Anybody ever tried FI Tech fuel injection?

[69wannabe]

It's been great here weather wise these last several days and I haven't been on the net but a few mins here and there. Got the charger out sunday for a drive with the Fi tech system on it and for the first time out it ran pretty good. It is smoother on acceleration now and the throttle response is better than the carb was. It didn't idle all that great tho and was erratic and idling high then low but it never died on me. The guys at Fi tech are busy im sure but I did email him and he emailed me back with some things to check. I got through today on the phone and he told me how to get my idle corrected so I done what he said and now my idle is solid at 850 rpms. It is still a little slow on deceleration and it hovers around 950 to 1000 rpms a little longer than I think it should but it does come down to 850 after several seconds tho. He said if it continues to do that he will help me get the deceleration adjusted to come down faster. Taking a little bit to get the bugs worked out but so far it's pretty cool and runs down the road great!!! Finally got to give it a good bath for the first time this year, it was due for a good wash job since it was so dusty from sitting most of the winter months!

[igozumn]

Just a note for anyone else that comes across this thread.  If you're wanting to run a stock/original air cleaner, the Fitech takes a 5/16" air cleaner stud instead of the Holley/Carter/Edelbrock 1/4".  You'll need something like this:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mor-66390/overview/


I suppose it's a good thing I'm not ready to bolt the air cleaner on.   

[69wannabe]

Just a note for anyone else that comes across this thread.  If you're wanting to run a stock/original air cleaner, the Fitech takes a 5/16" air cleaner stud instead of the Holley/Carter/Edelbrock 1/4".  You'll need something like this:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mor-66390/overview/


I suppose it's a good thing I'm not ready to bolt the air cleaner on.   

Yes,I forgot to mention that you need an adapter/reducer for the air cleaner stud. The reason I forgot about it was because I had one in my junk drawer so I didn't have to go buy one...

[igozumn]

Was getting ready to bolt the throttle body down and noticed it rocking back and forth.  Thought I had a wire caught, but no wire.  Thought I had some linkage interfering with the manifold, but no linkage hanging down.  Thought maybe the manifold was warped, since it's just an old Street Dominator that was on my other '69 Charger that I bought in '89.  Took the throttle body off to inspect everything when I found the issue....




The bottom of the TPS sensor was hanging down below the flange line.  Was dreading having to grind on the edge of the manifold on the carb mount.  Grabbed the gasket provided by Fitech to check clearance when I figured all I have to do is clearance the gasket.




Probably should have cut it back just a hair more where the little tab is towards the middle of where I cut it back (bench grinder for the win!), but it's now fine and bolted down tight.  Aluminum water pump housing and Milodon water pump from Mancini went on last night along with the fuel pump block off plate and fuel hose clamp/retainers.

[69wannabe]

Been driving mine quite a good bit lately, it's taking some time getting used to the throttle body when I have been used to a carb for so long. It's running good and I proud of my decision to make the move to go with the Fi Tech system. After some driving I noticed there was some fuel dripping from the frame rail where the vent tube runs from the filler tube down into the frame rail. I just ran the vent from the fuel command center and teed it into the original vent tube up at the filler tube but the FCC was pushing a little bit of fuel out. I called and asked the tech guy about it and he said it was normal for it to do that and that was why it was so important to vent it back to the tank. I pulled the filler tube out and drilled and tapped it with a 1/4 pipe tap and installed a 1/4 x 1/4 fitting about an inch below the factory vent tube and ran the FCC vent to the new fitting so any fuel coming through the vent line will drip back down the filler tube into the tank. Only took about an hour to fix this minor issue and have driven it a few times since and all is well now. It has really good driveability even with the fairly lumpy cam I have in the engine and has alot better throttle response than the carb had. I used to go in at dad's gravel driveway and I would be loping along and stab the gas and it would stumble and finally come alive and with the throttle body when i'm loping along and stab the gas it comes alive immediately!!! That was something that always bothered me about the carb and after changing part after part after part and no improvement it was time for a change!!! So far so good!! 

[igozumn]

Nice.  Thanks for the update.

