Firestones on a 'Tona

[maxwellwedge]

Looked at 2 original Daytona spares (one of them mine) with original tires (and wheel weights) that were Firestones. I think Roger told me a few years ago he found the same thing. Anyone else see the same?

And - Does anyone know how to decipher the Firestone codes?

Thanks!

[6bblgt]

I have heard this also, but in reference to F70-15s on HEMI Daytonas.

Tire technology was changing rapidly during the late '60s.  At the begining of the '69 model year, Goodyear was the only stateside manufacturer that had a performance belted 70-series tire.

I wonder if Firestone got Chrysler interested in thier "new" belted tire & Dodge tried them out on the late production Daytona?

How does the date on the spare wheel relate to the date of the wheels on the car & the SPD of the car?  What is the construction of the tire indicated on the sidewall?  What is the DOT code?

I have a F70-14 Firestone out of a GTO, code on tire is "000263PE", it is of NYLON construction not POLYGLAS (fiberglass belted) that was advertised as OPTIONAL on the 440 & STANDARD on the HEMI cars for 1969.  I have seen Corvette restoration info on decoding the Firestone dates, I'll try to locate the info.

[maxwellwedge]

Thanks - I'll post the details tomorrow.

[maxwellwedge]

OK - Here is what I have off one Daytona spare:

Rim - Feb 12      2 12  9  

Tire - Firestone Wide Oval, F70-14, Deluxe Champion, Polyester Cord, 4 Ply

000038LL, 8" from that it has 4QL

The other Daytona spare has:

Wheel - 2 10 9
Tire - Same as first one but has: 001VL778

I don't see a date code pattern emerging here - not a clear one anyway.

Both wheels have the original "LH" wheel weights and both look like the tire has never been off.

My other Daytona steel rims have a 2-12 date on all 5 rims but the spare tire has some junk off-brand tire on it.

[hemigeno]

Jim, which car has the Feb steel rims on the corners?  Doc?  Reason I'm asking is that the original Road Wheels for my car (412543 with a 6/9 SPD just 1 day before Doc) are all four dated May 23rd.  I don't have the original spare wheel, but had found one a good while back with an April '69 date.  If those wheels were on Doc, that's a pretty big spread for a 6/10 car.  Must be something with 14" steel wheels and a date lag if that's the case...

[maxwellwedge]

Gene - Here is the break-down.

Doc - 2 12  - All 5 wheels (black rims)
Boat - 2 12 - Spare (The rest are mags)
The other Tona that FB has in his shop (Not sure of VIN _ I'll ask) 2 10 spare (Not sure of the other 4)

I know Chrysler used Firestones from time to time.....The D70's on 69 Swinger 340's could have Firestones (mine does).


Doc has a lot of early dated stuff on it.

[nascarxx29]

I think my daytona spare was a Goodrich silver streak .Id have to look at my pictures to be sure

[maxwellwedge]

Doh!

[6bblgt]

I spoke to John at Kelsey Tire & a tech at Coker, the above numbers give no date info.
It is possible that Firestones were used due to availability, end of the model year - tire availability - last of the factory redlines etc.
Firestone did not have a fiberglass belted tire at the beginning of the '69 model year, by the end  ?

It is also possible the Firestones were only in the trunk.  Do we know when & where 500/Daytonas recieved their spares?

1969 440 b-body 70 series 14" tires
T82 - F70-14 "white" polyester 2 ply (4 ply rating) OPTIONAL N/C
T83 - F70-14 "red" polyester 2 ply (4 ply rating) STANDARD
T85 - F70-14 "red" polyester & fiberglass belted OPTIONAL at $26.45

As far as Goodyear is concerned "polyester" is "SPEEDWAY" & "fiberglass belted" is "POLYGLAS"

I have one original '69 spare? but it is a "white stripe" F70-14 Polyglas which doesn't show up in the order books until '70? 
wheel: 14x5-1/2"JK M39 1 -o- 13 55 (Motor Wheel Corp. Plant #3 1969 January 13 5.5")
tire: TK0265D (October, '68 LA Goodyear plant)

I am assuming this wheel/tire is from a LA assembled Coronet R/T, Superbee, Road Runner or GTX.

[nascarxx29]

It is also possible the Firestones were only in the trunk.  Do we know when & where
500/Daytonas recieved their spares?

2 different vendors and early or late determined what got used sounds like Chrysler line technique DOH

I never seen a daytona wearing firestones or in a trunk for a spare originally.Learn something new everday .I had a very original daytona with all the tires matched.

On the list step 7  Spare tires be removed.And probably stacked up .
Same practice with backseat got the buildsheets misplaced

[nascarxx29]

Trunk shows intake and some of spare
http://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/5704350

[6bblgt]

#7 refers to INSTALLATION with no mention of removal on the page.  

The original dark navy blue leather interior is in fantastic condition and includes a wood grain dash and electric windows among other special edition features.

blue leather EH?

Spare tire appears to be a 78 series Goodyear Polyglas or similar - IMO - not original.

[6bblgt]

I never seen a daytona wearing firestones or in a trunk for a spare originally.Learn something new everday .I had a very original daytona with all the tires matched.

& they were???

