Distance from ground to frame rails

[Dino]

This is part of my "how to stick the engine in from the bottom" plan.

With 28" tall tires sitting on the ground, how high would the front frame rails be off the ground, measured just behind the radiator support?

I'll be lifting the front of the car and slide the K member with engine and trans in from the front. I just need to know how high off the ground the K member mounting tabs need to be so that when the front gets lowered the frame rails will be parallel to the tabs.

I don't know if I need to have my rear tires on blocks or not. I don't want to scrape the rear bumper on the floor when I jack up the front but I'll do a test run once I figure out how high the top of the valve covers will be off the ground.

[Dreamcar]

If I understand correctly, you're going to need to raise the rad support enough to get clearance for the engine + k member + whatever you're using to move the engine (dollies or whatever). Correct? Then the height required would be the total height of engine + k member + whatever you're using to move it.

Would you be able to bring the car back down all the way to the k member once the engine has cleared the rad support?

[Dreamcar]

I should add that the 28 inch tall tires are not the best reference because your rear suspension plays a roll in how high the back end sits. The height of your rear bumper from the ground is the measurement to start with and will give you an idea on how much you can pivot the front end up before the rear touches the ground. 

[Dino]

Correct: dolly + k member + engine (and trans)

Good point about the suspension. The leaf springs are pretty curved so the rear sits up quite high. Unfortunately I have the car on stands right now so I don't know how high exactly.

It looks like I'll have to get the rear wheels on the ground so I can figure out how high the front end can go without touching the rear to the ground. Then if I need to have the rear wheels on blocks I'll have to add that height in the front dolly.

Can someone tell me why I took this damn car apart again? I know there was a point to it but I'm not seeing it right now.     

[Dreamcar]

Can someone tell me why I took this damn car apart again? I know there was a point to it but I'm not seeing it right now.     

I could be worse...look at my build thread. It's all about perspective.

[zoman440]

14" was the approximate distance from the ground to the K-frame top front edge on my "engine dolly". Not shown but the rear tires about 28" tall were on the ground and had plenty of space between gas tank / rear bumper , etc. I swapped left / right front bumper brackets and used existing hole for attaching chains. Also used duck tape covered threaded rods stuck in body as alignment guides as it lowered. Raised the lower radiator support bottom about 4 ft.

[Dino]

14" was the approximate distance from the ground to the K-frame top front edge on my "engine dolly". Not shown but the rear tires about 28" tall were on the ground and had plenty of space between gas tank / rear bumper , etc. I swapped left / right front bumper brackets and used existing hole for attaching chains. Also used duck tape covered threaded rods stuck in body as alignment guides as it lowered.

You just made my life a whole lot easier!   

I don't know if swapping the bumper brackets would work since they're different on a 69 but I'll give it a shot.   

What size casters are those and would you change anything on the dolly?

BTW, awesome car!   

Can someone tell me why I took this damn car apart again? I know there was a point to it but I'm not seeing it right now.     

I could be worse...look at my build thread. It's all about perspective.

That's very true.   

[zoman440]

Casters are 4". The compound of them made it not roll too easily after sitting but otherwise the old recycled moving dolly worked good.

[zoman440]

BTW, awesome car!   

Thanks!

[Dino]

You don't happen to have the dimensions of that dolly do you?   

[Troy]

Dirk my favorite Harbor Freight dollies are on sale now. The Challenger drive train is sitting on two right now. The good part about using two is that I can get a floor jack in there to match the tilt angle. If the floor is rough you can add bigger casters. I have some 6" ones floating around with decent load capacity. A lot of smaller casters only hold a couple hundred pounds so be careful (you're putting the engine, transmission, exhaust manifolds, k-frame, steering and suspension on there so you're likely well beyond 1,000 pounds).

The other Troy has a steel one:
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php?topic=51676.0

Brian has a cool setup too.
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,29980.msg327577.html#msg327577

I can measure the bronze car later tonight if you need me too.

Troy

[zoman440]

You don't happen to have the dimensions of that dolly do you?  

18" w x 31" long

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

BTW, awesome car!   

Thanks!

My that is beautiful looking

[Dino]

You don't happen to have the dimensions of that dolly do you?  

18" w x 31" long

Great thanks! 

Dirk my favorite Harbor Freight dollies are on sale now. The Challenger drive train is sitting on two right now. The good part about using two is that I can get a floor jack in there to match the tilt angle. If the floor is rough you can add bigger casters. I have some 6" ones floating around with decent load capacity. A lot of smaller casters only hold a couple hundred pounds so be careful (you're putting the engine, transmission, exhaust manifolds, k-frame, steering and suspension on there so you're likely well beyond 1,000 pounds).

The other Troy has a steel one:
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php?topic=51676.0

Brian has a cool setup too.
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,29980.msg327577.html#msg327577

I can measure the bronze car later tonight if you need me too.

Troy

Thanks Troy but don't go out of your way. Jeff came over today and we put something together that I think is going to work just fine. Well actually Jeff put it together...I'm not sure what the heck I was doing.   