I pulled my original 1/4" return line off and put a 3/8" hard line in tonight.  Using the original 5/16" supply line as the new return line.  Tank is pretty much ready to go in, but I'm fighting the junk O'reilly's fuel injection hose clamps.  Going to check with one of the other places in town for a better quality clamp.  May have to use the worm groove, as I haven't had problems getting those tight enough like I have with the EFI clamps.  Found a good location for the O2 sensor and verified I need to work on the driveshaft at some point.

[myk]

Been driving mine quite a good bit lately, it's taking some time getting used to the throttle body when I have been used to a carb for so long. It's running good and I proud of my decision to make the move to go with the Fi Tech system. After some driving I noticed there was some fuel dripping from the frame rail where the vent tube runs from the filler tube down into the frame rail. I just ran the vent from the fuel command center and teed it into the original vent tube up at the filler tube but the FCC was pushing a little bit of fuel out. I called and asked the tech guy about it and he said it was normal for it to do that and that was why it was so important to vent it back to the tank. I pulled the filler tube out and drilled and tapped it with a 1/4 pipe tap and installed a 1/4 x 1/4 fitting about an inch below the factory vent tube and ran the FCC vent to the new fitting so any fuel coming through the vent line will drip back down the filler tube into the tank. Only took about an hour to fix this minor issue and have driven it a few times since and all is well now. It has really good driveability even with the fairly lumpy cam I have in the engine and has alot better throttle response than the carb had. I used to go in at dad's gravel driveway and I would be loping along and stab the gas and it would stumble and finally come alive and with the throttle body when i'm loping along and stab the gas it comes alive immediately!!! That was something that always bothered me about the carb and after changing part after part after part and no improvement it was time for a change!!! So far so good!! 

So have you resolved your idle and deceleration issues?

[69wannabe]

The idle is solid now all the time, I have my desired idle speed at 850 rpm's and that is where it idles when it warms up to operating temp. When it is cold it idles a little higher kind of like a choke but the warmer the engine gets the more it idles down where I have it set on the handheld. I talked to the tech guy today and he told me how to get the idle to come down a little faster instead of hovering around 1100 a few more seconds than I think it should. It is as simple as making an adjustment on the handheld and he said to just go in the negative in increment's of 5's until I get the deceleration where I want it. Like anything if you want to fine tune it you have to drive it out some and see what is doing what and then fine tune it from there. The more tuning I do the better it get's and if something doesn't seem right you can just set it all back to zero's and go back to where it was to begin with.

[moparguy01]

Do any of you who run the system know how much power it draws? I have to run a power wire back to the battery in the trunk and want to run it this weekend. I'm not sure what size wire to run.

[John_Kunkel]

Instructions say main power wire requires 25-amp fuse. Why run a wire all the way to the trunk, the starter and the starter relay are closer and hook directly to the battery? 10/12-gauge should be plenty.

[69wannabe]

Exactly, I ran my wire to the starter relay for all time battery voltage. You could even run it to the big post on your alternator for a 12 volt power source....

[moparguy01]

My battery is in the trunk and the whole system is hooked to a cutoff switch. Push it in, stone dead. Then the system loses its memory and it would have to relearn each time. That's why I want it to have its own power wire that doesn't go through the cut off switch.

[John_Kunkel]

According to their main tech guy Ken, the memory is non-volatile. I specifically asked him about that because I have frequent need to disconnect the battery for system maintenance/modification.

[moparguy01]

One of their tech guys emailed me and told me it was and I should run a separate wire to the battery.

[John_Kunkel]

Call and ask for Ken, it seems that some of the other "techs" aren't as savvy.

[igozumn]

Up and running.        

Have a leak on the pressure fittings at the pump, so, have to pull the tank.   

And the thermostat housing has a small leak, but I expected it, LOL.

[69wannabe]

Up and running.        

Have a leak on the pressure fittings at the pump, so, have to pull the tank.   

And the thermostat housing has a small leak, but I expected it, LOL.

Glad to hear you got it running, there will be some tuning to do but it's fairly easy and the tech guys there are very helpful if needed. I have talked to two different guys but both got my question's answered very quickly. Sorry to hear about your leak, like most things there will be a few bug's to work out of it...

