Factory fit and finish on black cars ?

[Challenger340]

I gotta bounce this here for imput, because when it comes to historical/resto/numbers stuff I must admit to being a dummy .... just the way it is, nor do I don't profess any knowledge therein. 

So here's the skinny.
I was talking recently with a very well respected chief mechanic for a couple of private Car Collections, one of 75 cars and I think he also looks after another of 200 cars, all American Classics with values therein exceeding many Millions.
That's all this guy does full time, and he gets paid very well to do so. The collection owner will phone on a Thursday, says "we want to drive the Chevelle this weekend", or the copo Camaro, yada, yada,.... he then goes and fires up the Chevelle from the warehouse, checks fluids, tires, fuel etc., so it is "ready to go" Friday afternoon for pickup.
The rest of his time is spent in various larger projects within the collection, ie; if they wish to re-do the Engine in a recent acquisition, or a brake job, or whatever.
That's how we were talking in the first place about us doing an Engine job for one Challenger R/T in the collection

Anyways,
here is what he told me..... and again, in speaking with him, I find this guy to be extremely knowledgable, so I have no reason to doubt him.
he indicates that across ALL brands back in the day.... Chev, Ford & Chrysler....
the "Black" cars coming down the factory line were always better factory "fit & finish" due to increased attention therein.
According to him.... all factories had a standing line policy of "extra" attention to detail during assembly of Black cars, due to those Black cars (which shows everything body-wise) was most problematic and being the subject of the most "repair orders" for final fit & finish during final inspection,

Anybody else ever heard this before ?
That "Black" Cars were built better from factory ?

[Mytur Binsdirti]

I'm no expert, but I can't imagine that the build quality was any different on a particular car because of the color, especially Chrysler, as we all know that their build quality was the worst of the big three.

File under black cars don't matter.

[ht4spd307]

i heard they paid that much attention to the body the rest was overlooked   

[JR]

As someone who works in a modern day automotive assembly plant, I would be highly skeptical of that claim.

Especially considering how poor quality standards were back then. I call BS.

[RJS]

Yeah heard it on Graveyard Cars so what does that tell you???   I've owned 3 Original paint Black Mopar's over the years. Actually 4 if you count my 2013 Challenger.  I say nonsense, my first was a 72 SSP bought in 1977 from Original owner with 21,000 miles.  It arrived with dents in the hood and he accepted it. He was told a story by the dealer that it happened in transport?? Trunk alignment was horrible also and hood could have been adjusted better too.

Had a 70 6 BBL Cuda with about 70% Original paint, panel alignment could have been better but not crazy wrong on that one.

Two years ago bought another 72 Satellite Sebring Plus in Original Black paint and we had to line up everything on the car. Even shimming lower fenders to rocker.

My 2013 Challenger was the best panel fit of them all.

I've never seen a memo to state Black cars get special treatment from any manufacturer.

Oh also had a 71 Buick GS triple Black that was restored when I got it but original owner's nephew told me how painted body's would be shipped through Detroit ( he lived right near the plant) without the nose on them from Fisher Body Company till they meet up with a nose painted the same color but not painted at the same time.

Ron

[Challenger340]

Yeah, I didn't know what to say when he told me that ? that's why I was asking here ? to see if anyone else had ever heard this ?

You see what he said made some sense to me in my experience, my being otherwise not to savvy about originals ?
I owned upwards of 40 1968 to '70 B-Bodies over the decades, and I know full well about the quality/fit issues therein even as far back as the 70's when they were still fairly new and I owned/drove them ?
Then we ended up discussing my Charger after I told him I have a '69 R/T SE, Black, and that I felt it was a very well put together Car for a mopar ? far better than any of the dozens of others I have owned over 45 years.
Things like "gaps" and fit are perfect on mine, which being an un-restored original Car it would be easy to see any wrench marks in the original paint on bolts like door hinges, trunk & hood mounts, etc., etc... NONE ! so never adjusted as far as I can tell.
and,
that's when he indicated the "Black Car" thing, especially in higher lines as given more attention to detail.

I dunno here, but I tend to believe there may be at least some truth in what he says ?
Unfortunately though, not like there are hundreds of untouched survivors around of all colors to go compare against ?

[1965gp]

Maybe the issues on the production line were just easier to spot on a black car resulting in more fixes on black cars?

[Brock Lee]

If the slightest added labor was involved, black would have been an upcharge. It also would have had to have been something they did dedicated runs as the additional time spent on them would screw up the precisely timed movement of the line.

[Cncguy]

Maybe the issues on the production line were just easier to spot on a black car resulting in more fixes on black cars?