[maxwellwedge]

First off guys - That is not the Daytona I am talking about. The one from the auction had a off-brand tire crappy on the original rim - All 5 rims have the same date though   2 - 12.
That leads me to believe all 5 wheels tires left the factory on/with the car and Creative removed them (along with all the other stuff they removed), stacked 'em up and put them back in no particular order. This is the third one I have checked with 14" steel wheels that were all February dated. That is 3 out of three as I only became curious about this last week. 

The Daytona I am talking about is the "Boat-Tona".

[pettybird]

#7 refers to INSTALLATION with no mention of removal on the page.  

The original dark navy blue leather interior is in fantastic condition and includes a wood grain dash and electric windows among other special edition features.

blue leather EH?

Spare tire appears to be a 78 series Goodyear Polyglas or similar - IMO - not original.

I'm pretty sure that isn't the original spare tire to that car 

[hemigeno]

Rather than continue side-tracking the thread about Tim Wellborn's awesome HemiDaytona with a discussion about 14" tires that were never found on a '69 Hemicar, I thought I'd boost this thread back to the top and copy in Dan/6bblgt's information about tire construction and brands:

Coker Tire makes reproduction Firestones
Kelsey Tire makes reproduction Goodyears

All available 1969 Charger 500-Daytona-R/T tires (sort-of) are available in reproduction:
T82 white F70-14 nylon cord (Goodyear SPEEDWAY, Firestone WIDE OVAL*)
T83 red F70-14 nylon cord (Goodyear SPEEDWAY, Firestone WIDE OVAL*)
T85 red F70-14 fiberglass belted (Goodyear POLYGLAS)
U64 white F70-15 fiberglass belted (Goodyear POLYGLAS)
U65 red F70-15 fiberglass belted (Goodyear POLYGLAS)

* Firestone did not change the "WIDE OVAL" name when the design changed from nylon cord to fiberglass belted, what they did change was the "sub-title" on the tire's sidewall.
The nylon cord tires were "Deluxe Champion" & the fiberglass belted were "SUP-R-BELT" (the F70-14 Coker reproductions are 1970s "SUP-R-BELT")

& Goodyear's sidewall had the SPEEDWAY "Wide Tread" & POLYGLAS "Custom Wide Tread" text.

It rings a (very faint) bell about Goodyear repops being re-issued, but for whatever reason I thought that was limited to the F70-15 tires for the A12 & Hemicar crowd.  That's great to know they're doing 14" tires too, but for my own situation it may be a while before this set of Firestones gets replaced.

Below is an excerpt of a Chrysler engineering document from '69 that shows the T82 & T83 tires were "standard cord".  Would the reference to "Poly." be polyester, or polyglas?  By the time this document was issued in June of '68, it did not appear they were supposed to use Nylon cords for the F70 tires anyway.  What they actually used might have been different.

[66FBCharger]

Very interesting discussion!

[6bblgt]

hemigeno, What are the other tire manufacturers listed at the tops of the columns?  Can you post or email the complete document? dhead68@hotmail.com

If your car is a T83 car the Firestones are probably correct.

I don't believe there are non-NYLON or non-fiberglass 70 series tires for '69, the STANDARD might be "standard available" where there may be 78 series tire that has a less than NYLON base tire.  Rayon was pretty much

poly = polyester thread
nylon = nylon cord
glass = fiberglass belted
& with combinations you get polyester thread with fiberglass belts = POLYGLAS

* some decoders out there show some of the late '60s tire codes as "STEEL BELTED" - but they weren't on the scene until ~'73ish - Goodyear made "POLYGLAS" look-a-likes "POLYSTEEL" to market the latest trend to owners of musclecars.   

[hemigeno]

What are the other tire manufacturers listed at the tops of the columns?

Dan,

The three manufacturers listed in the column headings are Goodyear, Goodrich and Firestone - in that order.

I sent you an email on your other question.

[odcics2]

 OEM redlines and aftermarket at the Goodyear store had different widths for the same size tires!

And GM OEM redlines were not the same either!!!   

[TONY]

So what was the reason that the time of the year that Daytonas were built that Firestone tires were in use?

I've heard because Goodyear was on strike, but couldn't find out anything to confirm that

any ideas?

and, was it a plant specific issue?

[6bblgt]

WAG

with the introduction of the fiberglass belted tire (POLYGLAS), its popularity & GOODYEAR's desire to produce as many as possible to meet the high demand - lead to lower production of the lesser tires which depleted inventory, yet increased profits.  Chrysler had to go to other manufacturers to fill the void.

I'd bet timing & use was plant specific & tire specific (size, style & type) - but 45+ years later the pattern may be very difficult to map.

[TONY]

Dan

thanks for the input

from what ive been able to research the firestones only showed up at Hamtramck plant, not just on b-bodies but a-bodies too,

it'd be hard to believe that they ran short of all of the different size goodyears at the same time

no firestones have been found on original st Louis or lynch road cars

[6bblgt]

Firestone WIDE OVALs were original equipment on most performance a-bodies 1967-1969 (70 series tires), again not to be confused with the 1969 introduction of OPTIONAL fiberglass-belted tires (Goodyear POLYGLAS).

there are b-bodies from other plants that are original Firestone WIDE OVAL cars for 1969
(Chargers are the ONLY b-bodies built at HAMTRAMCK for the 1969 model year)