[igozumn]

I had used Summit NPT/AN fittings at the pump and Gascasinch sealer, which I've used on lots and lots of stuff (air cooled VW engine cases, sensors, etc for over 20 years).  Not sure if my Gascasinch is old (it's not) or the fittings didn't fit well, they did I guess.  But I bought some new fittings locally and some Permatex Aircraft Make a gasket and tried a 2nd time.  Still leaked but not as bad.  The new fittings were a thread or so shorter than the Summit ones.  Pulled the pressure side out and cleaned it up and ran teflon tape around it about 3 times and cranked the piss out of it.  No leak.  Tank back in, vent run, down off jack stands.......and......

Drove it to the gas station.  It already had 4.5 gallons in it, but the gauge was reading less than a 1/4.  I had tested the sending unit dry before final installation and eyeballed the midway/half point with the seam in the tank.  Gauge read half full.  Tweaked the arm and got the sender to read full with the float touching the top of the tank and empty with it on the bottom.  Put 5 gallons in and it didn't read half.  Oh well.  Put about 35 miles on it and put another 10 gallons in and it reads right about 3/4, so, I kinda have a feel for it, and when it hits 1/4 left, I know there's at least 6 or 7 gallons left.  Plenty of safety margin for not running out of fuel and pump longevity.

Right off the bat, the off-idle flat spot was gone, as it should be.  Deceleration had a bit of a barble or acid reflux, almost like a backfire, but more like those Lamborghini's shooting blue flames out their tailpipes.  Or at least, that's the way I like to think of it.  Acceleration (not hammering it of course) seemed fairly smooth and like it really wanted to just go.  I guess that's the throttle response working well.  Verified my temp gauge was waaay the heck off, but I knew it was.  Will be willing to see what the Fitech's reading when we hit 80 or 90 degrees.  With the Mancini housing and Milodon pump, I think I have a 180 thermostat in it.  (EDIT: Nope, was 160....)  Fitech was reading around 160-165 +/- tonight.  45 ambient degree temps for comparison.  I did pull the cast thermostat housing and dressed the chrome neck that came with the Mancini/Milodon kit with a file and my belt sander for a better hold.  With a new Felpro gasket instead of the chrome neck supplied gasket and some of the Permatex make a gasket stuff, I appear to have no coolant leaks.  Checked it at 30 miles and it all looked good.  

The idle finally did settle down to where I have it set at (770 rpm).  After about 30 miles on it, the deceleration cough, which it was doing only once on some, not all, of the manual transmission decel events (mostly loooong decels), had greated diminished.  I love, love, LOVE, pulling away from stops now.  With the off-idle flat spot gone, it's genuinely a pleasure to drive.  Speaking of which, I know it's just up and running tonight, and have lots of testing to do, warmer temps and such, but I experienced no exhaust smell tonight!  Something that's been plaguing this car for a loooong time.  I had even pulled my 509 Purple shaft in an attempt to rectify the issue, when I found a severely worn timing set.  But I still put in the next smaller Purple shaft.  It cut the nuts off of it on the top end (915 heads and factory manifolds 3 inch pipe and flowmasters) and midrange suffered a little.  After about 25 miles tonight, I popped it down into 1st going around a corner and put about 3/4 throttle to it and ran it up to about mid 3rd gear.  It felt like it had the old cam in it.  I joked with my buddy about how first gear midrange kinda made me do the "better hang on tight to this one" it felt sooo good.  

Long story short, put 60+ miles on it tonight.  I think it's worth every penny so far.    

ETA: Anybody experiencing a "whistle" on accel?  Kinda when you're 1/2 or so throttle?  Like if you had the air cleaner off, and how loud it was, it sounds like that.  Makes me think of the tuner guys.  I keep waiting for the wastegate valve to pop off, kechishhhhhhh, LOL.

[RCCDrew]

Good job. Makes me jealous. 