I agree. Probably a lot of dealer fixes.

[Charger_Fan]

He may be thinking of extra attention given at the factory when a vinyl top delete car came down the line. They would need to make the weld seams look much better than they did on vinyl top cars.

[tcs69rt]

File under black cars don't matter!!!!   

[Challenger340]

Maybe the issues on the production line were just easier to spot on a black car resulting in more fixes on black cars?

That was kinda the guy I spoke with's assertion ?

If the slightest added labor was involved, black would have been an upcharge. It also would have had to have been something they did dedicated runs as the additional time spent on them would screw up the precisely timed movement of the line.

I'm going to go look later.... but seems to me I read somewhere ? or saw a picture here ? that the "precisely" timed line movement, did indeed have a "sideline" at final inspection for repairs/fixes as req'd or ordered by the inspector ? 
Stands to reason at final inspection that they would not just let everything go "as is" no matter ?
or,
are you saying there was no final acceptance before leaving the precisely timed line ?   

[Challenger340]

File under black cars don't matter!!!!   

Yeah right 
That's like saying that crappy bodywork is just as easy to spot on a "white" Car ?.....  as a "Black" Car ? 

[tan top]

 could see it happening  if there was a code of  Y91 or Y92  or Y93 / Y97 ,  on the top right of the broadcast sheet    but that would not be limited to black cars , would be any color , that's destined to be a show / promo car etc  

[Alaskan_TA]

Myth.

Myth.

I said it again just for fun.

[hemi-hampton]

could see it happening  if there was a code of  Y91 or Y92  or Y93 / Y97 ,  on the top right of the broadcast sheet    but that would not be limited to black cars , would be any color , that's destined to be a show / promo car etc  

I Don't think Chrysler actually does any show or promo cars them selves. They outsource those to other companies. Like Roush, Prefix, Prestige, GLS,PSI, QEK (now Penske) ect, ect. At least now they do, In the old days it was Creative Industries, Masco-Tech, MSX, ASC, ect, ect. I never heard of anything special for black cars, is there a TBS on this? LEON.

[ht4spd307]

I've only ever heard of Monday morning cars and Friday afternoon cars being different  one being worse than the other as Monday no one wanted to be there & Friday afternoon the care factor kicked in  beer-o-clock

[Brock Lee]

I'm going to go look later.... but seems to me I read somewhere ? or saw a picture here ? that the "precisely" timed line movement, did indeed have a "sideline" at final inspection for repairs/fixes as req'd or ordered by the inspector ?  
Stands to reason at final inspection that they would not just let everything go "as is" no matter ?
or,
are you saying there was no final acceptance before leaving the precisely timed line ?  

There was a paint/body area that tended to the cars after assembly. Cars of all colors. That is not "extra attention to detail during assembly of Black cars". The cars are all assembled and off the line. Dealers would often have issues tended to as well. None of this has anything to do with extra care or QC on the line.

Again, they would factor in every second of labor into the cost of these cars. If any feature added labor, they would charge extra for it. Nothing was free.

[charge70]

Did the guys in the metal shop where the bodies were assembled even know what color the car was to be painted or did they care

[ht4spd307]

here is another can of worms for the special black car handling saga

[Challenger340]

here is another can of worms for the special black car handling saga

I'm confused ?
from my admittedly limited knowledge of anything historical about these Cars, that would seem to indicate that at least at some level ?, the factory did indeed have some capacity for "special handling" ?

Whether it required a "special" Fender Tag to be undertaken or not ? I guess that would be back to my original question(as related by the Collection's Mechanic), that Black Cars/higher-end examples being problematic to "showing" more flaws than for example than a "white"/slant 6 Car.... received more attention ?

[303 Mopar]

My understanding is "special handling" cars were demo, marketing, or exec cars.  I doubt any car was pulled off the line for special fit/finish just because of the color.  BTW, the color black was one of the least popular with one factor being the war.

[Charger_Fan]

BTW, the color black was one of the least popular with one factor being the war.

Because of Vietnam, black wasn't a popular color on cars? I don't see the correlation.

[303 Mopar]

Because of Vietnam, black wasn't a popular color on cars? I don't see the correlation.

World events effect on moods and economy directly impacted marketing and car color popularity.  Chrysler introduced the popular high impact colors that went with the wild crazy generation of the '60's while the multitude of deaths of Vietnam war reduced the popularity of grey scale colors.  The same thing happened in the '50's post-WWII with the introduction of new colors replacing the conservative ones.  In the '70's, with the fuel shortage and economy concerns, the darker colors became popular once again.

[Alaskan_TA]

Special handling fender tags come from police cars.