced version of a Shelby Cobra.  Those old Cobras never sold a lot of Mustangs & Fairlanes & Galaxys.  

You nailed it. 

Viper was conceived as a halo car for a 3-5 year run.  It was supposed to cost 30K when it came out!
I still have good memories driving an early model - rough & raw!   

[lukedukem]

You Viper owners need to post up pics....

I agree, here's a thread for Viper pics if anyone wants to show theirs
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,124581.0.html

Luke

[RallyeMike]

What a bummer.

I disagree that that the Hellcat takes it's place or led to the Viper's demise. They each have their niche. The Viper is 2-seater supercar coming in at 1/2 ton less in weight than the far too heavy Hellcat. It's sad to see Dodge bow out of the supercar market while Ford and Chevy continue on with the GT and Corvette.

On the flip side, the lack of the Viper may finally be the catalyst for Dodge to re-tool the Challenger on a specific platform, get the weight down, and improve the body proportions more along the lines of the Camaro and Mustang. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed.

[Troy]

I was perusing the Hellcat site the other day and saw a thread for actual weights. The one that stuck out to me was a Charger with driver and 1/4 tank of gas that tipped the scales at over 4,900 pounds. Not to mention they are about 58% biased to the front. Yes, the Hellcats may appeal to a similar demographic (financially?) but definitely not to anyone who wants a legitimate (curvy) track car. Of course, the last one my boss bought was well over $120k so that's why I put the question mark with "financially". Even a Hellcat with a healthy dealer markup isn't anywhere close to that.

I'll own a Viper at some point.

Troy

[JB400]

It's a shame.  What killed it was their commitment to keep it a manual trans.

[rebby]

It's a shame.  What killed it was their commitment to keep it a manual trans.

Funny, the fact that I can't get a (fake/modern) "Charger" Hellcat with a manual is the only reason that I won't buy one.

[Troy]

It's a shame.  What killed it was their commitment to keep it a manual trans.

Funny, the fact that I can't get a (fake/modern) "Charger" Hellcat with a manual is the only reason that I won't buy one.

That's been a beef since the Charger came out. Chrysler made a big deal about not being able to offer a manual for years - and then they released the Challenger on the same platform with a manual. Made them look dumb if you ask me. The 8 speed auto is paddle shifted and it's pretty fun to drive though (especially since you can adjust the shift points even in automatic mode).

Troy

[Mike DC]

        
The Viper was killed by a combination of things.  

Tiny production numbers without other models to spread out the costs.  Federal regulations bearing down on the emissions & body.  It had nothing left to prove on the track.  It was too uncompromising (stick tranny, etc) for the showoff buyers, but too expensive for the stripped-down performance lovers.  Etc.  When the Hellcat came along & demonstrated they could get a ton of "halo model" benefit just by slapping a blower onto a regular sedan . . . that was the last straw.  



       
Hellcats & curb weight -

For most buyers the curb weight simply does not matter.  Those cars could gain another 700 lbs for no reason next year and most of the buyers wouldn't bat an eye.  "You had me at 707 horsepower."  The car has a horsepower number so high it sounds socially irresponsible, it rips the tires to shreds at will, and pulls hard enough to scare the shit out of the driver.  Mission accomplished.  

The factory doesn't even bother making the Hellcats' engine block from aluminum.  That's an easy 100 pounds of weight saved and the MP alloy blocks are already sitting on their shelves.  Chrysler understands what is making Hellcats popular and it's not their performance numbers.  


50 years ago nobody cared that the cast-iron 426 Hemi engine messed up the car's balance.  The factory would readily sell you a cheaper & lighter 6-barrel wedge motor that was just as fast in the practical sense.   But even today, everybody loves 426 Hemis.  

[RallyeMike]

Viper production survived just fine at low production for 16 years. Then in 09 the economy tanked and Viper's never recovered. They were dead long before the Hellcat could kill them. It just took Chrysler 8 years to pull the plug.

For most buyers the curb weight simply does not matter.

Yup, most people are morons  You'd think after 50 years people would have it figured out.

[myk]

4900 pounds?

[Troy]

         
The Viper was killed by a combination of things. 

Tiny production numbers without other models to spread out the costs.  Federal regulations bearing down on the emissions & body.  It had nothing left to prove on the track.  It was too uncompromising (stick tranny, etc) for the showoff buyers, but too expensive for the stripped-down performance lovers.  Etc.  When the Hellcat came along & demonstrated they could get a ton of "halo model" benefit just by slapping a blower onto a regular sedan . . . that was the last straw.   



       
Hellcats & curb weight -

For most buyers the curb weight simply does not matter.  Those cars could gain another 700 lbs for no reason next year and most of the buyers wouldn't bat an eye.  "You had me at 707 horsepower."  The car has a horsepower number so high it sounds socially irresponsible, it rips the tires to shreds at will, and pulls hard enough to scare the shit out of the driver.  Mission accomplished. 

The factory doesn't even bother making the Hellcats' engine block from aluminum.  That's an easy 100 pounds of weight saved and the MP alloy blocks are already sitting on their shelves.  Chrysler understands what is making Hellcats popular and it's not their performance numbers. 


50 years ago nobody cared that the cast-iron 426 Hemi engine messed up the car's balance.  The factory would readily sell you a cheaper & lighter 6-barrel wedge motor that was just as fast in the practical sense.   But even today, everybody loves 426 Hemis. 

The original Hemi cars were meant for the drag strip (a lot like the Hellcats). The difference is, back then, Chrysler didn't have a 2 seat roadster/track car. I mentioned the weight only to point out that the cars certainly aren't comparable and appeal to different markets. I think the big thing that the Hellcats give Chrysler is that guys who have been buying big, powerful foreign sedans for years might cross over. It sure feels like I see them in garages with other brands.

I honestly don't see how the Viper lasted this long - purely based on the financial aspect.

Troy

[Mike DC]

Oh, I totally agree about that part of it.  The Hellcats have made this big splash because they are putting that kind of power into full-sized sedans.  

If Chevy wanted to make the Corvette start tempting Hellcat buyers away, it wouldn't need 707 horsepower, it would need a practical back seat.  


I still think the curb weight issue is nuts, though.  Maybe GM should start drawing up an 808-horsepower Suburban.    

[Mike DC]

  
BTW - I remember an anecdote about the early days of the Viper production.  Somebody in the program was saying that even their specific production volume was turning out to be a PITA for sourcing many of the parts.  

Most of the suppliers for the industry were ready to make 500 of something, or to make 50,000+.  But nobody wanted contracts for numbers like 5000.  The Viper program was always finding itself too big for short-run operating practices and too small for standard habits.    

[TexasStroker]

  I placed an order for a 2017 1 of 1 ACR with GTS interior a few weeks ago and just got confirmation on the build. Will this be the last winged dodge built? The ACR is a awesome car and if it is the last year for the Viper it will go out on top.
Pat

Very cool!  If I had the means, I would love to do the same thing.  I would like for a Viper to be my next purchase.  Enjoy that one for me 
I follow Mark Trostle on Twitter and he recently posted a picture of his car on the rack being built.

[moparnation74]

 I placed an order for a 2017 1 of 1 ACR with GTS interior a few weeks ago and just got confirmation on the build. Will this be the last winged dodge built? The ACR is a awesome car and if it is the last year for the Viper it will go out on top.
Pat

Congrats, Pat Awesome..

You will have to share pics when you get it home

[keepat]

 I am definitely looking forward to the build process. With the 1 of 1 program they will send over 100 pictures throughout the build  and I will post them here as I think they'll be pretty cool.
Thank you
Pat