We pretty much stole zoman's design and made a dolly out of 2x4s. Tomorrow I'll get these 4" caster and screw them to the dolly. They should do the trick!
http://www.harborfreight.com/material-handling/casters-swivel/4-in-polyurethane-heavy-duty-swivel-caster-61760.html

I'll also get some caster to mount on the frame rails, or at least on a wooden beam so the front end can rest on it. I see no other way of getting the car out of the garage. The floor is too rough for the jack to roll onto once the weight of the car is on it and we need to get the car onto the driveway to do the install.

This is all in prep while I wait for engine parts by the way so don't get excited just yet. If I'm lucky I'll have the engine back together early-mid April. I'll paint it as soon as I can and bolt everything back together but there's a lot of work left to do before everything goes back in the car.

[will]

When I pulled the 383 with trans out from under my car I put the k frame and all on two furniture dollies. Situated them under there in a 'T' formation with a piece of 3/4" plywood. Cheap and easy. Plenty of room on the back side. I did the same method as above, but I took a 20' tow strap, wrapped around the frame rails just behind the rad support. Lowered the boom, didn't use the hook because I had the strap in half, you know, making the strap 10 feet long to get as close as possible without having to take the hood off. Picked it up, no slipping, the car doesn't weigh that much without the engine and suspension in there anymore. Easy, did it all by myself, with some pointers from the pros on this board.

[1974dodgecharger]

OMFG that charger.....damn clean.

[HeavyFuel]

How I did mine.   (I pushed it in from the side.)

I know this isn't exactly what you asked for......but when I lowered my body frame, the k frame was positioned nicely.  I was able to hand thread in each k frame bolt most of the way in.

[HeavyFuel]

Get your tranny support ready to go as well....it works well as a guide when positioning the engine.

[Dino]

Thanks for the pics!   

My dolly looks fairly similar. I just put 4" casters on it and skateboarded through my garage on it! It rolls nicely over all the cracks in the concrete with me on it.   

Granted I'm not as heavy as an engine but it's all I could do.

I wasn't sure what to do about the trans crossmember. I thought it might be too much too have it on there but I'll have it in place since that's how you did it. Did you leave the trans to crossmember bolts loose to give yourself some play?

[HeavyFuel]

If memory serves, I just slipped a bolt through on each side, as the body lowered down, but that is not until the very end.  The real benefit is the fore/aft positioning of the engine/tranny assembly.....it's a very visible locating reference point.  The brace also helps you keep an eye on the side to side position of everything under the transmission tunnel....a hard to see area.   I pushed my engine under and lowered it down, bolted it up in about an hour.....by myself.

It's a tighter fit than I though it would be.   Prepare to wiggle a little.   Here's pic of mine halfway.

Wow, looking at this pic....I'm wondering what happened to the Cool Whip container that normally lived on top of my carb (they fit perfectly) to prevent Foreign Object Damage (FOD).   

Man, that was one of the most satisfying days I've had with the car.  Have a good time with it.  

[Dino]

I will definitely enjoy the process, but I'm sure I'll also be sweating bullets trying not to mess up that shiny new paint!   

[Canadian1968]

It's really not that bad. You can see my install thread in the " paint body " section  . I know you followed it a bit . All I can advise is keep the front of the engine / k Frame angle upwards slights just as it will when it sits on the car . When  the k-frame is bolted up it makes the engine very front heavy , even when  you bolt the transmission becareful ! I used the casters off my tire dollys . 

Putting it in from the bottom  is the way to go . It is NO where as nerve rackING as dangling your 800lbs + engine tranny over top of the front t end of the car ! Lowering is nice and simple . Stop the lift shimmy, lower , shimmy , do e !

[Dino]

That's good advice, I'll be sure to keep it at a slight angle.   

[ht4spd307]

just wondering  would it be a better idea to have the correct height for your wheels to be mounted so once all the x member bolts are in your wheels can also be bolted up 

[HeavyFuel]

just wondering  would it be a better idea to have the correct height for your wheels to be mounted so once all the x member bolts are in your wheels can also be bolted up 

It's not that simple.

The UCAs, brake lines, etc. need to be worked before the wheels/tires go on.

[miller time]

How come some people put the engine in from underneath the car? I've pulled on installed my 440 and 727 with an engine hoist and had no problems, just concerned about the massive load tipping over?

[ht4spd307]

just wondering  would it be a better idea to have the correct height for your wheels to be mounted so once all the x member bolts are in your wheels can also be bolted up 

It's not that simple.

The UCAs, brake lines, etc. need to be worked before the wheels/tires go on.

yes i totally understand that all must be done prior to fitting the wheels but i was thinking as a safety feature the wheels could go on prior to lifting the whole load off the stand once everything is bolted up. just in case for example as in the picture the car is on the engine crane once all is bolted up that's a lot of weight on that engine crane    no

[HeavyFuel]

307,
Many ways to skin a cat (and who came up with that saying?   )

1. Lift car body with hoist
2. Slide engine under
3. Lower body to K frame
4. Install K frame bolts
5. Lift car body again (with engine now attached) just a little bit in order to remove wheeled engine cradle.
6. Place stands under car body, lower body onto stands
7. Proceed to hook up UCA, brake lines, torsion bars, anything else
8. Install wheels/tires.

I get what you are saying...but the torsion bars need to be installed in order for the front suspension to bare weight....and that might be easier with that engine cradle out of the way.