[69wannabe]

I had used Summit NPT/AN fittings at the pump and Gascasinch sealer, which I've used on lots and lots of stuff (air cooled VW engine cases, sensors, etc for over 20 years).  Not sure if my Gascasinch is old (it's not) or the fittings didn't fit well, they did I guess.  But I bought some new fittings locally and some Permatex Aircraft Make a gasket and tried a 2nd time.  Still leaked but not as bad.  The new fittings were a thread or so shorter than the Summit ones.  Pulled the pressure side out and cleaned it up and ran teflon tape around it about 3 times and cranked the piss out of it.  No leak.  Tank back in, vent run, down off jack stands.......and......

Drove it to the gas station.  It already had 4.5 gallons in it, but the gauge was reading less than a 1/4.  I had tested the sending unit dry before final installation and eyeballed the midway/half point with the seam in the tank.  Gauge read half full.  Tweaked the arm and got the sender to read full with the float touching the top of the tank and empty with it on the bottom.  Put 5 gallons in and it didn't read half.  Oh well.  Put about 35 miles on it and put another 10 gallons in and it reads right about 3/4, so, I kinda have a feel for it, and when it hits 1/4 left, I know there's at least 6 or 7 gallons left.  Plenty of safety margin for not running out of fuel and pump longevity.

Right off the bat, the off-idle flat spot was gone, as it should be.  Deceleration had a bit of a barble or acid reflux, almost like a backfire, but more like those Lamborghini's shooting blue flames out their tailpipes.  Or at least, that's the way I like to think of it.  Acceleration (not hammering it of course) seemed fairly smooth and like it really wanted to just go.  I guess that's the throttle response working well.  Verified my temp gauge was waaay the heck off, but I knew it was.  Will be willing to see what the Fitech's reading when we hit 80 or 90 degrees.  With the Mancini housing and Milodon pump, I think I have a 180 thermostat in it.  Fitech was reading around 160-165 +/- tonight.  45 ambient degree temps for comparison.  I did pull the cast thermostat housing and dressed the chrome neck that came with the Mancini/Milodon kit with a file and my belt sander for a better hold.  With a new Felpro gasket instead of the chrome neck supplied gasket and some of the Permatex make a gasket stuff, I appear to have no coolant leaks.  Checked it at 30 miles and it all looked good.  

The idle finally did settle down to where I have it set at (770 rpm).  After about 30 miles on it, the deceleration cough, which it was doing only once on some, not all, of the manual transmission decel events (mostly loooong decels), had greated diminished.  I love, love, LOVE, pulling away from stops now.  With the off-idle flat spot gone, it's genuinely a pleasure to drive.  Speaking of which, I know it's just up and running tonight, and have lots of testing to do, warmer temps and such, but I experienced no exhaust smell tonight!  Something that's been plaguing this car for a loooong time.  I had even pulled my 509 Purple shaft in an attempt to rectify the issue, when I found a severely worn timing set.  But I still put in the next smaller Purple shaft.  It cut the nuts off of it on the top end (915 heads and factory manifolds 3 inch pipe and flowmasters) and midrange suffered a little.  After about 25 miles tonight, I popped it down into 1st going around a corner and put about 3/4 throttle to it and ran it up to about mid 3rd gear.  It felt like it had the old cam in it.  I joked with my buddy about how first gear midrange kinda made me do the "better hang on tight to this one" it felt sooo good.  

Long story short, put 60+ miles on it tonight.  I think it's worth every penny so far.    

ETA: Anybody experiencing a "whistle" on accel?  Kinda when you're 1/2 or so throttle?  Like if you had the air cleaner off, and how loud it was, it sounds like that.  Makes me think of the tuner guys.  I keep waiting for the wastegate valve to pop off, kechishhhhhhh, LOL.

Glad you are liking the kit too!!!! After some adjustments I am enjoying the off idle response and the smooth acceleration. I noticed mine would kinda pop through the exhaust on deceleration at first but after some driving it pretty much went away. Mine had a pretty loud whistle when I first started it up when it was trying to set it's idle but I haven't really noticed it since.

[igozumn]

Yeah, mine's getting better too.  115+ miles on it now.  Slight thermostat housing leak with the new chrome neck and Felpro gasket and the top tank on the radiator is leaking now, LOL.  But the cold start this morning, just put it in gear and take off....mmmmm......and the off-idle crap gone......mmmmm......and what appears to be no exhaust smell allowing me to smell the small coolant leak......well, that's good and bad?  Good and not so good?  Good that you can smell it, not good that you smell it.  Silver lining and all that I guess.   

I work at a Ford dealer and the guys that I showed today were really impressed with the setup.  I'll get some pictures up in the next day or two. 


Scared me tonight though.  Sent a text to my Nova, er, one of my Nova buddies, I mean, one of the Nova buddies that I have that had the Fitech system put on a couple months ago asking if he'd like to go for a drive, seeing as how I buzzed his house last night in it.  Said he would.  Went out to start it and it wouldn't crank.  Crap.  Hope my Radioshack pushbutton start switch hasn't gone bad already.  Long story short, the old original yellow wire at the starter relay was cracked and slightly shorted.  Bent it back just a little and was able to start it.  Guess I'll tackle that in the next day or so.  Now, about the radiator situation.......

[68CoronetRT]

Ordered this setup 3 weeks ago and FITech is out of stock on the 30004 part #.

I went with the tanks intank pump setup and re doing all the lines etc...

BTW, the timing is controlled through the coil. I saw a few posts about that. You sync the computer to your physical timing(Lock out dist.) which I'd guess is 10* then the computer tells the coil when to fire to advance "X" *'s.

[Rubberduck]

any news here?

[cdr]

Ordered this setup 3 weeks ago and FITech is out of stock on the 30004 part #.

I went with the tanks intank pump setup and re doing all the lines etc...

BTW, the timing is controlled through the coil. I saw a few posts about that. You sync the computer to your physical timing(Lock out dist.) which I'd guess is 10* then the computer tells the coil when to fire to advance "X" *'s.

you have to lock the internal advance mechanism inside the dist so it does not move.

[igozumn]

any news here?

Why yes.  Yes, there is.  I said I'd post pics, and haven't done it.  So, sitting at a new desk at work now for a month or two, and may have time to fool around.  Soooo.......

I had used the choke cable bracket to mount a RadioShack push button to operate the starter.  While those that have installed the Fitech without the timing control and not had an issue with the system losing power between run and start, I figured this was cheap and easy to put in.  Sure, very minor inconvenience, but you put the key in, turn it, and hit the button to engage the starter.  Haven't had any issues so far with trying to start the car using the run side coil voltage.




Started here.....what you see, has been on there for about 20 years.



Reproduction tank pad was about 4 inches shorter than the original, so I did what I think Dino did.  Craftsman tool chest drawer liner folded over itself.



I ran a reproduction 3/8 supply line and removed the factory 1/4 return line.  Used the original 5/16 supply as the "new" return.



I miscalculated the length of line on the pump assembly and ended up being too short.  It left about 1/2 inch on the bottom of the tank.  For anyone else running the Tanks Inc pump and tank, you have to cut the line down between the actual pump and pump mount on the assembly.  2 1/2 inch, or just a hair under, should be about the right measurement.  Heat gun works wonders for getting it together, and apart, and back together again.   


To use the bracket that was on the side of my carb, I had to cut a notch to clear the butterfly shaft from the Fitech.



The supplied temperature sensor adapter (silver) seemed to go a little far into the Mancini housing and I wondered if it would bottom out before sealing up.  I bought the brass fitting at the hardware store and was test fitting it, but from inside the housing, it looked as if the sensor probe might not get into the coolant flow and that might cause erratic readings.  So, I used the supplied Fitech fitting and all is well.


I had originally wanted to run hard line all the way to the throttle body, just like for a carb, but ended up running hose for time.  I put a couple clamps on the bolt for the fuel pump blockoff plate to retain the hoses.


I ground down the sharp casting line so it wouldn't cut into the hoses.  Also note the sharp corner of the water pump housing.


So, I rounded the corner.  If I had run hard line, this wouldn't have been an issue.  But, running 2 hoses around the distributor gets a little tight.


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